21:09:50 <nirik> #startmeeting Spins SIG
21:09:50 <zodbot> Meeting started Mon Nov 23 21:09:50 2009 UTC.  The chair is nirik. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
21:09:50 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
21:10:00 <nirik> #meetingname spins-sig
21:10:00 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'spins-sig'
21:10:11 <nirik> #chair biertie brunowolff
21:10:11 <zodbot> Current chairs: biertie brunowolff nirik
21:10:26 <nirik> ok, first topic?
21:10:51 <brunowolff> Why don't you continue with the netinstall.iso.
21:11:48 <nirik> #topic netinstall: could it be a spin?
21:11:52 <nirik> ok.
21:12:17 <brunowolff> Is there an actual package list for that image?
21:12:19 <nirik> So I see advantages here: More advertising, more info about what it does for people who don't know, download/popularity stats.
21:12:47 <nirik> Disadvantages: it's not live, so not sure it's really a spin, might confuse people if not done right.
21:12:58 <nirik> brunowolff: it's @base and @core I think.
21:13:05 <biertie> well, that's something we can add on the info page
21:13:22 <biertie> but I never used a fedora netinstall cd..
21:13:52 <brunowolff> Maybe it wouldn't be a spin, but could get advertised with the CD/DVD/USB install images?
21:14:16 <biertie> brunowolff: +1
21:15:01 <nirik> I could float the idea to the list? spins and/or devel?
21:15:50 <brunowolff> I would ask the design people.
21:16:44 <brunowolff> It is really a marketing issue, rather than a quality control issue which is more what I think spins sig is for.
21:16:44 <nirik> well, I guess the question is: is this something we want to advertise to people more or not.
21:16:51 <nirik> and thats more a technical thing.
21:17:38 <brunowolff> For one time installs it is less network bandwidth. For multiple installs it is less efficient.
21:17:39 <biertie> I say no... because it isn't a spin, but  I am pro adding it to the download list on get.fpo
21:18:34 <biertie> http://fedoraproject.org/en/get-fedora-all <-- here
21:18:54 <nirik> perhaps...
21:19:58 <brunowolff> There does seem to be a use case for it. I am not sure if it would get enough use to be worth the effort and possible confusion.
21:20:25 <nirik> ok, I can float the idea to devel list then? and if enough interest, talk to design/websites to add it?
21:20:49 <brunowolff> I don't know why the devel list would be a good place.
21:21:08 <nirik> because it comes from the base compose ?
21:21:17 <nirik> I guess rel-eng might be better?
21:21:23 <brunowolff> I would think you'd want to ask the infrastructure people iwhat the up and downsides are.
21:22:39 <brunowolff> If they see a possible up side to infrastructure load, then I think asking the design team about how it would fit in with marketing
21:22:52 <brunowolff> Fedora, specifically as another download option.
21:23:03 <nirik> well, infrastructure is just responsible for the hosting of things, etc... I think it makes more sense to ask the people who generate the image if they want to advertise it more.
21:23:21 <nirik> because the people who make it (rel-eng) may not want more advertising for it.
21:23:25 <brunowolff> If those two groups are OK with it, I don't think there is too much other effort involved.
21:23:49 <brunowolff> Isn't there a final version of it out there as part of the release?
21:24:14 <nirik> yes, but it's not advertised much. It's not on the download pages, none of the wiki pages off hand refer to it.
21:24:26 <brunowolff> I occasionally burn some as rescue images.
21:25:10 <nirik> yeah.
21:25:12 <brunowolff> Well then you might ask them if they had any concerns about extra work they may need to do as well. I wouldn't
21:25:37 <brunowolff> expect much, but maybe there is some subtle issue that would require more effort on their part.
21:26:13 <nirik> yeah. ok, I can do that.
21:26:21 <nirik> Thanks for the ideas...
21:26:27 <nirik> you had a topic?
21:27:05 <brunowolff> Can we do a quick run through of the items on https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Spins_SIG_Meeting_2009-11-23
21:27:16 <brunowolff> Some are kind of moot without kanarip.
