19:54:35 <spevack> #startmeeting 19:54:36 <zodbot> Meeting started Fri May 21 19:54:35 2010 UTC. The chair is spevack. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 19:54:36 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 19:54:51 <spevack> We've had our tour of the http://www.vrac.iastate.edu/ 19:55:03 <spevack> Now we're back 19:55:26 <spevack> And our goal is to discuss budget, swag procurement & distribution, regional leadership 19:55:31 <stickster> spevack: Site of a future FUDCon? :-) 19:55:52 <spevack> stickster: it was UNREAL in the VRAC 19:56:21 <rbergeron> the virtual unreality of it all 19:56:29 <stickster> spevack: pics? 19:59:14 * ianweller takes over transcribing 19:59:29 <ianweller> thusfar we're talking about the budget, and red hat's (spevack's) role in the budget for ambassadors 20:00:42 <ianweller> <spevack> we need to recommunicate that there's this publically recorded budget for fedora, and it's supposed to be used for marketing and community building, basically 20:02:13 * ianweller isn't sure what's being talked about at this point (: 20:05:03 <stickster> ianweller: Is there an audio feed that someone can listen in on (no need to talk)? 20:05:14 <ianweller> stickster: unfortunately not set up right now. 20:05:16 <stickster> k 20:05:19 <stickster> brb 20:05:23 <ianweller> rbergeron: can you help transcribe? 20:05:32 <ianweller> or someone :) 20:07:32 <lcafiero> OK 20:08:06 <lcafiero> discussion around budget decisions 20:08:48 <ianweller> we're attempting to set a level of where we have to have max approve 20:09:49 <rbergeron> spevack is talking about credit cards for individual regions. 20:10:05 <ianweller> RH finance is willing to make this happen 20:10:18 <stickster> \o/ 20:10:20 <ianweller> < spevack> the level of accountability doesn't change because we're already providing receipts and printing off wiki pages of people 20:10:21 <rbergeron> rh finance is willing to give it a shot; level of accountability won't change, since we'll still be providing receipts to show what fedora is doing. 20:10:26 <ianweller> rbergeron: jinx 20:10:32 <ianweller> (: 20:10:36 <rbergeron> all to make max's life a little better. :) 20:10:45 <ianweller> < herlo> maybe spevack isn't the man we have to talk to all the time 20:10:54 <rbergeron> but we love talking to spevack :) 20:11:04 <ianweller> < spevack> as long as the numbers add up, and it's transparent, and people can discuss that it's being spent wisely, it can pretty much run itself 20:11:23 <ianweller> < spevack> one of the things i would like to get out of htis conversation is if NA as a region feels like it would like to participate, we need to figure out who would be the point-persn 20:11:27 <ianweller> person* 20:11:30 <rbergeron> max would like to see from this conversation if in NA - we have someone to be a point person on being a CC holder 20:11:30 <ianweller> < spevack> RH finance is going to need a name 20:12:02 <ianweller> < ke4qqq> i don't feel that it's a huge obligation for us in NA to have one of those cards if it can be better used elsewhere. we have a lot easier access to spevack, mchua, quaid than the rest of the world does 20:12:13 <ianweller> < ke4qqq> if there's a place where a region having 2 cards is better, i'd forgo that 20:12:14 <rbergeron> ianweller is beating me to every sentence. 20:12:30 <ianweller> < spevack> once confidence grows in RH finance, it can probably be increased 20:12:37 <ianweller> < spevack> they're just worried aobut the total amount of credit out there 20:13:10 <ianweller> < spevack> if anybody ever wants to lose their respect and lose their respect with RHT and run off with a card with a $5K credit limit... 20:13:57 <ianweller> < spevack> this is just a way of cleaning up what we're doing ... instead of 5 people having my credit card number, it can be 5 different numbers -- better transparency 20:14:08 * quaid notes he shouldn't be on that list 20:14:21 <herlo> okay! 20:14:23 <ianweller> quaid: ok you're off now 20:14:25 <ianweller> ;) 20:14:37 <ianweller> < ke4qqq> if we have a single NA card it makes the most sense to me to have inode0 have the card 20:14:41 <ianweller> * herlo seconds 20:14:49 <ianweller> < ke4qqq> assuming another region can't make better use 20:15:06 <ianweller> < spevack> i don't think we have a limit. i'm more worried about other regions saying "we don't want your silly credit cards" 20:15:38 <ianweller> < herlo> that opens us up for some really cool opportunities with marketing -- we can now buy a bunch of CDs or sponsor people's business cards or whtaever's appropriate, easier 20:15:44 <ianweller> < herlo> small amounts of money more quickly 20:16:10 <ianweller> < spevack> it feels to me that it's the last step required to have the FAMNA team to be able to make their decisions completely and finally to get the things they need paid for and be self-sustatining 20:16:16 * ianweller cannot spell 20:16:31 <ianweller> < ke4qqq> i'm concerned that it's going to look like authority rather than responsibility 20:16:50 <threethirty> am i the only one who cant get on the wifi 20:16:58 <rbergeron> ummmm 20:17:00 <ianweller> threethirty: IASTATE? 20:17:02 <rbergeron> yes, apparently 20:17:06 <rbergeron> i'm not sure how you're on 20:17:09 <rbergeron> oh 20:17:11 <rbergeron> phone 20:17:13 <makfinsky> threethirty: You have to go through the registration and disconnect, then reconnect. 