20:00:01 #startmeeting EMEA ambassadors 2015-09-02 20:00:01 Meeting started Wed Sep 2 20:00:01 2015 UTC. The chair is sesivany. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 20:00:01 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 20:00:03 #meetingname emea ambassadors 20:00:03 The meeting name has been set to 'emea_ambassadors' 20:00:07 #topic Roll Call 20:00:13 .fas eischmann 20:00:15 sesivany: eischmann 'Jiri Eischmann' 20:00:18 .fas lupinix 20:00:18 lupinix: lupinix 'Christian Dersch' 20:00:21 .fas diegoestrada 20:00:21 taquilla: diegoestrada 'Diego Estrada' 20:00:27 .hello fedorauser 20:00:28 FedoraUser: fedorauser 'Medic Momcilo' 20:00:30 .fas mohamedfawzy 20:00:31 Mohamed_Fawzy: mohamedfawzy 'Mohamed Fawzy' 20:00:46 Welcome, everyone! 20:01:04 welcome sesivany 20:01:15 long time no meetings 20:01:20 yes 20:01:26 the summer... 20:01:42 flocks and whatnot :) 20:01:55 yeah, I was away for several weeks. 20:02:19 and then I missed the last planned meeting... 20:02:38 .fas GITNE 20:02:38 GITNE: gitne '' 20:02:48 .fas levex 20:02:48 lkurusa: levex 'Levente Kurusa' 20:03:51 ok, let's start. 20:04:03 #topic Announcements 20:04:09 any announcements, anyone? 20:04:54 Fedora 23 Alpha was released 20:05:04 on 2015-08-11 20:05:12 .fas thunderbirdtr 20:05:12 thunderbirdtr: thunderbirdtr 'Onuralp SEZER' 20:05:20 beta is on 21 sept 20:05:27 #info Fedora 23 Alpha was released on Aug 11th. 20:05:29 my birthday 20:05:51 #info Beta is scheduled for Sept 21st. 20:05:55 .fas robyduck 20:05:55 robyduck: robyduck 'Robert Mayr' 20:06:07 good night/evening everyone 20:06:29 I also have one thing to share.... 20:07:35 EMEA Ambassadors need new leadership, I've been doing several different leadership roles for the last 4 years and since I changed a job, I haven't done it properly. Plus I'm a bit burnt out, too. 20:08:07 So we need someone who will take over some of the roles and will drive the region forward. 20:08:17 I know we have such people among us. 20:08:20 sorry for the delay 20:08:23 .fas mitzie 20:08:24 mitzie: mitzie 'Zacharias Mitzelos' 20:08:29 hard work 20:08:36 sesivany: first: thank you very much for your work! 20:09:03 lupinix: I'm not going away by any means, I will still remain one of the most active ambassadors. 20:09:24 sesivany, ıt's gonna be said... but you manage really awesome.. 20:09:29 nice :) 20:09:34 but we need someone who will "own" the thing, drive it, make sure things are on track etc. 20:09:43 I'm just tired after 4 years. 20:09:52 * mitzie is catching up 20:09:58 you was a good leader i learned much this year with you 20:10:20 for example when there is no meeting scheduled, someone steps up and makes sure we hold it. 20:10:43 or we need a new treasurer that makes sure our expenses are within our budget. 20:11:07 I have no time to track our expenses properly this year, I only have a rough idea. 20:11:26 is there some kind of overview? 20:11:45 i had a look at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/EMEA/Budget:2016 20:11:51 sesivany, you can also stay for leadership and leave others too then ? is it also possible ? 20:13:01 sesivany: so what kind of roles would you like to transfer to others? 20:13:02 thunderbirdtr: I wanna stay, but I just don't have energy any more to be the one who makes sure we have a meeting, to be the lart arbiter about tickets, to be the driving force behing the budgeting, event planning. 20:14:00 for example we should start organizing another EMEA FAD, but I don't have the energy to start pushing it, so that things start moving. 20:14:08 sesivany, I see , and I understand that's not a easy job.... 20:14:42 I don't have to be replaced by one person, it could be and should be more people. 20:14:53 it has always been an informal leadership. 