15:04:00 <jreznik> #startmeeting kde-sig -- http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SIGs/KDE/Meetings/2012-04-17
15:04:00 <zodbot> Meeting started Tue Apr 17 15:04:00 2012 UTC.  The chair is jreznik. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
15:04:00 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
15:04:07 <jreznik> #meetingname kde-sig
15:04:08 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'kde-sig'
15:04:11 * jreznik is updating wiki
15:04:17 <jreznik> #topic Roll Call
15:04:24 * rnovacek is here
15:05:03 <Kevin_Kofler> Present.
15:06:00 <rdieter> here (doing a bad job of multitasking, and good job of distracting myself today)
15:06:24 * than is present
15:06:25 * jreznik is sickday today, still not feeling well but everything for meeting :)
15:06:36 * ltinkl is present
15:06:52 <jreznik> #chair jreznik ltinkl Kevin_Kofler rdieter than rnovacek
15:06:52 <zodbot> Current chairs: Kevin_Kofler jreznik ltinkl rdieter rnovacek than
15:07:01 <jreznik> #info Kevin_Kofler jreznik ltinkl rdieter rnovacek than present
15:07:15 <jreznik> #topic Agenda
15:07:43 <jreznik> ideas - test day wrap-up...
15:09:05 <jreznik> anything for agenda?
15:10:15 <than> perhaps blocker bugs for f17 if we have
15:11:09 <Kevin_Kofler> Oh, and what about shipping the polkit-kde authorization editor KCM? I noticed that some other distros are already shipping it.
15:11:24 <Kevin_Kofler> It's the only GUI to edit PolicyKit 1 authorizations.
15:11:31 <Kevin_Kofler> (There's not even a GNOME one.)
15:11:55 <jreznik> was it ever really! finished?
15:12:03 <rdieter> Kevin_Kofler: i guess that would mean we should package it first.
15:12:08 <jreznik> than: I'm not aware of any
15:13:05 <Kevin_Kofler> https://projects.kde.org/projects/extragear/base/polkit-kde-kcmodules-1/repository
15:13:06 <rdieter> speaking of stuff never finished, I just updated kiosktool from a git snapshot, it supports kde4 now, and (reportedly) actually works now.
15:13:23 <Kevin_Kofler> Thomas Balling Sørensen did some stuff on that in September 2011.
15:13:57 <jreznik> looks like more informal meeting today without agenda :)
15:13:59 <Kevin_Kofler> I don't know whether it's good enough to ship though. I only know that some distros are shipping it, but for all I know they might be shipping broken crap. ;-)
15:15:00 <Kevin_Kofler> rdieter: Good news, is that in Fedora proper yet? Or only in kde-redhat?
15:15:11 <than> Kevin_Kofler: imo we need to check it before, just avoiding to add broken stuff
15:15:19 <rdieter> hrm, I updated fedora git, but it may have been half-retired or blocked or something
15:15:24 <rdieter> my koji build didn't go through
15:16:02 <Kevin_Kofler> Re blocker bugs, I nominated the purple mess for final blocker status (as one argument for not having it block the Beta was "it's only a Beta", which obviously doesn't apply to the Final).
15:16:18 <Kevin_Kofler> No decision so far, I guess they'll only seriously look at the proposed blockers once we enter the Final Freeze.
15:16:21 <rdieter> what's 'the purpose mess'?
15:16:26 <rdieter> the purple mess even
15:16:41 <Kevin_Kofler> The cirrus 16 bpp issue.
15:17:08 <rdieter> oh ok (though it was some reference to libpurple... :) )
15:18:38 <Kevin_Kofler> There's also the livecd-tools size regression which makes us fail the blocking size criterion, a fix for that is already in Bodhi, so hopefully that'll be sorted out soon.
15:18:45 <rdieter> ok, confirmed kiosktool is blocked, and no < master/f18 branch exists
15:19:07 <Kevin_Kofler> (It turned out they accidentally and unnecessarily put multiple copies of the kernel on the ISO, which is what bloated it so much.)
