17:03:04 #startmeeting Fedora CommOps (2018-11-28) 17:03:04 Meeting started Wed Nov 28 17:03:04 2018 UTC. 17:03:04 This meeting is logged and archived in a public location. 17:03:04 The chair is jwf. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 17:03:04 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 17:03:04 The meeting name has been set to 'fedora_commops_(2018-11-28)' 17:03:06 #meetingname commops 17:03:06 The meeting name has been set to 'commops' 17:03:08 #nick commops 17:03:12 #topic Agenda 17:03:18 #link https://infinote.fedoraproject.org/cgit/infinote/tree/meeting-templates/fedora-commops-meeting-next 17:03:21 #info (1) Roll call / Q&A 17:03:23 #info (2) Announcements 17:03:24 .hello2 17:03:26 jonatoni: jonatoni 'Jona Azizaj' 17:03:27 * jonatoni is around 17:03:27 #info (3) Action items from last meeting 17:03:29 #info (4) Tickets 17:03:31 #info (5) Open floor 17:03:33 #topic Roll call / Q&A 17:03:35 #info Name; Timezone; Sub-projects/Interest Areas 17:03:37 #action commops New members, please introduce yourself on the CommOps Discourse [ https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/c/project/commops ] 17:03:40 If this is your first time at a CommOps meeting, feel free to introduce yourself to everyone and say hello! If anyone has any questions before we get started with the rest of the agenda, now is also a good time to ask. 17:03:43 * jwf waves to jonatoni 17:03:45 Good evening :-) 17:03:49 #chair jonatoni 17:03:49 Current chairs: jonatoni jwf 17:04:06 * jonatoni waves to jwf :) 17:04:15 Good evening :) 17:04:20 Hi all 17:04:47 hi VibroMax 17:05:29 * jwf waves to VibroMax 17:05:31 Hello! 17:05:34 Hi jonatoni: 17:05:42 We'll wait a couple more minutes for anyone else, and then jump in. 17:05:57 * jwf is also digging for announcements 17:06:02 Hi jwf 17:08:00 #info Alberto Rodriguez S; UTC-6; CommOps, Marketing, Fedora Join, dotnet and more 17:08:18 #info Justin W. Flory; UTC-5; CommOps, D&I Team, Fedora Badges 17:08:23 * jwf waves to bt0 17:08:27 #chair VibroMax bt0 17:08:27 Current chairs: VibroMax bt0 jonatoni jwf 17:08:37 Let's go ahead and get started :-) 17:08:46 * jonatoni waves to bt0 17:08:46 #topic Announcements 17:08:54 #info === "Report: GSoC Mentor Summit 2018" === 17:08:54 #link https://communityblog.fedoraproject.org/gsoc-mentor-summit-2018/ 17:08:54 #info A summary of what happened this year at the Google Summer of Code Mentor Summit, attended by Sumantro Mukherjee and Martin Bříza. 17:09:04 #info === "Secret plans revealed: what CommOps hopes to accomplish in Fedora 30 release cycle" === 17:09:04 #link https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/t/secret-plans-revealed-what-commops-hopes-to-accomplish-in-fedora-30-release-cycle/716 17:09:04 #info Summary of what we discussed last week / planning ahead for the future. 17:09:06 17:09:16 * jonatoni loves event reports :) 17:09:17 It was a quiet week last week, I suspect because of the US holiday week 17:09:28 jonatoni: I have this one queued up to read today :-) 17:09:36 Anyone else have something to share? 17:10:26 #info election nominations post on commblog: https://communityblog.fedoraproject.org/elections-nominations-now-open/ 17:10:30 #info election nominations post on commblog: https://communityblog.fedoraproject.org/elections-nominations-now-open/ 17:11:27 bt0++ good one to share :-) 17:11:37 Announcements, going once… 17:11:48 Going twice… 17:11:52 And thrice. 17:11:58 #topic Action items from last meeting 17:12:06 #link https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-commops/2018-10-31/commops.2018-10-31-16.03.html 17:12:06 #info How This Works: We look at past #action items from the last meeting for quick follow-up. If a task is completed, we move on to the next one. If it isn't, we get an update and re-action if needed. If no status, we'll try to get a quick update and move forward. 