17:31:18 #startmeeting Mindshare 17:31:18 Meeting started Wed Feb 24 17:31:18 2021 UTC. 17:31:18 This meeting is logged and archived in a public location. 17:31:18 The chair is riecatnor. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 17:31:18 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 17:31:18 The meeting name has been set to 'mindshare' 17:31:18 #meetingname Mindshare 17:31:18 #chair bt0dotninja codeblock tyll hhlp nb pbokoc riecatnor x3mboy tatica siddharthvipul1 duffy mizmo 17:31:18 The meeting name has been set to 'mindshare' 17:31:18 Current chairs: bt0dotninja codeblock duffy hhlp mizmo nb pbokoc riecatnor siddharthvipul1 tatica tyll x3mboy 17:31:18 #info About Mindshare: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/mindshare/ 17:31:18 #topic Hello 17:31:25 .hi 17:31:26 x3mboy: x3mboy 'Eduard Lucena' 17:31:30 .hello riecatnor 17:31:31 riecatnor: riecatnor 'Marie Nordin' 17:31:31 .hello siddharthvipul1 17:31:37 siddharthvipul: siddharthvipul1 'Vipul Siddharth' 17:31:45 heya mizmo ! 17:31:49 .hello duffy 17:31:50 mizmo: duffy 'Máirín Duffy' 17:31:56 hey :) 17:31:58 .hi 17:31:59 ComputerKid: Sorry, but you don't exist 17:32:07 .hello computerkid 17:32:08 ComputerKid: computerkid 'Grayson Penland' 17:32:11 what is everyone's weather today?? 17:32:31 9C here and partly cloudy 17:32:44 really wishing for a sunny day soon :) 17:33:06 .fas thunderbirdtr 17:33:07 osezer: thunderbirdtr 'Onuralp SEZER' 17:33:09 (48F for all the US people hehe) 17:33:27 Hello o/ 17:33:38 heya osezer 17:34:11 Hey, we finally got a sunny week down here, it's supposed to get up to 68F 17:34:34 ooo, that is nice, I am a bit jealous :P 17:34:50 what state are you in ComputerKid 17:34:54 if you care to share :) 17:35:00 Georgia 17:35:22 Ah, nice, much different than me, I am in upstate ny 17:35:27 well anyways! 17:35:28 #topic announcements and information 17:35:50 feel free to share any announcements 17:36:21 maybe that we have outreachy applicants starting to ramp up, so be sure to say hi and help if you can 17:36:29 #info Fedora 33 beta freeze on 2021-02-23 17:36:41 that would be 34 right? 17:36:42 #info outreachy application period begins March 15th-April 16th 17:36:43 wait, it should be 34 17:36:47 #undo 17:37:07 I guess we are deep into it 17:37:10 mizmo, right, typo 17:37:18 #info Fedora 34 beta freeze on 2021-02-23 17:38:08 #info outreachy application period is March 15th-April 16th, make sure to say hi and help out if you can 17:38:15 better, I am just leaving that other one 17:38:29 something about FAS-> Noggin 17:38:53 #info CPE is looking at turning FAS into readonly mode around the end of March and standing up Noggin (the replacement for FAS) a little bit before that 17:39:19 #link https://github.com/orgs/fedora-infra/projects/6 17:39:21 :hope so: :D 17:39:45 the result will be if we have outreachy folks creating FAS accounts the existing docs / etc wont work 17:40:09 it will be important siddharthvipul for us to be able to update the docs on outreachy page as soon as the change is made 17:40:16 will you be able to let us know? 17:40:23 mizmo, why won't it work? It will be just a new interface, right? 17:40:54 I think the backend change too, but the database should be kept as it is 17:40:57 if it doesn't say FAS and our docs say FAS, that is enough confusion :) 17:41:29 x3mboy, oh I mean backend changes too, but links and create account options will be pretty same (if not, redirect) 17:41:36 I think all that is needed is some notice that the change has occurred 17:41:42 siddharthvipul: got it 17:41:44 anyway, I will discuss this with noggin team and confirm this :) 17:41:53 Great! 17:41:54 Thanks 17:41:54 not the place to speculate how it would work :P 17:41:56 We really try to spell everything out for the outreachy interns, there can be confusion 17:41:57 siddharthvipul++ 17:41:57 x3mboy: Karma for siddharthvipul1 changed to 16 (for the current release cycle): https://badges.fedoraproject.org/tags/cookie/any 17:42:05 siddharthvipul: its my understanding from the convo i saw there wouldn't be auto redirects but i may have misunderstood 17:43:44 well, I am not *too* concerned about this, but we may need to do some updates, so it will be good to know. 17:43:55 I don't think there should be any changes in docs (unless there are screenshots). Links to admin.fp.o should be same and there would be an option to create an account. but I might also have misunderstood. WIll be sure to confirm and inform here 17:44:10 hi 17:44:10 thanks siddharthvipul 17:44:14 heya nb ! 