04:02:28 #startmeeting Fedora APAc bi-weekly meeting 2 January 2014 04:02:28 Meeting started Sat Jan 3 04:02:28 2015 UTC. The chair is banas. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 04:02:28 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 04:02:49 #chair rtnpro siddhesh 04:02:49 Current chairs: banas rtnpro siddhesh 04:02:52 .hellomynameis siddhedh 04:02:53 siddhesh: Sorry, but you don't exist 04:03:05 #topic Roll call 04:03:06 .hellomynameis siddhesh 04:03:07 siddhesh: siddhesh 'Siddhesh Poyarekar' 04:03:18 .fasinfo sarupbanskota 04:03:19 banas: User: sarupbanskota, Name: Sarup Banskota, email: sbanskota08@gmail.com, Creation: 2013-03-28, IRC Nick: banas, Timezone: Asia/Kolkata, Locale: en, GPG key ID: , Status: active 04:03:20 .hellomynameis rtnpro 04:03:22 banas: Unapproved Groups: summer-coding 04:03:25 banas: Approved Groups: cla_fpca cla_done designteam ambassadors 04:03:28 rtnpro: rtnpro 'Ratnadeep Debnath' 04:04:26 .hellomynameis alick 04:04:27 alick: alick 'Zhao Tao' 04:04:28 .hellomynameis kumarpraveen 04:04:30 praveenkumar: kumarpraveen 'None' 04:05:01 I have just reached here and have a shaky internet/charge 04:05:06 hi alick and praveenkumar 04:05:13 #chair alick praveenkumar 04:05:13 Current chairs: alick banas praveenkumar rtnpro siddhesh 04:07:56 banas: there and back again :) 04:08:17 sorry, I am on a very bad line. frequent disconnections. 04:08:38 same here, I just reached and have bad internet/charge 04:09:01 I believe today's tickets are here: https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/report/9 04:09:29 yes 04:09:52 any actions from last meeting? 04:09:57 Should we move to discussing tickets then, unless there's something that has to be announced? 04:11:00 not that I know. I don't think the bids were discussed at the famsco meeting 04:11:40 here's what I dug up: * tuanta to propose this suggestion to FAmSCo next week meeting 04:11:55 hi 04:12:06 .fasinfo pravins 04:12:07 pravins: User: pravins, Name: Pravin Satpute, email: psatpute@redhat.com, Creation: 2007-11-14, IRC Nick: pravins, Timezone: Asia/Kolkata, Locale: en, GPG key ID: 3EDF779F, Status: active 04:12:07 since tuanta is not here today, mark it as action again 04:12:10 pravins: Approved Groups: fedorabugs cla_fedora cla_done @cvsredhat-config-language packager @svnsystem-config-language gitenglish-typing-booster @svnitranslit svnlohit @gitibus-rawcode @gitibus-sayura +gitliberation-fonts @gitindic-typing-booster cla_fpca @gitibus-indic-table provenpackager ambassadors marketing 04:12:38 "this" being community agreed to suggest Pune as the location for FUDCon APAC 2015 04:12:50 #chair pravins 04:12:50 Current chairs: alick banas praveenkumar pravins rtnpro siddhesh 04:13:17 tuanta said he'll join later, should we wait until he arrives alick ? 04:14:04 banas: ok, next topic first then 04:14:49 right, let's start with the tickets 04:14:56 #topic Tickets 04:15:34 We'll start with #174: https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/ticket/174 04:16:27 banas, yay! 04:16:46 .fas zerng07 04:16:48 zerng07: zerng07 'Cheng-Chia Tseng' 04:17:17 So, the above ticket is for budget approval for F21 release party in Bangalore 04:17:24 the related wikipage is here: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Release_Party_F21_Bangalore 04:17:32 It's happening on Jan 10, 2015 04:17:37 banas, thanks :) 04:17:46 #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Release_Party_F21_Bangalore 04:18:07 We got the space for the event at Red Hat, Bangalore 04:18:51 also, we are talking with Red Hat for sponsorship for the cake and snacks as well 04:19:06 but that is not confirmed yet 04:19:06 rtnpro: and I will be sending DVDs in the