16:00:23 <geppetto> #startmeeting fpc
16:00:24 <zodbot> Meeting started Thu Aug 23 16:00:23 2018 UTC.
16:00:24 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
16:00:24 <zodbot> The chair is geppetto. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
16:00:24 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
16:00:24 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fpc'
16:00:24 <geppetto> #meetingname fpc
16:00:24 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fpc'
16:00:24 <geppetto> #topic Roll Call
16:00:35 <redi> sup guys
16:00:39 <geppetto> #chair redi
16:00:39 <zodbot> Current chairs: geppetto redi
16:00:47 <tibbs> Hello.
16:00:50 <mhroncok> hi
16:00:50 <geppetto> #chair tibbs
16:00:50 <zodbot> Current chairs: geppetto redi tibbs
16:00:54 <geppetto> #chair mhroncok
16:00:55 <zodbot> Current chairs: geppetto mhroncok redi tibbs
16:00:57 <tibbs> First week of the semester and I'm crazy busy.
16:01:23 <redi> I'm on a conference call so likely to only give this channel a small part of my attention
16:01:26 <ignatenkobrain> .hello2
16:01:27 <zodbot> ignatenkobrain: ignatenkobrain 'Igor Gnatenko' <i.gnatenko.brain@gmail.com>
16:01:29 <geppetto> I thought it was only supposed to get bad in september ;)
16:01:34 <geppetto> #chair ignatenkobrain
16:01:34 <zodbot> Current chairs: geppetto ignatenkobrain mhroncok redi tibbs
16:02:11 <mhroncok> I'm on a conference call as well, but I'm mostly just listening
16:04:13 <geppetto> mhroncok: the pie one?
16:04:24 <mhroncok> geppetto: pie?
16:04:52 <geppetto> I almost went to that too
16:07:01 <geppetto> Ok, gonna start
16:07:49 <geppetto> #topic Schedule
16:07:52 <geppetto> https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/packaging@lists.fedoraproject.org/message/KYBCQZDT57OJEJAR4BTB6VX3X3AHN6YD/
16:08:13 <geppetto> #topic #785 Crypto policies packaging guideline update
16:08:17 <geppetto> .fpc 785
16:08:18 <zodbot> geppetto: Issue #785: Crypto policies packaging guideline update - packaging-committee - Pagure - https://pagure.io/packaging-committee/issue/785
16:10:37 <mhroncok> +1 as tibbs comment says in there
16:10:42 <mhroncok> (get rid of 21 mention)
16:11:39 <geppetto> yeh, had to get to the bottom to see that :-o
16:11:47 <geppetto> trivial +1
16:12:03 <ignatenkobrain> I'm +1 with one thing: what is the SLA of Security Team response?
16:12:32 <tibbs> This is Fedora; I don't think we live by SLAs.
16:13:06 <tibbs> It's probably better than ours is going to be in any case.
16:14:25 <ignatenkobrain> tibbs: just saying that if we say "we are going to give permission based on security team response"... and if they never respond..
16:15:34 <tibbs> Even if we get some kind of promise now, it wouldn't necessarily mean anything in a couple of years.
16:17:03 <geppetto> I feel like the security team will care enough about new crypto libraries
16:17:15 <tibbs> I'm prepared to deal with that when (or if) it actually matters.
16:17:37 <geppetto> redi: Vote?
16:22:35 <geppetto> Well we have +4 … but redi looks like he's busy
16:22:45 <mhroncok> ok, vote on the ticket?
16:22:50 <geppetto> Sure
16:23:03 <geppetto> #info Crypto policies packaging guideline update (+1:4, 0:0, -1:0)
16:23:24 <geppetto> #action Everyone/someone else can vote in the ticket
16:23:46 <geppetto> #topic #788 Bootstrap Exception for rebar3
16:23:50 <geppetto> .fpc 788
16:23:51 <zodbot> geppetto: Issue #788: Bootstrap Exception for rebar3 - packaging-committee - Pagure - https://pagure.io/packaging-committee/issue/788
16:24:10 <geppetto> We are already +3 from the ticket
16:24:14 <geppetto> I'll +1
16:24:33 <geppetto> Alas, nobody here who hasn't voted so …
16:24:54 <geppetto> #info Bootstrap Exception for rebar3 (+1:4, 0:0, -1:0)
16:25:00 <geppetto> #action Everyone/someone else can vote in the ticket
16:25:11 <geppetto> #topic #789 Use bconds everywhere
16:25:15 <geppetto> .fpc 789
16:25:16 <zodbot> geppetto: Issue #789: Use bconds everywhere - packaging-committee - Pagure - https://pagure.io/packaging-committee/issue/789
16:26:27 <mhroncok> I'm obviously +1 to both
16:26:37 <mhroncok> I can also answer questions
16:26:44 <geppetto> I'm +1
16:27:20 <ignatenkobrain> +1 too
16:27:22 <geppetto> tibbs: Do you prefer using --define 'foo 1' etc. for some reason?
16:28:03 <tibbs> Depends on the context, really.
16:28:33 <tibbs> There are places where it makes sense and places where it doesn't.
