13:06:14 <dmsimard> #startmeeting Contributor Summit Day 1
13:06:14 <zodbot> Meeting started Tue Sep 28 13:06:14 2021 UTC.
13:06:14 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
13:06:14 <zodbot> The chair is dmsimard. Information about MeetBot at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Zodbot#Meeting_Functions.
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13:06:14 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'contributor_summit_day_1'
13:06:45 <andersson007_[m]> o/
13:08:22 <gwmngilfen-work> hackathon pitches / sessions: https://hackmd.io/@ansible-community/hackathon-202109-pitches
13:08:25 <dmsimard> #chair cyberpear andersson007_[m] gundalow FelixFontein[m] cybette_ dericcrago ompragash tadeboro
13:08:25 <zodbot> Current chairs: FelixFontein[m] andersson007_[m] cyberpear cybette_ dericcrago dmsimard gundalow ompragash tadeboro
13:08:36 <dmsimard> ^ zodbot is on, feel free to #info important bits and such
13:09:08 <Tas-sos> :=)
13:10:20 <shanemcd[m]> 👋
13:11:39 <gwmngilfen-work> do ask your Q&A folks, I will relay to the speakers
13:12:35 <andersson007_[m]> thanks gundalow cybette for the introduction!
13:12:48 <fsteve800[m]> where is the into happening?
13:13:00 <gwmngilfen-work> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rk73ND-uP3A
13:13:14 <gwmngilfen-work> or in the embedded client if you're on Element
13:15:37 <gwmngilfen-work> question: should work with podman too, I guess?
13:15:37 <Honiix[m]> Don't Molecule have replaced Vagrant? :)
13:15:39 <cyberpear> docker or podman I assume
13:16:06 <felixfontein> podman works well with the latest development/beta version of ansible-core
13:16:27 <felixfontein> I'm not sure how well it works with ansible-core 2.11; with < 2.11 it's probably not so good
13:16:43 <gwmngilfen-work> felixfontein: good to know
13:17:10 * gwmngilfen-work is so busy being the producer, he's going to have to scroll back to 13:00 UTC and watch it all again later
13:17:19 * felixfontein looks forward to the GA of ansible-core 2.12, that version will definitely be best for use with podman :)
13:19:23 <killergoalie[m]> So fun question, anyone know when RH is going to move past 2.9?
13:20:57 <felixfontein> I think that's supposed to be happening soon, but it's probably better if someone from RH comments on that :)
13:21:20 <cidrblock[m]> killergoalie: When RH release the next version of the Ansible automation platform this fall, ansible-core 2.11 will be fully supported
13:21:26 <gwmngilfen-work> reminder, Q&A at the end, I'm noting questions as we go
13:21:28 <cidrblock[m]> s/release/releases/
13:21:34 <gwmngilfen-work> thanks cidrblock !
13:21:51 <felixfontein> cidrblock[m]: so 'only' 2.11, not 2.12?
13:22:18 <killergoalie[m]> cidrblock: thanks
13:22:31 * gwmngilfen-work is also crossing out questions as we go :D
13:23:44 <cidrblock[m]> felixfontein: I'm checking :)
13:24:53 <dmsimard[m]> ah! tadeboro is set up like a cooking show, he already has the cakes prepared :)
13:25:21 <gwmngilfen-work> "heres one i made earlier!"
13:25:44 <jrglynn2> that's the way to make sure nothing fails in live demo :-)
13:26:08 <felixfontein> there's nothing more fun than "ok, here would be the demo, but it doesn't work..." :)
13:26:27 <Honiix[m]> We have multiple way of setup the developper Python interpreter, Same for the controller. What are the options for the targets of the playbook? Can we use venv as ansible_python_interpreter?
13:27:18 <dmsimard[m]> Honiix: the venv lives on the machine running the playbook, it cannot be used remotely
13:27:57 <felixfontein> ... except if you use `connection: local` :)
13:28:49 <Honiix[m]> dmsimard: I know, but I constantly run into collition. Mysql collection wants to use PyMySQL which requires Python 3.9 on latest RHEL8, and aws want boto3 on Python3.6... So seting up those Python package with the package manager is a nightmare.
13:29:42 <Honiix[m]> and installing boto3 on rhel8 using pip makes urllib3 to be in a version that yum/dnf doesn't like. Just for example. I have other compatibility issue all the time.
13:31:36 <fsteve800[m]> got a plausible solution for https://github.com/ansible-collections/community.windows/issues/284 wanted to explore how do i submit
13:31:39 <gwmngilfen-work> tadeboro: more sacrifices to the demo gods!
13:32:02 <gwmngilfen-work> fsteve800: sounds a perfect topic for the hackathon later on today
13:32:12 <dmsimard[m]> Honiix: I don't think there is one good solution or answer to that but it's a good topic to talk about, let's keep that for later
13:32:33 <cidrblock[m]> Honiix: This seems to be a common way to use the venv's python, set in the inventory ```all:
13:32:33 <cidrblock[m]> vars:
13:32:33 <cidrblock[m]> ansible_python_interpreter: python
13:32:33 <cidrblock[m]> ```
13:32:47 <cidrblock[m]> * Honiix: This seems to be a common way to use the venv's python, set in the inventory `all:... (full message at https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/libera.chat/0ff2ea23d82d95968555c624e3a1a9d19583a1bc)
13:32:55 <gwmngilfen-work> cidrblock: two line breaks
13:33:00 <gwmngilfen-work> then ```
13:33:07 <cidrblock[m]> * Honiix: This seems to be a common way to use the venv's python, set in the inventory
13:33:07 <cidrblock[m]> all:
13:33:07 <cidrblock[m]> vars:
13:33:07 <cidrblock[m]> ansible_python_interpreter: python
13:33:12 <gwmngilfen-work> the markdown parser in element is picky ;)
13:33:26 <cidrblock[m]> * Honiix: This seems to be a common way to use the venv's python, set in the inventory... (full message at https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/libera.chat/75c7139e5738c11381fb72f14fdb7ede4c09f1cf)
13:33:36 <cidrblock[m]> * Honiix: This seems to be a common way to use the venv's python, set in the inventory... (full message at https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/libera.chat/ac328b99808168b80092931a7130a01e5c096885)
13:35:25 <Honiix[m]> cidrblock: My question was about the dependencies required by collections that are either available via pip or the package manager.
