13:59:29 <randomuser`> #startmeeting Docs Project Meeting - Agenda: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Project_meetings
13:59:29 <zodbot> Meeting started Mon Aug 26 13:59:29 2013 UTC.  The chair is randomuser`. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
13:59:29 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
13:59:29 <randomuser`> #meetingname Fedora Docs
13:59:29 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fedora_docs'
13:59:29 <randomuser`> #topic Roll Call
13:59:39 * Capesteve is here
13:59:53 * jhradilek is here.
14:00:08 * croberts here
14:00:11 * jsmith is lurking
14:00:21 * zoglesby is here
14:00:25 * randomuser` wonders if any new members will appear today
14:00:39 * pkovar 
14:01:59 <randomuser`> morning, swflint
14:02:16 * jreznik is around, ping me if you will need me
14:02:46 * jamielinux is here, thinking about joining docs team. Not gone through steps yet, but since I'm here, thought I'd say hello
14:02:52 <swflint> good morning to you too randomuser`
14:03:56 <randomuser`> welcome, jamielinux , feel free to throw out any questions
14:04:05 <jamielinux> randomuser`: Thanks :)
14:05:36 <randomuser`> #topic Follow up on last week's action items (10 minutes )
14:05:48 <randomuser`> So, last week we had action items for Badges
14:06:17 <randomuser`> Is it safe to say we know where to file tickets for badges, and we don't have to meet about it ?
14:07:40 <randomuser`> okay, glad we agree
14:07:58 <randomuser`> #topic Release Notes / Changes
14:08:21 <randomuser`> A brief overview might be good for our new people
14:08:58 <randomuser`> We divide the work of creating the release notes into beats and track it at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Category:Documentation_beats?rd=Docs/Beats
14:09:20 <randomuser`> Writers can volunteer to *own* a beat or contribute ad hoc
14:10:07 <randomuser`> We also have a Changes process, wherein we will try to assign a writer to each of the major Changes for inclusion in the RNs and to assess impact on other guides
14:10:33 <randomuser`> #info Writers can create bugs for themselves to cover our part of the changes process at any time
14:11:11 <randomuser`> so, this part of the meeting is usually just to remind people about the process
14:11:39 <randomuser`> Has anyone taken a beat yet? anything I left out in the overview that would be helpful for new writers?
14:12:59 <croberts> I would but i am still working on my guide and dont want to take too much on
14:13:25 <randomuser`> that's fair
14:14:19 <randomuser`> #action randomuser to announce open beats
14:14:39 <randomuser`> #action randomuser to start creating tracking bugs for Changes
14:14:56 <randomuser`> #topic Guide Status
14:15:04 <randomuser`> any Guide news?
14:15:35 <swflint> I could consider taking the QA for the Amatuer Radio Guide
14:16:17 <randomuser`> swflint, that'd be great! Anything we can do to help?
14:16:37 <croberts> I will push new updates to mine today, My laptop crashed so I will be using my desktop for a while. Otherwise I would have pushed to git sooner
14:16:54 <randomuser`> swflint, i think jjmcd and Sparks are well invested in that, and they are often in #fedora-docs
14:17:29 <swflint> Yes, I know
14:17:48 <zoglesby> I am hard at work on the ARM Guide
14:18:44 <randomuser`> did you find/need any technical contacts for that, zoglesby ?
14:19:15 <zoglesby> randomuser`: indeed
14:19:29 <jhradilek> randomuser`: I am not sure if this is the right time and place to announce it, but I will have to step down as the maintainer of the System Administrator's Guide.
14:19:32 <randomuser`> zoglesby, sorry, you have to pick one
14:20:07 <zoglesby> randomuser`: I am working with the #fedora-arm group and jsmith says he will help
14:20:15 <zoglesby> but we will see about that last part :P
14:20:46 <jreznik> randomuser`: for tracking bugs, please update it in the Change page (once created + owner, or update the Change page to fit your need ;-)
14:20:58 <randomuser`> zoglesby, cool. I bought a little gadget to play around with, but if I'm being realistic, i'll probably spend my writing time on something else and leave android on it
14:21:03 <randomuser`> jreznik, ACK
14:21:26 <randomuser`> jhradilek, aww.... is that a side effect of your promotion?