coming week to the rh office 04:19:16 siddhesh, ok 04:19:50 rtnpro: I will send 800, so if you or anybody down south needs them, you know where to get them from. 04:20:07 siddhesh, +1 04:20:07 I'm likely to be in Bangalore as well on that day, but it clashes with Rubyconf 04:20:09 banas, :P 04:20:47 so, regarding the budget approval, the figures that I gave are tentative 04:21:19 and I am trying my best to bring it down 04:21:32 hi all :) 04:21:36 happy new year :) 04:21:38 .fas tuanta 04:21:39 tuanta_: tuanta 'Truong Anh Tuan' 04:21:53 anyone can chair me? 04:21:55 rtnpro: how much is it? sorry I am unable to access the ticket right now 04:22:02 #chair tuanta_ 04:22:02 Current chairs: alick banas praveenkumar pravins rtnpro siddhesh tuanta_ 04:22:19 siddhesh, it's 146$ 04:22:23 happy new year tuanta_ :) 04:22:25 sorry, I had a late meeting in my office 04:23:02 no worries tuanta_, we were discussing #174 04:23:15 breakup: Fedora indoor standee: 43$, Fedora 21 Cake (2 kg): 24$, Snacks: 79$ 04:23:36 https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/ticket/174 fyi 04:23:36 rtnpro: for release party budget limit is only $100 As fas as i know 04:23:47 pravins, I know that 04:24:08 The indoor standee can be reused though 04:24:15 banas, yes 04:24:30 +1 banas 04:25:22 +1 banas 04:25:29 I see it is fine enough 04:25:43 that limit is not hard, it is flexible 04:26:02 of course, provided that it is a Fedora standee and not a F21 standee 04:26:23 siddhesh, it will be a Fedora standee :) 04:26:38 sounds good 04:27:07 rtnpro: then it should be requested in the marketing material budget, not for release party 04:27:27 tuanta_: thats good. 04:27:40 siddhesh, I will move the budget requirement for the standee to another ticket 04:27:41 which then brings your budget closer to the $100 limit 04:27:44 yes, without the standee, it's pretty much within the 100$ cap 04:27:50 +1 siddhesh. We can add a note to clarify it 04:28:02 tuanta_ what do you think? 04:28:19 ok 04:28:36 rtnpro, you don't need to open another ticket, add a note is ok 04:28:46 tuanta_, ok 04:29:21 then try to get the total for remaining items to $100. That's fair enough for all 04:29:25 I think so 04:29:47 +1 04:29:54 +1 04:29:58 tuanta_: agree +1 04:30:00 unless it is impossible. we can add an exception here. 04:30:21 but I don't see it's necessary to do that 04:30:48 the remaining items are $103 04:31:18 down snack a bit. is that ok, rtnpro ? 04:31:34 I think we can vote for it now 04:31:48 tuanta_, as I said, the values are tentative 04:31:49 +1 04:32:03 +1 04:32:05 +1 04:32:07 yes, it seems good, +1 04:32:10 +1 04:32:20 rtnpro, but you should manage the total expense under the limit ($100) 04:32:21 +1 04:32:39 everyone is doing that. unless you need an exception 04:32:48 tuanta_, I will do that 04:33:46 #info Fedora standee expense should be separated (by adding a note into the ticket) 04:34:15 #info the total expense should be managed under the limit of $100 04:34:25 +1 with above notes 04:35:01 banas, can you count the vote then note an "agreed"? 04:36:01 #AGREED ticket #175. +1(6), -1(0) 04:36:11 Is that the right format tuanta_? 04:36:28 #undo 04:36:28 Removing item from minutes: AGREED by banas at 04:36:01 : ticket #175. +1(6), -1(0) 04:36:31 i'm afraid it should be in small case :) 04:36:46 yes, it should be in small case. 04:37:00 banas, it is fine 04:37:01 oh, seems OK with captical case? 04:37:04 #agreed ticket #174. +1(6), -1(0): Support for Release Party Bangalore 04:37:11 it is undoed indeed. 