13:38:26 <JoshCorrick[m]> Is the -docker switch for ansible-test using docker, or can you use podman?
13:38:45 <gwmngilfen-work> > podman works well with the latest development/beta version of ansible-core
13:38:45 <gwmngilfen-work> Josh Corrick ^
13:38:47 <cidrblock[m]> Honiix: ah...collections that have python deps that require different python versions....messy :)
13:39:37 <gwmngilfen-work> Josh Corrick: oh, core vs test. felixfontein does that change the answer? :)
13:39:43 <felixfontein> JoshCorrick[m]: for ansible-core 2.12.0b1, `--docker` will prefer Docker if available, but will pick podman if it isn't. you can set ANSIBLE_TEST_PREFER_PODMAN=1 to make it first try podman.
13:40:41 <Enphuego[m]> where are the setup playbooks used in the example?
13:40:42 <felixfontein> gwmngilfen-work: ansible-test is part of ansible-core, ansible-base, and Ansible 2.9 :) the version that's part of ansible-core 2.12.0b1 is the most advanced one that works well with podman
13:41:48 <Tas-sos> Thank you tadeboro ! :-)
13:42:12 <gwmngilfen-work> tadeboro++
13:42:26 <andersson007_[m]> thanks tadeboro!
13:44:52 <cidrblock[m]> felixfontein: Platform 2.1 (this fall) will use containerized Ansible known as "execution environments" The EE's that are provided with the platform will be based on ansible-core 2.12
13:45:13 <joshcorr[m]> felixfontein: I'll be honest been confused about this one (newer to Ansible here), but what is the difference between `ansible-core, ansible-base, and Ansible 2.9`. Core, base seem like synonyms
13:45:26 <felixfontein> cidrblock[m]: that's great news!
13:45:40 <gwmngilfen-work> ^ paging dmsimard and his many explanations
13:46:09 <felixfontein> joshcorr[m]: after Ansible 2.9, Ansible was split up into ansible-base (which contains the `ansible`, `ansible-playbook`, ..., `ansible-test` CLI commands), and a set of collections. for version 2.11 ansible-base was renamed to ansible-core (hopefully it will keep this name)
13:46:40 <dmsimard[m]> joshcorr: ansible-base existed during 2.10 and was renamed to ansible-core in 2.11 -- you can read more about it here: https://www.ansible.com/blog/ansible-3.0.0-qa
13:46:43 <felixfontein> so basically ansible-base is the old name of ansible-core which you can hopefully ignore if you don't need it for some strange reason ;)
13:47:18 <dmsimard> #topic Main Track for the Ansible Contributor Summit presentations | YouTube stream for Day1 - https://youtu.be/rk73ND-uP3A | Bridged to #ansible-conf on Libera - if joining from Libera, please be aware the channel is logged on Matrix
13:47:21 <cidrblock[m]> joshcorr: ansible 2.9 was the last pre-collection split distribution of ansible, ansible-base was the original name of the content-less ansible package, ansible-core is the name moving forward... (ansible-base was only used for a short time)
13:47:43 <cidrblock[m]> s/-/ /
13:47:44 <Honiix[m]> Thanks tadeboro for the great presentation and the answers!
13:47:50 <gwmngilfen-work> great demo tadeboro
13:49:34 <joshcorr[m]> Thanks dmsimard cidrblock and felixfontein for clearing that up. Makes sense now.
13:51:15 <andersson007_[m]> for folks who missed, ompragash is talking about instruqt learning scenarios now, see the links above
13:51:17 <cybette_> https://www.ansible.com/products/ansible-community-training
13:51:28 <gwmngilfen-work> for new joiners coming in for ompragash's talk, do ask questions as we go, and we'll collate them for later
13:53:15 <dmsimard[m]> If you want to chat about the labs and workshops, there is #ansible-workshops on libera is bridged to matrix: https://matrix.to/#/#workshops:ansible.com -- while the conference may move on, feel free to go at your pace and there are people available to answer questions
13:53:38 <gwmngilfen-work> #workshops:ansible.com / #ansible-workshops on Libera
13:54:01 <gwmngilfen-work> hey Toshio くらとみ :)
13:54:18 <Toshio[m]> Good morning :-)
13:54:20 <felixfontein> good morning toshio!
13:57:06 <netopsengineer[m> As someone who is comfortable with creating modules, and collections, at small scale, what type of resources are available for "noobs" for the more advanced developer experience type tools like antsi-bull or collection_prep, and helping learn the developer workflow around those tools?  Day 0 turn up you guys have made modules and collections straightforward with the `init` commands, but the Day 1 and beyond maintenance seems like
13:57:06 <netopsengineer[m> a steep step for someone new with current documentation around those topics.
