20:00:43 <riecatnor[m]1> #startmeeting Mindshare
20:00:43 <zodbot> Meeting started Thu Dec  2 20:00:43 2021 UTC.
20:00:43 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
20:00:43 <zodbot> The chair is riecatnor[m]1. Information about MeetBot at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Zodbot#Meeting_Functions.
20:00:43 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
20:00:43 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'mindshare'
20:00:48 <riecatnor[m]1> #meetingname Mindshare
20:00:48 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'mindshare'
20:00:55 <riecatnor[m]1> #chair @bt0dotninja codeblock tyll nb pbokoc riecatnor thunderbirdtr siddharthvipul relrod mizmo @OnuralpSezer[m] @PetrBokoc[m]
20:00:55 <zodbot> Current chairs: @OnuralpSezer[m] @PetrBokoc[m] @bt0dotninja codeblock mizmo nb pbokoc relrod riecatnor riecatnor[m]1 siddharthvipul thunderbirdtr tyll
20:01:03 <riecatnor[m]1> #info About Mindshare: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/mindshare/
20:01:09 <riecatnor[m]1> #topic Hello
20:01:09 <mizmo> 👋
20:01:17 <riecatnor[m]1> heyy Máirín Duffy !
20:03:48 <riecatnor[m]1> Vipul Siddharth Alberto Rodríguez Sánchez nb pbokoc Onuralp Sezer tyll
20:04:00 <riecatnor[m]1> I need to update that @chair command :P
20:04:25 <VipulSiddharth[m> 👋
20:04:29 <pbokoc> hey
20:04:31 <riecatnor[m]1> hey Vipul
20:04:37 <MadelinePeck[m]> ☺️👋🏻
20:04:41 <riecatnor[m]1> Hiya pbokoc & Madeline Peck :)
20:05:14 <riecatnor[m]1> how's it goin today?
20:05:21 <VipulSiddharth[m> riecatnor @riecatnor:fedora.im: very sleepy.. so before phone hits my face, I should let it go and sleep 😂😂
20:05:26 <MadelinePeck[m]> Good day! I’m good! How is everyone? Its a balmy 57 degrees F in boston today 😨
20:05:33 <OnuralpSezer[m]> riecatnor:  hello (with a bit of sleepy mode of mine)
20:05:34 <riecatnor[m]1> good idea Vipul Siddharth tho I swear this sounds familiar ;)
20:05:44 <VipulSiddharth[m> Haha
20:05:54 <MadelinePeck[m]> the sleep feel is real
20:05:58 <JWF[m]> Phew, 1:30am Vipul! The meeting trekker :P
20:06:03 <OnuralpSezer[m]> Vipul Siddharth:  we should go :)
20:06:18 <riecatnor[m]1> I think December should just be for naps
20:06:31 <VipulSiddharth[m> J.W.F. 🔕📴: yeah, one day I would learn :p
20:06:33 <riecatnor[m]1> Hi J.W.F. 🔕📴 !!
20:06:39 <pbokoc> heh, yeah, we could just hibernate like bears
20:06:55 <riecatnor[m]1> +1
20:06:57 <OnuralpSezer[m]> riecatnor:  can we have a snow while we sleep It could nice to see it
20:07:01 <VipulSiddharth[m> +1
20:07:01 <OnuralpSezer[m]> If we woke up
20:07:02 <OnuralpSezer[m]> :)
20:07:03 <VipulSiddharth[m> Pass that bill
20:07:07 <riecatnor[m]1> right here it is just rain :(
20:07:12 <JWF[m]> Hiya riecatnor and all 👋🏻
20:07:14 <OnuralpSezer[m]> no no no
20:07:16 <OnuralpSezer[m]> we snow is better
20:07:22 <OnuralpSezer[m]> J.W.F. 🔕📴:  hello o/
20:07:24 <riecatnor[m]1> agreed lol
20:07:27 <riecatnor[m]1> #topic announcements and information
20:07:50 <riecatnor[m]1> #info Fedora Elections are open now until Dec 9th, vote today!
20:07:52 <riecatnor[m]1> #link https://communityblog.fedoraproject.org/f35-elections-voting-now-open/
20:08:25 <riecatnor[m]1> #info Fedora Annual Survey 2021 Data Set now available for analysis!
20:08:27 <riecatnor[m]1> #link https://communityblog.fedoraproject.org/fedora-contributor-annual-survey-data-set-available/
20:08:58 <JWF[m]> I love the featured image artwork
20:09:26 <riecatnor[m]1> thats from the badge, of course :)
20:09:28 <AlbertoRodrguezS> Yes, is amazing, hi!!