04:37:21 I had the ticket number wrong :) it supports capital case. 04:37:21 :) 04:37:35 banas, undo again :) 04:37:36 banas: :) 04:37:39 tuanta_, I have updated the ticket 04:37:47 thanks, rtnpro 04:37:51 but AFAIK #action needs small case... 04:38:15 tuanta_: I fixed the ticket number on the last one.. what did you want me to undo it for? 04:38:35 that's ok, banas :) 04:38:37 thanks 04:38:42 ok, next? 04:38:49 sure! next should be #175 04:39:10 https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/ticket/175, Release Party at IITM 04:39:46 #link https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/ticket/175 04:40:19 I'm doing a 3 nights workshop here starting tonight. On the last day, I would like to organize a Release Party. 04:40:55 I am fine with this ticket. Thanks banas 04:40:59 The other days are more focused on general development (not specific to any community), but the last day is Fedora-oriented 04:41:01 any questions? 04:41:20 banas, you are doing a great job 04:41:29 no..looks good. 04:42:07 banas, +1 04:42:31 +1 for ticket #175 04:42:39 looks great #175 04:42:41 banas: i only have one more suggestion 04:42:47 +1 for #175 04:42:48 alick: sure 04:42:51 +1 04:42:59 maybe discuss some student league or teachers, to get more students involved. 04:43:25 eof 04:43:34 +1 alick 04:43:51 um, I'm not sure what a student league is.. is that like a club (how we call it in India?) help me with that siddhesh? 04:44:06 or a user group? 04:44:20 banas, yes, user groups in IITM 04:44:21 banas: maybe, like a LUG on campus 04:44:42 banas, it is also available in Vietnam. I can imagine :) 04:44:45 I think he means club. 04:44:53 we call them student leagues or student associations here 04:45:26 ah yes, there are IITM students helping me, I think they said some LUG folks will attend :) the workshop participation is limited to folks who qualify some screening, so I think we might be able to land some potential contributors 04:45:56 if that counts, +1 for me to (for the record) 04:46:01 *from 04:46:27 * siddhesh offline for a bit. brb 04:46:38 so.. should I agree this? 04:46:46 +1 for the ticket 04:47:11 banas, you have a vote, of course 04:47:19 banas: yes, I think that was alick concern/suggestion. 04:47:54 #agreed ticket #175: +1(6), -1(0): Support for Release Party IIT Madras 04:47:55 .fas izhar 04:47:56 KageSenshi: izhar 'Mohd Izhar Firdaus Ismail' 04:48:01 +1 for #175 04:48:09 KageSenshi, hello. Some concerns about reimbursement. It is good if you could be around here for the next topic. 04:48:11 sorry, power outage just now due to some house fixing .. 04:48:30 #agreed ticket #175. +1(6), -1(0): Support for F21 Release Party at IIT Madras 04:48:38 next up is #176 04:48:50 https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/ticket/176, Budget For Release Party Fedora 21 - Beijing, China 04:48:56 :\ 04:49:05 #link https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/ticket/176 04:49:08 oh, this is my ticket for relparty beijing 04:49:11 #action tuanta to update the ticket #175 for approval status 04:49:27 https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Release_Party_F21_Beijing FYI 04:49:35 #action tuanta to update the ticket #174 for approval status 04:49:44 oh and thanks alick btw! :D 04:50:31 we plan to organize it on Jan 24, in a university. 04:50:37 the cost detailed on #176 is pretty detailed, very nice :) 04:51:16 banas, +1 04:51:38 alick: Is cake cost cover in Food/Drink section (want to confirm in case alick forgot to add it)? 04:51:42 this time we do not include DVD budget, since it will be shipped from Europe 04:52:11 alick, I still seeing a more general issue how to produce swag and media to (re)use in all Fedora events 04:52:13 praveenkumar: oh, we have not planned a cake ;) 04:52:40 alick, have you got any updates about DVD shipping? 04:52:40 paragn: if we are going to have a cake, it should be included in food & drinks. 