16:31:10 #startmeeting Fedora CommOps (2017-04-04) 16:31:10 Meeting started Tue Apr 4 16:31:10 2017 UTC. The chair is jwf. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 16:31:10 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 16:31:10 The meeting name has been set to 'fedora_commops_(2017-04-04)' 16:31:15 #meetingname commops 16:31:15 The meeting name has been set to 'commops' 16:31:19 #nick commops 16:31:23 #topic Agenda 16:31:28 #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Meeting:CommOps_2017-04-04 16:31:32 #info (1) Roll Call / Q&A 16:31:35 #info (2) Announcements 16:31:39 #info (3) Action items from last meeting 16:31:42 #info (4) Tickets 16:31:46 #info (5) Community Blog 16:31:50 #info (6) Open Floor 16:31:59 #topic Roll Call / Q&A 16:32:00 #info Name; Timezone; Sub-projects/Interest Areas 16:32:05 #action commops New members, make sure you introduce yourself on the CommOps mailing list [ https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/CommOps/Join ] 16:32:10 If this is your first time at a CommOps meeting, feel free to introduce yourself to everyone and say hello! If anyone has any questions before we get started with the rest of the agenda, now is also a good time to ask. 16:32:10 #info Alberto Rodriguez S; UTC-5; Commops, Metrics, dotnet, infra 16:32:21 .hello bt0dotninja 16:32:22 bt0: bt0dotninja 'Alberto Rodriguez Sanchez' 16:32:33 #info Eduard Lucena; UTC -3; Marketing, Magazine, Infra, Ambassadors 16:32:35 #info Justin W. Flory; UTC+1; CommOps, Marketing, Magazine, Ambassadors, Diversity, sysadmin-badges 16:32:40 Afternoon! 16:32:44 #chair bt0 x3mboy 16:32:44 Current chairs: bt0 jwf x3mboy 16:32:59 As I mentioned in #fedora-commops, I'm behind the ball today, so I don't have a fully finished agenda yet. 16:33:09 ok 16:33:17 But we can improvise a little bit. :) 16:34:28 .hello rhea 16:34:29 Rhea: rhea 'Radka Janek' 16:34:39 * jwf waves to Rhea 16:34:42 o/ 16:36:07 o/ 16:37:44 Okay, can press on. :) 16:37:51 #topic Announcements 16:37:55 #info === Fedora 26 Alpha releases today === 16:37:59 #link https://fedoramagazine.org/fedora-26-alpha-available-now/ 16:38:17 #info The Fedora 26 Alpha releases today (in fact, right now, at 14:00 UTC). Help spread the word by sharing the Fedora Magazine article. Thanks ryanlerch++ for helping coordinate the short announcement. 16:38:22 #info === "Fedora at SCaLE 15x (2017) Event Report – Pasadena, California" === 16:38:26 #link https://communityblog.fedoraproject.org/scale-15x-event-report/ 16:38:29 #info The event report from SCaLE 15x, which has feedback from booth attendees about Fedora. Mentioned was lack of awareness of Raspberry Pi + Fedora (better coverage in a release? making it its own lab?). Additionally, a lot of people were surprised about GNOME Boxes for virtualization and were excited by. A gap to fill? 16:38:32 16:38:37 Anyone else have anything they want to throw out? 16:39:46 * bt0 no 16:40:16 #topic Action items from last meeting 16:40:23 #link https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/teams/commops/commops.2017-03-07-17.30.html 16:40:29 #info How This Works: We look at past #action items from the last meeting for quick follow-up. If a task is completed, we move on to the next one. If it isn't, we get an update and re-action it if needed. If no status, we'll try to get a quick update and move forward. 16:40:34 #info === jwf Start thread on CommOps mailing list (CC: bexelbie) on the best way to store and host a "directory" or database of Fedora contributors actively involved with EDU efforts === 16:40:47 #action jwf Start thread on CommOps mailing list (CC: bexelbie) on the best way to store and host a "directory" or database of Fedora contributors actively involved with EDU efforts 16:40:51 #info === [COMPLETE] x3mboy Follow up with LATAM Ambassadors about if a CommBlog article suffices for reimbursement, update ticket #21 with feedback === 16:40:57 #link https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/commops@lists.fedoraproject.org/thread/MJZRHOFLCQ5FYZHVR556W5WOIH2OEQAU/ 16:41:11 .thank x3mboy 16:41:11 jwf thinks x3mboy is awesome and is happy they are helping! (Please don't forget to x3mboy++ also) 16:41:14 Np 16:41:27 Guidelines would definitely help here to be communicated with the Ambassadors. Haven't replied yet but I haven't forgotten. 