20:09:36 <riecatnor[m]1> hi Alberto!
20:10:17 <riecatnor[m]1> So, I am pretty short on announcements this week actually
20:10:27 <riecatnor[m]1> anyone else have some info or announcements to share today?
20:10:30 <JWF[m]> Maybe one thing to add, for folks following the DevConf CZ track: https://twitter.com/devconf_cz/status/1466353953222934530
20:10:52 <riecatnor[m]1> #info DevConf.CZ is moving from hybrid to all virtual for 2023
20:10:59 <riecatnor[m]1> #link https://twitter.com/devconf_cz/status/1466353953222934530
20:11:06 <riecatnor[m]1> thank you, J.W.F. 🔕📴 !
20:11:15 <riecatnor[m]1> #action undo
20:11:17 <riecatnor[m]1> @undo
20:11:19 <riecatnor[m]1> #undo
20:11:19 <zodbot> Removing item from minutes: ACTION by riecatnor[m]1 at 20:11:15 : undo
20:11:21 <riecatnor[m]1> wow!!!
20:11:26 <riecatnor[m]1> it didn't even work
20:11:35 <riecatnor[m]1> #info DevConf.CZ is moving from hybrid to all virtual for 2022*
20:12:11 <riecatnor[m]1> anything else?
20:12:27 <mizmo> thats probably for the best given omicron ☹️
20:12:43 <riecatnor[m]1> yea :(
20:12:57 <riecatnor[m]1> #topic today's meeting agenda
20:13:21 <riecatnor[m]1> I have a couple things I would like to cover today, this is your chance to add things to discuss :)
20:16:33 * mizmo has nothing
20:16:47 <riecatnor[m]1> cool, just waiting a couple minutes for folks to catch up
20:17:00 <riecatnor[m]1> #topic swag
20:17:17 <riecatnor[m]1> #link https://pagure.io/mindshare/issue/301
20:17:59 <riecatnor[m]1> so first, tshirts. I got the samples, the allmade is def the best for the quality/price/eco-friendly aspect. I think we should move forward with that one.
20:18:25 <riecatnor[m]1> My question for Mindshare at this point is do we have any thoughts about color combos
20:18:33 <riecatnor[m]1> I feel confident asking this bc Mo is here :)
20:18:45 <riecatnor[m]1> also Madeline!
20:19:05 <riecatnor[m]1> here is the link for the tshirt: http://nadelwilmingtonshop.com/ProductDetails/?productId=553018402&imageId=42554175&tab=Tile&referrerPage=ProductResults&refPgId=526271826&referrerModule=PRDREB
20:19:19 <riecatnor[m]1> it doesn't show the color options tho :/ just lists them
20:19:36 <mizmo> can they send color swatches?
20:19:56 <mizmo> i have that pantone book too so if they have pantone equiv color codes available i can go off of that instead
20:20:08 <riecatnor[m]1> oh yea, ok. let me see what I can do
20:20:23 <riecatnor[m]1> Can we discuss what the optimal situation would be? (for example white logo on blue)
20:20:28 <MadelinePeck[m]> Oh thats a cool thing to have Mo! Very helpful as a designer
20:20:49 <MadelinePeck[m]> we only get one color option right?
20:21:04 <MadelinePeck[m]> or one color combo i mean
20:21:07 <riecatnor[m]1> I priced out a two color option, but 1 color is cheaper :)
20:21:25 <mizmo> i know in the past fedorans have complained about white tshirts bc they stain more easily and they have a lot of whtie, and they prefer dark but its been a while since ive gotten that feedback (in terms of shirt color)
20:21:30 <mizmo> we can actually do one color now woohoo
20:21:38 <riecatnor[m]1> I feel exactly the same, Máirín Duffy
20:21:41 <riecatnor[m]1> no white tees for me
20:21:52 <mizmo> but non white usually means 2 color since you need the white base for color to show up on dark shirts
20:22:02 <mizmo> unless we did like a heather grey
20:22:17 <mizmo> i dont think ive had a vendor willing to do one color on darker than heather grey
20:22:20 <riecatnor[m]1> That makes sense Mizmo
20:23:26 <riecatnor[m]1> well, we can do 2 color if that is what is needed.
20:23:41 <mizmo> so i think the optimal situation is either white on blue, if the blue shirt color is reasonable, or blue on black or dark grey.