21:27:45 <nirik> sure, go ahead... you have bot control.
21:27:51 <brunowolff> #topic Progress on recurring spin tasks
21:28:12 <brunowolff> This actually will cover a couple of items on the list.
21:28:36 <brunowolff> Since the last I checked the git kickstart repo hasn't been branched.
21:29:20 <brunowolff> Since at least I like my final wiki page to point into the version branch, I am still waiting to update my spin page for
21:29:42 <nirik> ok. Hopefully kanarip will get to that soon. Perhaps drop him an email?
21:29:46 <brunowolff> the next release. The QA isn't really tied to a specific release so that won't change.
21:30:30 <brunowolff> We can bug him soon. I don't think anything critically needs to get done now.
21:31:04 <brunowolff> Eventually we will want to remind spin page owners to update their stuff for the F13 cycle.
21:31:26 <nirik> yep.
21:31:48 <brunowolff> I think that covers the branching top as well.
21:32:08 <brunowolff> #topic Nightly spins versus release builds
21:32:34 <brunowolff> Does anyone know details on why the breakage of the LXDE spin wasn't detected?
21:33:02 <brunowolff> Was there some difference in the build Jesse did compared to the automated process?
21:33:05 <nirik> I'm not sure yet... we do need to get to the bottom of it.
21:34:14 <brunowolff> I think as a goal we should have all of the spins building with the nightly process with the same build process that
21:34:21 <brunowolff> will be used for release.
21:34:40 * nirik nods.
21:34:48 <brunowolff> At some point in this cycle we want to get AOS in there. I think before feature freeze.
21:35:21 <brunowolff> # Some FYI stuff
21:35:32 <nirik> yeah, sounded like there was going to be possibly a new compose method for it.
21:36:03 <brunowolff> I saw some discussion about expanding the desktop spin to 1 GB targeting USB devices.
21:36:27 <nirik> yeah.
21:36:30 <brunowolff> I don't know that we need to act on that, but it might be nice for people to be aware of it.
21:36:52 <nirik> yeah, I don't think it changes anything off hand, but we might see others spins interested in doing that too.
21:37:18 <brunowolff> Also kanarip made a new spin kickstart release which is in bodhi somewhere now. So that task is probably done.
21:38:05 <nirik> so we will need to note that they are not cd sized.
21:38:40 <brunowolff> We have a good chance of getting lzma squashfs in F13. Phillip Lougher claimed to be planning on submitting it in the 2.6.33
21:39:07 <nirik> that would be nice.
21:39:25 <brunowolff> merge window. This should happen by the end of calendar year if it is going to happen.
21:40:13 <brunowolff> One other topic for future discussion is policy for spin owners and the spins sig list.
21:40:55 <brunowolff> Without kanarip here we probably don't want to discuss it now. But people might want to think about policy for future discussion.
21:42:27 <brunowolff> What prompted this was that Jesse sent a message about AOS to the spins sig list to notify someone about a problem.
21:43:04 <brunowolff> I am not sure if that was right or wrong be we should probably figure out what the policy is, document it and make sure releng
21:43:11 <nirik> yeah... do we know for sure there is someone for each spin susbscribed to the list and paying attention?
21:43:14 <brunowolff> and the spin owners know what is expected.
21:44:50 <brunowolff> I think that covers the stuff I had noted as much as I think we can do with a limited group.
21:46:18 <brunowolff> #topic others?
21:46:29 <brunowolff> Anything else anyone wants to discuss?
21:47:38 * nirik doesnt have anything off hand.
21:47:53 <nirik> oh, hopefully we can get lxde back up soon... there are fixes now, it just needs a recompose.
21:48:38 <brunowolff> OK. I think we are done for today.
21:48:43 <abadger1999> Re: netinstall, might want to look into boot.kernel.org as well.  that could let you boot an installer or a live image over the network. (warthog9 will be talking about it at fudcon,)
21:50:28 <nirik> abadger1999: yeah, the GPXE stuff is cool.
21:51:42 <nirik> shall we close the meeting then?
21:52:36 <nirik> #endmeeting