19:59:28 <mmcgrath> #startmeeting
19:59:28 <zodbot> Meeting started Thu Sep 10 19:59:28 2009 UTC.  The chair is mmcgrath. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
19:59:28 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
19:59:42 <mmcgrath> #topic Infrastructure -- Meeting start!  Who's here?
19:59:45 * mmcgrath is
19:59:47 * nirik is hanging around
19:59:48 * skvidal is here
20:00:16 * smooge raises his hand and says "Not Here"
20:00:30 * heffer is just lurking
20:00:33 * jpwdsm hangs out in the back
20:00:36 <mmcgrath> smooge: I think that logic just took some iq points from me.
20:00:44 * Oxf13 
20:01:12 <mmcgrath> Ok, lets get started
20:01:17 <mmcgrath> #topic Infrastructure -- Tickets
20:01:32 * mdomsch here
20:01:46 <mmcgrath> Oh, and there's no meeting tickets.
20:01:46 <mmcgrath> that's easy
20:01:47 <mmcgrath> #topic Infrastructure -- IPv6
20:01:59 <mmcgrath> mdomsch: want to take it quick on this one?  Mostly just about what problem we saw and what we did about it.
20:02:06 <mdomsch> 2 classes of problem
20:02:09 <mdomsch> 1 we can fix
20:02:19 <mdomsch> so we did.  we lowered the MTU for IPv6 packets, from 1500 to 1280
20:02:41 <mmcgrath> We do have one confirmed report that that seems to have fixed his/her problem
20:02:42 <mdomsch> apparently some packets were considered "too large" for some routers between our customers and us
20:02:49 <mdomsch> s/customers/users/
20:03:04 <mdomsch> hopefully that'll help
20:03:17 <mdomsch> problem 2: other routers dropping packets for unknown reasons
20:03:24 <mdomsch> 0xf13 may have been bit by this
20:03:55 <mdomsch> last I knew, this was progressing between Sprint and Indiana gigapop NOCs, or at least bouncing between them
20:03:56 <mmcgrath> well, in Oxf13's case his router was sending IPv6 info even though his router wasn't configured to use it.
20:04:05 <smooge> I have seen this for 'security reasons'. Various IPS sometimes think IPV6 is a security problem and will drop/degrade service
20:04:38 <mdomsch> if someone pops into #fedora-admin with questions, please try to help
20:04:46 <mdomsch> moving on from problems
20:04:51 <mmcgrath> <nod>
20:04:53 <mdomsch> I'd like to get opentorrent built for el5
20:05:05 <mmcgrath> mdomsch: is it in Fedora already?
20:05:23 <mdomsch> it depends on libowfat which I branched for EL-5 but haven't finished the work of de-dietlibc-ing it
20:05:32 <mmcgrath> ah
20:05:32 <mdomsch> mmcgrath, and no, opentorrent is not in Fedora yet
20:05:40 <mmcgrath> k
20:05:50 <mmcgrath> that'll be another nice ipv6 service though
20:05:57 <mdomsch> that's the only other service we offer at ibiblio that we could serve on v6
20:06:03 <mmcgrath> <nod>
20:06:11 <mmcgrath> mdomsch: emails are still bouncing around about our glue
20:06:12 <mdomsch> everything else (cvs, git, ...) are in non-v6-capable data centers
20:06:31 <mmcgrath> but it'll happen eventually
20:06:35 <mdomsch> oh, and MM is ready to go
20:06:40 <mmcgrath> sweet
20:06:45 <smooge> mdomsch, I wonder if we could do a app6to4 proxy
20:06:45 <mmcgrath> did we re-enable mirrors.fp.o for ipv6?
20:06:48 <Oxf13> fwiw, I replaced my router's firmware with dd-wrt, so I shouldn't have this issue anymore
20:06:52 <mdomsch> mmcgrath, no we haven't yet
20:07:01 <mdomsch> I need dgilmore to push the package to epel-testing :-)
20:07:14 <mmcgrath> ah, of course :)
20:07:17 <mdomsch> smooge, we could, but it might be slow...
20:07:48 <mmcgrath> <nod> I worry about the performance people would see if we start running our own proxies.
20:07:57 <mmcgrath> but if people care enough about it we can look closer and see exactly what we're talking about
20:08:00 <mmcgrath> anywho
20:08:01 <mmcgrath> mdomsch: anything else on ipv6?
20:08:44 <mdomsch> that's all
20:08:48 <mmcgrath> sweet.
