17:37:15 #startmeeting Mindshare Committee 17:37:15 Meeting started Wed May 13 17:37:15 2020 UTC. 17:37:15 This meeting is logged and archived in a public location. 17:37:15 The chair is riecatnor. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 17:37:15 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 17:37:15 The meeting name has been set to 'mindshare_committee' 17:37:24 roll call :) 17:37:25 Hi 17:37:36 how are you bt0 17:37:46 * sumantro is here 17:37:52 Great Thanks :) 17:37:58 Love to hear that :D 17:38:19 I hope everyone is holding up okay these days 17:38:37 In Rochester we are starting to reopen in a limited way on Friday 17:39:24 Wow 17:39:38 riecatnor, thats great news .. 17:39:40 Yeah, I think just manufacturing and a couple other categories 17:39:59 riecatnor, that makes sense now 17:40:18 and there is a metric we have to meet continually to progress 17:40:43 anyways 17:40:48 the "restart" of the "new normal life" 17:40:59 yeah, bt0, not sure if things will ever be quite the same 17:41:03 at least not for some time 17:41:11 right 17:41:31 It is crazy to think about some natural disasters that happen in one area of the world, or another. This event has effected literally everyone 17:43:57 yes, all of us are sharing similar experiences don't matter our country or region 17:44:25 riecatnor, its hard to contemplate .. kinda like nightmare 17:44:44 :) looking at it like that I can see just a small positive side 17:44:51 Ik the feeling sumantro 17:44:52 .hello siddharthvipul1 17:44:53 siddharthvipul: siddharthvipul1 'Vipul Siddharth' 17:44:58 so, want to look at some tickets? 17:45:05 #topic tickets 17:45:05 yes 17:45:09 #link https://pagure.io/mindshare/issue/195 17:45:12 hey siddharthvipul :) 17:45:14 hi vipul o/ 17:45:24 sumantro: riecatnor bt0 \o :D 17:45:44 hiya siddharthvipul ! 17:46:29 bt0 I see you were going to add people to the advocate group? 17:46:45 I do it :) 17:46:57 I have a simple solution to this (for now that will not really have any downside) any ambassador (or someone who is active in other functional SIG), if their datagrepper says active in last 1 year, and if they show interest in being a sponsor (opening a ticket) they should be able to get the sponsor access 17:47:06 too harsh? :P 17:47:15 https://pagure.io/mindshare/issue/196 17:47:27 So, I guess 195 isn't the best one to tackle irst 17:47:29 first* 17:47:53 * riecatnor reading 17:47:54 ok 17:48:12 riecatnor: hmm, we can try 196 first (since it's more about who get's to "recruit" advocates 17:48:20 but 195 seems a better option 17:48:51 bt0, thanks for doing that! 17:48:58 please reverse the ticket numbers here ^ agh 17:49:00 So, I like Suma 17:49:03 Sumantros take 17:49:03 hi 17:49:06 #196 looks resolved to me and its taken care of nicely by bt0 17:49:07 Hi nb! 17:49:17 sure, sumantro, can you close 196 for us? 17:49:20 nb: hey :) 17:49:26 Hi nb! 17:49:42 riecatnor, sure 17:49:44 hi nb 17:49:57 bt0++ 17:49:57 sumantro: Karma for bt0dotninja changed to 4 (for the current release cycle): https://badges.fedoraproject.org/tags/cookie/any 17:50:32 sumantro: so since Sumantro and I had similar idea for advocate, I don't think I need clearance on that. glad that's closing (which means this is sorted) 17:50:47 :) 17:50:49 I want to pause the tickets for a moment, as well. There is thought I have that comes off of Sumantros comment on 195. The thought is that I am not sure people realize what Mindshare does, there are less folks applying to be here (i saw election stats), and I think this advocate thing is indicative of a bigger issue. The biggest issue being Mindshare Committee visibility 17:51:27 For example before I became FCAIC, I was not sure.. once I was here it made complete sense 17:52:15 Am I off base? 17:52:22 I'd like to hear peoples thoughts on this 17:53:20 riecatnor: I would tentatively agree 17:53:27 That same thought led me to open #210 17:53:38 riecatnor: fwiw, I am definitely inclined to say I am not sure what mindshare's responsibility is.. I mean I get it when I see the seats, but still I am not sure if that's happening 17:53:46 Right. Well, recently I hear this comment from vipul 17:54:06 jeje 17:54:21 bt0: yeah, I have been really nosy lately :) 17:54:40 Lol, siddharthvipul is looking for more work, I won't stop you :P 17:54:46 We have a lack of visibility 17:55:14 sumantro, nb, any thoughts on the state of mindshare visibility? 