16:41:28 There action items that came with this 16:41:29 #info === [INCOMPLETE] jwf Update ticket #21 with proposed guidelines based on agreed objectives/goals for pre- and post-event reports === 16:41:36 #action jwf Update ticket #21 with proposed guidelines based on agreed objectives/goals for pre- and post-event reports 16:42:07 Also, make it this approach global (I just contacted latam) 16:42:15 * jwf nods 16:42:22 Thanks for action yourself with that one 16:42:24 So maybe this would be a good thing to take up with FAmSCo… 16:43:21 It would be cool to have some kind of common guidelines for writing on the CommBlog, although I will definitely want to document editing on the CommBlog so more people can help out with that while I'm away over the summer months. 16:44:16 That's going to be a high priority item for me this month 16:44:27 Anyways, this is all of the relevant actions from our last meeting. 16:44:36 Sorry for some of the inconsistency in the past couple of weeks. 16:44:43 #topic Tickets 16:44:48 #link https://pagure.io/fedora-commops/issues?tags=meeting 16:44:54 #info === Ticket #70: "FOSS Student Pack" === 16:44:59 #link https://pagure.io/fedora-commops/issue/70 16:45:32 Okay, trying to remember where we left off on this one with the actual content of the pack. 16:46:09 * jwf is flipping through logs 16:47:48 Going to repeat some lines just for fresh context: 16:47:50 #agreed Intended target audience for a "Fedora Student Pack" would be university students, which compliments the Fedora Marketing efforts and also allows us to shape our content and language to be friendlier to a specific audience (this can be repurposed or retooled later) 16:49:06 I'm trying to the layer description I had… 16:49:29 Ahh, found it: 16:49:37 What we should discuss first is what the goal or objective of this ticket is. While tangible, sponsored items would be nice to include, we should likely look inward a little more first and consider building the "Fedora Student Pack" with resources within our own community that would be helpful to provide for students to get involved with Fedora and the community (calling this "layer 1"). Once layer 1 is established, we can build and support on top 16:49:37 of this with "layer 2", which could include financial support from outside organizations. But before doing that, we should look at (1) who it's designed for, (2) what the impact of doing it would be, and lastly (3) what the first layer looks like. 16:50:23 Okay. So I think we thoroughly discussed some of the other backgrounds and concerns at the last meeting, so I'd really like to spend time to figure out what that "layer 1" looks like. 16:50:31 If that makes sense? 16:51:12 Give me a second to read 16:51:22 Yup, no problem :) 16:51:58 I have a silly question, is it physical? 16:52:06 as a ... pack 16:52:22 Rhea, not silly, I was about to ask the same think 16:52:24 Rhea: No, I don't think it would be possible for us to do something physical. 16:52:37 I have followup q 16:52:46 Maybe part of the "layer 2", but I think we could probably get there after doing the groundwork here. 16:52:49 why digital stuff they can get anyway 16:53:22 Rhea: Think of it more like a compilation. The idea behind this was to combine different resources and digital things they can get on their own together as some sort of presentable "package" 16:53:36 * bt0 agree 16:53:40 Mmmmm 16:53:46 if approaching students with digital content then it should be a simple flyer "we offer these different spins with these different tools - go get em" 16:54:12 So the package would be... a spin? 16:54:14 