20:18:17 <ianweller> < spevack> this is a job for a detail-oriented person 20:18:30 <ianweller> < herlo> the question is, how much work is that 20:18:36 <ianweller> < spevack> it's not that much 20:18:54 <ianweller> < ke4qqq> he says it's not a big deal, but at lunch he was complaining about expense reports. ;) 20:19:05 <ianweller> < spevack> the time sink is when i'm taking all of that times the whole world and getting it in a RHT format 20:20:33 <ianweller> < spevack> what's going to happen is RHT will get the bill at the end of the month, and all they want is the PDFs of the invoice, the fedora contributor's wiki page, and as a bonus, the blog post they wrote 20:20:38 <ianweller> < ke4qqq> ok action item time now 20:20:43 <ianweller> < spevack> do we want to do this? 20:20:52 <ianweller> < spevack> do we want to decentralize this away from me? yes 20:21:30 <ianweller> < spevack> it's about an opportunity to spend more closely to the budget instead of having a lot of money left over 20:26:27 * ianweller was distracted by another channel and is lost 20:26:35 <herlo> consensus 20:29:18 <lcafiero> discussion around sponsorship to events 20:30:17 <lcafiero> < ke4qqq> Made it seems that it only applies to ambassadors instead of anyone who needs sponsorship 20:30:29 <makfinsky> Guidelines vs. Policies. I believe in order to feel comfortable with taking on the spending responsibility w/o having the authoritative aspect of it, we need guidelines rather than policies. 20:30:41 <lcafiero> < herlo> Should make process more visible 20:31:13 <lcafiero> < ke4qqq> who does someone ask? 20:31:41 <ianweller> < herlo> what if we use famnarequests (trac) 20:39:43 <lcafiero> Discussion around handling money ensues. 20:41:30 <ianweller> basically, "who handles it" 20:41:45 <stickster> makfinsky: There will be some requirements that are carved in stone, because those are things Red Hat requires for financial tracking. There should be other "should" factors that are recommendations, some stronger than others. 20:42:41 <makfinsky> stickster: Understood, the things we are talking about here though are inside the scope of the hard boundaries I think. 20:44:18 <ianweller> now none of us know where we're trying to go. :) 20:44:38 <ianweller> < ke4qqq> if i am not an ambassador, or if i'm a $FOO who wants to do $BAR, how do i do that, and who do i talk to? 20:44:47 <ianweller> < ke4qqq> if the answer is spevack it's broken 20:45:17 <ianweller> < spevack> the worry is getting people to stop thinking, if i'm not associated with ambassadors i can't get the money 20:45:41 <makfinsky> Sounds like we are trying to develop a role type solution for finance requests. 20:48:50 <ke4qqq> spevack: I think there needs to be a $role for this 20:48:54 <makfinsky> 1. We need to let contributors/community members that they can get funding for attending events on behalf of fedora and 2. we need a method of making sure that the requests are valid/good/desirable/in-line with Fedora project goals. 20:48:57 <ke4qqq> whether that's famsco or $body 20:49:05 <ke4qqq> is a matter of preference 20:49:54 <ke4qqq> because the alternative is what we have now, right? 20:50:15 <ke4qqq> so additional governance is better than the vacuum/spof now. 21:02:15 <ianweller> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Reimbursements 21:18:24 <lcafiero> Discussion to do away with Regional Ambassador title 21:27:16 <ke4qqq> what did I miss that this got beyond a wiki page? 21:28:32 <spevack> i don't know 21:28:38 <spevack> wiki pages solve everything 21:28:56 <dgilmore> ke4qqq: wiki is easy to ignore/not update etc 21:29:14 <ke4qqq> ok, good point 21:29:25 <spevack> #link https://fedorahosted.org/emea-swag-tracking/wiki/Inventory 21:29:59 <spevack> everyone look at this ^^^^^ 21:31:53 * ke4qqq goes to link 21:31:58 * rbergeron already went 21:37:19 <spevack> https://fedorahosted.org/emea-swag-tracking/wiki/Inventory?action=history 21:40:36 <herlo> https://fedorahosted.org/famnarequests <-- what we do now 21:42:01 <lcafiero> https://fedorahosted.org/famnarequests/ <--- where to request stuff 21:42:22 * lcafiero is not as fast a typist as herlo 21:42:34 <spevack> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FUDCon_budget_template 21:42:39 <herlo> lcafiero: I can copy and paste faster than you :) 21:42:50 <lcafiero> Heh 21:51:31 <spevack> morning --> http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-fad/2010-05-21/fedora-fad.2010-05-21-15.02.html 21:52:43 <ke4qqq> #action spevack ke4qqq - Propose policy for handling all of Fedora's money 21:53:53 <ke4qqq> #action inode threethirty - Do away with regional ambassador titles, purge references on wiki, announce on mailing lists 21:54:58 <ke4qqq> #action herlo - swag inventory - wiki/trac plugin, or alternate solution 21:55:08 <spevack> /nick Mr_Burns 21:55:24 <ke4qqq> #action lcafiero inode0 - budget production 21:56:17 * mchua watches with curiosity - I'm keen to see whether this can be community-ized more than it presently is (not necessarily right away, but over the next year or two). 21:56:58 <rbergeron> this what? 21:57:13 <ke4qqq> mchua: define this - or rather tell us the antecedent to this 21:57:14 <rbergeron> udget stuff 21:57:16 <rbergeron> ? 21:57:18 <rbergeron> errr....budget 21:57:20 <threethirty> oh hai mchua 21:57:36 * ke4qqq waves at mel 21:58:15 <ianweller> it's a mel! 21:58:20 <mchua> Oh, I was referring to "policy for handling all of Fedora's money" 21:59:00 <rbergeron> that's what i said... maybe a .... more community-ized commarch 21:59:06 <ianweller> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Category:Pages_that_need_love 21:59:20 <rbergeron> but.... it could also be in the hands of famsco, or... whomever 22:01:12 <rbergeron> ke4qqq raises his hand 22:01:54 <dgilmore> #endmeeting 22:03:01 <spevack> #endmeeting