17:44:17 nb, \o 17:44:26 #topic tickets 17:44:29 #link https://pagure.io/mindshare/issue/255 17:44:51 Yay! 17:45:00 Can I jump in? 17:45:22 absolutely :) 17:46:09 Seems straightforward.. only question i have is on this line: "We do not place restrictions on community engagement though with that said, I'm sure you'd understand we wouldn't want another network broadcasting DLN associated shows on their network." does that mean our show can only be used on DLN and no other networks? Is that ok with us? are there many other networks we would want to be a part of? 17:46:15 how many listeners does DLN have. the exclusivity worries me 17:47:18 hi MichaelTunnell|D ! 17:47:24 thanks for joining 17:47:28 Perfect timing! 17:47:49 hello there :D 17:47:55 This means that we shouldn't publish the podcast on other networks. So we can collab with other networks like Jupiter Broadcasting, but not be published by them 17:48:03 Or that's how I read it 17:48:53 That's the point I think. MichaelTunnell|D can you comment? 17:49:38 On YouTube Destination Linux Network has 8690 suscriptores 17:49:56 so you could guest on a jupiter broadcasting podcast, but not be syndicated by them 17:49:58 basically if our association is in an official sense such as DLN promoting the Fedora Podcast as a part of the network then if Fedora Podcast were to do that with any other network then it would be confusing to all audiences. 17:50:44 Exactly what I thought 17:50:55 is there a term / contract / obligation here? like is this for one year or indefinite? if we wanted to end the relationship (not saying we would just trying to figure out the terms) how would that look 17:51:11 Also, it doesn't mean that any community member, collaborator or fedora person can't go to other shows 17:51:43 I collaborate personally with Linux Lad (Dublin LUG) and with Linux Unplugged (Jupiter) 17:51:49 And I don't mean to stop 17:51:57 and what constitutes a network. for example red hat has a whole family of podcast and may like to feature the fedora podcast in that. i wouldn't qualify it as a network at all, but for example they might have a page listing all RHT afilliated podcasts and it could show up on that page. would that be an issue 17:52:37 can we independently list on podcatchers 17:53:24 I think these are important questions, especially about the terms of the relationship 17:53:45 Me too 17:53:52 I am not sure if we can answer them all now and here? 17:54:07 Maybe we should put these questions into the ticket, and give MichaelTunnell|D more time to give some feedback? 17:54:23 I think, in terms of RH, we couldn't be not published by them, since they are our main sponsor 17:54:55 (and fedora trademark holder) 17:54:56 to address the going on podcasts. We do not even attempt to restrict that. The best example of that is Noah on DL. Noah has been on JB in the past year and I think that is a great example of not restricting :D 17:56:42 we have not attempted to do this before so we do not have a contract for this kind of thing but if Fedora would prefer there be one, then we can work with that I'm sure. 17:57:26 oh ok cool, no i was more trying to figure out the mechanics. so it's sort of a loose mutual agreement, and could be called off by any party at any time it seems? 17:58:27 Red Hat being the main sponsor of Fedora gives it an exception. Red Hat's main business isn't a podcasting network so it wouldn't be an issue. We are mostly referring to direct competitors being associated with it while also being associated with DLN would be very confusing to all audiences trying to understand how it worked. 17:58:42 oh ok great that makes a lot of sense. 17:59:15 We would not attempt to take over control of any of those aspects. We may request something be added to reference the DLN association but Fedora would be in control of all podcast infrastructure. We would only offer advice where requested. 17:59:44 That makes sense to me 18:00:08 it would be great to get these responses in the ticket please :) 18:00:12 #link https://pagure.io/mindshare/issue/111 18:00:24 this soudns great to me if the council is ok w it you have my support :) 18:00:47 we would want at least a reasonable commitment just because if we do a bunch of promotion we wouldnt want a situation where someone could benefit from us and then bounce. That would not be ideal for us. We'd want a mutual benefit situation for sure. 18:01:07 let's talk about swag re: new logo! 18:01:11 Indeed that's the next move, the trademark approval 18:01:21 DLN approaches podcasting and content creation with an Open Source philosophy. We help Fedora Podcast and in turn we benefit as well. 18:02:10 I added a comment to #111 about what we currently keep around 18:02:51 * DLN approaches podcasting and content creation with an Open Source philosophy. We help Fedora Podcast and in turn we benefit as well. We also treat our hosts this way as well. For example, Jill was on a podcast prior to her joining DL. We