04:52:54 ah, alright. 04:53:24 tuanta_: no updates about DVD so far. 04:53:25 last time, I asked Jiri to send 2000 DVD to Singapore and 1000 to Beijing, but I am not sure he did send them 04:53:43 ah, ok, we need to check this 04:54:02 we have provided the address, so I believe he should have sent them. 04:54:12 yeah, we need to check with Jiri 04:54:13 #action tuanta to remind Jiri to ship DVD to Singapore and Beijing 04:55:08 how about swag, could you have a way to produce it in batch for other events. I think it would be cheaper 04:55:33 e.g. stickers 04:56:19 yes i think zsun is contacting vendors to get quotes of stickers and other small goodies. 04:56:52 * banas will brb, meds 04:57:08 alick, and the expense listed in this ticket is that quote? 04:57:31 tuanta_: no, the expense are from past experience. 04:57:44 tuanta_: by quotes I mean quotes for large quantity production 04:58:05 alick, yes I see. It is not available at this moment 04:58:13 so we need to think more for next events 04:58:27 anyway, I am fine with this ticket. +1 for it 04:58:40 +1 04:59:01 * siddhesh back 04:59:16 alick, we're still discussing #176 right? 04:59:18 voting, please :) 04:59:19 +1 04:59:23 yes, siddhesh 04:59:25 siddhesh: yes 04:59:39 +1 for #176 04:59:48 +1 04:59:53 time is up 05:00:06 any more tickets to day? :) 05:00:22 tuanta_, the ticket for discussing transaction fees 05:00:26 +1 for #176 05:00:46 tuanta_, also https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/ticket/173 05:00:55 thanks siddhesh. it is more important 05:01:03 tuanta_, I have produced 1000 server dvds for APAC 05:01:17 and we need to discuss shipping for that 05:01:20 cool. Thanks siddhesh 05:01:29 and of course, budget for it 05:01:47 tuanta_, I did it in advance because the vendor gave me a special rate for it 05:02:03 that is, I did it without waiting for budget approval 05:02:30 ok, please close discussing about #176 first 05:02:39 banas, enough vote? 05:03:08 yes, there are 6 05:03:33 agreed? 05:03:46 #agreed ticket #176. +1(6), -1(0): Support for Release Party Beijing 05:03:50 Yeah 05:04:11 #action tuanta_ to update ticket #176 for approval 05:04:28 thx :) 05:04:32 #topic Media shipping 05:04:32 tuanta_, the budget request for apac server dvds is: https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/ticket/172 05:04:55 #info siddhesh produced 1000 server DVD for APAC 05:05:00 #link https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/ticket/172 05:05:35 $390 including sleeves, but I haven't got the sleeves made yet. we hope to close that with a vendor this coming week 05:07:02 siddhesh, that's a good price, I see. Thank you for making it on time 05:07:28 any questions? or should we vote for it now? 05:07:57 #topic #Ticket #172 - Server DVDs for APAC 05:08:24 it is in this FY budget, right? 05:08:45 yes, we are still in FY2015, alick 05:08:57 siddhesh: special thanks for making it available just in time for Mumbai release party :) 05:09:07 pravins, heh, np :) 05:09:35 tuanta_: oh i see. no further questions from me. 05:10:46 voting? 05:10:50 +1 from me 05:10:54 +1 for #172 05:10:54 +1 05:11:06 +1 05:11:13 +1 05:11:45 banas, your turn :) 05:12:21 +1 for #172 05:13:19 #agreed ticket #172: +1(6), -1(0): Server DVDs for apac 05:14:26 cool, that leaves 2 important topics: 1) shipping these in APAC and 2) the transaction fees problem 05:14:35 #topic Media shipping in APAC 05:14:50 any ideas? 