14:06:17 <ryanlerch> #startmeeting Workstation WG 14:06:17 <zodbot> Meeting started Mon Jan 14 14:06:17 2019 UTC. 14:06:17 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location. 14:06:17 <zodbot> The chair is ryanlerch. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 14:06:17 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 14:06:17 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'workstation_wg' 14:06:32 <mcatanzaro> .hello catanzaro 14:06:33 <zodbot> mcatanzaro: catanzaro 'Michael Catanzaro' <mcatanzaro@gnome.org> 14:06:35 <ryanlerch> #topic roll call 14:06:41 <ryanlerch> .hellow ryanlerch 14:06:48 <otaylor> .hello otaylor 14:06:49 <zodbot> otaylor: otaylor 'Owen Taylor' <otaylor@redhat.com> 14:06:56 <mclasen> .hello mclasen 14:06:56 <zodbot> mclasen: mclasen 'Matthias Clasen' <mclasen@redhat.com> 14:07:50 <juhp> .hello petersen 14:07:51 <zodbot> juhp: petersen 'Jens Petersen' <petersen@redhat.com> 14:08:09 <ryanlerch> .hello ryanlerch 14:08:10 <zodbot> ryanlerch: ryanlerch 'Ryan Lerch' <rlerch@redhat.com> 14:08:25 <ryanlerch> that's 5 so far 14:08:33 <ryanlerch> who are we missing? 14:08:51 <mcatanzaro> Rex (meeting chair :) 14:08:52 * cschalle hi 14:08:58 <ryanlerch> stickster ? 14:09:13 <mcatanzaro> stickster said he couldn't make the meeting time. 14:09:17 <ryanlerch> okies 14:09:33 <ryanlerch> mcatanzaro: yeah, its midnight here, so i decided to just start the meeting 14:09:43 <ryanlerch> sorry, was impatient 14:10:02 <ryanlerch> okies, there isonly one ticket with the meeting tag 14:10:06 <otaylor> kalev: around? 14:10:43 <mclasen> cschalle should be here any second 14:11:13 <ryanlerch> #topic issue #45 -- drop workstation install tree 14:11:23 <ryanlerch> #info https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/45 14:13:05 <mclasen> anything to say there ? 14:13:06 <kalev> hello 14:13:17 <mclasen> I don't think we need to do anything there 14:13:55 * kalev nods. 14:14:22 <otaylor> It was never voted on, but no dissenting voices - we clearly don't need the Workstation install tree, and if the netinstall ISO for the workstation vanishes as a side effect of removing it, I don't think we care 14:14:39 <mcatanzaro> ryanlerch: Thanks for keeping things moving :) 14:14:42 <juhp> So the tree will be removed? 14:14:57 <mcatanzaro> What's an install tree? :P 14:15:16 <juhp> https://dl.fedoraproject.org/pub/fedora/linux/development/rawhide/Workstation/x86_64/os/ 14:16:12 <kalev> mcatanzaro: it's a directory with all the rpms that are in a Workstation install 14:16:20 <juhp> I believe that is the x86_64 tree 14:17:27 <ryanlerch> so nothing to discuss really on this one? 14:17:54 <mclasen> no 14:18:07 <otaylor> I don't think so, somone should think about the question "if I wanted to kickstart Fedora workstation, to get something identical the Live CD install, where do I go to find docs about how to do that" 14:18:19 <ryanlerch> okies, removing the meeting tag from it 14:19:29 <juhp> otaylor: right 14:19:45 <ryanlerch> okies, nothing else is tagged meeting 14:20:19 <mclasen> cschalle: do we have an update on openh264 ? 14:21:05 <ryanlerch> mclasen: this one? https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/84 14:21:21 <cschalle> mclasen, yes, I talked to Centricular last week. The required patches to get Main/High support should be submitted in final form to Cisco within two weeks, and then hopefully there will be a new upstream release shortly afterwards 14:21:53 <mclasen> ryanlerch: yes, that was the one that triggered my question 14:21:59 <ryanlerch> #topic issue #84 - openh264 codecs 14:22:09 <ryanlerch> #info https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/84 14:22:37 <cschalle> I will update the ticket 14:23:10 <ryanlerch> thanks cschalle ! 14:23:23 <ryanlerch> anyone else have a ticket or tpoic to bring up? 14:23:28 <ryanlerch> *topic 14:25:18 <mclasen> otaylor: do you have an update on flatpaks ? did we get any more built ? 