I remember a aweful hard discussion about this topic, and we aren't even close to discuss what the content should/could be 16:54:15 o.o 16:54:39 yeah, i remember it too 16:54:44 the awful hard discussion was about whether this is contributor aquisition or not 16:54:52 not about the pack 16:55:13 and sory typos i have ... freshly painted nails xD 16:55:19 LOL 16:55:22 :) 16:55:43 x3mboy: Yeah, it was a long discussion. Where do you think we should focus first on? 16:55:44 Rhea: No problem. :) 16:55:45 so anyway, are we talking about a spin? 16:56:04 student oriented fedora spin with stuffs in it? 16:56:15 i cant imagine different kind of package 16:56:20 digital package 16:56:40 Rhea: I would be thinking of a resource along these lines: https://education.github.com/pack 16:56:47 That was the original motivation behind the ticket. 16:56:48 jwf, We should focus in make a strong definition, that doesn't hurt feelings in any WG/SIG 16:57:11 thats the thing 16:57:18 these packs are finantially valuable 16:57:20 ours isnt 16:57:26 x3mboy: Okay, makes sense. So what are we trying to define – the purpose, the content, or something else? 16:57:36 Purpose mainly 16:57:51 purpose will give content 16:57:58 yeah, many dscounts and demos 16:58:10 Rhea: Right, so… I'm going to two-fold answer Rhea and explain my idea of purpose for x3mboy :) 16:58:12 * bt0 loves it 16:58:42 I mean, last meeting some people was looking the pack like "new-contributor-oriented" 16:58:52 And it's not (at least from my POV) 16:59:04 which is worng pov 16:59:05 And I remember I put my opinion on the ticket 16:59:05 yep 16:59:20 its a "here you go" thing where "hope you give back" 16:59:29 emphasis on hope 17:00:21 And from hope: "If you give back, go to the Join SIG", Am I rigth? 17:00:38 The purpose of a Fedora / FOSS pack that we put together is to provide tools / "getting started advice" for someone who wants to start working on open source software, whether it's Fedora or not. These tools would be focused on providing examples of tools, services, or other helpful things available either **in** Fedora or in Fedora's **infrastructure**. So we're doing the work of creating a "welcome to Fedora / FOSS" sort of welcoming package, and 17:00:38 the primary purpose is to give tools or services helpful to a student working on open source. The secondary purpose is to get them familiar with the Fedora community and ecosystem. 17:00:43 x3mboy: yup 17:01:03 x3mboy: that/wcidff etc... the usual direction 17:01:19 yeah 17:01:20 Yeah, I think we thoroughly discussed at the last meeting that we're not aiming to be as a magnet for new contributors. We should avoid talking about it as that to avoid confusion. 17:01:57 It can be used for new contributors as a resource, but its sole purpose isn't to take the role of something like the Join SIG or other onboarding resources in the project. 17:02:00 Does this all make sense? 17:02:08 i see so it's a package of "look we googled it for you" 17:02:12 ...tools 17:02:38 O.O ... that is right 17:03:01 LOL 17:03:03 but 17:03:04 It's right 17:03:07 "best ide, best this best that tool..." all the best tools around contributing to foss 17:03:18 Rhea: You could probably say that. And also tailored to open source contributing or working in FOSS communities. Admittedly, it would have a bias towards Fedora (e.g. pointing out something like COPR or Pagure), but that's also part of the point. 17:03:44 of course, Fedora is best 17:03:58 So then, maybe the best way for us to find what we're putting inside this pack is to create "questions" we want to be answered by this pack. 17:04:03 For example… 17:04:18 someone asking on this subreddit "i want a distro where matlab works" and i replied "fedora has a spin for that!" 17:04:25 Fedora is The Best 17:04:28 "What are good editors to work with Python?" "What is a good way to test an RPM package?" 