19:30:46 <darknao> #startmeeting docs
19:30:46 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Nov 16 19:30:46 2022 UTC.
19:30:46 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
19:30:46 <zodbot> The chair is darknao. Information about MeetBot at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Zodbot#Meeting_Functions.
19:30:46 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
19:30:46 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'docs'
19:30:57 <darknao> #topic Roll call
19:30:59 <darknao> #chair pboy darknao pbokoc py0xc3[m]
19:30:59 <zodbot> Current chairs: darknao pbokoc pboy py0xc3[m]
19:31:12 <pboy> .hi
19:31:13 <zodbot> pboy: pboy 'Peter Boy' <pboy@uni-bremen.de>
19:31:21 <darknao> hi o/
19:31:26 <AnthonyMcGlone[m> Hi
19:31:47 <hankuoffroad[m]> .hello hankuoffroad
19:31:48 <zodbot> hankuoffroad[m]: hankuoffroad 'None' <allegrovelo@gmail.com>
19:33:18 <darknao> welcome everyone!
19:33:34 <darknao> #topic Agenda
19:33:40 <darknao> #link https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/t/docs-meeting-agenda-2022-11-16/44101
19:33:42 <darknao> #info Announcements
19:33:44 <darknao> #info Action item followup
19:33:46 <darknao> #info Updates on the new variant-oriented pages
19:33:48 <darknao> #info Proposal on adding Vale linter to the documentation writer workflow
19:33:50 <darknao> #info Time to drop old docs?
19:33:52 <darknao> #info Open Floor
19:33:54 <darknao> #topic Announcements
19:33:59 <darknao> #info F37 has been released \o/
19:34:01 <darknao> #info New variant-oriented homepage is live
19:34:03 <darknao> #info Next milestone is F38 (2023-04-18)
19:34:05 <darknao> #info We use GitLab to track work: https://gitlab.com/groups/fedora/docs/-/boards
19:34:32 <darknao> any other announcement to make?
19:35:20 <darknao> ok, moving on
19:35:29 <darknao> #topic Previous action items
19:35:34 <darknao> #info pboy was to test run the new builder script on Mac
19:35:56 <pboy> hm still on todo, but now with f37 out ....
19:36:09 <darknao> ok, no rush :)
19:36:24 <darknao> #action pboy to test run the new builder script on Mac
19:36:38 <darknao> #topic Updates on the new variant-oriented pages
19:36:50 <darknao> #link https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/docs/
19:37:09 <darknao> so it's live, thanks everyone :)
19:37:34 <pboy> Yeah, I think, it looks fine.
19:37:56 <pboy> Next step is to get the Workstation repo included.
19:38:07 <darknao> The workstation part is missing, but Allan says a work in progress can be seen https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/tree/docs
19:38:20 <darknao> so I guess i could add that to the staging instance
19:38:27 <darknao> to get a preview
19:38:38 <pboy> yes, I had a look into it, it looks good.
19:38:46 <darknao> good
19:38:48 <pboy> yes, stg is a good idea.
19:39:19 <darknao> #action darknao to deploy WIP workstartion-docs on staging
19:39:45 <darknao> is there anything else to discuss on this topic?
19:40:12 <pboy> I think we have to plan how to improve it. But later, i think.
19:40:45 <pboy> I would like to add a "why Fedora" for example.
19:41:02 <pboy> as a section to Fedora Linux
19:41:12 <hankuoffroad[m]> Can I take it that if someone suggests a topic to write about and it is agreed, then one deploys WIP docs on staging? Just to be sure where to share a draft.
19:41:32 <pboy> What is WIP?
19:41:37 <darknao> work in progress
19:41:45 <pboy> aahh. thanks
19:41:54 <hankuoffroad[m]> yes WIP = draft docs
19:42:13 <pboy> I would appreciate the stg
19:42:25 <pboy> for a preview and discussion
19:42:34 <darknao> so yes, usually, when we want to add something to the docs, but it's not complete yet, we deploy it on staging first
19:42:45 <hankuoffroad[m]> because if someone shares a doc (adoc) in hackMD, it is additional work
19:43:03 <hankuoffroad[m]> darknao: ok that works for me (future me :)
19:43:09 <pboy> can hackMD. adoc ?