05:15:27 in the past, shipping DVD has been checked much at Vietnamese customs 05:15:35 but I hope it would be better today 05:15:41 One idea I have is to ship 700 of those 1000 DVDs to singapore and then let harish send them to whoever requests it 05:15:42 I would like to retry 05:15:58 sounds good, siddhesh 05:16:08 because singapore seems to have good relations with most of apac 05:16:40 Yeah, that's true. 05:17:00 also because harish can mix with Workstation DVD and other goodies 05:17:10 right 05:17:37 so, let discuss with Harish first, I think. He needs to know that in advanced 05:17:57 personally, I think it is the best way 05:18:40 then each country should take a risk to import it from Singapore at least once and take all notes 05:18:52 we need to try, no way to guess all 05:19:28 ok, I'll drop him an email and discuss it 05:19:32 time to time, we will complete all guidelines for shipping to each country 05:20:02 siddhesh, please copy it to me as well 05:20:16 #action siddhesh to discuss shipping server DVDs from India to Singapore with harish 05:20:16 thanks siddhesh 05:20:16 tuanta_, of course :) 05:20:23 ok, next? 05:20:41 next would be the transaction fee problem 05:20:44 #topic The transaction fees problem 05:21:03 #link https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/ticket/167 05:22:12 KageSenshi: do you have some updates on this? 05:22:34 i lean more towards handling the transaction charges as they occur, instead of revisiting them later. latter is more work for both parties. 05:23:08 no update here been busy with dayjob .. i think we havent assign who going to check this with FPL .. 05:23:50 alick, KageSenshi: I think we should vote for the most reasonable solution first 05:23:58 by discussing and voting 05:24:16 then I will propose it to FAmSCo and FPL 05:24:21 i'm suggesting to have a US western union account , which will need a US phone number for me to register .. 05:24:36 let's do it now, then. we could then forward it to FPL with what we think is a good solution 05:24:39 western union is supported in pretty much all APAC countries .. 05:24:40 KageSenshi, how about US PayPal account? 05:24:54 tuanta_, still doesnt solve cambodian reimbursement 05:25:13 yes, KageSenshi. but it is only one case 05:25:22 most other APAC countries can use PayPal 05:25:32 just to cover the transaction fees for them first 05:25:38 then other special cases later 05:25:48 ah, if we have a phone number in place, is it hard work to get both? 05:26:04 would prefer to have a solution that applies to everyone 05:26:28 including any new countries such as myanmar etc 05:26:39 yes, KageSenshi. it is in a perfect world but we do not live in such a world :) 05:26:54 so we will solve it case by case 05:26:59 I think so 05:27:10 KageSenshi, are the charges for both comparable? 05:27:17 IIRC WU is expensive 05:27:24 yeh, as siddhesh said 05:27:35 yes, siddhesh. that's why Fedora prefer PayPal 05:27:43 WU is just the final way 05:27:45 it depends on where things are being sent from i think .. both paypal and WU 05:27:59 KageSenshi, +1 05:27:59 tuanta_, then we need both US paypal and US WU 05:28:06 +1 KageSenshi :) 05:28:18 i think we can propose both to FPL 05:28:23 and firstly, play with PayPal, I think 05:28:25 +1 but lets go for the US paypal first 05:28:26 yes, alick 05:28:28 and let him to decide. 05:28:31 +1 siddhesh 05:28:36 i'm also wondering on how long paypal will keep the cover-transaction-fee thing 05:28:51 because from what i heard from gnokii, even EU paypal have that removed 05:29:01 tuanta_ is right, if that takes time, maybe we can deal with cambodia with in-person payments? 