13:57:36 <gwmngilfen-work> netopsengineer: sounds like a perfect question for the "ask a maintainer" session that's up next
13:58:12 <timeisler[m]> Why was curl used to get timezone.py instead of an ansible-galaxy cmd?
13:59:03 <jrglynn2> huh, learned something new about vim, who knew :-)
13:59:03 <samccann> very slow in pulling myself together this am!
13:59:50 <gwmngilfen-work> samccann: me every morning
14:00:22 <cidrblock[m]> netopsengineer: This is specifically for developing network resource modules, https://github.com/ansible-network/cli_rm_builder In the future there should be a more generic scaffolding tool that isn't network specific.....  << this is WIP but I don't have a timeline for when the code will be in a public repo
14:00:24 <gwmngilfen-work> jrglynn2: i'm fairly certain it isn't possible to know everything about vim, there's a quantum thing going on)
14:00:45 <jrglynn2> gwmngilfen-work: ha! truth
14:01:23 <gundalow> We'd love your feedback on Instruqt. We will randomly select 5 people to give some swag to https://github.com/ansible/instruqt/discussions/54
14:01:25 <gwmngilfen-work> dmsimard: shall i add netopsengineer's q to your session? seems to fit?
14:01:52 <felixfontein> netopsengineer[m: you only really need antsibull if you want to create a similar docsite to https://docs.ansible.com/ansible/latest/collections/; antsibull-changelog on the other hand is useful for creating changelogs similar to the Ansible and ansible-core changelog
14:02:32 <felixfontein> netopsengineer[m: for changelogs, there are docs here: https://github.com/ansible-community/antsibull-changelog/blob/main/docs/changelogs.rst#changelogs-for-collections and https://docs.ansible.com/ansible/devel/community/development_process.html#changelogs-how-to
14:02:37 <andersson007_[m]> great demo ompragash , thanks!
14:02:39 <netopsengineer[m> cidrblock: I came across that recently, I am a network guy as my name implies and was excited to see that :)  Again makes it easy to turn up, but as it gets more complex, how do I keep it documented, change-log, etc where those other tools I mentioned come in handy.  The docs kind of assume that you know what to do, and when to do it, like you had done it before, so geared from a different perspective of learning.
14:02:54 <nilashishc> netopsengineer: just extending what Brad said, there's a Developer Guide for developing Resource Modules using cli_rm_builder: https://github.com/ansible-network/cli_rm_builder/blob/main/docs/rm_dev_guide.md.
14:03:30 <timeisler[m]> Thank you.
14:03:52 <gwmngilfen-work> good work ompragash !
14:03:57 <felixfontein> netopsengineer[m: creating docsites with antsibull there aren't docs yet I think, though running `antsibull-docs sphinx-init --use-current foo.bar` in a new directory will create you a skeleton sphinx site with a requirements.txt and build script for a collection foo.bar (that needs to be installed somewhere so that ansible can find it)
14:04:14 <dmsimard[m]> gwmngilfen-work: sure, it has been answered in some capacity but it's a good topic to talk about
14:04:59 <cidrblock[m]> netopsengineer: yeah, collection_prep helps a little with the README, cli_rm_builder can be used to re-sync the argpec with the docstring....  If you want to interact directly with the ansible network team about these tools, there is a network slack channel, I think it just got bridged to matrix too
14:05:17 <cidrblock[m]> netopsengineer: they, an I would love the feedback
14:05:24 <cidrblock[m]> s/an/and/
14:06:06 <wolftales[m]> Yes - more links
14:06:31 <joshcorr[m]> Did one of the labs yesterday, and it is very helpful. Thank you!
14:06:38 <gundalow> netopsengineer: Hi, and welcome. You make a good point, we do "jump" in skill level a bit from today's session to Friday's session. I'd hope that some of Friday's topics would be useful
14:07:45 <gwmngilfen-work> reminder that for questions about the hackathon or working through the Instruqt courses, we have the #workshops:ansible.com / #ansible-workshops room waiting for you
14:08:08 <gundalow> joshcorr: Would love to hear your feedback via https://github.com/ansible/instruqt/discussions/54
14:08:47 <netopsengineer[m> gundalow: look forward to seeing the future sessions as well.  I work for a large enterprise, so while I can't publish the docs to github per se, if one day I could, I want to be developing them in the context that its possible.   So the tools that scaffold projects, and help maintain those projects, help when building large shareable projects that are custom to our org
14:09:01 <gundalow> wolftales: Hi there, I might have missed the context. What links are you interested in
14:09:21 <felixfontein> netopsengineer[m: using antsibull / sphinx can also be useful for an internal docsite :)
14:10:14 <gundalow> netopsengineer: That's fairly common (private collections). Reviewing your collection against https://github.com/ansible-collections/overview/blob/main/collection_requirements.rst would help identify some things that could be improved
14:10:31 <dmsimard[m]> While we're on break, you can look at the workshops from the previous session at https://www.ansible.com/products/ansible-community-training
14:10:46 <wolftales[m]> gundalow: On the summary, not sure what the expectation was for these - watching/overview, or following along. So feeling a little lost at the moment.
14:12:29 <gwmngilfen-work> wolftales: i *think* the intention is to give a flavour, and then if you diced to give Instruqt a go, we'll be around to support throught the day (and to be honest on other days, but perhaps with less focus :P)
14:12:31 <tadeboro> netopsengineer[m: From my personal experience, there is not much one needs to do once the collections is "established". Running tests on a schedule is the only thing we actually do most of the time.