19:43:39 <pboy> I think it is md only.
19:43:49 <hankuoffroad[m]> I don't think so. I mean if I upload a doc (write a doc there in markdown), then i need to change markup to adoc later
19:44:24 <pboy> Yes, this is annoying
19:45:34 <hankuoffroad[m]> thanks for clarification.
19:45:36 <darknao> I recommand using gitlab to draft adoc
19:45:53 <darknao> you don't even need a repository, you can just create a snippet here using adoc
19:46:06 <darknao> and you'll get a preview
19:46:13 <hankuoffroad[m]> oh that'll also be fine.
19:46:31 <darknao> then if you ever need to include it on the docs website, it's basically just a copy/paste
19:47:40 <pboy> Well, i have to find out how to do that. I'm still a bit uncomfortable with  gitlab
19:47:52 <darknao> https://gitlab.com/-/snippets/new
19:48:09 <pboy> OK thanks.
19:48:23 <darknao> you just need to give the filename a adoc extension, and it will get formatted correctly
19:48:26 <hankuoffroad[m]> darknao: Cool
19:49:19 <darknao> ok, next topic then
19:49:31 <darknao> #topic Proposal on adding Vale linter to the documentation writer workflow
19:50:27 <hankuoffroad[m]> I was pondering about tools that will help writing flow.
19:50:40 <darknao> I also tried (very quickly) Vale and that seems quite interresting
19:50:47 <pboy> Currently I use  DeepL and language tool and have to copy and paste back and forth.
19:50:58 <pboy> A bit uncomfortable
19:51:14 <darknao> we have a Red Hat documentation (that also use antora btw) about it here https://redhat-documentation.github.io/vale-at-red-hat/docs/main/user-guide/introduction/
19:51:29 <hankuoffroad[m]> I'm conscious an additional tool may be putting writers off, but in the ling run we will save time
19:52:15 <darknao> So I think we can add this to one or 2 repos, to test run it, then see if we decide to add it to the repository template for new documentation
19:52:34 <hankuoffroad[m]> darknao: First time I saw this, thanks
19:52:44 <darknao> at least add it to the CI so we get a report generated automatically
19:53:01 <darknao> that will be best for writers, so they don't really need to care too much about it at first
19:53:33 <hankuoffroad[m]> what do others think about it?
19:53:57 <pboy> I think we should give it a try.
19:54:19 <darknao> the included ruleset use the Red Hat style guide, but I think ours is quite close to the Red Hat one
19:54:30 <pboy> Yes it is.
19:54:39 <darknao> so we should be able to use it right out of the box
19:54:40 <hankuoffroad[m]> yeah, I used that as baseline style
19:54:40 <copperi[m]> sounds good to me
19:55:32 <darknao> ok, so we just need to decide on which repos we want to set that up first
19:55:47 <darknao> I was thinking maybe the contributors guide
19:56:05 <pboy> Good idea!
19:56:20 <darknao> and the Fedora Linux homepage maybe?
19:56:23 <pboy> you mean the team page, complete.
19:56:43 <darknao> yeah this one https://gitlab.com/fedora/docs/community-tools/documentation-contributors-guide
19:56:49 <pboy> yeah, the homepage needs some finetuning
19:57:12 <darknao> ok, let's do that then
19:57:39 <darknao> #action darknao to set up Vale linting on contributors-guide and Fedora Linux homepage repositories
19:57:45 <hankuoffroad[m]> Sounds good.
19:58:26 <darknao> alright, anything else regarding this topic?
19:59:03 <pboy> nope
19:59:16 <hankuoffroad[m]> no from me, thanks
19:59:17 <darknao> #topic Time to drop old docs?
19:59:45 <darknao> Once upon a time, we decided to drop the old docs, but never did
19:59:50 <pboy> Yes. I think I'm too busy for the next month to care about it.
20:00:11 <pboy> We postponed, because I wanted th check for useful sections.
20:00:22 <darknao> now that F37 is out, with the new homepage, the old docs are not even mentioned on it
20:00:23 <pboy> But I'm running out of time.
20:00:50 <pboy> darknao we want to keep them for internal lookups only.
20:00:55 <darknao> So I think we can finally just remove it completely. The docs are still available in the repository.