specifically gave her an exception in her contract to continue to do that show without worry that it would conflict. We have no desire to be a burden, only to help � 18:02:55 I think you cover most of the swag here https://pagure.io/mindshare/issue/111#comment-717737 18:03:37 i added a few more on that I missed just now 18:04:05 hah, there's a Fedora-branded tablecloth? :)) 18:04:06 so question to mindshare is, do we want to eventually have all these things redone? I will need to work out a schedule based on budgetary things 18:04:14 and, do we want additional things 18:04:33 At some point we had usb drives 18:04:47 meanwhile, I see we have multiple things here that may need some version of re-design, so I think we need to defer to mizmo on what a timeline for that would be 18:05:02 But not sure if it was as swag or as contributor 'prizes' 18:05:20 We do have that outreachy application period coming up, where we can get a lot of help in a quick time (quality varies 18:05:33 I'm not personally a big fan of swag, especially clothing. I have a box of branded stuff hidden somewhere that I've been meaning to donate, because I don't wear it anyway. I'm probably in the minority as far as the community is concerned though 18:06:15 i was talking to mattdm about what he thinks we *need* and he mentioned case badge strips, some drinkware option, and tshirts 18:06:42 I'd definitely stay away from backpacks because I've never seen a swag backpack that wasn't terrible, I'm sorry to say. It's really hard to find a good backpack for a decent price and I don't think a company like Osprey would be open to making some for us... 18:06:48 pbokoc, I understand that sentiment as well. We could do a sign up for a tshirt moment, order just what we need, and thats it 18:06:55 it would be great to see the new logo on some tshirts, imo :) 18:07:36 I think that we need "powered by" stickers 18:07:42 riecatnor, yeah, if we allow people to sign up for them that's great, whoever wants one gets one and the box under my bed (or wherever I put it) won't explode :) 18:07:42 Fedora caps please 18:07:44 x3mboy, we are getting USB drives, they will have the old logo 18:07:51 Oh and camera covers 18:07:51 Since the preinstalled lenovo laptops doesn't have any 18:07:54 Everyone loves it 18:07:58 I like the camera cover idea 18:08:06 stickers and USB drives are +1 from me, especially the latter, you can't have enough of those :)) 18:08:08 x3mboy, agreed! 18:08:23 ah yes and camera covers are great too 18:08:25 Ok, I am gathering these ideas and I will drop them on the ticket 18:09:18 some of these items I originally posted don't even have the logo, so I will remove those 18:10:08 branded duct tape! :-D 18:10:25 it's like a sticker except 100m long! 18:10:43 Pbokoc, then I want fedora wd40 as well 18:10:49 lol 18:10:49 yes! 18:11:06 How about hand sanitizer? 18:11:11 if it moves and shouldn't, duct tape; if it doesn't move and should, WD-40 18:11:12 kidding and not all at once :P 18:11:23 hahha 18:11:25 riecatnor, oh, that's actually not too bad of an idea 18:11:44 (also WD-40 is useful for preventing rust on nuclear missiles, or so I've heard) 18:11:48 I think we can draw the line before face masks tho lol 18:12:04 Every year I hear sanitizer ideas before devconf but never happens :p 18:12:34 I guess because the bottles are useless once used and mostly thrown away. Maybe not good for branding? 18:12:46 Just thinking out loud, ignore 18:12:48 siddharthvipul, you make a good point 18:12:55 yeah, I didn't use hand sanitizer at this year's devconf and now I caught the legendary DevConf flu. IT WAS VIRTUAL FOR GOD'S SAKE! 18:13:36 one google search confirmed my thought that there is a "sustainable sanitizer packaging" industry lol 18:13:49 hahah pbokoc you are full of jokes today i love it 18:13:52 that is a good point. Also it kinda associates Fedora with Covid. There was a big debate about branded face masks in Red Hat when the crisis started and we were originally told there wouldn't be any for that reason. IIRC the branding team changed that after a month or so due to huge demand, but I understand the sentiment 18:14:29 riecatnor, not a very important point, but having things that Red Hat already produces (on cool-stuf store) might be easier to do 18:14:39 not produces, outsources* 18:14:42 well, as of right now, it's just an idea.. if we could do it sustainably I wouldn't be against it 18:14:49 That will take research on my behalf 18:14:58 a make-your-own-sanitizer chemist kit, miuch more in line with free software ethos 18:15:06 I was just gonna say that misc 18:15:07 so hats, tshirts, camera cover, oh oh SOCKS!!, scarfs etc 18:15:16 pbokoc: great spirits think alike ! 