20:23:55 <mizmo> the problem is the vendors blue shirt colors are all over the place. i usually go black / dark grey just because its more of a sure thing / less risky than blue
20:24:09 <mizmo> but if we can take the time to get swatches and do this properly blue would be better if we have some assurance its in the ballpark
20:24:14 <riecatnor[m]1> for the black/dark grey would we want to go all blue for the logo or add in the white 'F'
20:24:23 <mizmo> white in the f is better for sure
20:24:29 <mizmo> but that wouldnt cost extra
20:24:35 <mizmo> because they do a white under layer anyway
20:24:42 <mizmo> so it should not be an extra color charge
20:24:45 <MadelinePeck[m]> mmm
20:25:07 <riecatnor[m]1> interesting. Ok! I will take these notes, hopefully we can get swatches quickly
20:25:12 <riecatnor[m]1> or the pantone colors.
20:25:14 <mizmo> altho i guess it might be since theyd need an extra screen. not sure. depends on how they price it and their equipment i guess lol.
20:25:23 <mizmo> some charge based on # colors some charge based on # screens
20:25:58 <riecatnor[m]1> ok, second question for the tshirt. We want the horizontal logo across the front, correct?
20:26:32 <riecatnor[m]1> or are we looking at stacked?
20:26:34 <mizmo> yeh i think so. horiz logo across front. maybe something on sleeve for smtg extra
20:26:43 <mizmo> we want to promote the horiz logo as teh primary one
20:26:50 <riecatnor[m]1> cool, that is what I thought as well
20:27:12 <MadelinePeck[m]> oooh something small on sleeve would be extra cool
20:27:33 <riecatnor[m]1> I will see what the extra will cost :)
20:27:36 <riecatnor[m]1> ok- anything else for the tshirt?
20:28:09 <AlbertoRodrguezS> Not from me (I learn a lot)
20:29:25 <riecatnor[m]1> ok, onto Ambassador Polos - good news here is we can get a full sample of these
20:30:02 <riecatnor[m]1> we need to settle on a design for the polos. I found out the option we have available to us now can embroider on the chest area and one sleeve only
20:30:31 <riecatnor[m]1> I found this version of the polo: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Polo_Shirt?rd=Ambassadors/PoloShirt#Fedora_Ambassadors_Polo_Shirt
20:30:52 <riecatnor[m]1> Ben had a shirt which was different (and newer, I think)
20:30:53 <riecatnor[m]1> https://pagure.io/mindshare/issue/301#comment-764336
20:30:54 <mizmo> that logo deffo needs updating
20:31:30 <mizmo> the one from Ben's. I can't see the one in the other shot but that looks like the FUDcon Berlin booth which was 2009
20:31:55 <riecatnor[m]1> it looks like the group pic, the chest just has the logomark
20:32:09 <riecatnor[m]1> the later version has the whole ambassadors logo
20:32:24 <riecatnor[m]1> I prefer it to say ambassadors, I think
20:33:17 <riecatnor[m]1> any thoughts on this?
20:33:59 <AlbertoRodrguezS> Not here
20:34:13 <riecatnor[m]1> #link https://pagure.io/design/issue/764
20:34:14 <mizmo> i think the idea with ambassador is that the person wearing it is an ambassador
20:34:20 <mizmo> i dont really have a pref tho
20:35:02 <riecatnor[m]1> I think it saying ambassadors could help strengthen folks identity and connection back to the program
20:35:32 <riecatnor[m]1> so here we have an updated layout of the ambassadors logo: https://pagure.io/design/issue/raw/files/afc49d632a2263705bea1917a714f3c2e6684a7c68d1b6d907656b4c53f13d82-Ambassadors_dark_blue.png
20:36:29 <riecatnor[m]1> any thoughts about color/logo/placement combinations for the polos?
20:36:56 <mizmo> i think if we stick with the white on blue shirt that would be good. i have similar concerns about the shirt colors but maybe we can get codes / swatches as well/
20:37:04 <AlbertoRodrguezS> I love it (as ambassador)
20:37:16 <mizmo> traditionally the ambassadors shirt is a blue polo... it sticks out on conference floors...
20:37:27 <riecatnor[m]1> to me, the older shirts look kind of like the darker fedora blue
20:37:42 <mizmo> ive seen at least 3 incarnations with different color blues
20:37:49 <riecatnor[m]1> lol, checks out
20:37:55 <mizmo> the EMEA vendor had a very diff blue than the NA and LATAM produced ones
20:38:08 <riecatnor[m]1> well, these will all ship from the Cool stuff store!
