23:00:10 <Sparks> #startmeeting Docs Project Meeting - Agenda: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Project_meetings
23:00:10 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Jun 29 23:00:10 2011 UTC.  The chair is Sparks. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
23:00:10 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
23:00:13 <Sparks> #meetingname Fedora Docs
23:00:13 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fedora_docs'
23:00:18 <Sparks> #topic Roll Call
23:00:19 * Sparks 
23:00:36 * jhradilek 
23:00:46 <sgordon> hey guys
23:00:49 * jjmcd 
23:00:52 <sgordon> was just grabbing a coffee
23:00:54 * sgordon 
23:01:02 <jhradilek> Hm, coffee...
23:01:06 <jwulf> yo
23:01:31 * rbergeron waves
23:02:02 * Sparks waves back at rbergeron
23:02:37 * Sparks is having a rough day with configurations today
23:02:52 <Sparks> I hope zodbot takes care of me tonight
23:03:08 * fnadge running for the water
23:05:00 <Sparks> Okay, let's get started.
23:05:15 <Sparks> #topic Follow up on last week's action items
23:05:26 <Sparks> jjmcd: You have a couple of items...
23:05:36 <jjmcd> Yeah, first one no progress
23:05:52 <jjmcd> second I did find something but haven't been able to connect w/rudi
23:06:03 <jjmcd> Might not be the solution, but might be
23:06:28 <Sparks> #action jjmcd to check with dgrift on Ubuntu migration / policycoreutils
23:06:45 <sgordon> rudi isn't going to be in till late today so we will have to follow up with him
23:06:46 <Sparks> #action jjmcd and rudi to continue to follow up on non-Latin characters in web
23:06:49 <sgordon> as far as the fop issue
23:06:57 <sgordon> there is a workaround package
23:07:02 <Sparks> sgordon: Yep, he sent me a message about that earlier.
23:07:05 <sgordon> but we dont have a solution we can actually ship
23:07:13 <sgordon> so still work to do there
23:07:29 <Sparks> #action rudi to continue to follow up on FOP issue
23:07:42 <Sparks> sgordon: Any work on the AmazonEC2 chapter?
23:07:52 <sgordon> yeah I pushed *some* content this morning
23:07:59 <sgordon> im just working through the sign-up procedure
23:08:08 <sgordon> and added a stub section for discussion AWS credentials
23:08:14 <sgordon> as i think that is a topic in its own right
23:08:31 <Sparks> sgordon: Awesome
23:08:47 <Sparks> On my items...
23:09:02 <Sparks> I completed the blog about FOP help (this morning... :/  )
23:09:21 <Sparks> And the FAD @ OLF stuff (will talk about that in a bit)
23:09:35 <Sparks> #action sparks to work with OLF folks to figure out a good time for the event.
23:09:50 <Sparks> #action sparks to work on teleconference setup for OLF
23:10:03 <Sparks> #action sparks to update the Docs list on Docs QA
23:10:17 <Sparks> I believe that takes us to the end of our list of items from last week.
23:10:34 <Sparks> #topic Copyright changes for all guides
23:10:50 <Sparks> If you missed the discussion on the Docs list...
23:10:55 <Sparks> #link https://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/docs/2011-June/013474.html
23:11:50 * nb 
23:11:52 <Sparks> So this is a bigger discussion about how we should be asking for attribution, how we provide attribution, and what our copyright statement should read.
23:12:14 <Sparks> I proposed four things today:
23:13:13 <Sparks> 1. We change the copyright on all guides to read "Fedora Project Contributors"
23:13:26 <Sparks> 2. We add an attribution appendix to all guides that include those
23:13:27 <Sparks> that have worked on the information contained within the guide.
23:13:41 <Sparks> 3. We remove the author list from the front of the guides.
23:13:53 <Sparks> 4. Clarify in the license text that attribution must be done within the work.
23:14:04 <Sparks> Anyone have any comments/questions on these?
23:15:02 <jjmcd> I assume
23:15:12 <jjmcd> this is in line with Spot's thinking?
23:16:01 <Sparks> Well, spot apparently isn't on the Docs list so I was going to point that discussion at him.
23:16:48 <Sparks> So I'd have to speculate...
23:16:54 * jjmcd has a hard time getting geeked about legal issues and tends to be of the opinion "If it's alright with Spot ...
23:16:58 <Sparks> But I think it does cover some of what he was talking about.
23:17:02 * sgordon agrees
23:17:05 <Sparks> heh
23:17:10 * Sparks agrees.
23:17:47 <jjmcd> We haven't been listing individual RN contributors, which is a delta IMO
23:17:51 <sgordon> i cant really comment on 4, but to me 1-3 just make sense
23:18:15 <sgordon> yeah, do we even track those currently?
23:18:27 <sgordon> or is that back to the discussion about working out how to draw it from the edits on the wiki
23:18:37 <jjmcd> The wiki history pages are wonderful
23:18:47 <sgordon> almost too wonderful ;D
23:19:01 <Sparks> I think it's important to give credit where credit is due... if we take stuff from the wiki then we are using it in compliance with the license
23:19:13 <Sparks> ...and thus must attribute the work.
23:19:26 <jjmcd> yep, I have no prob with that
23:19:42 <Sparks> #4, by the way, stemmed from a conversation I had with spot at SELF.