17:04:35 See, contents of the pack - science fedora spin 17:04:42 take notes 17:04:43 xD 17:04:45 I think the question in some point will be: "Does the FOSS Pack bring someone to other distro?" 17:04:54 Right. :) 17:05:14 i think that the answer would be.. why not 17:05:34 x3mboy: Sure, I think it's not out of the question, but the slant on Fedora would incline them into our community 17:05:50 But it's inevitable that it could still be useful for other people working on different distributions 17:05:53 But I think that's okay. 17:06:30 I think it's not only ok, I think it will be good and better. It's a Foss pack, not a Only Fedora stuffs pack 17:06:45 * jwf nods 17:06:46 maybe adding some little tutorials for help students to get familiar with some FOSS technologies 17:07:18 Instructional content would also be helpful. 17:08:20 so the way I'm seeing it, the first action item would be to come up with the questions we want this FOSS student pack to answer. Is this fair? 17:08:44 I really like the idea 17:08:48 So +1 for me 17:08:51 +1 17:10:11 Okay, I'm going to get some things into Meetbot ;) 17:11:03 #agreed Primary purpose is to provide tools / services helpful to university students working on open source; secondary purpose is get students familiar with Fedora resources, community, ecosystem 17:11:32 #agreed Purpose is not to be a magnet to attract newcomers – best left to other initiatives like whatcanidoforfedora.org / Join SIG 17:11:51 #agreed First steps to begin "building" the pack: what questions do we want this FOSS Student Pack to answer? 17:12:19 So maybe we can all throw out some questions and ideas for things we want this pack to cover… 17:12:26 For example… 17:12:37 #idea What are good editing environments or tools for working with Python? 17:12:53 #idea What's helpful for me to test out building RPMs if I want to make a package? 17:13:26 These are things I had in mind, but please feel free to throw out ideas and suggestions of your own :) 17:13:57 * skamath is here 17:13:57 This can be things like programming-related questions about tools, ways to work with open source, or anything that you might have found helpful if you had known about it in the beginning. 17:13:59 If mentioning one programming language, then I suggest covering at least one of each category (like there are at least 50 types of javascript so lets not list an ide for everything) 17:14:00 Sorry, had some work 17:14:07 #idea Where can I host my code? 17:14:11 * jwf waves to skamath 17:14:12 #chair skamath 17:14:12 Current chairs: bt0 jwf skamath x3mboy 17:14:16 #chair Rhea 17:14:16 Current chairs: Rhea bt0 jwf skamath x3mboy 17:14:17 e.g. cover python java c c++ c# and maybe rust and go 17:14:22 * skamath waves back to jwf 17:14:37 Rhea: Yeah, sure, if we have things we can recommend, then I see no reason why not. :) 17:15:03 I would totally mention c# as upcoming thing in linux 17:15:08 #idea What are good tools for working with {Python,Java,C,C++,C#,Ruby,Rust,Go,JavaScript,etc.}? 17:15:11 or well, not upcoming, it's'already rising 17:15:17 Rhea: Would love to have it covered. :) 17:16:13 jwf, maybe we can ping WG/SIGs to know what they currently uses 17:16:28 For example dotnet SIG or python SIG 17:16:28 #idea What can I use for task management (e.g. Kanban)? 17:16:35 taiga :D 17:16:49 x3mboy: Definitely, would be great to have their input. 17:17:10 x3mboy: That's what I was thinking. :) https://taiga.fedorainfracloud.org/ 17:17:19 jwf, are 'tools' defined? 17:17:22 Or can it be anything? 17:17:53 skamath: Not yet, it can be anything. We're trying to ask questions that we want the student pack to answer, so we can start building the scope of the pack, which will then let us start picking specific tools or recommendations. 17:18:05 nod nod 17:18:20 Sounds like a plan 17:18:27 .hello dhanesh95 17:18:28 dhanesh95: dhanesh95 'Dhanesh Bhalchandra Sabane' 17:18:34 dhanesh95, o/ 17:18:48 skamath, jwf: o/ 17:18:50 #idea How can I get experience with Linux servers? 