17:12:11 bt0 Complete a first draft of new CommOps docs page on suggested Pagure tags (due: post-FAW, revisit later) 17:12:23 bt0: Do you want to set a date for this one now that FAW wrapped up? 17:12:50 the next monday is fine for me 17:12:55 Okay, perfect 17:13:21 #action bt0 Complete a first draft of new CommOps docs page on suggested Pagure tags (due: Monday, Dec. 3rd) 17:13:29 #info === [COMPLETE] "jwf Archive CommOps mailing list" === 17:13:29 #link https://pagure.io/fedora-commops/issue/178#comment-542414 17:13:29 #info CommOps list now has an updated description, rejects new posts to the list, and requires moderation for new subscriptions. 17:13:37 #info === [COMPLETE] "jwf Start a new Discourse thread to solicit feedback on F30 planning focus" === 17:13:37 #link https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/t/secret-plans-revealed-what-commops-hopes-to-accomplish-in-fedora-30-release-cycle/716 17:13:37 #info Link also shared over to Mindshare mailing list. 17:13:43 17:14:00 Nothing else is pending, so we can look at tickets next. 17:14:08 #topic Tickets 17:14:08 #link https://pagure.io/fedora-commops/issues?status=Open&priority=20 17:14:36 I highlighted the three tickets we selected last week. 17:14:47 #topic Ticket #186: "Run worldcloudbot on @fedoracommunity Twitter account" 17:14:47 #link https://pagure.io/fedora-commops/issue/186 17:15:10 #info Next steps: Need to find a willing volunteer to play with Python and fedmsg. Some coding background is helpful, but it should not be complex. If no volunteers in the meeting, let's find a way to make this task more visible in the Fedora community. Discourse? CommBlog? Reddit…? We can be creative. 17:15:45 I figure to ask here first. Is anyone interested in working on this ticket? 17:17:17 If not, I was wondering if we try to integrate this into GCI somehow or raise publicity for it across the community 17:17:34 GCI is almost over now :/ 17:17:43 it is too late for it 17:17:54 Oh, I forgot it's earlier in December 17:18:14 * bt0 is reading carefully 17:18:15 yeah 17:18:38 One way we could try to do this to write up a CommBlog article (like a "CommOps winter 2018 easyfix newsletter") and try sharing that more widely on social media or user communities 17:18:50 +1 17:18:54 +1 17:19:00 +1 17:19:02 #idea Write up a CommBlog article (like a "CommOps winter 2018 easyfix newsletter") and try sharing that more widely on social media or user communities 17:19:20 Seems like an easy agreement :-) 17:20:03 Does anyone want to take lead on a new CommBlog article to link and explain two or three CommOps "easyfix" tasks? 17:20:13 * jwf is also open to other ideas. Using Instagram or other social media…? 17:20:40 action me for the monday too 17:20:59 bt0: Super, I'll action you for the CommBlog article 17:21:10 :) 17:21:32 #action bt0 Write a CommBlog draft to link and explain two or three CommOps "easyfix" tasks for Winter 2018 (due: Monday, Dec. 3rd) 17:21:39 .thank bt0 17:21:39 jwf thinks bt0 is awesome and is happy they are helping! (Please don't forget to bt0++ also) 17:21:57 jonatoni: I wonder if we could use something like Instagram stories to highlight contribution opportunities like this. 17:22:07 .hello x3m oy 17:22:10 jwf: definitely yesss 17:22:14 * jwf waves to @x3mboy 17:22:17 .hello x3mboy 17:22:23 HI 17:22:24 #chair x3mboy 17:22:24 Current chairs: VibroMax bt0 jonatoni jwf x3mboy 17:22:34 It's lunch time 17:22:35 * jonatoni waves at x3mboy 17:22:40 So, I'm partially here 17:22:52 * bt0 waves at @x3mboy 17:22:56 jonatoni: Do you think you could help us do something creative on Instagram once the CommBlog article is published? 17:23:13 jwf: yes, I would be very happy to do that :) 17:23:18 Awesome :D 17:23:35 I love the idea 17:23:41 #idea Using Instagram stories to highlight contribution opportunities once CommBlog article publishes (cc: jonatoni) 17:24:13 I was wondering how we could try to reach new audiences with some of these things too :-) Could be a fun experiment to see. 17:24:26 Cool! So I think we have a plan for this ticket. 