20:01:04 <pboy> agreed
20:01:14 <darknao> so you can still use that if you want to recover some materials from it
20:01:41 <py0xc3[m]> +1 :D
20:01:48 <pboy> I may have to ask you where to find something i want to check. :-)
20:01:54 <copperi[m]> as long docs are available in some archive it is ok.
20:02:22 <copperi[m]> (or repository)
20:04:11 <darknao> yeah there is a repository somewhere, let me find it very quickly
20:05:14 <darknao> #link https://pagure.io/fedora-docs-web
20:05:17 <darknao> there you go
20:05:20 <darknao> all of it
20:05:40 <darknao> PDFs included
20:05:44 <pboy> Oh, thanks!
20:06:12 <pboy> Look good!
20:06:18 <darknao> and it's pure html, so you can easily spin up a webserver to read it with your browser
20:07:10 <pboy> yes, and epub as well. very nice
20:08:05 <darknao> ok, so agreed on removing it from the website?
20:08:15 <pboy> agreed
20:08:21 <copperi[m]> +1
20:08:58 <darknao> #agreed to remove old docs from the documentation website
20:09:22 <darknao> #action darknao to remove old docs from the website
20:09:30 <darknao> great :)
20:09:41 <darknao> last topic
20:09:49 <darknao> #topic Open Floor!
20:10:17 <AnthonyMcGlone[m> Hi all, I'm a new contributor, I was looking for some advice on what I could get started on.
20:10:34 <darknao> Hi and welcome AnthonyMcGlone[m !
20:10:45 <pboy> welcome  AnthonyMcGlone
20:11:17 <hankuoffroad[m]> Welcome to the Docs
20:11:23 <pboy> What do you think of, writing, designing, UX, ...?
20:12:02 <AnthonyMcGlone[m> Thanks for the warm welcome. I'd like to help out with the docs, so mainly writing.
20:12:19 <pboy> Verygood!!!
20:12:25 <darknao> So one way to start contributing is by reading some documentation you are interrested in, and report (or fix) any typo or error you may find.
20:13:19 <pboy> We have several areas, e.g. quickdocs, which needs some care, improving our contributors pages, etc. What do you like to write about?
20:13:24 <AnthonyMcGlone[m> Ok, should I pick some documentation issue from a repo in GitLab ? Something like that?
20:14:01 <py0xc3[m]> It might be noted that there are some "good first issues" in the list. I'm not sure if some of them are interesting? ;)
20:14:15 <darknao> #link https://gitlab.com/groups/fedora/docs/-/issues
20:15:21 <pboy> AnthonyMcGlone[m Another question, is there a special domain you are specifically experienced? Server? Workstation? Gnome? Systemadmin? .....?
20:16:06 <pboy> experienced and insterested
20:17:43 <AnthonyMcGlone[m> Maybe it's better I start off reviewing the Quick docs. I'd say the domain I am experienced in would be Systemadmin.
20:18:41 <pboy> AnthonyMcGlone[m>.  Quickdoc is a good start. And not entirely without self-interest, server would also be.
20:19:54 <AnthonyMcGlone[m> I'm happy to look at Server also.
20:19:54 <Marius[m]> if you knew gstream in&out that help me atm :D
20:20:27 <pboy> Regarding Quickdoc, I plan to post some thoughts on improving Quickdoc in the next few days (in discussion)
20:20:51 <pboy> Probably we can start a discussion about some planning.
20:21:33 <pboy> And welcome to Server  https://docs.stg.fedoraproject.org/en-US/fedora-server/
20:22:13 <AnthonyMcGlone[m> Yes, having a thread with some pointers how I could get started would be great.
20:26:56 <darknao> yeah that would help. There are a few threads about this, but we don't have a clear list yet
20:27:39 <darknao> definitely something we should work on
20:28:17 <pboy> Yes, we had several threads. I'll try to consolidate everything.
20:28:51 <darknao> anyway, don't hesitate to ask question if you have any on discourse, and we will try to help :)
20:29:16 <AnthonyMcGlone[m> Sure thing.
20:29:28 <darknao> you can also find us on #fedora-docs channel if needed
20:30:09 <darknao> ok, thank you everyone! See you all next week :)
20:30:20 <darknao> #endmeeting