14:12:52 <gwmngilfen-work> s/*think*/_think_/, s/diced/decidedto/, s/to//
14:13:45 <gundalow> wolftales: ah, sure. I know it can be confusing as people join at various points though the day. https://hackmd.io/AcI9TZf_SZqi7NG3ZyplnA?view is the agenda
14:13:45 <gundalow> What's you experience with contributing?
14:13:45 <gundalow> We are here all day to answer any questions you may have
14:13:45 <gundalow> If you are fairly new the Instruqt Courses are a great way to (safely) learn https://hackmd.io/AcI9TZf_SZqi7NG3ZyplnA?view#Self-paced-Instruqt
14:13:54 <tadeboro> netopsengineer[m: But what we always do is create a developer guide for collections we maintain where things like setting up development environment, generating docs, making releases are documented.
14:14:22 <tadeboro> netopsengineer[m: https://sensu.github.io/sensu-go-ansible/hacking.html is one such example.
14:14:41 <wolftales[m]> gwmngilfen-work: Thanks, that context would have helped me from trying to find files. Sorry, new to this and trying to get a handle on everything :)
14:15:06 <gwmngilfen-work> wolftales: we hear that, please do just ask and we'll help where we can
14:15:53 <wolftales[m]> > <@gundalow:ansible.im> wolftales: ah, sure. I know it can be confusing as people join at various points though the day. https://hackmd.io/AcI9TZf_SZqi7NG3ZyplnA?view is the agenda... (full message at https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/libera.chat/ea3df5d9faa975025dc91fd7138d13d548a070a6)
14:15:59 <netopsengineer[m> tadeboro: We typically are creating curated "live mop" type collections of utilities and tools, to execute different maintenance related activities, pre-checks, post-checks, etc, so things change frequently for us
14:21:28 <Enphuego[m]> so I can't for the life of me find the ansible playbooks from the first session - I saw he ran 'vagrant provision ansible' but that must be his own vagrant file?
14:21:43 <tadeboro> netopsengineer[m: I am not sure if there are any special tools that would help you in this situation. Sanity and integration tests can help you ensure nothing breaks too badly, but that is about it.
14:22:05 <Enphuego[m]> googling 'ansible vagrant' is less than helpful - is there a vagrant prebuilt ansible VM?
14:22:20 <tadeboro> Enphuego[m]: Let me post those files to github now. Give me a minute and I will be back with a link.
14:23:00 <netopsengineer[m> tadeboro: it is more about documenting the instructions on how to use them, change-logs, breaking changes from previous versions, etc that is of interest
14:23:04 <cyberpear> it's great that we don't require signing up for marketing e-mail to use the instruqt challenges
14:24:21 <tadeboro> netopsengineer[m: For changelogs, there is antsibull-changelog if you need it, but we usually just require meaningful git commit messages.
14:24:28 <Enphuego[m]> Do the instruqt environments allow you to go off script?
14:25:11 <gwmngilfen-work> i don't think so, ompragash?
14:25:31 <gwmngilfen-work> that said, if an "off-script" question occurs to you, come and ask :)
14:26:28 <ompragash[m]1> Enphuego: no as we have check scripts at the end of each challenge
14:26:38 <gwmngilfen-work> @room when we get back from the break (5mins) we'll be giving an overview of the hackathon, and then hosting an "Ask A Maintainer" session with jillr, dmsimard, and spotz.
14:26:45 <netopsengineer[m> tadeboro: yeah it is more along the lines of constantly updating the docs on how to run them, creating the doc fragments, etc, as the end users are not reading the commit messages, they are using ansible-doc, the readme files in the repo's, etc.
14:26:49 * gwmngilfen-work will use room pings sparingly, promise
14:27:08 <cyberpear> `ansible-galaxy collection init community.clock` in the instruqt should be `ansible-galaxy collection init community/clock`
14:28:12 <gwmngilfen-work> morning jillr !
14:28:29 <jillr[m]> hola Gwmngilfen!
14:28:46 <gwmngilfen-work> reminders for those just coming in: stream is at: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rk73ND-uP3A, and please keep the Q&A coming, we will make sure it gets to the right place
14:31:13 <gundalow> WE ARE BACK
14:32:30 <tadeboro> Enphuego[m]: https://github.com/xlab-steampunk/ansible-dev-env contains the files I used during the talk.
14:33:05 <gwmngilfen-work> hackathon: #workshops:ansible.com
14:33:52 <gundalow> We will no start the Hackathon. We have a dedicated channel for this, so the discussion can continue over the next 4 days. So please join us in #workshops:ansible.com (IRC: `#ansible-workshops`)
14:35:01 <gundalow> This is a great chance to get some 1:1 support. Maybe you've got an idea for something, though unsure where to start.
14:37:26 <gwmngilfen-work> fsteve800: ^
14:37:27 <gundalow> Many years ago I started contributing to Ansible as a way to learn Git and understand GitHub's PR process. We are happy to help you in any part of the contributor process, such as: Setting up development environment; forking some code; How to write the code; Understanding how to test (ie ansible-test); How to create a Pull Request (PR).
14:38:20 <gwmngilfen-work> cybette: ❤️
14:38:34 <samccann> For docs, we'll be on ansible-docs /docs channels for any help you want with working on the docs!
14:38:46 <fsteve800[m]> yes i can put the solution here?
14:38:58 <SeanCavanaugh[m]> this is really cool gundalow!