20:09:21 <mmcgrath> #topic Change Freeze
20:09:35 <dgilmore> mdomsch: ill do it now
20:09:35 <mmcgrath> The change freeze will start for the beta on the 29th
20:09:42 <mmcgrath> Oxf13: what are our odds of a slip?
20:10:07 <notting> ask after the blocker meeting tomorrow?
20:10:11 <skvidal> mmcgrath: statistically? :)
20:10:24 <Oxf13> mmcgrath: hard to say right now.
20:10:41 <mdomsch> skvidal, the last 2 full release cycles are outliers, and can be discareded
20:10:52 <mmcgrath> notting: will do
20:10:57 <skvidal> mdomsch: really? :)
20:11:00 * mmcgrath is just reminding everyone that a slip would be really really really bad
20:11:08 <mmcgrath> at least for Infrastructure
20:11:13 <mmcgrath> OK, moving on
20:11:14 <notting> mmcgrath: my 'finger in the air' estimate is that non-anaconda bits are in ok shape
20:11:19 <smooge> a slip means no Canada for smooge
20:11:48 <mmcgrath> #topic Infrastructure -- qpidd
20:12:02 <mmcgrath> J5: pnig
20:12:04 <mmcgrath> err ping even
20:12:12 <mmcgrath> .any lmacken
20:12:12 <skvidal> 2009-11-10 <-- and if we slip much we hit US thanksgiving
20:12:12 <zodbot> mmcgrath: lmacken was last seen in #fedora-meeting 16 hours, 12 minutes, and 7 seconds ago: *** lmacken has quit IRC (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
20:12:20 <J5> mmcgrath: pong
20:12:29 <mmcgrath> J5: any progress on the messaging stuff?
20:12:57 <mmcgrath> lmacken: hey, just checking to see if there's any progress from you guys on the messaging stuff
20:13:29 <J5> mmcgrath: I ran into decoding structs issues which I am working on but I have python sending messaqes to js.  I just need ot get them decoded
20:13:35 <lmacken> hey, so yeah, I haven't deployed any Moksha/Fedora Community stuff to staging yet
20:13:51 <mmcgrath> <nod>
20:13:58 <mmcgrath> if there's nothing else we'll move on to the next topic
20:15:55 <mmcgrath> Ok
20:16:01 <mmcgrath> #topic Infrastructure -- Fedora insight
20:16:08 <mmcgrath> boo, just missed mchua
20:16:11 <mmcgrath> abadger1999: do you know anything about this?
20:16:17 <mmcgrath> last I checked fas auth was still not working
20:16:20 <mmcgrath> mizmo: you know anything?
20:16:42 <abadger1999> mmcgrath: Nope, haven't been followed the day-to-day, just the getting new features ready for the platform.
20:17:04 <mmcgrath> k, I'll follow up with mchua on that then.
20:17:14 <mmcgrath> zikula and qpid are the two major pushes I'm trying to get out.
20:17:23 <mmcgrath> #topic Infrastructure -- Smolt
20:17:30 <mmcgrath> So I've spent much of my week working on smolt.
20:17:33 <mmcgrath> specifically database queries.
20:17:45 <mizmo> mmcgrath: a little bit
20:17:49 <mmcgrath> I've got the render-stats script in much better shape
20:18:04 <mmcgrath> mizmo: do you know what the status of the fas auth stuff on pt6 is?
20:18:45 <mizmo> mmcgrath: i dont :( im just working on the css
20:18:51 <mmcgrath> K, no worries.
20:18:53 <mmcgrath> mizmo: thanks.
20:19:12 <mmcgrath> So on the smolt stuff, I've got a couple more changes to make and one final query (that happens to get run multiple times) to get figured out.
20:19:22 <mmcgrath> I'm hopeful that most of our smolt issues will go away after this
20:19:36 <lmacken> I hit some smolt wikifail the other day when trying to add a new page for some hardware
20:19:37 <smooge> just in time for a new code release
20:19:50 <mmcgrath> lmacken: how 'the other day' was it?
20:19:51 <lmacken> it ate my changes, so I got frustrated and gave up :)
20:19:58 <lmacken> mmcgrath: last night I think
20:20:00 <mmcgrath> couple of weeks back?
20:20:02 <mmcgrath> oh just last night
20:20:42 <mmcgrath> lmacken: I'll take a look.
20:20:52 <mmcgrath> K, anyone have any questions / concerns on that?