20:15:21 moreover looks like FAmSCo will continue and we need new representatives for that, too. 20:15:49 so how could we handle meetings for example? possible to have a group of possible chairs? 20:16:05 lupinix: There is already something like that 20:16:09 sesivany, so that's mean FAmSCo and EMEA gonna change too ? 20:16:15 mitzie, +1 e.g French ? 20:16:17 sesivany: we should make elections for F24 and F25 cycle indeed, once F23 is out 20:16:57 lupinix: Jon Archer and Giannis have been helping me chair the meeting, but it's still me who needs to ask who will chair it this time, to make sure it happens. It'd be great if someone could take over this responsibility. 20:17:59 sesivany: this sounds like you basically only have trouble to hold the meeting 20:18:02 thunderbirdtr: FAmSCo will need new blood for sure. 20:18:11 sesivany: at least sometimes 20:18:31 GITNE: not only that, we need a new treasurer who tracks our expenses. 20:18:44 sesivany, still we have that problem too ? 20:18:51 okay, so let's think about one role at a time 20:18:59 last years, I tracked every single expense, everything is on the wiki, but not this year :-( 20:19:47 it was hard job sesivany but you did it 20:19:51 sesivany: how about we hold an election on roles next meeting or due to some date you're comfortable with? 20:20:06 sesivany: I'd say we should split the responsibilities. Maybe you can continue as treasurer, it's an important role and you are "nearer" to swags, cc, OSAS etc 20:20:33 GITNE: it doesn't have to be an election, I don't think the roles are so attractive that we'd have many candidates. 20:20:41 robyduck: sounds wise to me 20:20:50 robyduck: I will continue taking care of swag. 20:20:52 for the rest we could make a sort of election of people who want to take over the meeting/event/otherstuff job 20:21:13 robyduck: it has been mostly done by Kveta anyway. 20:21:24 election sounds nice 20:21:26 sure, but under your wing 20:22:05 yeah, it does not need to be an elaborate election. I mean it, just needs to be more or less an official role so that people feel resoponsible 20:22:12 yes .... +1 need to be control but not all of it. after while and experience he/she can do the job 20:22:36 and I'm willing to help everyone in his new role, as I said I'm not going away, but I have taken too many roles in the last 4 years, and it's not viable any more and I know I'm not doing a good job in many of them any more. 20:23:48 so basically we need: the main chair for our meetings, treasurer, and FAmSCo members. 20:24:02 sesivany: okay we get it :-) so we need to find a mode of progress now how to transfer some stuff that you've been doing to others 20:24:30 and people stepping up and taking action like "hey, we haven't done towards our EMEA FAD, let's do call for locations etc.". 20:25:05 as a sidenote, we (Hungary) might have a bid for EMEA FAD 20:25:06 same happened for FLOCK 2016 bids 20:25:24 * GITNE would like to help but is a greenhorn ;-) 20:25:50 robyduck: yes, two years ago, it was pretty much me who arranged the Prague location with Miro. 20:26:02 yeah I remember 20:26:04 I agree with GITNE, that it should be something more or less official, so people will feel responsible for this place 20:26:09 robyduck: I would have taken such actions this year again, but I haven't had time. 20:26:37 so it's not only about specified roles, but also about making sure things are happening. 20:27:14 sesivany: I feel also FAmSCo's inactivity also plays a role in the regional stop of activities 20:27:15 anyway, you know the situation, it doesn't have to be solved over night, but I can't hold for too long :) 20:27:42 robyduck: I think Ambassadors in general have problem with leadership, not only EMEA. 20:27:51 +1 20:28:00 yes... 20:28:04 Old farts have been leading for too long, we need new people, new blood who will drive the project. 