15:19:16 <ltinkl> rdieter: one of my students will work on extending kiosktool
15:19:17 <rdieter> ugh, that may mean a re-review, but meh.  I'll investigate more after meeting
15:19:21 <rdieter> ltinkl: yay!
15:21:58 <rdieter> jreznik: ok, let's move on to your test day wrap up topic
15:22:46 <Kevin_Kofler> And thanks to rdieter and jreznik for getting qt-at-spi into Fedora, another wanted package that is in now.
15:23:51 <jreznik> Kevin_Kofler: the idea behind qt-at-spi is to be able to do automatic test via dogtail
15:24:11 <jreznik> and it's still crashing heavily (even 0.3.1) as reported by vhumpa
15:24:27 <jreznik> also the idea is to provide kcm to enable it easily
15:25:48 <Kevin_Kofler> qt-at-spi is also useful for people who need the Orca screen reader. But automatic testing is also very nice. Hopefully the crashes can be sorted out.
15:26:11 <jreznik> Kevin_Kofler: of course it's great for people who need screen readers
15:26:27 <jreznik> #topic Test Day wrap-up
15:26:42 <Kevin_Kofler> I guess Dogtail could also be abused to automate GUI apps in some cases. :-)
15:27:02 <jreznik> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2012-04-10_KDE_4.8
15:27:02 <Kevin_Kofler> (GUI scripting)
15:27:38 <jreznik> we have received quite a lot of test results
15:27:48 <rdieter> got a lot of good testing, feedback, and bugs.
15:28:20 <jreznik> I think it was worth the work, next time we will need more time for creating better test cases
15:28:40 <jreznik> but still we have more confidence in F17 is at least booting :)
15:28:56 <Kevin_Kofler> Also a couple very strange bug reports, but most of the reports seem to make sense. Now I wonder whether we can actually fix them or get them fixed by upstream…
15:29:20 <jreznik> Kevin_Kofler: I'd like to go through tmrw (same for desktop validation tests ones)
15:29:59 * rdieter tried triaging some of them at least, but indeed, most need more love (confirming, re-testing, sending upstream where appropriate)
15:29:59 <jreznik> we should try to upstream it but also we should push on it to get fixes
15:30:16 <jreznik> rdieter: thanks, I saw your feedback
15:30:31 <jreznik> it would be great to offer some feedback to our users as thank you for testing
15:30:50 <jreznik> so I'd like to ask you to love these bugs :) and for me it's command :)
15:32:24 <rdieter> indeed, most of these (and other recent) bugs were very good ones, so explictly offering them thanks is the least we can do. and, I will say so next chance I get to comment in any of those bz's
15:35:07 <jreznik> anything else for test day?
15:35:19 <than> jreznik: +1,  i will go througg bugzilla and add some comments
15:39:40 <Kevin_Kofler> Hmmm, one more thing: What about the firstboot theming issue?
15:40:12 <jreznik> #topic Firstboot theming
15:40:22 <jreznik> Kevin_Kofler: good topic
15:40:36 <jreznik> if we will prepare patch, it will be merged into firstboot
15:40:38 <jreznik> I have a deal
15:40:40 <Kevin_Kofler> Has anybody looked at making firstboot detect the KDE spin and run xsettings-kde there as we discussed? If not, should we restore the gtkrc hack which makes oxygen-gtk the default theme for root on the KDE spin?
15:41:11 <Kevin_Kofler> So I have an idea how to fix firstboot (see above), but so far I haven't been able to look into implementing it.
15:41:18 <jreznik> so if you have any idea how to detect it, I can take a look
15:41:42 <rdieter> i'd guess the path of least-resistance would be a gtkrc
15:42:08 <rdieter> (that'll only work as long as firstboot is gtk2-based of course)
15:42:12 <Kevin_Kofler> I'd say a good and on-topic method would be a test like "exists(oxygen-gtk2) and not exists(adwaita-gtk2)".