16:29:50 <tibbs> So while I don't think it's a bad idea to use the bcond macros in the guidelines and to try to be consistent about that, I don't believe we should be requiring their use.
16:30:38 <geppetto> Even limited to all switchable conditions?
16:31:15 <tibbs> I'm not sure it's even possible to define what that is.
16:31:46 <geppetto> mhroncok: what do you think?
16:32:04 <mhroncok> Is still think that we should recommend bconds
16:32:06 <mhroncok> as SHOULD
16:32:18 <mhroncok> possibly saying (if it makes sense)
16:32:37 <geppetto> You think it's easy to define when you should use them?
16:34:07 <mhroncok> Well at least in a general picture
16:34:20 <mhroncok> I am not able to come up with a defiinition right now
16:34:31 <mhroncok> amek it ana ction for me?
16:34:35 <mhroncok> *an action
16:34:41 <mhroncok> *make
16:35:27 * geppetto nods
16:36:13 <geppetto> #action mhroncok Will come up with the policy of which cases they should be used in.
16:36:14 <mhroncok> #action mhroncok to give a definition of when to use bconds
16:36:19 <mhroncok> :)
16:36:23 <geppetto> 👍
16:37:32 <geppetto> #topic #782 Forbid %{pythonX_site(lib|arch)}/* in %files
16:37:36 <geppetto> .fpc 782
16:37:38 <zodbot> geppetto: Issue #782: Forbid %{pythonX_site(lib|arch)}/* in %files - packaging-committee - Pagure - https://pagure.io/packaging-committee/issue/782
16:38:31 <mhroncok> nothing to vote
16:38:39 <tibbs> I may have missed a writeup here.
16:38:40 <mhroncok> needs writeup
16:38:45 <mhroncok> I can do that
16:38:57 <mhroncok> also makeing sure the examples are updated
16:39:33 <geppetto> yeh, I saw it had been modified … but doesn't look like we need to do anything in the meeting
16:39:41 <geppetto> #topic #775 Allow to have %{?suse_version} condition in spec file
16:39:45 <geppetto> .fpc 775
16:39:46 <zodbot> geppetto: Issue #775: Allow to have %{?suse_version} condition in spec file - packaging-committee - Pagure - https://pagure.io/packaging-committee/issue/775
16:39:57 <mhroncok> I'm still +1 (for this one package)
16:40:07 <geppetto> Not sure there's much to say here … looks like "You can't stop me so I'll do it"
16:40:24 <mhroncok> I think we need to vote and make an official decision
16:40:31 <mhroncok> so we can say: FPC does not allow that
16:40:43 <mhroncok> and than they do whatever they want
16:40:52 <mhroncok> but without our approval
16:40:59 <mhroncok> or we say: FPC grants an exception
16:41:12 <mhroncok> it doesn't change the think, but at least we give them something
16:41:53 <geppetto> Well there's not really quorum anymore … and I'm on the fence
16:42:40 <geppetto> In some simple cases I'm fine with it, to allow cooperation … but I don't want specfiles to turn into a disaster just so they work on N distros.
16:43:14 <geppetto> really need a better language than specfiles to do this kind of thing … or more consistency among distros.
16:45:28 <tibbs> I think I've made my views pretty clear.
16:47:06 * geppetto nods
16:47:20 <geppetto> #topic Open Floor
16:47:30 <geppetto> Anything anyone wants to discuss?
16:48:48 <tibbs> The static library thing is back.
16:48:55 <digilicious> hi
16:48:59 <digilicious> that would be me
16:49:05 <tibbs> No draft so not much do say, really.
16:49:44 <digilicious> what exactly should I provide to have this issues addressed?
16:49:59 <tibbs> The exact changes you're asking for, at minimum.
16:50:12 <digilicious> ok
16:50:17 <tibbs> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging_Committee
16:50:47 <tibbs> Start from a copy of the guidelines page or section, copy that into a draft, save it, and then make your proposed changes.
16:50:50 <tibbs> That way we can see a diff.
16:51:18 <digilicious> ok: will do
16:51:24 <digilicious> thanks
16:51:25 <tibbs> And the guidelines aren't generally going to include justification (because they're guidelines)
16:52:25 <tibbs> Personally I'm more concerned with things in Fedora not actually using static libraries than with preventing packagers from creating -static subpackages if they like.
16:56:35 <geppetto> they are somewhat correlated
16:56:53 <digilicious> how so?
16:56:54 <geppetto> Anyway … anything else?
16:56:56 <tibbs> That is true.
16:57:15 <geppetto> digilicious: The easier it is to use a static library the more packages will do so
16:57:18 <tibbs> If they don't exist then nobody will be using them.
16:58:06 <digilicious> they are not used by default, so it is work to use them
16:58:19 <digilicious> and it is work to exclude them from library packages
16:58:26 * geppetto nods
16:58:37 <digilicious> will create draft
16:58:42 <geppetto> 👍
16:58:44 <digilicious> can discuss more any time
16:59:18 * geppetto nods
16:59:23 <geppetto> #endmeeting