17:18:53 * jwf waves to dhanesh95 17:18:56 #chair dhanesh95 17:18:56 Current chairs: Rhea bt0 dhanesh95 jwf skamath x3mboy 17:19:40 jwf, action and pass to next point 17:19:40 #idea Where can I ask questions and get help about Fedora? 17:19:55 Time is short 17:20:21 ^^A very important question 17:20:41 Yeah, might be easier if we have time to think about it and then discuss. I'll make a comment in the ticket to summarize what we discussed, give some of the questions I asked, and then we can revisit to start looking at specific tools and other things to include. 17:20:50 +1 17:21:06 #action jwf Add comment to ticket #70 explaining our discussion and focus of student pack, give examples of questions, post to mailing list asking for comments 17:21:18 I will do this after the meeting. :) 17:21:24 jwf++ 17:21:30 Anything else that we want to cover here? 17:21:44 This was the only ticket I had on my last-minute agenda. 17:22:31 Going once… 17:22:40 Going twice… 17:22:42 Nothing from me. 17:22:46 And thrice… 17:22:53 #topic Community Blog 17:23:00 #info How This Works: There is a quick blast of information about what was published in the past week with some metrics, followed by posts that are being drafted. After the information blast, the floor is opened for any Community Blog-related discussion. Here we go! 17:23:05 #info === This Week in CommBlog === 17:23:10 #info (1) "Fedora Activity Day, Bangalore 2017" - a2batic++ 17:23:10 jwf: Karma for a2batic changed to 1 (for the f25 release cycle): https://badges.fedoraproject.org/tags/cookie/any 17:23:14 #link https://communityblog.fedoraproject.org/fedora-activity-day-bangalore-2017/ 17:23:20 #info Total Views (March 28 - April 4): 56 17:23:26 #link https://wordpress.com/stats/post/3590/communityblog.fedoraproject.org 17:23:31 #info (2) "Fedora 26 Supplementary Wallpapers: Vote now!" - gnokii++ 17:23:32 jwf: Karma for gnokii changed to 4 (for the f25 release cycle): https://badges.fedoraproject.org/tags/cookie/any 17:23:36 #link https://communityblog.fedoraproject.org/fedora-26-supplementary-wallpapers-vote-now/ 17:23:41 #info Total Views (March 28 - April 4): 1254 17:23:45 #link https://wordpress.com/stats/post/3618/communityblog.fedoraproject.org 17:23:51 #info (3) "Fedora at SCaLE 15x (2017) Event Report – Pasadena, California" - lajuggler++ 17:23:51 jwf: Karma for lajuggler changed to 1 (for the f25 release cycle): https://badges.fedoraproject.org/tags/cookie/any 17:23:56 #link https://communityblog.fedoraproject.org/scale-15x-event-report/ 17:24:03 #info Total Views (March 31 - April 4): 113 17:24:08 #link https://wordpress.com/stats/post/3513/communityblog.fedoraproject.org 17:24:13 hmm 17:24:15 #info (4) "Anaconda BlivetGUI Test Day: 2017-04-06" - sumantrom++ 17:24:15 jwf: Karma for sumantrom changed to 1 (for the f25 release cycle): https://badges.fedoraproject.org/tags/cookie/any 17:24:20 #link https://communityblog.fedoraproject.org/anaconda-blivetgui-test-day/ 17:24:25 #info Total Views (April 4): 15 17:24:32 #link https://wordpress.com/stats/post/3651/communityblog.fedoraproject.org 17:24:42 #info === Coming Up in CommBlog === 17:24:47 #info (1) "Fedora at Technologix 2017" - sumantrom 17:24:51 #link https://communityblog.fedoraproject.org/?p=3647&preview=1&_ppp=4d64ffcdd1 17:24:54 17:24:59 #topic Open Floor 17:25:13 Alright, that's everything on the agenda. 17:25:21 I've got something. 17:25:25 Anyone have anything they want to bring up here? Comments, ideas, suggestions, anything? 17:25:27 skamath: Go for it@! 17:25:34 So as you all might know, we have an open idea for CommOps this SoC 17:25:45 yeah 17:26:01 It'd be great if CommOps-ers can comment on the ticket on Pagure 17:26:08 Just the same comment I did you about magazine 17:26:10 ^Suggestions, Metrics ideas and more 17:26:15 skamath: Roger that! 17:26:20 The plugin for sharing and like is failing 17:26:22 #link https://pagure.io/fedora-commops/issue/105 17:26:37 #action commops Review and leave feedback on ticket for CommOps Google Summer of Code slot https://pagure.io/fedora-commops/issue/105 17:26:50 jwf, Have any specific metrics idea in mind as of now? 17:26:53 x3mboy: I'm going to try digging into this one tonight or tomorrow. 