17:55:49 riecatnor, we had two primary issues, first was visibility. we needed to render the thought clear that ever focus group and SIG that participated/represented in Mindshare has a responsibility to grow the community or get more contributors in general either by helping folks or by hosting events themselves. 17:56:39 the second part of the issues was, we had people who dont show up at the meetings and we want to move the seats around a lil bit to see if that changes the dynamics 17:57:06 By example, In LATAM (ambassadors), Not to much people knows the process to request swag/budget for events 17:57:37 riecatnor, I think we need to figure out a better way to communicate 17:57:46 maybe even occasionally posting something on announce-list 17:57:55 like for example, we are not very sure FAmA is today..but then we have a seat , which can be let say given to someone more active in a focus group to get more contributors 17:57:57 yeah 17:58:00 from my point, these things should be a part of commops, probably need an udpate there (and talking to join sig so that they are aware and can point out people if needed) 17:58:13 these things -> process to request budget 17:58:13 sumantro, FAmA is here 17:58:20 Yeah, I prefer to hold my meetings very relaxed, but maybe I need to start creating more agenda and a wrap up to go to a mailing list? 17:58:30 but there isn't a lot for FAmA to do now that mentors sponsor people themselves 17:58:55 right 17:59:17 We do need to figure out if we wnat to proceed with asking ambassadors if they are active 17:59:32 we discussed that at Flock, but I never really got a clear "go ahead and send out an email" 17:59:38 riecatnor: I get the flexibility, but it's a seat's responsibility to update what's happening, maybe a monthly call for what's up on a mindshare ticket and then a curated and published like a blog (like fpgm but less frequent)? 17:59:54 I think the thought was "IF you say you are active, then you remain in ambassadors, if not, you become ambassadors-emeriti" 18:00:17 and same with mentors, we did one round of asking mentors if they were active, but haven't done it in a year or so 18:00:30 nb: regarding emeriti, I am +1 with the idea (with total knowledge that my +1 doesn't count) 18:00:39 nb, that approach might not be great tho. If you ask people, they will say yes, of course 18:00:50 Like for mindshare committee 18:01:04 riecatnor, well, IDK. When I did the mentors one, I did have several that said no 18:01:06 that why with @bt0 script come 18:01:10 interesting, ok 18:01:10 yes 18:01:32 i can get the data 18:01:46 bt0, but is everything ambassadors do in datagrepper? 18:01:53 what if i do stuff at a local lug but don't ask for funding? 18:01:56 yeah, that is my concern too. 18:02:02 * sumantro agree with ambassadors-emeriti 18:02:08 i think asking people if they are active is good enough, at least to start with 18:02:10 It will be interesting to see the read out 18:02:12 riecatnor: we don't have to ask people, an announce on say ambassador's list, probably devel list. "we will check your activity and if it's 0 in last 2 years (just an example) you will be moved to ambassador emeritus) if you want to stay in ambassador despite of inactivity, let us know 18:02:28 I like siddharthvipul's approach more. 18:02:34 hmm, that's a good idea 18:02:36 I'm here 18:02:38 sorry 18:02:39 don't ask people who are obviously active 18:02:41 .hello2 18:02:42 x3mboy: x3mboy 'Eduard Lucena' 18:02:49 nb, thanks for the ML 18:02:53 That was fast! 18:03:00 the question about whether or not the data from the script tells the whole story of a contributor is the issue with that approach 18:03:23 how about, if activity in last year is 0, email them and ask if they are active 18:03:45 nb: most part as participating in meetings (irc), open and follow tickets (pagure) and publishing event reports (wiki, commblog and fedora planet) 18:04:04 siddharthvipul, we did that but I am really ready to do that activity again , just to see if something has changed 18:04:25 bt0: I am also inclined to letting any activity from datagrepper also pass as active (just to give benefit of doubt) 18:04:33 yeah 18:04:37 /suggestion folks, I know :p 18:04:43 agreed on that siddharthvipul 18:04:48 nb, that also sounds good to me. 18:05:05 nb, but I have one thing with emailing them and asking them 18:05:13 I can do it today 18:05:33 ok.. we got a bit off topic, but its good. we came to some agreements 18:05:35 +1 vipul relaxed filter of activity 18:05:47 how long do we wait for their response, how will the individual email response be tracked 18:06:03 bt0, can you put a draft into a pagure issue or send to the ML? 18:06:18 2 weeks then a gentle reminder and wait for another week? 18:06:20 we always fall in the infinite loop of getting response from people 18:06:20 the idea with you let us know if you still want to be an ambassador despite of inactivity is less inflow of emails.. which will be easier to track 18:06:32 hhlp: exactly 18:07:12 create tag's for getting response, and progres check and all that stuff 18:07:27 so going with "moved to emeritus group if not active and no reply of the announcement" sounds a peaceful approach 18:08:04 Give them a week or something? 18:08:05 now we can define what's "active" which bt0's script + datagrepper activity (as per earlier conversation) 18:08:14 siddharthvipul, sounds fair 18:08:24 siddharthvipul, we said any activity in the last year makes them active, yeah? 18:08:30 riecatnor: yep 18:08:36 riecatnor, yep 18:09:01 i think 2 weeks, gentle reminder, two weeks, emeritus 18:09:14 riecatnor, i could go for that 18:09:15 a month seems a good time to get around to email :P 18:09:15 yes, that seems reasonable 18:09:19 who will collect the responses? 18:09:25 riecatnor, agreed 18:09:34 nb i volunteer 18:09:36 I can draft a response in the ticket 18:09:36 nb: what about just comment your username on a mindshare ticket ;) 18:09:49 that way no one has to depend on their inbox 18:10:02 And the scripts get information from fedmsg too 18:10:14 siddharthvipul, I like that idea. 18:10:33 nb: I am just from having less trouble for a person to track, and open discussion 18:10:48 so if they are active still, we direct them to go to this ticket and comment 18:10:52 yeah 18:11:05 +1 easier than tracking manually 18:11:11 I can implement the FAS changes after the month is over 18:11:23 nb sounds great 18:11:32 riecatnor: not exactly, if they are active, they will be in ambassador group by default, if they are not active and still want to be in the group, they can comment their username in ticket 18:11:34 Cool 18:11:42 which also means they will have a pagure activity 18:11:49 so the script will catch that? 18:11:52 bt0? 18:11:58 Yes 18:12:06 yes 18:12:18 so, run it again at the end of the month? 18:12:25 sure 18:12:32 then it got even simpler, if you are not active, and want to be an ambassador, comment and become active hahaaha 18:12:45 :) 18:12:53 I 18:12:55 ! 18:12:58 I'd like to move back to visibility 18:13:06 riecatnor: right 18:13:07 go ahead x3mboy 18:13:24 x3mboy, please go ahead if you have something to add to ambassador convo :) 18:13:44 I don't. It's an OT request 18:13:50 I will do it on Open Floor 18:13:57 Not I'm embarrassed 18:13:59 so what do you think about having a monthly blog? all seats have to update their monthly report paragraph at a place, and any seat (say take turns?) can pick them all, and publish them on commblog 18:14:01 Now* 18:14:12 oh sorry x3mboy 18:14:32 siddharthvipul, no, I'm sorry 18:14:47 x3mboy: ^.^ we are good people :P 18:14:51 Let me try to understand 18:15:03 The script will grab info from fas? 18:15:10 siddharthvipul, quarterly blog and internal monthly report on a pagure tracker ? 18:15:12 What that will include? 18:15:28 Logins 18:15:32 Not changes 18:15:52 sumantro: that also works but it seems that quarterly blog is too far stretched 18:16:17 I'm always +1 to this: we don't have to ask people, an announce on say ambassador's list, probably devel list. "we will check your activity and if it's 0 in last 2 years (just an example) you will be moved to ambassador emeritus) if you want to stay in ambassador despite of inactivity, let us know 18:16:25 I'm pretty sure we agreed on that 18:16:27 yes 18:16:29 Long time ago 18:16:43 +1 18:16:45 x3mboy: ah, I was unaware, as I was told, great minds think alike 18:16:47 :P 18:17:03 Sure they do 18:17:04 :P 18:17:07 x3mboy, we did and we will do that again :P 18:17:14 Ok 18:17:21 +1 from me 18:18:00 can we write the decision on the ticket and make it an action item assigned to someone? so that it doesn't drag anymore? 