14:21:31 <randomuser`> congrats, btw
14:21:39 <jhradilek> randomuser`: Thanks. :)
14:22:47 <randomuser`> Is Capesteve stepping in? That's a big office cot to fill
14:22:51 <jhradilek> Unfortunately yes. :( I will still be contributing to it, but I think it deserves someone who can take better care of it.
14:22:59 <jhradilek> I hope he is. :)
14:23:05 <randomuser`> :)
14:23:24 <Capesteve> I'll need a lot of help
14:23:30 <randomuser`> jhradilek, well, it's a relief to hear you will still be working with us
14:23:43 <jhradilek> Capesteve: Now is the time for you to pretend that you volunteer to do it. :)
14:23:57 <jhradilek> randomuser`: I certainly will. :)
14:23:58 <Capesteve> oh, sherbet
14:24:54 <Capesteve> I'll try to motivate some others to help with the text for outstanding bugs
14:25:56 <jhradilek> Capesteve: I'll do my best to find you more volunteers. ;)
14:26:21 <randomuser`> if it helps, there are badges
14:26:26 <randomuser`> and sometimes tshirts
14:26:38 <Capesteve> people here need luncheon vouchers
14:26:45 <randomuser`> ha!
14:27:26 * randomuser` usually gets a "luncheon voucher" in the form of a "why did you stop working"phone call
14:27:53 <Capesteve> sounds harsh if not cruel
14:28:16 <randomuser`> and also OT, apologies
14:28:36 <randomuser`> oh, while I'm thinking about it
14:28:44 <randomuser`> here, zoglesby, have a badge
14:28:50 <randomuser`> #chair zoglesby
14:28:50 <zodbot> Current chairs: randomuser` zoglesby
14:30:58 <jhradilek> You can get a badge for that? o.O
14:31:09 <randomuser`> for chairing a meeting? yes
14:31:12 <croberts> yep
14:31:16 * jhradilek suddenly wants one too. :)
14:31:19 <randomuser`> you got one last time, jhradilek
14:31:24 <jhradilek> Did I?
14:32:07 <zoglesby> yay!
14:32:18 <randomuser`> at least, I thought you should have
14:32:30 <jhradilek> https://badges.fedoraproject.org/user/1345
14:33:08 <randomuser`> #chair jhradilek
14:33:08 <zodbot> Current chairs: jhradilek randomuser` zoglesby
14:33:25 <randomuser`> hey Sparks
14:34:37 <randomuser`> okay, guides are covered i think
14:34:49 <randomuser`> #topic Outstanding BZ tickets
14:35:03 <randomuser`> #link http://tinyurl.com/lbrq84
14:35:23 <randomuser`> so, we've got some bugs thar
14:35:29 <randomuser`> any we should talk about?
14:36:03 <randomuser`> btw, croberts, i think you've discovered why you should commit and push frequently
14:36:06 <randomuser`> :P
14:37:15 <croberts> lol yes I have
14:37:30 <croberts> i have learned the hard way
14:37:52 <Capesteve> that is the best way
14:38:51 * lnovich sorry so late
14:38:54 <lnovich> miss anything?
14:39:42 <randomuser`> lnovich, we're on bugs
14:39:55 <lnovich> eew .. bugs
14:40:37 <randomuser`> indeed. We have quite a few of them, actually
14:41:24 <randomuser`> maybe we need a VFAD or similar
14:42:44 <lnovich> wanted to ask in general - if another upstream community is making a package that is in Fedora and they already have a decent doc base for that feature - link to it or paraphrase it?
14:43:43 <randomuser`> I would try and represent the feature in the Fedora docs, personally
14:43:51 <randomuser`> #topic Open Floor
14:44:11 <jamielinux> What does VFAD stand for? I can assume what it is, but Google suggests variable food agro diagnostics? Or perhaps variable fresh air duct? :P
14:44:23 <randomuser`> lnovich, it could be very easy, depending on the upstream license
14:44:42 <jsmith> jamielinux: A Virtual Fedora Activity Day
14:44:52 <randomuser`> jamielinux, virtual fedora activity day. basically we have a consensus about a date and purpose
14:45:04 <lnovich> sounds like a plan...