17:27:03 * skamath is wondering if we can somehow grab CommOps views 17:27:08 *CommBlog 17:27:11 #action jwf Investigate why like / share buttons have gone MIA in Magazine / CommBlog 17:27:47 skamath: I don't have any immediate ideas off the top of my head, but mattdm's State of Fedora presentation is probably a great place to start, if someone hasn't already thrown that in the hat. :) 17:28:04 Also, I feel like mattdm might have a lot of ideas on this ticket for what community metrics we want to look into. 17:28:10 jwf, Yep! Have mentioned that in the ticket 17:28:14 Someone may want to ping him about it via email and get his thoughts. 17:28:41 jwf, That's one of the primary tasks this SoC ;) 17:28:41 ok, I promise to check it out soon 17:28:46 skamath: As for CommBlog article, if someone puts one together, we can share it out :) 17:28:51 skamath: Excellent. :) 17:29:13 I'll try to check it out soon too, but I'm working through a backlog this week 17:29:15 jwf, I was talking about pulling views statistics from CommBlog. 17:29:22 skamath: Ohhhh! 17:29:35 It'd be great if we can pull itoff. 17:29:52 skamath: Sounds like a great idea! 17:29:55 Theoretically possible, I would think, with WordPress API, but it would be so nice to have a way to gather metrics about articles on the CommBlog / Magazine. The nice thing is that if you write it for one, you write it for both 17:30:02 We can have an awesome CommOps dashboard with real time data. 17:30:09 It would definitely, definitely help us at the Magazine 17:30:22 +1 17:30:25 +1 17:30:39 eof for me 17:30:41 Maybe not as part of GSoC, but that is definitely something we can work on. 17:30:42 I'll try to get that as a comment into the ticket while it's still fresh on my mind 17:30:45 I need to eat something 17:30:46 Thanks skamath :) 17:30:53 Anything else we want to cover? 17:30:57 EOF 17:30:59 ! 17:31:04 dhanesh95: Shoot! 17:31:09 Is this the final decided timeslot for CommOps meets? 17:31:14 jwf, for CommOps! :D 17:31:24 Oh yeah,I had that question as well 17:31:30 dhanesh95: Well, it was a problem, but then the time changed here 17:31:38 So now it's not a problem 17:31:44 No DST on this part of the globe so I'm not sure how things work out. 17:31:52 Ohhhh, is it a problem in IST? 17:31:53 * dhanesh95 never understood daylight saving 17:32:09 dhanesh95: I've been living with it for almost 20 years and I still don't understand it 17:32:14 jwf: Not a problem as long as we don't delay it 17:32:22 ^ 17:32:23 dhanesh95: Is the current time good? 17:32:32 jwf: Yes 17:32:33 jwf, Current time is perfect. 17:32:42 Now that the time adjusted in Europe, the existing time is fine for me 17:32:56 It was just that awkward two weeks when the time changed in the US, but not Europe, and then it did change here 17:33:03 * dhanesh95 is rethinking about living in Europe 17:33:05 :P 17:33:08 lol 17:33:10 I didn't realize there was a continental lag for that until literally last month 17:33:34 But anyways, if current time works, we can keep this time. 17:33:36 jwf: You completely lost me there 17:33:41 +1 from me. 17:33:47 jwf: +1 17:34:00 +1 17:34:06 #agreed Now that the places with daylight savings times have all had their changes across the world, we will just maintain the existing time. Thanks DST! 17:34:17 :P 17:34:17 .thank DST 17:34:17 skamath thinks DST is awesome and is happy they are helping! (Please don't forget to DST++ also) 17:34:21 lolol 17:34:25 LOL 17:34:29 Alright, anything else? 17:34:31 x.x 17:34:34 LOL 17:34:40 Rhea: o/ 17:34:45 Going once… 17:34:45 Didn't notice you ther 17:34:50 no from me 17:34:50 s/ther/there 17:34:55 Going twice… 17:35:06 Going thrice… 17:35:08 Sold! 17:35:11 :) 17:35:16 * Rhea waves 17:35:22 Alright CommOpsers, see you on the flipside :) 17:35:22 #endmeeting