18:18:10 siddharthvipul, I think your idea is a good one, with a bit of tweaking 18:18:23 for example, what if nothing happens in a month for a team or two? 18:18:29 can we #agreed what we decided? 18:18:47 yeah one sec nb 18:18:54 Run bt0 script for people with no activity in 1 year, email them, wait 2 weeks, email them again, wait 2 weeks, then move them to ambassadors-emeriti? 18:18:57 yes 18:19:06 #agreed Run bt0 script for people with no activity in 1 year, email them, wait 2 weeks, email them again, wait 2 weeks, then move them to ambassadors-emeriti 18:19:07 if they don't update the pagure ticket within that month 18:19:17 we can always skip that seat.. just as an example, if there is a summer-coding seat on mindshare as per jwf's ticket, there will be no programs for a couple of months, we can skip that seat 18:19:20 riecatnor: 18:19:48 but having an update of seats that is active will bring the visibility to mindshare as a total 18:20:03 I am not talking about each seat's activity, but mindshare as a whole 18:20:28 we aso need to discuss the docs seat, now that Bex has a new role, does he want to remain on the commitee, or should we see if docs wants to pick someone else 18:20:38 I am not convinced yet lol 18:20:42 nb, spoke to bex 18:20:54 he urged me to ask pbocok about it 18:20:54 riecatnor:, in agreed, we are not exactly emailing them, right? it's more of an announcement? 18:21:06 i shot an email, will update if he declines 18:21:24 siddharthvipul, i thoguht we were only going to send it to the people with 0 activity 18:21:36 I would rather it go directly to people, not to a list 18:21:39 pbocok will be perfect since he is already doing all there is to do around doc :P but will he have time? 18:22:07 nb: sure, if that's what you think is better, it's easier to miss a list email 18:22:10 ok, so, I think we need to slow this process down a bit. bt0 offered to write a draft, once he does, let's review it before we send 18:22:14 siddharthvipul, thats the talk which I initiated.. :D 18:22:19 Well, someone on the group have to take the sit 18:22:25 I think writing a blog post about this from mindshare is something that would make sense 18:22:33 riecatnor, yeah 18:22:34 sumantro: which one exactly :P I have been speaking a lot here 18:22:35 Even if it's not pbocok, even when he is ideal 18:22:57 the pbocok about docs seat handling time convo 18:23:02 AHEM 18:23:06 folks. 18:23:07 ah, ++ for that 18:23:13 lets keep one topic. 18:23:30 The topic is too wide: Tickets 18:23:31 is the ambassador topic closed? 18:23:48 I think we agreed on something, so yes. Move on 18:23:58 +1 riecatnor: for that let's keep the data review and take a decision 18:24:06 anyone else for the ambassador topic 18:24:20 looking forward to the draft, I think we can move on 18:24:39 same here 18:24:42 I love that you all have so many thoughts but it makes things less productive :D 18:24:52 ok 18:24:54 visibility 18:25:12 proposals for how we want to be visible, go! 18:25:32 more posts on fedoramag and commblog? 18:25:34 monthly blog of active seats is what I would like to see as a community member, let's see the -1s with reason and +1s with reason? 18:25:44 nb: definitely 18:25:51 -1 setting us up for failure 18:25:52 detailing how to plan an event and what we would like to see from event proposals 18:26:25 I think commblog is the right place for us to post versus magazine 18:26:26 I think the problme with visibility if all the hard work is occuring behind the scene 18:26:44 My proposal is a weekly email to the mailing list from me after the meeting 18:26:55 Blog post to the comm blog when its appropriate 18:27:04 riecatnor: that's great as well 18:27:09 I like it 18:27:17 and i think it could be a part of our process, like someone opens a ticket, we ask, do we need a blog post for this? 18:27:21 riecatnor, sounds like a plan 18:27:40 and for event tickets, those people are the ones making the post 18:27:49 we could try to get more folks to publish