20:28:19 just like we need 3 years ago. 20:28:24 s/need/did 20:28:46 can we trac this in some way? Where? Let's not mix this up with FAmSCo, which is a separate topic IMO 20:29:16 robyduck: I can open a ticket about it, and I'm going to write email to the list. 20:29:27 awesome 20:30:01 #action sesivany to write email about new leadership and create tickets to track progress 20:30:22 ok, let's move one, shall we? 20:30:27 sesivany, lasty.. . 20:30:27 yes 20:30:27 then we gonna need to seperate country by country as possible as we can for experienced ambassadors/mentors then they gonna drive project in their country parts and in meeting every country can also move on more effectively I think ? 20:30:34 .fas gnokii 20:30:34 gnokii: gnokii 'Sirko Kemter' 20:31:13 thunderbirdtr: country leadership is important, but we need regional leadership too. 20:31:31 EMEA has been example for other regions in many ways, let's keep it that way. 20:31:40 sesivany, okey... 20:31:50 ok, let's move to the next topic. 20:32:06 #topic Requests 20:32:27 shitty hungarian ideas with separate countries 20:33:16 * sesivany is checking the trac... 20:33:22 sesivany: I don't want to sound like a drag but do we have enough people for country or regional leaderships? 20:34:04 gnokii, excuse me? 20:34:17 guys, let's follow the protocol. 20:34:19 sesivany: besides, fedora has a different level of prevalence in every country 20:34:44 let's discuss the leadership further on the mailing list. 20:34:56 and please avoid any side notes. 20:35:05 now requests 20:35:10 ok, sorry 20:35:28 any tickets still waiting for approval? 20:35:34 sesivany, I need 20:35:38 yes 20:35:52 #496 and #502 for FrOSCon 20:36:15 #498 for me 20:36:15 thunderbirdtr: you mean #498, right? 20:36:19 sesivany, yes 20:36:31 sesivany, I have to in 8 days and I didn't give respond because of this 20:36:37 sesivany, If It's gonna be accepted 20:36:39 #info Funding request for BalCCon 2k15 - #498 20:36:50 #link https://fedorahosted.org/emea-swag-tracking/ticket/498 20:37:01 didn't we approve this via ML? 20:37:17 ++ 20:37:24 robyduck, well ... I can't confirm it because there is last comment for that.. 20:37:38 please check re-confirm so I can move on that 20:37:39 robyduck: looks like guys were getting votes all over the place, the ticket only has 3 votes. 20:38:12 we had more than 5 votes on the list 20:38:18 robyduck, +1 20:38:19 even for 1100 20:38:33 * lupinix voted +1 for this 20:38:35 so I don't see any need to vote again 20:38:36 ok, let's consider it confirmed. 20:39:00 #agreed The ticket #498 has been approved by enough votes on the mailing list. 20:39:15 we have funds left we didn't spend this year, so I thin even 1100 is ok 20:39:20 sesivany, thank you 20:39:30 s/thin/think 20:39:44 sesivany, so I can do the tickets and send mail to Event owners for other preparation for us. 20:39:53 but we need to learn some lesson from this: 1. we need to have a clear plan and budget enough time before the event, 2. please need to apply for expense approval soon enough. 20:39:53 thunderbirdtr: good luck, we need fresh blood from there ;) 20:40:04 robyduck, there is gonna be :) 20:40:13 robyduck, thanks for good luck :) 20:40:21 thunderbirdtr: yes, I will make a confirmation in the ticket for jsimon. 20:40:37 sesivany: +1 20:40:41 thunderbirdtr, no need for email, I am here :) 20:41:07 FedoraUser, :) awesome 20:41:20 next time I'd like to see some plan and reasoning behind it because $1100 is quite a lot for an event we're participating in for the first time. 20:41:32 sesivany, sorry for delaying 20:41:39 but let's move on for now. 20:42:27 #info Funding request for FrOSCon 2015 - #496 20:42:35 #link https://fedorahosted.org/emea-swag-tracking/ticket/496 20:42:49 i think this can be done in combination with #502 20:43:16 #link https://fedorahosted.org/emea-swag-tracking/ticket/502 20:43:19 #496 is hotel room for gnokii and me, train ticket for me 20:43:19 ok then 20:43:29 #502 is travel for gnokii 20:43:45 FrosCon had a plan, budget, this is within it, I don't see a problem. 