15:42:52 <Kevin_Kofler> rdieter: It's also possible for gtk3. The drawback is the same in both cases, it forces the theme for root even in other desktops.
15:43:21 <rdieter> oh right, I was thinking GTK2_RC_FILES
15:43:37 <rdieter> your proposal is better
15:47:14 <rdieter> Kevin_Kofler: so your 'if...' pseudo code would conditionally run xsettings-kde ?
15:48:52 <Kevin_Kofler> Yes.
15:49:11 <Kevin_Kofler> Probably also testing that /usr/bin/xsettings-kde exists before trying to run it would be a good idea. :-)
15:51:00 <Kevin_Kofler> Though actually I'm not sure it would be sufficient… How do we set the default theme for kcm-gtk and xsettings-kde to use? There's some script in /etc/kde/env, isn't there? That's not going to be run in firstboot. :-/
15:51:57 <Kevin_Kofler> (unless we run it explicitly)
15:53:00 <rdieter> well, you'd have to test it all, sure. :)
15:53:46 <rdieter> but sure, since xsettings-kde currently groks it from .gtkrc2-kde4 or whatever, right?
15:54:15 * rdieter checked, ~/.gtkrc-2.0-kde4 is the one
15:54:20 <Kevin_Kofler> Right, and that's copied by some /etc/kde/env script, what a mess.
15:54:44 <Kevin_Kofler> https://fedorahosted.org/kde-settings/browser/trunk/etc/kde/env/gtk2_rc_files.sh
15:55:02 <rdieter> ok, firstboot isn't a user session, so won't get any of that by default alright
15:55:05 <Kevin_Kofler> So the firstboot hack would have to invoke that before invoking xsettings-kde.
15:55:12 <rdieter> yup
15:55:45 <Kevin_Kofler> Unless we do the copy in the live kickstart.
15:55:48 <Kevin_Kofler> (for root)
15:56:09 <jreznik> uf
15:56:36 <rdieter> the live kickstart would be a nice addition, but wouldn't help non-live installs
15:56:46 <rdieter> DVD, netinstalls, yada yada
15:56:47 <Kevin_Kofler> Another big mess is that this also sets GTK2_RC_FILES; without that set, I don't think xsettings-kde will find the file.
15:56:56 <Kevin_Kofler> rdieter: The whole hack is live-CD-specific.
15:57:15 <Kevin_Kofler> (live-install-specific, to be more precise)
15:57:33 <rdieter> firstboot from DVD install works ok ?
15:57:47 <Kevin_Kofler> Well, I guess it depends on what you checked.
15:58:04 <Kevin_Kofler> If you manage to install without adwaita, you'll also get the ugly fallback theme there, otherwise you'll get adwaita.
15:58:08 <rdieter> ok, so I was hoping we have something more robust to handle both(all!) cases
15:58:10 <Kevin_Kofler> This has always been like that.
15:58:44 <rdieter> but baby steps, if getting only kde-live working is a first step, so be it
15:59:30 <Kevin_Kofler> Uhm, what if, instead of invoking xsettings-kde, if we have Oxygen and no Adwaita, we write a gtkrc2-firstboot which sets the theme to Oxygen and set GTK2_RC_FILES to that.
15:59:34 <Kevin_Kofler> Do it all inside firstboot.
16:00:00 <Kevin_Kofler> That will do the right thing whenever you install with the KDE group and none of the comps groups with Adwaita in them.
16:00:04 <rdieter> right that was my first suggestion about 15 minutes ago. :)
16:00:10 <Kevin_Kofler> (and if you do have Adwaita, it will use Adwaita)
16:00:41 <rdieter> well, the basic idea, anyway, works for me.
16:02:08 <rdieter> Kevin_Kofler: if you want to work on it, i'll defer to your perference (ie, the one doing the work gets more say in the matter). :)
16:02:26 <jreznik> we are out of time -> #fedora-kde
16:02:35 <rdieter> nod
16:02:41 <jreznik> #endmeeting