14:39:14 <gwmngilfen-work> fsteve800: probably better in #workshops:ansible.com
14:39:20 <gundalow> Sean Cavanaugh: Thanks. A lot of people have put a lot of time and effort into this
14:40:42 <gundalow> Sean Cavanaugh: Since you are here. In the Instuqt lab's you folks have put together, what editor do you use for the labs? We got some good feedback from Simon Dodsley that using vim can be a bit of a pain, especially when pasting code
14:41:01 <SeanCavanaugh[m]> we use visual studio code, or rather an upstream browser version called code server
14:41:53 <SeanCavanaugh[m]> so visual studio code shows up in a tab within instruqt
14:42:01 * gwmngilfen-work switches back to the YT stream, hears himself
14:43:08 <gundalow> wernerfred: maniram477 Welcome to Ansible Contributor Summit. This is all very informal, so feel free to just ask question at anypoint.
14:43:08 <gundalow> Agenda: https://hackmd.io/AcI9TZf_SZqi7NG3ZyplnA?both
14:43:08 <gundalow> We are about to start the hackathons, feel free to join us in #workshops:ansible.com details: https://hackmd.io/AcI9TZf_SZqi7NG3ZyplnA?both#Hackathon
14:44:11 <davdunc[m]> you have made things very clear.
14:48:28 <gundalow> Sean Cavanaugh: Thanks. Is vscode overkill for editing just a small file? Wondering if you've found a better text editor
14:48:28 * gwmngilfen-work is ready for more Q&A!
14:51:49 <gwmngilfen-work> i am excited about "meaningful contrbutions without code"
14:51:49 <gwmngilfen-work> since i am a frequently terrible developer
14:51:54 <zbr> if anyione has qestions on molecule/lint, i am here.
14:56:45 <fsteve800[m]> gundalow: anybody speaking about issue resolution like https://github.com/ansible-collections/community.windows/issues/284
14:57:47 <gundalow> fsteve800: Let me see if any of the Windows experts are around. FYI we have `#ansible-windows` channel
14:58:33 <gwmngilfen-work> for those wishing to explore the full range of (Matrix) rooms, join #space:ansible.im
14:58:53 <netopsengineer[m> gundalow: while vscode can be overkill, I like to start my new folks to Ansible off in it, because I can worry less about intimidating them with all of the Git commands, and so forth, its a single pane of glass to editing, and push-button Git functionality, plus while it has some quirks, the Ansible language engine extension is pretty great for showing them documentation as they hover, and auto-suggest things.   So folks who are
14:58:53 <netopsengineer[m> likely to be new, and be in some of the intsruqt classes because of it, might find it more comfortable to get started more quickly.
14:58:55 <gwmngilfen-work> oh, hey spotz ! all three presenters are here \o/
14:59:13 <spotz> gwmngilfen-work: Yep:)
15:00:18 <gwmngilfen-work> ok, next session is about to start, and as this is "ask a maintainer", you;d better start getting your questions in!
15:00:58 <gwmngilfen-work> I'll go with "how can I make the maintainers life easier?" because thats the same as "how does my patch get merged quicker" :)
15:01:24 <maniram477[m]> Hi all. I'm looking at ansible after a very long time and able to see some new features like collections.  After taking a glance at the documentation I came to an understanding that collections are analogous to docker images and galaxy.yaml is kind of Dockerfile. Please correct me whether my understanding is correct.
15:02:19 <gwmngilfen-work> I'm also interested in the "non-code contributions" topic too ;)
15:02:33 <gwmngilfen-work> 👋
15:02:36 <Tas-sos> o/
15:02:45 <Toshio[m]> maniram477: I think collections are more like python packages.  There's another new thing called execution environments that are more like docker images.
15:02:49 <Honiix[m]> I maintain stuff that I'm the only user... that's count? ;)
15:03:31 <gwmngilfen-work> Honiix: heh, we all start somewhere
15:03:37 <relrod[m]> Honiix[m]: if it's open source, it absolutely counts.
15:03:41 <utoddl[m]> maniram477: Collections are more of a packaging format for facilitating sharing Ansible assets — roles, plugins, etc.
15:04:15 <Enphuego[m]> All I'm going to say is that for a tool that is about automation, it's waaay too hard to get Ansible running
15:04:52 <Toshio[m]> maniram477: collections contain a set of plugins (mostly modules but the other plugins are supported as well).  When you install the collection, you have access to all of those modules (via a fully qualified name).  For instance, I can use `ansible-galaxy collection install ansible.posix`.  Then I can run `ansible -m ansible.posix.synchronize [..]`
15:05:12 <tadeboro> Enphuego[m]: Getting ansible to run is just one "pip install ansible" away.
15:05:18 <Honiix[m]> Question: What's the better option between 1 big repo for the whole collection or 1 repo per role + meta repo for the collection?
15:05:34 <tadeboro> Enphuego[m]: Getting development environment up is a bit trickier, but not much.
15:05:43 <felixfontein> Enphuego[m]: do you mean setting up a ansible dev environment? that's definitely harder and can be made still easier :)
15:06:04 <gwmngilfen-work> jillr: ooh, the burn 🔥
15:06:31 <Enphuego[m]> needs vagrant box add generic/ansible --provider virtualbox
15:06:35 <felixfontein> (docker not working out of the box on some platforms makes this harder, and ansible-core's ansible-test only properly supporting podman in the latest beta does as well, but fortunately with 2.12 GA that improves :) )
15:07:03 <gwmngilfen-work> spotz: i'm definitely asking a leading question there :)
15:07:14 <Enphuego[m]> So I just mean that if you are starting from literal scratch as a non-python developer there are a lot of prereqs especially if you typically run Windows
15:07:42 <Enphuego[m]> you need vagrant, ansible on host, virtualbox, docker in VM, python virtualenv etc
15:08:55 <gwmngilfen-work> good answers jillr dmsimard spotz
15:09:10 <gwmngilfen-work> reminder, ask your questions here and we'll relay them
15:10:01 <ptoal[m]> We could always use more empathy. :)
15:10:19 <samccann> Enphuego: are you talking about as a new Ansible user or new ansible developer?