20:21:14 <mmcgrath> k
20:21:29 <mmcgrath> #topic Infrastructure -- 1667'
20:21:32 <mmcgrath> abadger1999: was this you?
20:21:35 <mmcgrath> https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/1667
20:21:37 <mmcgrath> .ticket 1667
20:21:38 <zodbot> mmcgrath: #1667 (BZ Component and Product Change Request) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/1667
20:21:38 <mmcgrath> sorry :)
20:21:46 <mmcgrath> abadger1999: didn't we talk to that guy already?
20:21:59 <abadger1999> mmcgrath: I'm on it as much as anyone is.
20:22:14 <abadger1999> mmcgrath: It needs to go through fedora-docs before it gets handled by us.
20:22:16 <mmcgrath> I'm just wanting to verify that is something we need to do, that's not something the bugzilla admins do?
20:22:24 <mmcgrath> quaid: ping
20:22:29 <mmcgrath> stickster: ping
20:22:40 <abadger1999> mmcgrath: That part.... I think we may need both Fedora nad bz admin help.
20:22:51 <abadger1999> But I don't even know if we're actually going to be renaming yet.
20:22:59 <abadger1999> So I'm waiting on more docs input.
20:23:04 <mmcgrath> he seems very insistant on it at this point, even sent an email to admin@fp.o
20:23:13 <abadger1999> huh.  Since yesterday?
20:23:22 <mmcgrath> yeah, just a few minutes ago
20:23:29 * abadger1999 reads mail
20:23:42 <mmcgrath> abadger1999: we did communicate that to him yesterday right?
20:23:48 <stickster> mmcgrath: pong
20:23:56 <mmcgrath> stickster: who's in charge of docs these days/
20:24:07 <stickster> mmcgrath: Eric Christensen (Sparks)
20:24:11 <stickster> .fasinfo sparks
20:24:11 <mmcgrath> Sparks: ping
20:24:12 <zodbot> stickster: User: sparks, Name: Eric Christensen, email: eric@christensenplace.us, Creation: 2007-07-17, IRC Nick: sparks, Timezone: US/Eastern, Locale: en, Extension: 5102043, GPG key ID: BD0C14C1, Status: active
20:24:14 <zodbot> stickster: Approved Groups: cla_done fedorabugs cvsfedora packager docs ambassadors cla_fedora sysadmin-test svnsecurityguide gitabout-fedora githomepage gitreadme gitreadme-live-image gitreadme-burning-isos gitfedora-wiki cmsadmin gitfedora-cms gitrpmguide svnaccessibility-guide gitamateur-radio-guide
20:24:17 <zodbot> stickster: Unapproved Groups: None
20:24:32 * stickster always forgets how... thorough zodbot is.
20:24:39 <mmcgrath> ohh, a couple more and he'll be in the .more club with me :)
20:24:44 <stickster> heh
20:25:01 <mmcgrath> ok, I'll email Eric and see if he's ok with this
20:25:07 <abadger1999> Hmmm......
20:25:08 <mmcgrath> stickster: we're talking about - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/1667
20:25:14 <abadger1999> Is dhensley == perspectival?
20:25:16 <mmcgrath> which seems to have come from nowhere but impacts the docs team?
20:25:34 <mmcgrath> .fasinfo dhensley
20:25:34 <zodbot> mmcgrath: User "dhensley" doesn't exist
20:25:38 <mmcgrath> .fas dhensley
20:25:41 <zodbot> mmcgrath: dsilas '' <dhensley@redhat.com>
20:25:45 <mmcgrath> .fasinfo dsillas
20:25:51 <zodbot> mmcgrath: User "dsillas" doesn't exist
20:25:51 <mmcgrath> .fasinfo dsilas
20:25:54 <zodbot> mmcgrath: User: dsilas, Name: None, email: dhensley@redhat.com, Creation: 2009-05-15, IRC Nick: silas, Timezone: None, Locale: None, Extension: 5130286, GPG key ID: None, Status: active
20:25:56 <zodbot> mmcgrath: Approved Groups: cla_done cla_fedora svndeployment-guide svnsecurityguide
20:25:58 <zodbot> mmcgrath: Unapproved Groups: None
20:25:58 <mmcgrath> boo, privacy flag.
20:26:01 <abadger1999> yep.
20:26:15 <stickster> mmcgrath: I'm not sure I understand what's going on there --
20:26:16 <stickster> mmcgrath: but
20:26:18 <abadger1999> Well, I'll email dhensley and ask if he's perspectival.