20:38:19 <riecatnor[m]1> so that is a nice improvement
20:38:39 <mizmo> i think maybe, have the fedora logo in white on the chest, and the ( ) Ambassadors logo on the sleeve?
20:38:58 <mizmo> because they interface with folks at confs and newbies... so having the full fedora wordmark most prominent i think makes sense
20:39:19 <mizmo> and having ambassadors on the sleeve is like a rank / role placement uniforms use
20:39:55 <riecatnor[m]1> I think that makes sense, Mo
20:40:17 <riecatnor[m]1> When we discussed this at the tuesday meeting last week, the four foundations logo was brought up.. But i am not sure where we would work that in
20:40:47 <mizmo> i dont know that it'd work too well at that scale in embroidery either
20:40:51 <mizmo> (the 4 foudnations)
20:40:54 <riecatnor[m]1> right
20:41:17 <riecatnor[m]1> its a very cool design, it would be nice to use it on the "fun" tshirt design somehow
20:42:00 <riecatnor[m]1> ok.. anything else for polos today?
20:42:16 <riecatnor[m]1> I will go back with our preferences and I think they will make a sample for us right away
20:42:48 <JWF[m]> A late add, but if it were possible to do right, it would be nice to have blue t-shirts and/or blue polos, in the Fedora swatch
20:43:19 <riecatnor[m]1> I am going to shoot for that :)
20:43:56 <riecatnor[m]1> ok- next swag thing, this one is quick
20:44:03 <JWF[m]> 🙌🏻
20:44:07 <riecatnor[m]1> they got back to me and said we cant do the laser engraved mugs :((((
20:44:26 <riecatnor[m]1> I had also gotten some pushback on the mug storage from our fulfillment center.
20:44:27 <mizmo> why not??
20:44:51 <riecatnor[m]1> this is what I got "Laser engraving is the recommended on the site, but they are having issues with the deco quality via laser engraved.  "
20:45:11 <riecatnor[m]1> so, I guess it would like bad :/
20:45:39 <riecatnor[m]1> riecatnor[m]1: turns out mugs take up a lot of space, and we have some with the old logo on them already that they want us to move
20:45:56 <riecatnor[m]1> s/like/look/
20:46:12 <mizmo> ahh ok
20:46:38 <riecatnor[m]1> so, I was like, what else did we have on the Mindshare list of swag
20:46:40 <mizmo> do we need to figure out smtg to order by a deadline
20:46:45 <riecatnor[m]1> and I had them quote camera covers
20:46:47 <riecatnor[m]1> and enamel pins
20:46:54 <mizmo> camera covers and pins are great ideas
20:47:02 <mizmo> the pins would be awesome. when weve done logo pins before they were a super hot item
20:47:03 <riecatnor[m]1> also, take up less space!
20:47:09 <MadelinePeck[m]> ooh yea
20:47:14 <mizmo> lol swag planned via storage space
20:47:22 <mizmo> dude i want panda pins
20:47:29 <riecatnor[m]1> lol, I meannnn, cube is real :P
20:47:46 <riecatnor[m]1> omgosh yes, with the new character design?
20:48:06 <AlbertoRodrguezS> Sounds very cool
20:48:19 <mizmo> yah!!
20:48:28 <riecatnor[m]1> rad, I want one!
20:48:40 <riecatnor[m]1> ok, anything else for swag today? (thank you everyone for all the input!)
20:50:35 <riecatnor[m]1> #topic future of fedoracommunity.org
20:50:38 <riecatnor[m]1> #link https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/t/replace-fedoracommunity-org-with-a-doc-on-docs-fp-o/34845
20:51:30 <mizmo> if we couldnt keep fedoracommunity.org updated and maintained i question how having a doc on docs.fpo has any better chances of being updated
20:51:47 <riecatnor[m]1> I clicked through a lot of links.. I didn't find one that was working
20:52:27 <riecatnor[m]1> I was able to discuss with Mariana & Sumantro, and we think we could make use of this for ambassadors, just in a different way. What i would ask Mindshare is, is there something we feel should be there? its a very official kind of URL
20:52:35 <mizmo> kind of feels like something that should be associated with ambassadors
20:52:57 <AlbertoRodrguezS> Right
20:52:58 <riecatnor[m]1> this seems to fall in line with the website strategy work
20:53:02 <mizmo> fedora germany, italy, france all worked on the emea page, its not all dead links
20:53:09 <riecatnor[m]1> I want to make sure we are aligned with that before saying "we want to use this url"
20:53:30 <mizmo> the website strategy is gonna be less domain names 🙂
20:53:51 <mizmo> we are also talking about more contextual "upselling" into onboarding contributors
20:54:31 <mizmo> so rather than having one page thats like "join fedora" we have lower key contextual invitations. like, "hey you're looking at fedora's brand guidelines. perhaps you'd like to join the design team?"or "hey you're looking at the known bugs for the latest release. perhaps you'd be interested in QA/testing?" etc
20:54:51 <mizmo> it is a good domain name just not sure where to point it
20:55:18 <mizmo> i mean maybe
20:55:28 <mizmo> maybe itd be good to point at a page on the website that lists out communication channels fort he community
20:55:38 <mizmo> discourse, fedora.im, lists.fpo, etc
20:55:48 <riecatnor[m]1> The Revamp teams rough proposal is to use the site for 3 things(all outreach/ambassador related).