20:43:49 +1 20:44:21 * lupinix is not voting for his own ticket 20:44:26 +1 20:44:29 420 total amount, planned was 2000? +1 20:44:33 +1 20:44:35 yeah sesivany but the event owner says nothing to it :) 20:44:54 ++ 20:45:00 we need one vote more 20:45:31 +1 20:45:32 robyduck: yeah, that's why we can afford to spend $1100 on BalCCon which didn't have any budget planned originally. 20:45:39 +1 20:45:50 said so on ML 20:45:57 sesivany: even because of Pycon IT :( 20:46:08 #agreed Tickets #496 and #502 has been approved. 20:46:26 robyduck: Pycon CZ might take some of that money ;-) 20:46:34 cool 20:46:37 thank you :) i'll report on events later 20:47:07 FrOSCon needs a new event owner next year 20:47:30 gnokii: lupinix perhaps? 20:47:37 ++ 20:48:06 maybe, depends on my situation then (i'll finish my study and start with a real job) 20:48:12 I think we have covered all requests, haven't we? 20:48:22 * lupinix takes a look again 20:49:04 looks like we are done 20:49:32 last call, have your ticket approved or be quiet forever :) 20:49:40 :) 20:49:47 ok, looks like we're really done. 20:50:11 #topic Ambassador's schedule 20:50:26 I can't find a link to the schedule. 20:50:47 https://fedorapeople.org/groups/schedule/f-23/f-23-ambassadors-tasks.html 20:50:51 but our prime time is coming, the release is just one and half month away. 20:51:02 #link https://fedorapeople.org/groups/schedule/f-23/f-23-ambassadors-tasks.html 20:51:04 thanks 20:51:23 we should start preparing swag. 20:51:45 I will make sure we have enough of the standard stuff - stickers, badges, case badges,... 20:52:05 we should make some t-shirts for contributors. 20:52:09 gnokii: any ideas? 20:52:18 +1 for t-shirts 20:52:28 I gave that task to Maria, but if you have a good idea... 20:52:39 sesivany: can we talk seperately about that? 20:52:39 sesivany: i dont have any swags :( 20:53:28 +1 for tshirts 20:53:28 Mohamed_Fawzy: nothing from Diaa Radwan? 20:53:52 sesivany: swag is in dubai he didnt come yet 20:54:10 :( 20:54:27 I'd also like to produce t-shirts for users. 20:54:33 i will chat him :D 20:54:36 from dubai to where? 20:54:46 Egypt 20:54:54 +1 for tshirts 20:54:58 +1 to t-shirts 20:54:58 but is this stuff for any particular fedora release? 20:55:01 we would have a couple of dozen of t-shirts for larger events and we would give them to loyal users etc. 20:55:13 sesivany: sounds nice 20:55:20 +1 on the Tshirt proposal 20:55:25 openSUSE people did that @FrOSCon too bzw 20:55:27 *btw 20:55:36 GITNE: doesn't have to be, since we haven't had codenames, it's hard to do release specific stuff. 20:55:57 good old times with Schroedinger's Cat... 20:56:14 * lupinix got one for using open build service :D 20:56:16 I like cat one :))) that was a nice t-shirt 20:56:20 sesivany: that's good because any date or release specific swag outlives itself pretty quickly and can't be reused 20:56:34 lupinix, any picture for that send PM If possible :) please 20:56:36 sesivany: there is an internal codename 20:56:54 gnokii: which is? for F23? 20:57:13 thunderbirdtr: remind me later 20:57:14 sesivany: lighthouse 20:57:21 lupinix, okey 20:57:22 ah ok 20:57:32 thats why there is the sailor on the banners 20:58:09 so where do I make an order for swag? 20:58:11 thunderbirdtr: it's mainly the suse chameleons head 20:58:19 GITNE: the trac 20:58:29 sesivany: ah ok, thx 20:58:31 lupinix, gotcha 20:58:32 GITNE: you specify what you want, why and when. 20:58:42 you can check other tickets for inspiration. 20:58:48 is the cheatcube idea still on the table? 20:58:54 .fas b10n1k 20:58:55 b10n1k_: b10n1k 'jiannis Bonatakis' - jobo 'jiannis bonatakis' 20:58:56 robyduck: I hope so. 20:59:08 would be nice to have some again 20:59:19 cheatcube would be very nice 20:59:20 afak cheatcube is being updated 20:59:21 +1 20:59:29 robyduck: I think it was fransciscoD who said was working on update. 