17:24:37 Anyone want to mention anything else for #186 or the wordcloudbot? 17:24:57 Going once… 17:25:07 Going twice… 17:25:17 And thrice. 17:25:24 :) 17:25:43 #topic Ticket #159: "Run a "Write the Docs" event targeting Fedora support groups" 17:25:43 #link https://pagure.io/fedora-commops/issue/159 17:25:58 #info Next steps: Identify barriers to contributing to docs as of today. Start generating a list of pain points. How can CommOps help smooth some of this points and make it easier for a first-time contributor to land their contribution without too much fuss? Start here as our base. 17:26:34 I was thinking we could do some brainstorming around this. I was thinking of a way to make this one more interactive, and I had an idea: 17:27:17 If different team members could run through different common tasks required to contribute to the docs, we could basically do a set of usability testing, see what we can get fixed in the project, or otherwise include in notes for contributing docs leading to the event. 17:27:36 This way, we can hopefully run an event that leads to more successful contributions and less frustrated potential contributors 17:27:41 Or that was my thinking, anyways 17:27:56 Wonder what you all think? 17:29:46 If it sounds like a good first step, we could come up with some test scenarios (make a pull request, run a development environment, etc.) and have different people do them, and report back in the ticket. What was easy, what was confusing, what could be improved? Like a couple of bullet points 17:30:19 sounds great, also we need to point for some intro materials like: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LkH2ugg49Ag (docs classroom) 17:30:40 .hello blaise 17:30:41 bpabon: blaise 'Blaise R Pabon' 17:30:54 Shyam (@Shyamjos) has joined the Telegram Group! 17:31:37 #link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LkH2ugg49Ag 17:31:41 asamalik++ 17:31:41 jwf: Karma for asamalik changed to 8 (for the current release cycle): https://badges.fedoraproject.org/tags/cookie/any 17:32:51 Uh-oh, Telegram bridge died… 17:33:12 bt0: Definitely! Using resources like that as a base is helpful. Maybe another task could be finding links for helpful starter resources, like the video, the docs contribution guide, etc. 17:33:20 * jwf waves to bpabon 17:33:27 bpabon: Hi, welcome back o/ 17:33:35 #chair bpabon 17:33:35 Current chairs: VibroMax bpabon bt0 jonatoni jwf x3mboy 17:35:44 #idea Running simple user tests to note difficult points of contributing to docs, adding comments to Pagure ticket with notes 17:36:00 #idea Collecting intro materials like videos and contribution guidelines 17:36:22 I could take an action to draft up some test cases and create new tickets for them 17:36:39 And then we can open them up too. They could fit into the easyfix newsletter even 17:36:43 cool 17:37:29 #action jwf Draft set of user testing scenarios for contributing to docs, create new tickets for each test scenario. Due: Friday, Nov. 30th. 17:38:39 I think this is okay for now 17:38:50 We can revisit next week. I think we're still very early on 17:38:52 #idea Sketch out constributor onboarding flows, similar to https://blog.sourcerer.io/designing-a-perfect-onboarding-flow-5285c4c3ca91 17:40:16 bpabon++ This would be a super idea to do too. I bet this feedback would be super valuable to the Docs development team but also for our own planning on this ticket 17:40:16 jwf: Karma for blaise changed to 1 (for the current release cycle): https://badges.fedoraproject.org/tags/cookie/any 17:40:44 This makes me think, I should probably reach out to the Design Team and get some feedback on the test scenarios, since this is more up their ally too. 17:41:02 #action jwf Share test scenarios with Design Team to get additional feedback 17:41:06 #idea Provide instrumentation to collect feedback and user responses to pages. (eg. "what could improve this page) to increase 2way feedback. 