15:10:32 <gwmngilfen-work> empathy++
15:10:45 <gundalow> netopsengineer: I keep on meaning to spend some time to look at VScode. You make a good point that it's a good integration environment. FYI the folks in #devtools:ansible.com are creating a VScode plugin which is going to make it a lot easier to make good quality Ansible content  https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/items?itemName=redhat.ansible https://github.com/ansible/vscode-ansible
15:10:52 <Enphuego[m]> new Ansible user mostly... but trying to throw together the dev environment in 30 minutes and not happening
15:11:08 <Enphuego[m]> and that's with experience setting up Ansible servers before
15:12:20 <spotz> gwmngilfen-work: hehe
15:13:04 <zbr> Can I answer? "collections!", usually not too many of them as this would incur other maintenance costs.
15:13:09 <samccann> Enphuego: I'm one of the docs writers for Ansible and would love to get more details on your experiences as a new ansible user (and developer if you are trying to do both).  We can chat sometime here in irc/matrix or if you prefer, would love your thoughts in an Ansible issue so we can track where theproblem areas are that we might be able to address with better docs etc  - https://github.com/ansible/ansible/issues
15:13:17 <JorgeRodriguez[m> Enphuego: I generally just use a python virtual environment with whatever Ansible is available on PIP, that works for my development needs. But then again I'm working on collections, I don't know that it will work for ansible core development
15:13:33 <gwmngilfen-work> samccann: Enphuego or join #docs:ansible.com :)
15:13:52 <zbr> openstack just made few initial steps towards collections, the old standalone-roles approach proved to not scale well.
15:14:00 <timeisler[m]> I ran ansible-test sanity on my fork of the ansible-core repo to get a baseline before I add my change. I got many errors from the pylint and rstcheck tests. Is it expected and safe for me to proceed?
15:14:05 <davdunc[m]> I have found that there are some things in specific collections that aren't available for testing in say molecule without escalated privileges for the environment. How do you go about mocking up the tests for things like that so that they can be verified longer term? I am specifically thinking of the example of adding "additional-info" in the community.aws.ec2_instance
15:14:30 <felixfontein> timeisler[m]: did you use the `--docker` argument for ansible-test or not?
15:15:02 <felixfontein> timeisler[m]: the number of errors depends a lot on the installed versions of tools like rstcheck and pylint; with --docker you will use the same versions that are used in CI
15:15:18 <gwmngilfen-work> jillr++
15:16:19 <timeisler[m]> Ah, good point felixfontein. I must retry with --docker. i did just learn that earlier today. Thanks.
15:16:27 <samccann> timeisler: usually rstcheck errors are 'bad'. But as others say, it's important to be running the same tools and versions that CI does.
15:16:31 <gwmngilfen-work> jillr: i think it's easier for a single maintainer to end up as a community manager without ever realising they signed up for that job, and help with it is usually well received
15:16:37 <gwmngilfen-work> s/easier/easy/
15:17:03 <andersson007_[m]> i do like @jillr 's explanation of non-code contribution and its importance
15:17:08 <gwmngilfen-work> 💯
15:17:17 <jrglynn2> andersson007_[m]: agreed
15:17:37 <gwmngilfen-work> all my contributions to ansible are technically non-code (even though my stats have a fair amount of my own code :P)
15:18:43 <cybette_> docs, answering questions, sharing experiences, blog posts, organize meetups, making connections, translations, etc.
15:19:06 <gwmngilfen-work> spotz: yes! signposting people and making sure they get help is a leadership thing for sure
15:19:08 <timeisler[m]> samccann: Thank you. I shall retry with --docker and also review the docs. They seemed to be focused on collections and modules not core code but I shall reread now.
15:19:47 <SeanCavanaugh[m]> gundalow: what is your favorite ansible content collection and why?
15:20:57 <gundalow> Sean Cavanaugh: favourite depends on what you mean (coolest, best community, most useful to me). My least favourite collection is community.general
15:21:21 <SeanCavanaugh[m]> most useful to gundalow
15:21:21 <felixfontein> gundalow: :P :D
15:21:25 <andersson007_[m]> FYI we have the collection review checklist https://github.com/ansible/community-docs/blob/main/review_checklist.rst
15:22:07 <dmsimard[m]> https://mtlynch.io/code-review-love/ has some ideas about thoughtful code review :)
15:22:12 <jrglynn2> andersson007_[m]: ahh thank you, i was wondering if something like that existed
15:22:35 <andersson007_[m]> jrglynn2: you're welcome!:)
15:22:49 <timeisler[m]> <felixfontein> "timeisler: the number of..." <- I did not but I shall do it soon. Thanks.
15:23:31 <gwmngilfen-work> jillr: 🫖
15:23:46 <JorgeRodriguez[m> Github discussions is a good tool to keep that kind of communication going
15:25:48 <andersson007_[m]> Jorge Rodriguez: thanks for joining us!:)
15:26:32 <JorgeRodriguez[m> andersson007_: my pleasure
15:28:07 <Qalthos[m]> SrRaven: Hooray you found us
15:28:40 <netopsengineer[m> Thankful for dmsimard's work on ARA, always helpful and reachable!