21:00:04 I remember he talked about flyers...gnokii? 21:00:22 sesivany: robyduck he has updated it 21:00:32 but ok, I guess it's marketing task still 21:00:39 Maria should work with him on flyers of editions. 21:00:51 fine 21:01:02 FYI Maria Leonova is a new Fedora design intern in Brno office. 21:01:48 We're also finishing the guidebook pilot. 21:02:01 The content is finished, the cover almost too: https://fedorahosted.org/design-team/ticket/393 21:02:57 ! 21:03:02 gnokii: yes? 21:03:47 can you please stop all open q to me, its 4 in the morning if you have a problem write me a mail 21:03:51 eof 21:04:37 ok, let's move on to Events... 21:04:51 #topic Events 21:05:32 * sesivany is checking the event plan 21:05:43 #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/EMEA/EventPlan:2016 21:06:32 We still don't have LinuxCon Europe covered. 21:06:48 I'm still waiting for a final confirmation from the Linux Foundation. 21:07:18 they first need to make sure they have enough room for booths of sponsors, then they can confirm a booth for us. 21:07:50 LinuxDays in Prague are covered. 21:08:13 speaking of events, we really need to start working on EMEA FAD. 21:08:40 we need to get a location, budget and then go to the Council/OSAS to ask for money. 21:09:00 considering it always takes place in December, there is not much time left. 21:09:13 ++ 21:09:18 sesivany: +1 21:09:34 I'm always willing to organize it in Brno as a fallback option, venue would be for free. 21:09:51 or Miro offered Prague. 21:09:59 but flying there is hard 21:10:06 sesivany: Traditionally we host in Germany, so we should look for potential locations there first, as it's easier for most people to get there 21:10:46 mitzie: sure, but I don't think Gerold or Felix will want to organize it this year. 21:10:54 which kind of locations? 21:11:10 castle 21:11:18 :) 21:11:47 I have castle nearby :) 21:11:59 this one's in Germany: http://d3dswxqmrohvno.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/Neuschwanstein-Castle.jpg ;-) 21:12:08 hahaha 21:12:11 :D 21:12:15 :P 21:12:18 was there some years ago 21:12:18 oh my... that would be pretty darn cool FAD 21:12:22 very nice :D 21:12:32 whos king ? :)))) 21:12:46 sesivany of course 21:12:58 * lupinix will be there in about 3 weeks :P 21:13:03 robyduck, +1 :))) 21:13:21 so a castle would be nice, but it can be any suitable venue. 21:13:44 I'd love to have a decent connection finally so that we can do streaming for others who can't attend. 21:14:09 ok let's talk seriously, what about a deadline, let's say F23-Beta for complete bids? 21:14:15 +1 sesivany, last year was a disaster 21:14:26 is there a wiki page explaining a process for bids? 21:14:38 mitzie: any year before that was even worse. 21:14:50 sesivany: indeed 21:15:06 FedoraUser: no, this event doesn't have any formal process for bids. 21:15:15 oh ok 21:15:19 how many people? maybe i could ask @university 21:15:34 FedoraUser: EMEA FAD is traditionally a very special event for us 21:15:35 historically it was in Rheinfelden in a castle, remote please venue and accommodation together. 21:15:42 that's a pattern for the event. 21:16:08 10GBit connection should be fast enough :D 21:16:09 s/please/place 21:17:02 robyduck: F23 beta as deadline sounds good. 21:17:19 anyone volunteering to write a call for bids? 21:17:55 whereever it is can we see we get connection to me have to say something this year 21:18:07 sesivany: on the ML? I can do if nobody else wants 21:18:19 robyduck: yes, on the ML. 21:18:32 * robyduck will do 21:18:35 robyduck: ok, looks like it's on you. 21:18:36 I can help sesivany with that 21:19:16 mitzie: ok then. 21:20:11 #action mitzie to write a call for bids for EMEA FAD 2015 and send it to the ambassadors mailing list, F23 beta release date should be deadline for bids. 21:20:51 #topic Open Floor 21:21:06 now we've got open floor to discuss anything. 