18:15:18 misc, how do I give you a ++ from telegram :P 18:15:33 there's already open source beer, hand sanitizer is child's play in comparison 18:15:39 misc++ :) 18:15:39 pbokoc: Karma for misc changed to 10 (for the current release cycle): https://badges.fedoraproject.org/tags/cookie/any 18:15:51 misc++ lol 18:15:56 the real challenge would be a beer that can also serve as hand sanitizer 18:16:06 (well, no, that's called opensource vodka..) 18:17:05 #link https://pagure.io/mindshare/issue/235 18:17:06 look up "Tactical Nuclear Penguin", it's beer stronger than vodka. Plus, penguin :-D 18:17:17 is #235 something we still want to do? 18:17:22 and I'm only talking about nukes for the 2nd time today by sheer coincidence, I promise! 18:18:02 just fyi, the council is working on a community wide survey https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/tickets/issue/327 18:18:42 well if that's the case, how about we just ask the Council to include a question or two for us? Might prevent "survey fatigue" 18:18:42 lol does this tactical penguin taste good? 18:18:51 pbokoc, exactly my thought 18:19:04 problem is, I was already ragging on them to shorten it :P 18:19:22 riecatnor, never had it, it's really expensive and it would probably be hard to get here in CZ, I think it's American. Given the >70% alcohol content I imagine drinking it feels like getting hit by a brick 18:19:29 #link https://hackmd.io/MqPUtYrnSOesig7hJ9RPQg?view 18:19:37 #link https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/tickets/issue/327 18:19:49 no that's perfect, let's get them to shorten it so there's more room for our questions! 18:19:58 in fact, cut everything else 18:20:11 bookwar won't have that :P 18:20:39 Ok, so let's try to quickly define what we want to gain from asking a question here 18:21:17 Further understand how much the Fedora community understands about the Mindshare Committee and it's processes. 18:21:30 too many 'understands' 18:21:48 replace the first one with "insight into" 18:22:23 Gain further insight into how much the Fedora community understands about the Mindshare Committee and it's processes. 18:22:26 I like it 18:22:35 Next, let's try to quickly define what we might do with the data 18:23:18 Use the data to improve Mindshare Committee more visible and useable to the entirety of the Fedora community. 18:23:27 oops.. too many thoughts 18:23:46 hehehe 18:23:53 Use the data we gain to improve the Mindshare Committees visibility and make our processes more useable to the entirety of the Fedora community. 18:23:54 riecatnor I have a contact for the ocmpany that currently makes the case badges 18:24:00 nb, good to know! 18:24:22 can you forward that on to me and any other info I need to know bout that process? 18:24:30 We definitely need tablecloths 18:24:36 for when we have in-person events 18:24:43 nb, agreed 18:25:40 ok, i am adding notes to 235 rn 18:26:01 riecatnor sure, i will look back in my old emails and send you the info 18:26:03 we will need to come up with the questions, one may even be enough 18:27:02 #topic open floor 18:27:20 We are short on time, I squeezed an extra ticket in 18:27:26 Does anyone have things? 18:27:41 OH I have a thing lol 18:27:55 I am on PTO this friday through Monday the 8th 18:28:14 Do ya'll want to run the meeting without me or should i cancel 18:28:17 riecatnor Enjoy! 18:28:37 thanks :) super looking forward to it 18:28:49 still about the survey - how about instead of asking a question like "are you aware there's a mindshare committee", we make it a little test? Ask something like, I dunno, "Who would you first try to contact if you wanted to do a Fedora release party?" 18:29:03 i like it pbokoc 18:29:05 pbokoc I like that 18:29:10 or just an event? 18:29:12 and the percentage of correct answers tells us how many people know about us and what we do 18:29:42 yeah that was just a random example that popped into my head first, it definitely needs more refinement. Event sounds better :) 18:29:57 or swag, or something like that 18:29:59 it would do the job pretty well 18:30:02 ok, yea! 18:30:26 I wonder multiple choice or fill in t 18:30:46 and think up a couple plausible sounding answers - Council, mattdm, "just ask random people in #fedora", "that guy who kept spamming FreeNode with random crap yesterday"... 18:30:58 I'd say multiple choice 18:31:07 yep, FCAIC is another one lol 18:31:10 Sorry 18:31:14 Cross meeting 18:31:19 so for next week, want to run without me or should i cancel in fedocal? 18:31:37 I can chair if needed 18:31:47 x3mboy++ 18:31:47 pbokoc: Karma for x3mboy changed to 15 (for the current release cycle): https://badges.fedoraproject.org/tags/cookie/any 18:31:53 ok, cool! I won't do anything then, except read the logs later ;) 18:31:57 thanks everyone! 18:32:00 #endmeeting