15:30:13 <Honiix[m]> Question: Do you look at the licenses used in collections/role ?
15:30:18 <gwmngilfen-work> thanks jillr dmsimard spotz !
15:30:35 <spotz> gwmngilfen-work: My pleasure thanks for having me:)
15:30:50 <gwmngilfen-work> "multitude of channels" -> see #space:ansible.im :P
15:30:52 <andersson007_[m]> i would also highlight importance of welcoming newcomers and thanking people for their contributions after things get merged
15:31:27 <gwmngilfen-work> #workshops:ansible.com / #ansible-workshops
15:31:58 <wolftales[m]> Thank you!
15:32:06 <Tas-sos> Thank you very very much! :-D
15:32:11 <davdunc[m]> Thank you! Great guidance.
15:32:18 <felixfontein> saying 'thanks' is always a good idea :)
15:32:27 <andersson007_[m]> thank you folks!
15:32:50 <timeisler[m]> Thank you all for presentations and answering my n00b questions.
15:33:04 <dmsimard[m]> Honiix[m]: In what context ?
15:33:16 <jrglynn2> thanks everyone, all of the sessions were very useful!
15:33:26 <gwmngilfen-work> thanks to all the speakers and attendees. feel free to keep chatting here, or join us in #workshops:ansible.com for some active participation!
15:33:27 <SeanCavanaugh[m]> sorry i was distracting gundalow he is one of my besties
15:34:07 <samccann> timeisler: if you continue to hit rstcheck problems, ping us on the docs channel as that is the tool that checks the docs .rst files
15:34:27 <timeisler[m]> samccann: ok. Thanks.
15:34:46 <andersson007_[m]> FYI we have the maintainer guidelines https://github.com/ansible/community-docs/blob/main/maintaining.rst if someone is interested in what it is and how to become a maintainer
15:34:58 <andersson007_[m]> would be also helpful for current maintainers
15:35:07 <Honiix[m]> dmsimard[m]: I mean, some time roles get included into a collection. Do all licence must be the same in that case?
15:35:19 <gwmngilfen-work> feel free to use this channel for general Fest backchat if you're attending, by the way
15:36:24 <felixfontein> thanks to all the speakers! :)
15:36:30 <felixfontein> (and of course also to all participants!)
15:38:13 <dmsimard[m]> Honiix[m]: That's more of an open source licensing question than it is an ansible one -- generally speaking, a lot of Ansible content is gplv3 because Ansible itself is gplv3.. I would say, as someone who is not a lawyer, that it is simpler and generally best if all the licensing matches :)
15:40:45 <Toshio[m]> Honiix: yeah, it is definitely simpler if all licenses match.  However, you could have roles under a different license.  I believe that the license field in the collection metadata takes a list now so you probably should list all of the licenses there.
15:41:39 <andersson007_[m]> Hope to see all the guys who are here today on Friday!
15:42:19 <Toshio[m]> I haven't thought about whether a role that imports another role when the two have incompatible licenses would be legal so that might be something to look out for.  A plugin and a role don't import from each other, though so they are okay to have incompatible licenses.
15:42:55 <Enphuego[m]> samccann: do you have a minute to discuss bootstrapping Ansible on a Windows host?
15:44:50 <samccann> Enphuego: I'd love to hear the problems, but I can't help you fix any of them if that makes sense. I write the docs, but I don't have the knowledge to help you out of any pickles you are facing.
15:44:59 <samccann> but yes I'm available
15:45:24 <Enphuego[m]> yeah that's not the issue... I can "fix" all the problems but lol if you think somebody new to Ansible can get a working VM ready
15:45:35 <Honiix[m]> dmsimard: Toshio くらとみ Thanks for the reply. The default is set à BSD in the role template. I wounder why it's not GPLv3.
15:45:50 <samccann> lol
15:46:14 <Enphuego[m]> well working is the wrong word... it will work but it will need to be rebuilt
15:46:21 <samccann> Enphuego: let's take it oveer to the docs channel
15:48:28 <Toshio[m]> Honiix: My guess for that is that setting the template to a non-copyleft license made it clear that people who started with the template and then expanded it could license their code however they wanted.  (if it was GPL, then some people would wonder if they were allowed to license other than GPL since they were "including" the template in ther role)
15:49:39 <Honiix[m]> Toshio くらとみ: Ho it makes sense!
15:52:57 <Honiix[m]> Thanks to everyone. Very informative afternoon! I look forward to be back here. But I've to go til tomorrow :(
15:53:11 <dmsimard> We're here all week, have fun o/
15:53:16 <jtanner> gwmngilfen-work: cumulatve per month, or cumulative over all time?
15:53:24 <jtanner> for unique contributors
15:53:56 <jtanner> the slope makes me assume over all time
16:28:01 <jdelaporte> Hello folks! Was the session on setting up a dev environment recorded?
16:29:00 <dmsimard> jdelaporte: all sessions were recorded, yes
16:36:25 <cybette_> jdelaporte: we will edit the videos later, in the meantime you can access it from this part of the live stream https://youtu.be/rk73ND-uP3A?t=635
16:37:59 <jdelaporte> cybette: Thanks; I just found it, too!
16:38:22 <cybette_> great!
16:38:39 <jdelaporte> Who here would be interested in working on win_dsc module?
16:39:58 <timeisler[m]> cybette_: and https://github.com/xlab-steampunk/ansible-dev-env contains the files used during the "dev env" talk.
