16:00:07 #startmeeting fpc 16:00:07 Meeting started Thu Aug 1 16:00:07 2019 UTC. 16:00:07 This meeting is logged and archived in a public location. 16:00:07 The chair is geppetto. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 16:00:07 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 16:00:07 The meeting name has been set to 'fpc' 16:00:07 #meetingname fpc 16:00:07 #topic Roll Call 16:00:07 The meeting name has been set to 'fpc' 16:00:13 hey 16:00:18 #chair mhroncok 16:00:18 Current chairs: geppetto mhroncok 16:00:19 hey 16:00:22 hello o/ 16:01:59 #chair decathorpe 16:01:59 Current chairs: decathorpe geppetto mhroncok 16:04:32 Hey, folks 16:04:39 #chair tibbs 16:04:39 Current chairs: decathorpe geppetto mhroncok tibbs 16:04:41 hey 16:04:56 I'm sort of here on the sly. Trying to pretend to pay attention to this presentation. 16:05:18 ok 16:05:40 We only have 4 atm. … so can maybe just go back to your presentation soon :) 16:06:10 Hopefully we'll get a fifth, then. I would prefer not to pay attention to that. 16:06:22 ha 16:07:00 * limburgher here 16:07:22 #chair limburgher 16:07:22 Current chairs: decathorpe geppetto limburgher mhroncok tibbs 16:07:28 Woo, we made it :) 16:07:48 Look how far we've come, my baby. . . 16:08:10 #topic Schedule 16:08:13 #link https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/packaging@lists.fedoraproject.org/message/GABB3NIS6R76YSAYV5ZCSL5LQM2Z6HQ7/ 16:08:21 #topic #914 Automatic R runtime dependencies 16:08:25 .fpc 914 16:08:26 geppetto: Issue #914: F31 System-wide Change: Automatic R runtime dependencies - packaging-committee - Pagure.io - https://pagure.io/packaging-committee/issue/914 16:11:02 I'm pretty sure we don't want people doing weak requires on things that don't exist … I don't think there's a legal problem, but still 16:11:40 No, but if they're requiring things we don't carry, that's a bug, strong or weak. 16:11:49 isn't Suggests still a noop by default? 16:11:53 it is 16:11:58 There is a philosophical question here, I think, 16:12:03 so haveing the suggests here brings no benefit imho 16:12:15 And I think fundamentally it's a question for FESCo and the legal folks. 16:12:37 instead of arguing whther suggesting nonesisitng packages is OK (some think it is, some that it isn't), we shloud just not do it and call it a day 16:12:53 I mean, I have no experience with R packaging at all. but if it's simple to remove unpackaged stuff from metadata during package builds, I think it would be reasonable to do that 16:12:59 The legal angle is related to whether a package can suggest ffmpeg or something like that. 16:13:32 I'd say the tech angle precludes the legal angle because of the legal angle. Circles. 16:13:43 tibbs: yeh, but the user still needs to manually enable the ffmpeg repos. … 16:13:47 That may not have made any sense. :) 16:13:48 The issue is that the nice automation for generating these dependencies might have false positives. 16:14:02 I'm fine with deferring to fesco 16:14:24 geppetto: It's down in the question of contributory infringement, which is why the legal folks need to tell us what to do. 16:14:34 * geppetto nods 16:14:55 The question of whether we care about complete closure of the repository, even at the level of weak dependencies. 16:15:19 That's what I'd leave to fesco. 16:15:37 ok 16:15:39 Bottom line is that whatever automation is in place, it needs a way to filter the generated dependencies. 16:15:56 Of course, we do already have that in plave using the general PRM mechanis, 16:16:00 mechanism. 16:16:01 so fesco needs to decide whether recommedns and suggests need to be resolvable for technical reasons 16:16:05 and legal fro legal reasons 16:16:33 Pretty much. 16:16:43 however, I still think that automatically generated suggests are useless 16:16:51 soe my recommendation here would be: don't bother 16:17:17 RIght now we have nothing which checks that the repository is closed under any type of depedency at all. 16:17:30 But that doesn't mean that we shouldn't have that. 16:17:53 what about repoclosure? 16:18:00 The automated geting stuff should at least be cheking that the packages being pushed are installable. 16:18:28 I know that repoclosure had some work done recently but it still isn't being done. 16:18:48 And it doesn't understand Boolean dependencies which means that it can still miss things. 16:18:59 ugh 16:19:02 :( 16:19:03 Though I do think even a 50% solution is much better than nothing. 16:19:42 I could be out of date here but I certainly haven't seen any reports about it. 16:20:56 #action FESCO need to rule on the technical problem of allowing packages to suggest things which don't exist. 16:21:19 #action Legal needs to rule on the legal problems of allowing packages to suggest things which don't exist (Eg. ffmpeg possibility). 16:21:32 Anything else to say? 16:22:39 Don't think so. 16:23:17 Note that this is only an issue if the exoectation is that people won't try to filter these things from their packages. 16:23:45 #topic #907 Which %__foo macros for executables are acceptable? 16:23:45 I think in the case of R the problem is that a large number of the generated weak deps won't exist. 16:23:54 .fpc 907 16:23:55 geppetto: Issue #907: Which %__foo macros for executables are acceptable? - packaging-committee - Pagure.io - https://pagure.io/packaging-committee/issue/907 16:24:46 the PR for python looks reasonable 16:24:49 So for this, Panu basically gave us the answer we're lookng for so the rest is mostrly cleanup and making sure we have non-underscored macros for everything that needs to be macroized. 16:25:19 yeh, I think the PR is fine 16:25:33 I need to log out briefly. I wont lose any messages because of znc but I;ll be out for a couple of minutes. 16:26:19 I have to leave in 4 minutes and can't be back for an hour. :( 16:26:28 ok 16:28:11 Back. 16:29:04 I sent a comment to the pyhon PR but it wa snot sent, so I've just resnt it now 16:30:16 I sent a comment and I think it made it there. 16:31:52 ok 16:32:03 #topic Open Floor 16:32:22 Given we only have 4 now, anything we want to talk about? 16:32:50 we have a lot of stalled PRs 16:32:58 shall we start taggign them with meeting? 16:33:49 it would help us to clear out some old cruft 16:34:11 yeh, if there's a good way to collect them I can add them to the schedule 16:34:53 geppetto: I belive that it would add one more step: collecting tagged issues + tagged prs, but I'm not sure 16:38:04 let's end? 16:39:38 will there be a meeting next week? I guess some of us will be at flock 16:39:58 yeh, I'll be there … so I'd guess no 16:40:26 #endmeeting