14:27:37 <otaylor> mclasen: We have not gotten any more built (ok, I added one more myself), I've been working some on a) flatpak-common - https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Flatpak:Easy now shows what packages are in flatpak-common b) moving flatpaks to their own namespace to avoid having to file manual releng tickets (https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/issue/7496) 14:28:28 <otaylor> I'm planning to get together with some of the Red Hat desktop folks in Brno before devconf to help them work on flatpak'ing their packages 14:29:14 <mclasen> alright 14:29:48 <mcatanzaro> Oh wow, MP4 support for OpenH264 by way of Centricular? Thanks for funding it cschalle! 14:30:39 <mcatanzaro> But I seem to recall fdk-aac was ruled nonfree by FSF, so what's the status there? Are we out of luck for audio? 14:30:46 <cschalle> mcatanzaro, well it is funded in part by Red Hat, in part by Endless and in part by Cisco; and also Centricular are doing it at a very reasonable rate so they deserve credit for that too 14:31:23 <mcatanzaro> Ah wait: fdk-aac was ruled free by GPL incompatible, right? 14:31:32 <mcatanzaro> So we can't put it into a GStreamer plugin, which sucks 14:32:15 <mcatanzaro> (If you put it into a GStreamer plugin, it will get loaded by GPL applications, of course) 14:33:06 <cschalle> mcatanzaro, well it is a little more nuanced by that. Yes, on the face of it the text is not GPL friendly, but since there are no patents involved anymore it is actually compatible (meaning that a statement of no patent grant and a statement of full patent grant actually means the same when there are zero patents involved) 14:33:31 <cschalle> but we are having discussions about how to commmunicate that etc. 14:33:38 <mcatanzaro> Patents affected GPL compatibility??? 14:34:14 <cschalle> yes, because at least with GPL3 there is a requirement for explicit patent grant while the fdk-aac license and an explicit non-patent grant 14:34:41 <cschalle> but of course if there are no longer any patents to be granted those clauses are moot 14:34:53 <mcatanzaro> But it's AAC, of course there are patents 14:35:22 <cschalle> mcatanzaro, not anymore (at least not for the versions of AAC we look to support), and expired patents can not be granted 14:35:40 <cschalle> I even have a letter from Via licensing clearly stating that the AAC low complexity patents have all expired 14:36:12 <mcatanzaro> "the versions of AAC we look to support" == "the versions of AAC used by MP4" ? 14:37:08 <cschalle> mcatanzaro, the versions supported by the source tarball that Wim produced, which yes will support most AAC used by MP4 14:37:37 <mcatanzaro> Amazing! 14:37:39 <mcatanzaro> But what does "most" mean? :( 14:38:13 <cschalle> the problem with AAC (and H264) for that matter is that they are continually evolving standards so there is always a chance you meet a file you can't support, for H264 for instance we do not support the SVC version of the codec for instance 14:38:58 <cschalle> so what we have done is to go back far enough in time to ensure all patents have expired and then support that, which from what we can tell covers 99% of files out there, but of course I am sure someone will find a file using a AAC version we don't support and file a bug :) 14:40:29 <cschalle> in theory I guess even Mp3 got that issue as there was this thing called Mp3 pro Frauenhoffer tried to push for a while, but I have never seen such a file in reality 14:44:05 <cschalle> luckily though the GStreamer capabilities descriptions should have the granularity needed to describe things, so if you do hit a file we can't support it should fail with a proper message and even allow you to install any other AAC plugin you might be able to find if they do support it 14:44:57 <cschalle> Are we done? I got another meeting 'waiting' for me :) 14:46:33 <juhp> Lot of tickets open... we should maybe do some cleanup? 14:47:15 <juhp> I guess we could close https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/74 (f29 talking points) 14:52:13 <mcatanzaro> Yeah :P 15:06:04 <juhp> end the meeting? 15:09:36 <mclasen> yes 15:09:51 <juhp> #chair 15:10:03 <juhp> ryanlerch: still there? 15:11:51 <juhp> #endmeeting 15:11:53 <juhp> ... 15:18:05 <mclasen> late for him... 15:19:26 <juhp> yes\p 15:21:06 <nirik> #endmeeting