21:21:36 can I ask gnokii to please elaborate his views on hungarian ideas? 21:21:50 FrOSCon @august 22/23 was the forst event I attended as an ambassador, nice experience :) 21:21:52 I found that at least a bit offensive 21:21:54 *first 21:22:35 what is the ratio of workstation dvds / alternate desktop dvds? 21:22:54 I believe 4:1 21:23:03 lkurusa: let's talk about fedora 21:23:06 lupinix: 2000 Workstation vs 1000 Alternative. 21:23:11 sure and you will get an answer, I hate separation EMEA was running so good because we acted together and I see some things happen there that are not nice 21:23:17 robyduck, I assume it is fedora related 21:23:25 (since he wrote it into this channel) 21:23:35 sesivany: btw we'll have another spin for F23, so the alternative DVD should contain that too 21:23:35 many people asked for non-GNOME desktops, so we gave all alternate dvds away but i still have some workstation dvds 21:23:48 robyduck: cinnamon? 21:23:58 filing a ticket for that doesn't hurt 21:24:09 lupinix: yes 21:24:33 yes, we can put cinnamon on the alternative desktop DVD. 21:24:37 not sure if we they all fit on the DVD 21:24:51 * robyduck needs to check, but releng needs a ticket 21:24:52 the questions as always is if we want to continue producing DVDs... 21:24:59 lupinix: yeah but we had not 4:1 alternate available we had around 20 alternate and 200 workstation 21:25:04 yeh, right 21:25:08 gnokii: thats true… 21:25:17 sesivany: why we still use dvds 21:25:19 gnokii, I don't see how this is related to hungarian ideas? did somebody from the team have any idea to separate EMEA or what? I don't understand 21:25:24 but I don/t see any non-expensive alternatives right now 21:25:30 many new device not support it 21:25:45 Mohamed_Fawzy, other alternatives are less supported or a lot more expensive 21:25:52 lkurusa: yes it starts with from "the team" 21:25:54 Mohamed_Fawzy: +1 many users told us that a dvd is quite useless for them 21:26:15 here i use usb more than dvds 21:26:15 so for some of them i wrote fedora to their usb stick using live usb creator 21:26:24 lkurusa: thunderbiardtr said that earlier in this meeting, maybe gnokii thought he was from Hungary. 21:26:29 perhaps we need to evaluate how many leftover dvd's we have and if more expensive media produced in lower numbers may be an option 21:26:37 lupinix: Mohamed_Fawzy that was and is discussed always and we cant afford usb sticks 21:26:58 sesivany, still I think we can expect some minimal manners... like elaborating and avoiding swear words 21:27:36 the about 50 fedora 23 dvds i still have wo go away when I start my python course :D 21:27:39 Mohamed_Fawzy: it's not only about price, yesterday I had to prepare 20 usb sticks with Fedora and it took ages. 21:27:45 *will 21:27:59 sesivany, that doesn't mean has to be rude .. 21:28:51 thunderbirdtr: just one question how many ambassadors are there in turkey? 21:29:07 gnokii, active 3 21:29:15 active 3? 21:29:25 if he doesn't agree, fine, let's discuss. but saying something like that is useless and rude 21:29:43 I must be blind never did read from their activity on ML or saw them in meeting 21:29:56 ok guys, I'm ending this meeting, let's not use the open floor to fight each other. 21:30:09 my idea after FrOSCon was: how about some kind of fedora demo instead of giving media away and say "have fun"? 21:30:10 thank you for attending and see you in 2 weeks! 21:30:17 I just don't like when somebody is being rude without any reason 21:30:18 see you! 21:30:19 gnokii: what about sd cards as a medium? isn't that cheaper and more common today? most laptos have sd card reads... 21:30:23 that's not the Fedora I kno 21:30:24 buy 21:30:28