23:20:16 <sgordon> oh the other question i had
23:20:20 <Sparks> Okay, if no one has anything else to say about this, we'll move on.
23:20:22 <sgordon> was about translation attribution
23:20:28 <Sparks> right
23:20:31 <sgordon> and what the plan was for that
23:20:42 <Sparks> so that should be applied to the translation.
23:21:09 <sgordon> as an addition to the authors of the base document or a replacement?
23:21:22 <Sparks> as an addition
23:22:01 <Sparks> a translation is a derivative work
23:22:02 <sgordon> kk
23:22:05 <sgordon> yeah
23:22:25 <Sparks> I encourage everyone to weigh in on the Docs list...
23:22:30 <Sparks> Okay, anything else?
23:23:24 <Sparks> #topic Publican/pdf - Build system status
23:23:29 <Sparks> nb: Do you have anything on this?
23:23:42 <nb> nope, rudi is working oni t
23:23:48 <nb> i've been pretty much gone lately
23:24:22 <jjmcd> I think this is pending the FOP and non-Latin issues
23:25:09 <Sparks> right
23:25:14 <Sparks> Okay, moving on
23:25:28 <Sparks> #topic Goals for FAD @ OLF
23:25:42 <Sparks> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FAD_@_OLF_2011
23:26:16 <Sparks> I created a wiki page ^^^ to capture our goals, attendees, and other information.
23:26:16 <sgordon> personally i think it would be an opportunity to smash the cloud guide out of the park if enough people are interested, not sure if that is the right type of project for it though?
23:26:51 <Sparks> sgordon: That is an option.
23:26:52 <rbergeron> we might have the right people around to help out with that.
23:27:11 <sgordon> i will be remoting, probably with rudi fromt he office but yeah - definitely interested
23:27:13 <Sparks> I was hoping to get some of the "primary" guides some help but I'm up for anything.
23:27:19 <sgordon> fair enough
23:27:32 <sgordon> i dont think which guide(s) is that important
23:27:46 <Sparks> sgordon: Put it on the goals list on that wiki page, please.
23:27:49 <sgordon> just that it's an opportunity to get a number of authors pushing in the same direction while we are all in contact
23:27:50 <sgordon> yup
23:29:04 <Sparks> Anyone have anything else on this?
23:29:11 * Sparks knows it's still a bit early
23:29:52 <Sparks> Okay, moving on...
23:29:57 <Sparks> #topic Docs QA
23:30:26 <Sparks> Well, I haven't had a chance to really address this.
23:30:37 <Sparks> I'd really like it if someone picked this up and ran with it.
23:31:26 <sgordon> *crickets*
23:31:38 <Sparks> Yeah, tell me about it.
23:31:45 <Sparks> Well, it's on my to-do list so...
23:31:46 <sgordon> what is the actually aim
23:31:52 <sgordon> at least for an F16 timeframe
23:31:57 <sgordon> *actual
23:32:37 <Sparks> Ummm...  well, I'm not sure.  I'd really like to have the program up and running and have guides reviewed.
23:33:32 <sgordon> ok
23:33:58 <Sparks> but that might be a bit far fetched... :)
23:34:01 <sgordon> i cant really help much with organising an actual review phase
23:34:06 <sgordon> but i do have a script we use internally
23:34:15 <sgordon> for a basic sanity check
23:34:19 <jwulf> are there people who are waiting to do Docs QA?
23:34:31 <fnadge> well I could should have the tie
23:34:31 <jwulf> or do we need a process, and the people as well?
23:34:48 <sgordon> mainly spelling, entity usage, repeated words
23:34:52 <sgordon> basic things like that
23:34:58 <sgordon> i think we are after both jwulf
23:35:09 <Sparks> jwulf: Ummm...  I wouldn't say we have an army of QAers waiting... but there have been a few people who wanted to do this
23:35:11 <sgordon> there currently pretty much isnt a QA process
23:35:21 <jjmcd> Seems to me a few folks have raised their hands
23:35:27 <sgordon> and yeah, one or two people have said they'd like to but we dont have a process for it
23:35:51 <jwulf> two passes:
23:35:58 <jwulf> one through the built html testing the procedures
23:36:13 <jwulf> and spelling
23:36:15 <jwulf> one through the xml checking the tags?
23:36:48 <Sparks> jwulf: Yeah... and sanity checking procedures and such
23:38:30 <jwulf> i could put together a rough outline for a QA process this week
23:39:13 <Sparks> jwulf: That would be most helpful
23:39:23 <jwulf> k
23:39:39 <Sparks> jwulf: Thank you!
23:39:51 <jwulf> np, glad to be able to help out
23:39:58 <Sparks> :)
23:40:00 <Sparks> Okay, anything else?
23:41:05 <Sparks> #topic Outstanding BZ Tickets
23:41:15 <Sparks> #link http://tinyurl.com/lbrq84
23:41:46 <Sparks> Just wanted to point out that there are bugs to be fixed!  You don't have to be a guide owner to provide patches!  :)
23:42:00 <Sparks> #topic Open floor discussion
23:42:05 <Sparks> Okay, anyone have anything else?
23:45:08 <Sparks> Okay, then.  Thanks everyone for coming out!
23:45:19 <jjmcd> Thanks, Eric
23:45:33 <Sparks> Will meet everyone over in #fedora-docs!
23:45:38 <Sparks> #endmeeting