that on commblog 18:27:51 or make it a requirement 18:28:03 FYI a few weeks ago I opened up the ambassadors list so anyone could subscribe 18:28:09 "powered by mindshare committee" 18:28:16 nb, offtopic :P 18:28:26 I did see that tho :D 18:28:35 its relevant for the advocate docs , thanks nb 18:29:44 I will make myself a template for the weekly email and will do my best to get the incorporated in smoothly 18:29:50 get that* 18:30:18 what mailing lists do you have in mind? 18:30:25 to share the updates I mean 18:30:50 siddharthvipul, all the subgroup mindshare caters to 18:30:54 mindshare 18:31:03 hmmmm 18:31:08 just mindshare might not be enough, but I like the idea of all subgroups 18:31:14 sumantro, that is a bit spammy? 18:31:26 I am not sure, maybe not 18:31:29 that's there too 18:31:33 hmm 18:31:51 maybe subgroups once a months with highlights 18:31:53 I think look at what other teams do and they post to their own mailing lists 18:31:57 and weekly mindshare 18:32:02 Oh, I am not against that 18:32:22 that seems pretty good actually. I think we need a template for a month mindshare all teams update 18:32:27 can someone else make that? 18:32:32 me 18:32:36 monthly* 18:32:39 great! 18:32:40 i will take that one 18:32:42 so what will be those? -docs, -summer-coding, -commops, -ambassadors, -mindshare.. what am I missing 18:32:58 design 18:33:00 websites join 18:33:01 magazine 18:33:02 design 18:33:06 magazine 18:33:08 I have a list :P 18:33:08 Marketing 18:33:16 community blog 18:33:25 so missing a lot, see! I am learning :P 18:33:30 commops :P 18:33:42 commops already added :P 18:33:42 OKAY , I am not pressing keys for 10 secs 18:33:43 Check the podcast 18:34:06 Sorry for that, it wasn't intended to be posted here 18:34:15 :P happens x3mboy 18:34:42 * siddharthvipul thought there was a podcast on mindshare's role :P 18:35:05 #agreed Mindshare committee wants to commit to raising visibility. We will send out weekly updates after our meetings. We will send a monthly update to mindshare teams. We will post to commblog more often, when appropriate. 18:35:08 okay we have a list.. I make a template and everyone gets to review that.. which goes out covering the highlights to subgroup..does all the stakeholders agree? 18:35:21 riecatnor, stole my thunder :) 18:35:24 LOL 18:35:26 +1 18:35:38 sorry I was just trying to be more official business meeting runner 18:35:42 :P 18:35:44 I as a community member, a major stockholder, agree :P 18:36:01 +1 18:36:04 s/stockholder/stakeholder (my cat, ugh) 18:36:04 Moved to telegram because cooking needs 18:36:30 x3mboy, oh gosh I bet you are making something great! 18:36:54 ok, so I think we agreed on some great things... good conversation today 18:36:54 moving on.. what else do we have? 18:36:59 any more thoughts on visibility? 18:37:03 +1 18:37:15 If not, I will close the meeting :D 18:37:20 riecatnor: for starters this seems good, maybe we can visit back later with some more brainstorming? 18:37:33 oh def. only so much can be done in an hour :P 18:37:43 No, I have an ot request 18:37:44 riecatnor: I feel a huge lot was done :P 18:37:50 go 18:37:51 It'd a super little one 18:37:51 x3mboy, go ahead 18:38:50 Can the meeting initiator/host/leader make a '.members mindshare' atem the beginning to raise a notification? 18:39:14 .members mindshare 18:39:15 bt0: Members of mindshare: bt0dotninja codeblock hhlp nb @riecatnor sumantrom x3mboy 18:39:35 Like that 18:40:17 we can generate a template for ur mettings as we do on commops ... 18:40:29 bt0 that would be helpful 18:40:39 That's not a bad idea 18:40:42 let me propose one 18:40:47 riecatnor, we had a ticket where someone is wanting an Ambassadors Polo - we don't do those anymroe do we? 18:40:55 that was only something EMEA did I think? 18:41:01 If it is something we do, I want one :P 18:41:09 I was looking into it, haven't figured it out yet 18:41:30 Also, totally honest, was not at the top of my priority list the last couple weeks 18:41:39 nb, thanks for reminding me tho 18:41:50 nb: I don't think it was just EMEA 18:42:27 Let me look into it :) 18:43:18 any more to add? 18:43:26 Nope 18:43:31 Eol 18:43:40 not from my side 18:43:48 chao folks, thank you for having an open participation meeting 18:43:54 #endmeeting