17:41:23 +1 sounds great 17:41:27 That could be done with filing a new Pagure issue too 17:41:34 Just to make that link visible and present 17:42:00 #info ^ file new Pagure issue on pagure.io/docs-fp-o 17:42:35 Super 17:42:39 In the fedora apps collection is there a diagram rederer we can use to create diagrams from text? (eg Graphviz or diagrams.js ?) 17:43:31 bpabon: I'm not sure what was used for that. I know there have been complaints about it being difficult to use though. It might be a good idea to consider another tool to visualize. I don't *think* that was something done in-house (versus a framework) but I'm not sure 17:43:59 But our use case could be different 17:44:53 [Also, since I don't think @dhanesh95 is here, I think we can skip ticket #108? It will be hard to discuss without him.] 17:46:20 Oh, sorry I didn't mean the tool used to create the Landing page https://apps.fedoraproject.org/ I meant something like https://www.websequencediagrams.com/ 17:46:39 Ooh, okay 17:47:02 #link https://www.websequencediagrams.com/ 17:47:35 That uses the ancient Graphviz library, so we could include Graphviz plugins for Antora and Pagure, etc. 17:47:42 bpabon: I understand what you are asking now. I'm not sure if there is a tool for that. I think the one even mattdm uses these days is a web app 17:48:14 Oh, hmm. 17:48:32 bpabon: What is the use case for Graphviz plugins in Antora / Pagure? 17:49:02 https://www.sphinx-doc.org/en/master/usage/extensions/graphviz.html 17:49:18 * jwf clicks 17:50:10 Oh, neat, I understand now. 17:50:20 Authors can compose elaborate workflows in text, publish them as diagrams, and updat the text without having to rearrange icons. 17:51:07 There's two ways to move forward with this: 17:51:17 * bt0 is amazed with the idea 17:51:33 1. A new Pagure RFE ticket on pagure.io/pagure to request Graphviz rendering support in the web browser 17:52:05 2. Probably asking in #fedora-docs / #freenode_#fedora-docs:matrix.org about where the best place to ask for Graphviz support in our docs is. 17:52:25 OK, I can provide lots of cadidate tools. 17:52:39 It would be cool to use a tool like this and actually make them visible in our docs too 17:53:16 bpabon: Would you want to investigate this one further and then open new Pagure / docs-fp-o tickets for better ways to visualize diagrams from text? 17:54:12 We can help point you to all the right places to go :-) 17:54:36 Yes, jwf I will add the ticket number here also. 17:55:21 bpabon: Great! Can I give you this action item to do by our next meeting on Dec. 5th? 17:55:37 Yes, please. 17:57:27 #action bpabon Investigate ways to visualize diagrams from text further and then open new Pagure / docs-fp-o tickets for rendering support 17:57:45 #link https://pagure.io/pagure/new_issue 17:57:54 #link https://pagure.io/fedora-docs/docs-fp-o/new_issue 17:57:59 .thank bpabon 17:57:59 jwf thinks bpabon is awesome and is happy they are helping! (Please don't forget to bpabon++ also) 17:58:13 Great! And we're almost at time, so we can switch to open floor 17:58:16 #topic Open floor 17:58:24 I had one thing I wanted to bring up 17:58:38 I think the meeting time conflict with Mindshare is difficult for this team 17:58:52 * bt0 knows :( 17:58:57 I wanted to suggest if we find a new meeting day/time or if bt0 wants to suggest a new meeting time for Mindshare 17:59:02 * jwf isn't sure what is easier 17:59:28 me neither :S 17:59:57 I'll open a new thread on Discourse about it. 18:00:00 cool 18:00:18 #action jwf Start new Discourse thread about the Dilemma of the Conflicting Meetings 18:00:19 :P 18:00:32 Anyone want to share anything else? 18:01:51 Going once… 18:02:01 Twice… 18:02:08 And thrice. 18:02:18 Thanks everyone for coming out today and for the good ideas \o/ 18:02:23 Enjoy the rest of your week. 18:02:25 #endmeeting