14:45:12 <jamielinux> jsmith: randomuser`: Thanks! I did like Google's suggestions though.. ;)
14:45:42 <lnovich> sounds like a hackathon
14:46:01 <lnovich> what would that entail?
14:46:16 * randomuser` has never done one
14:46:32 <lnovich> neither have I
14:46:58 <lnovich> but i think having one day for doc writing Fedora sounds like a really good idea
14:47:33 <randomuser`> we could probably get a lot of bugs cleaned up, as a group
14:47:42 <lnovich> yes we can
14:49:15 <jamielinux> What's the plan RE publican 3.0?
14:49:38 * lnovich hides in the corner and pleads the 5th
14:49:50 <randomuser`> jamielinux, releng, infra, and the publican maintainer are working on it
14:50:07 <randomuser`> I suppose they will let us know when it is done and how to use it
14:50:16 <jamielinux> randomuser`: Cool!
14:50:23 <lnovich> it may take a while but we are working on it
14:50:44 <lnovich> I will ask Rudi to give a status update if you want
14:50:44 <jamielinux> lnovich: No rush, I was just wondering. publican 2.5 is pretty nice.
14:51:06 <jamielinux> :
14:51:08 <jamielinux> :)
14:51:30 <lnovich> i will ask/ beg him tomorrow when i speak w/him
14:52:14 <lnovich> is there any need - want for putting the MAN pages online ?
14:52:26 <randomuser`> lnovich, Hopefully, he's aware we are interested in the progress already - no need to nag
14:52:44 <lnovich> sometimes rudi needs to be nudged
14:52:50 <randomuser`> lnovich, there was some vague interest, but not enough to overcome the infrastructure demands of making it happen
14:53:04 <randomuser`> we've discussed it a few times with no real development
14:53:06 <lnovich> what would be involved?
14:53:46 <randomuser`> lnovich, something that would unpack every rpm on every update, format the manpage, and push to a web site
14:53:59 <Capesteve> putting man pages on-line is waste of our time
14:54:23 <Capesteve> efforts to improve man pages more important
14:54:36 <randomuser`> Capesteve, +1 . It certainly isn't something I want to invest time in
14:54:37 <jamielinux> Also there are man page conflicts to worry about too. Seems like a lot of effort for not that much benefit.
14:55:12 <Capesteve> jamielinux: yes, version problems
14:55:26 <lnovich> ok noted
14:56:02 <Capesteve> guides on how to do it for developers might be something jhradilek could look into in his new spare time?
14:56:17 <lnovich> is there a way submit a patch for changing a man page?
14:56:26 <lnovich> or is opening a bug better
14:56:29 <lnovich> or both?
14:56:50 <randomuser`> lnovich, download/clone upstream release, generate diff?
14:56:52 <Capesteve> lnovich: I do it for developers when I document thier application sometimes
14:57:05 <lnovich> ok guess i need to get more into that
14:57:17 <randomuser`> Capesteve, I like that idea; better for users, and endears us to the devs
14:57:24 <lnovich> as i am getting involved more and more w/libvirt
14:57:43 <lnovich> can we talk offline on how it is done?
14:57:44 <Capesteve> lnovich: clone the developers repo if you are working on documenting something new, take a look at the man pages
14:58:07 <randomuser`> fascinating, fast paced development with libvirt
14:58:22 <lnovich> warp speed in a blender
14:58:42 <randomuser`> we should be wrapping up, qa is starting soon
14:58:52 <lnovich> and the interaction with and without QEMU and KVM is a bit confusing to say the least
14:58:52 <Capesteve> lnovich: ping me when you need to make your first patch or view your first man page in a repo
14:58:57 <lnovich> sure will do capesteve
14:59:43 <Capesteve> time check
14:59:44 <lnovich> </done>
14:59:55 <randomuser`> #endmeeting