16:40:37 <jdelaporte> timeisler[m]: thanks!
16:42:28 <briantist> jdelaporte: what are you interested in changing in `win_dsc`?
16:42:49 <Toshio[m]> jdelaporte: I'm not sure who's around and interested in windows modules at the moment but there is the #windows:ansible.com channel if you aren't aware of it.
16:43:13 <briantist> Toshio[m]: I'm around and interested :)
16:43:27 <Toshio[m]> Cool :-)
16:43:50 <briantist> but I'm also in the #ansible-windows channel
16:43:54 <dmsimard> or #ansible-windows on IRC ^ yeah
16:43:56 <jdelaporte> briantist: This issue has a workaround proposed. I would love another pair of eyes on it. https://github.com/ansible-collections/ansible.windows/issues/15#issuecomment-802962322
16:45:05 <jdelaporte> I can move this to #ansible-windows
17:04:21 <gwmngilfen-work> Thanks to everyone for today! I'm collecting feedback for a blog  post I'll write after the event, so your comments on how this way of running a conference worked for you are very welcome - speakers, attendees, organisers, I want to hear it :)
17:04:21 <gwmngilfen-work> Feel free to DM me if you're not comfortable with public feedback.
17:05:46 * gundalow waves to jdelaporte :)
17:13:04 <zbiles[m]> > <@gwmngilfen:ansible.im> Thanks to everyone for today! I'm collecting feedback for a blog  post I'll write after the event, so your comments on how this way of running a conference worked for you are very welcome - speakers, attendees, organisers, I want to hear it :)
17:13:04 <zbiles[m]> > Feel free to DM me if you're not comfortable with public feedback.
17:13:04 <zbiles[m]> As someone who's brand new to all of this, especially matrix it was a little bit difficult to figure out what was happening where. Like where the livestream was and how we're supposed to interact with everything. took me most of the livestream to get this all figured out, so now I'll have to go back and re-watch things. Not so much a problem, just more administrative trouble. Admittedly, I also found out about this whole event 15 min
17:13:04 <zbiles[m]> before it started, so I was scrambling to begin with which didn't help. Maybe it's just me, but the hackmd was a little cluttered and hard to pick out the info I needed. I think having all the notes on how to join things in one section together instead of split up would have been more readable in my opinion. All in all, great event and I really appreciate all the info so far! Looking forward to more on Friday.
17:15:03 <gwmngilfen-work> Yeah, improving the hackmd is already on our postmortem, I think
17:15:07 <gwmngilfen-work> Thanks!
17:15:55 <felixfontein> zbiles[m]: out of curiosity, which matrix client are you using?
17:19:00 <wolftales[m]> I see there is an old bug report for `instruqt` not allowing cut-n-paste for firefox. It still doesn't work on firefox today. I had to switch to Edge
17:20:33 <gundalow> wolftales: Interesting. Could you please add that to https://github.com/ansible/instruqt/discussions/54
17:20:33 <gundalow> We (Red Hat) have a support contract with Instruqt so we can follow up with them
17:21:54 <gundalow> zbiles: Hi there. Thanks for the feedback. We've changed a lot of things this time round. I think you are right the hackmd has too much in it, so is hard to follow. Out of interest, where did you find out about the Contributor Summit? We likely need to promote the day in other places.
17:21:58 <wolftales[m]> > <@gundalow:ansible.im> wolftales: Interesting. Could you please add that to https://github.com/ansible/instruqt/discussions/54
17:21:58 <wolftales[m]> > We (Red Hat) have a support contract with Instruqt so we can follow up with them
17:21:58 <wolftales[m]> Yes I can. I added a note to `https://github.com/instruqt/instruqt/issues/2`
17:24:37 <zbiles[m]> <felixfontein> "zbiles: out of curiosity..." <- Went with element, but I looked at a couple different ones while I was creating an account. There's so much to choose from it's a bit overwhelming. I never used IRC either so I didn't have past experience to draw from there. I'm used to slack/teams.
17:25:16 <gwmngilfen-work> Element is what we recommend to new folks too, for exactly that reason. Glad you got there!
17:26:01 <zbiles[m]> gundalow: I'm in the netdev, ntc, and ansible slacks. Saw your post actually. haha if you had posted on it previously I must have missed it.
17:26:57 <gundalow> zbiles: ah, cool. I didn't post in there as often I should have :(
17:27:17 <zbiles[m]> gundalow: No worries, I got here eventually 🙂 haha
17:28:10 <gundalow> oh, you are in all three, so you really got spammed today then :)
17:28:10 <gundalow> netdev.netdev collection community has really picked up in the past few weeks, it's great to see
17:29:20 <zbiles[m]> > <@gundalow:ansible.im> oh, you are in all three, so you really got spammed today then :)
17:29:20 <zbiles[m]> > netdev.netdev collection community has really picked up in the past few weeks, it's great to see
17:29:20 <zbiles[m]> Yeah, no chance I missed it today 😀
17:30:49 <wolftales[m]> gundalow: One issue that is likely being a new user - conferencing seems very awkward on here. Video doesn't shift between speakers. And it seems problematic to restore once minimized.
17:33:04 <gundalow> wolftales: Oh, didn't realise that. Thanks for the feedback, I'll add it to the retrospective document
17:34:55 * cybette_ afk for the next hour or so to grab some dinner. will be back later if anyone wants to chat about Ansible meetups! (I think there's one going on right now in Zurich!)
17:35:48 <dmsimard> #endmeeting