05:29:15 and maybe also involve EMEA guys, it is not an issue specific to APAC. 05:29:20 KageSenshi, we need a solution today then it could be changed later if PayPal offers other good solution 05:29:37 ok 05:29:40 banas, yes, Cambodia is a bit complicated 05:29:51 +1 alick 05:30:06 so we have two solutions now: 05:30:19 1. Having US accounts for CC holder 05:30:23 for me, whichever works .. though for US paypal i'll have to create new email xD .. and find a US proxy (linode should be ok i think) 05:31:06 2. Sum all transaction fees up regularly (or when reaching a limit - e.g. $100) to reimbursement them 05:31:21 3 solutions: 1) get US accounts 2) reimburse transaction fees on every reimbursement 3) pool transaction fees and file another ticket for reimbursement 05:31:47 siddhesh, "2" is impossible, I think 05:31:51 also .. i noticed that even with US proxy, paypal keep redirecting me to paypal.com/my .. 05:32:07 tuanta_, +1 05:32:15 we should also note that currency conversion rate used by Paypal is less than market value. 05:32:47 siddhesh, 3) sounds good 05:32:48 tuanta_, not really. If we know the rate, the treasurer just has to compute the final value based on it and reimburse 05:32:49 KageSenshi, you should look for a "hide-ip-address" (I can not remember the technical term) proxy 05:33:09 tuanta_, either way, i'll need a US phone number to fill in both Paypal and WU forms 05:33:13 KageSenshi, US-based vpn 05:33:24 siddhesh, linode is US based :) 05:33:28 siddhesh, it is impossible because CC holder must send money exactly on receipts 05:34:00 tuanta_, if ruth et al agree then we could work it out 05:34:08 tuanta_, of course, my first preference is (1) 05:34:17 yes, siddhesh 05:34:33 we should also discuss all three ones with FPL 05:34:54 once he supported, that solution could be ok 05:35:00 i can do minor adjustments of reimbursement amount based on currency exchange .. but thats not enough to cover transaction fee 05:35:41 tuanta_, agreed, lets take all three solutions. 05:35:56 KageSenshi, exchange rate is another devil :/ 05:35:57 +1 KageSenshi. since we transfer money via PayPal, we can use its currency exchange rate 05:36:39 that's fair enough 05:36:40 KageSenshi: agree. 05:36:56 tuanta_, i mean .. exchange rate have point-in-time variability .. 05:37:33 KageSenshi: but we can at least guess based on previous transactions reference 05:38:00 yes, KageSenshi. I just would like to add a note that exchange rate could be different among providers, we should apply PayPal one 05:38:03 so coming back to exactly-on-receipt thing .. some adjustments can be made depending on which point-in-time exchange rate i use 05:38:57 though yeah .. not significant enough to cover transaction fee 05:39:33 ok 05:39:33 so the problem is just transaction fee, not exchange rate 05:39:42 yep .. :) 05:39:51 tuanta_: exactly :) 05:40:10 what i'm saying, currently i'm using exchange rate to absorb a bit of the transaction fee 05:40:23 #idea there are 3 solutions for covering transaction fees: 1) get US accounts 2) reimburse transaction fees on every reimbursement 3) pool transaction fees and file another ticket for reimbursement 05:40:45 #action tuanta_ and KageSenshi to propose solution to FPL 05:41:10 #idea for option 1) US account - a US phone number is required in order to open Paypal/WesternUnion online account 05:41:13 #action tuanta_ to discuss them in FAmSCo as well 05:41:38 tuanta_, great. then hopefully EU folks will also hop in to the conversation 05:41:49 +1 siddhesh 05:41:51 dont you feel 3rd action is recursive :) 05:42:03 +1 pravins 05:42:14 pravyeah, recurse to the point that the transaction fee -> 0 ;) 05:42:21 pravins: haha, not in the real world 05:42:34 :) 05:42:42 anything else today? 05:42:48 real world -> screw this, its close to 0, i'll absorb it anyway 05:43:17 * siddhesh has nothing. good meeting today :) 05:43:22 ! 05:43:28 #topic Open floor 05:43:34 go ahead, KageSenshi 05:43:35 tuanta_: your action in last meeting? 05:43:50