20:26:36 * mmcgrath pings in #fedora-docs
20:26:37 <abadger1999> And if not catch him up on the need to go through docs and then explain what's going on.
20:26:45 <mmcgrath> abadger1999: ok, thanks.
20:26:51 <stickster> It could be the way that Publican produces docs creates a certain package name, and they're looking for a component in BZ to represent the package
20:27:12 <Oxf13> they get that automatically when the package is brought into Fedora
20:27:25 <Oxf13> the /source/ package that is
20:27:30 <stickster> Oxf13: Right, maybe that's not fully understood?
20:27:38 <perspectival> hello
20:27:41 <mmcgrath> perspectival: are you dhensley?
20:27:44 <stickster> perspectival: We meet again! :-D
20:27:45 <perspectival> yes
20:27:53 <mmcgrath> we're talking about
20:27:56 <perspectival> I assume we're discussing the component/product change
20:27:58 <mmcgrath> .ticket 1667
20:27:59 <zodbot> mmcgrath: #1667 (BZ Component and Product Change Request) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/1667
20:28:02 <perspectival> right
20:28:06 <mmcgrath> yeah, no one in docs seems to know about it?
20:28:15 <mmcgrath> well, no one we've talked to (which isn't many yet)
20:28:24 <stickster> From yesterday, I thought that Sparks did know about this?
20:28:40 * stickster didn't see how the conversation ended
20:29:08 <perspectival> this name change was initially referenced on an internal email, and then Mike Hideo requested, in an email to me, that (verbatim):
20:29:08 <perspectival> "Can we change the component name to:
20:29:08 <perspectival> doc-Deployment_Guide for Fedora? "
20:29:21 <mmcgrath> perspectival: was Sparks ok with that?
20:29:47 <perspectival> I spoke to Sparks initially about this (2 days ago), and stickster was confusedly brought into it yesterday
20:29:47 <abadger1999> perspectival: Note, you're wanting to both change the name and change the product it's under.
20:29:52 <perspectival> yes
20:29:58 <perspectival> abadger1999: true
20:30:05 <quaid> mmcgrath: pong
20:30:16 <stickster> perspectival: It's OK, I'm used to being confused as quaid will tell you :-)
20:30:22 <perspectival> I have not spoken to Sparks about this again (he was away yesterday I believe)
20:30:26 <dgilmore> perspectival: if its in fedora it needs to go through a package review
20:30:52 <quaid> can haz fedora-docs-list plz
20:30:54 <abadger1999> dgilmore: It's not yet a package -- which is part of why I'm wondering why we want to moce it from the Fedora Documentation product to the Fedora product.
20:30:58 <mmcgrath> quaid: talking about
20:31:00 <mmcgrath> t.ticket 1667
20:31:03 <mmcgrath> .ticket 1667
20:31:05 <zodbot> mmcgrath: #1667 (BZ Component and Product Change Request) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/1667
20:31:08 <dgilmore> abadger1999: then it does not belong under fedora
20:31:29 <perspectival> I am not sure, and I'm sort of new to the Fedora documentation procedures, so I'll relay that to Mike and make sure my information is correct
20:31:49 <quaid> mmcgrath: what I mean is ...
20:32:01 <quaid> asking Sparks on IRC is not the way to resolve the question of, "What does Docs intend here?"
20:32:04 <abadger1999> perspectival: <nod> In terms of moving forward, the important thing is for us to understand what fedora-docs wants out of this.
20:32:11 <mmcgrath> quaid: <nod>
20:32:11 <abadger1999> quaid: +1
20:32:19 <perspectival> ok
20:32:23 <mmcgrath> perspectival: can you email this ticket to the fedora-docs-list so everyone knows whats up?
20:32:44 <quaid> if mhideo doesn't want to join fedora-docs-list to discuss, by all means proxy for the reasoning.
20:32:49 <mmcgrath> there's two parts to this, one of them is getting sparks and team all aware and stuff, the other one is technical
20:32:54 <mmcgrath> which we're still not sure of 100%
20:33:01 <quaid> I have insight for #2
20:33:10 <quaid> i) create new bugzilla component (package needed)
20:33:28 <quaid> ii) remove the item from owners.list & probably confirm that it's gone with note to BZ team
20:33:39 <mmcgrath> <nod>
20:33:58 <quaid> >2 folks have the edit for owners.list, so no blockage there likely :)
20:34:01 <abadger1999> iii) bugzilla team shifts open bug reports to the new bugzilla component
20:34:16 <mmcgrath> perspectival: you know what steps to take next?