20:55:48 <riecatnor[m]1> 1. Links to the most active/maintained chat channels (selective)
20:55:48 <riecatnor[m]1> 2. Links to the important tools/spaces in the Fedora ecosystem
20:55:48 <riecatnor[m]1> 3. A set of simple infographics highlighting different aspects of Fedora that ambassadors can use as a tool while talking to people.
20:55:48 <mizmo> that should feature somewhere on the website
20:56:10 <mizmo> wait im on the revamp team, that is all new to me
20:56:12 <mizmo> where did that come from
20:56:16 <riecatnor[m]1> this is the fedora community outreach revamp
20:56:26 <mizmo> ohhhh too many revamp teams bwahaha
20:56:29 <riecatnor[m]1> ambassadors/outreach revamp :P)
20:56:37 * mizmo was referring to websites revamp
20:56:44 <riecatnor[m]1> oh, I know lololol
20:56:57 <mizmo> i like ideas #1 and #3. #2, not sure about
20:57:07 <mizmo> tbh #3 sounds super compelling
20:57:13 <riecatnor[m]1> I had a meeting with Mariana and Sumantro today- we discussed the discourse thread.
20:57:18 <mizmo> rn you have to dig up mattdm's latest state of fpo talk slides to get that data
20:57:57 <riecatnor[m]1> so, the concept behind 2 is what Mariana called a "link tree"
20:58:46 <riecatnor[m]1> it was the first time I heard of that, but it seemed useful.
20:58:54 <mizmo> like the current apps.fpo 😒
20:59:07 <mizmo> s/😒/😕 ?/
20:59:20 <JWF[m]> I wonder if fedoracommunity.org could point to the org chart
20:59:22 <mizmo> thats what i was envisioning
20:59:23 <riecatnor[m]1> this was her example: https://linktr.ee/GitLab
20:59:33 <AlbertoRodrguezS> Apps.fpo is cool
20:59:36 <JWF[m]> https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/orgchart/
20:59:51 <riecatnor[m]1> J.W.F. 🔕📴: one of the info graphics we want to include is the org chart!
20:59:53 <mizmo> im not a real fan of apps.fpo
21:00:01 <riecatnor[m]1> I like it in concept
21:00:17 <mizmo> i dont like how linktree appears to function either, it opens a new window, its hard to read
21:00:55 <mizmo> The org chart is very internal focused. But right now fedoracommunity.org is very external focused
21:01:03 <mizmo> So i think we need to figure out which way we want it oriented
21:01:06 <mattdm> apps.fpo is cool looking but not practical at all
21:01:07 <mizmo> to an end user the org chart is meaningless
21:01:29 <mizmo> its super important for contributors and a great map for them tho
21:01:30 <riecatnor[m]1> I think it should be focused towards into attracting contributors
21:01:41 <riecatnor[m]1> like, here is fedora, the places you can get involved
21:01:50 <JWF[m]> There was on-going work in the Websites & Apps Revamp to make an interactive org chart based from SVGs, but not sure what the timeline is for that
21:02:00 <mizmo> this feels like the perennial argument around fedora tho.... is the community ppl who use or people who contribute. the universe of ppl who use is much larger
21:02:16 <mizmo> or at least it should be o_O
21:02:31 <riecatnor[m]1> its a biggie, for sure :)
21:02:35 <mizmo> how does having an interactive org chart help anybody tho
21:02:59 <riecatnor[m]1> ok, we are fully over on time. I think we should revisit this!
21:03:13 <riecatnor[m]1> And please feel free to add to the discourse thread :)
21:03:29 <riecatnor[m]1> thank you for the lively discussion today, hope ya'll have a good rest of your day
21:03:33 <riecatnor[m]1> #endmeeting