20:34:24 <quaid> abadger1999: yep, thx, that one too :)
20:34:25 <perspectival> I'm about to email fedora-docs list and CC mike
20:34:36 * quaid did all this recently, fwiw, so it does work
20:34:49 <stickster> quaid: good to know, excellent
20:34:55 <mmcgrath> perspectival: excellent
20:35:02 <mmcgrath> Ok, anyone have anything else for now?
20:35:16 <quaid> perspectival: sorry for any confusion; the Fedora deal is basically, work on it with the edge-focused team, they usually have people/processes in place to carry it onward
20:35:53 <mmcgrath> anyone have anything else on this?
20:35:59 <quaid> where carry == tell you who to contact next, what to do, etc. to enable individuals to achieve their own goals.
20:36:03 * quaid done now
20:36:28 <mmcgrath> Ok, moving on :)
20:36:36 <mmcgrath> #topic Infrastructure -- The PHX move
20:36:57 <skvidal> why did I read that as the THX movie
20:36:57 <mmcgrath> smooge: did you get the meeting invite for Friday?
20:37:05 <smooge> I did
20:37:25 <smooge> I am trying to figure out when it is exaxctly as evolution has it down for 1800
20:37:37 <smooge> which would be rather late for people on the east coast
20:37:57 <mmcgrath> :)
20:38:03 <mmcgrath> smooge: well there's wiki pages for us to fill out as well
20:38:15 <mmcgrath> smooge: so lets get some of the stuff we've discussed moved over
20:38:35 <smooge> oh boy
20:38:47 <smooge> I want 10GB to each system and a pony
20:39:02 <mdomsch> and ipv6
20:39:26 <mmcgrath> hahah
20:39:26 <abadger1999> smooge: Better get stable boys too, a pony for each system will produce a lot of... ammonia
20:39:34 <mmcgrath> smooge: lets get the server count and amp count at least put up there.
20:39:54 <smooge> ah yeah..
20:39:56 <dgilmore> mmcgrath: i want a rack full of sparc boxes :)
20:40:27 <smooge> mdomsch, could I ask a favor. I need an amp count for powervault and pe2950. I found max but not 'average'.
20:40:29 <mmcgrath> Anyone have anything else on that?
20:41:23 <mmcgrath> ok :)
20:41:29 <mmcgrath> #topic Infrastructure -- Open Floor
20:41:35 <mmcgrath> Anyone have anything they'd like to discuss?
20:41:41 <smooge> reboot of bastion tomorrow
20:41:52 <smooge> it should be a couple of file changes and a reboot..
20:42:04 <smooge> upgrade/reboot of xen13 next week
20:42:07 <ricky> Ugh, I completely forgot, sorry
20:42:18 <mmcgrath> smooge: oh yes, excellent
20:42:27 <smooge> that will also cause some reboots
20:42:36 <smooge> actually I was thinking of combining them
20:42:45 <smooge> since bastion1 will need to be rebooted twice :)
20:42:48 <mmcgrath> I think both will be 0 impact, we'll see :)
20:42:57 <dgilmore> i did all the builders over the weekend
20:43:02 <dgilmore> except xenbuilder4
20:43:05 <ricky> xen13 already has reboots often enough but thankfully we're setup so that we don't notice them outside
20:43:56 <smooge> dgilmore, other than logwatch.. did you notice anything?
20:44:23 <dgilmore> smooge: nope
20:44:27 <dgilmore> it was very smooth
20:44:38 <dgilmore> i did have to exclude net-snmp*
20:44:46 <smooge> ?
20:44:55 <dgilmore> but thats due to needing to rebuild it to work in the builder environment
20:45:01 <dgilmore> smooge: it links to rpm
20:45:07 <dgilmore> but we bumped rpm
20:45:10 <smooge> ah so it should not affect other boxes
20:45:19 <dgilmore> nope
20:45:21 <smooge> or did everything get the newer rpm
20:45:27 * Fedora-Angel is away: I'm busy
20:45:36 <smooge> slow typing makes smooge a poor psort
20:45:43 <dgilmore> smooge: just builders releng boxes have a different rpm
20:46:16 <smooge> dgilmore, thanks
20:46:30 <mmcgrath> k, anyone have anything else?
20:46:59 <mmcgrath> If not we'll close the meetings in 30
20:47:26 <mmcgrath> ok
20:47:28 <mmcgrath> #endmeeting