13:59:38 <mchua> #startmeeting
13:59:39 <zodbot> Meeting started Tue Apr 27 13:59:38 2010 UTC.  The chair is mchua. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
13:59:40 <mchua> #meetingname spin pages
13:59:40 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
13:59:42 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'spin_pages'
14:00:05 <mchua> to recap: I'm trying to get the spin pages finished this week.
14:00:09 <mchua> So, the Security spin has a webpage already, so I'm going to shoot this to the websites and marketing lists, and the 3 spin owners, and say "any updates?" and consider that one done.
14:00:11 <gwerra> mchua: I am around if you need anything
14:00:16 * gwerra is here for a while
14:00:33 <mchua> gwerra: thanks! oh, you're one of the Security spin owners.
14:00:48 <gwerra> and from the websites team :)
14:00:50 <mchua> can you see if anything on http://spins.fedoraproject.org/security/ needs to be changed/fixed?
14:00:53 <mchua> gwerra: that too :)
14:01:02 <mchua> gwerra: let's make sure we take care of your spin first though.
14:01:06 * mchua looks at the talking point for security spin
14:01:09 <gwerra> Sure
14:01:30 <mchua> gwerra: actually, I'm confused - how did the security spin get listed as a new spin if it was a spin before? coming back from a hiatus? (that's what I *thought* happened, but not so sure)
14:01:54 <gwerra> mchua: there was only a .ks file before and no working spins
14:01:55 <gwerra> spin**
14:01:57 <mchua> Ahh, okay.
14:02:04 <gwerra> and its official with F13 release
14:02:15 <mchua> ...hm, the screenshots may not be... the most useful things ever.
14:02:35 <gwerra> screenshots were from a F12 respin taken around november
14:02:43 <gwerra> s/november/december
14:03:01 <gwerra> I am going to redo them soon
14:03:03 <mchua> gwerra: ok, maybe we should see if we can get better screenshots there, but... I mean, it looks pretty decent to me, I'm not sure what you folks are trying to do with the marketing for this
14:03:08 * mchua nods
14:03:25 <mchua> gwerra: also, is there another list/channel that should be on the support tab? it points to genericness right now.
14:03:27 <gwerra> mchua: get people/unis use this
14:03:50 <gwerra> instead of other distros
14:04:08 <gwerra> (e.g. backtrack, phrack, etc)
14:04:15 <mchua> Ok. I'm not super-familiar with this, but... is there a "Fedora Security" community we should make sure the webpage points to?
14:04:26 <mchua> if you folks secretly have a mailing list or channel or something that isn't #fedora, I mean.
14:04:29 <mchua> (which should be not-secret)
14:04:48 <gwerra> The mailing list is by the group name, we dont have a list right now IIRC
14:05:24 <gwerra> mchua: https://fedorahosted.org/security-spin/
14:07:06 <mchua> gwerra: is it active? do you want people there?
14:07:19 <gwerra> It is active
14:07:34 <gwerra> and yes we can have people there
14:07:44 <gwerra> we need people to complete the wishlist of packages too
14:07:50 <mchua> gwerra: okeydokey, that's an easy edit to make to the website then.
14:08:01 <mchua> gwerra: is that stuff on a webpage anywhere?
14:08:07 <gwerra> Sure, just mail the list with all of them and I'll do that
14:08:20 <gwerra> mchua: its on the fedorahosted trac
14:09:26 <gwerra> mchua: https://fedorahosted.org/security-spin/wiki/Wishlist
14:11:55 <mchua> gwerra: mail which list with all of what? (sorry, too many possible nouns there to choose from)
14:12:06 <mchua> mail security list with changes that need to be made to the site? or...
14:12:10 <mchua> (we can also just do that now)
14:12:29 <mchua> sdziallas: we can start hacking on the design/soas pages in parallel, which do you want to do first?
14:12:31 <gwerra> mchua: mail websites list with all changes to be made to spin websites
14:12:36 <mchua> sdziallas: or actually, want to finish moblin first?
14:12:39 <mchua> gwerra: ah, okay
14:13:09 <sdziallas> mchua: we can also take it one at a time, I'm fine with either :)
14:13:13 <gwerra> mchua: I am on a vacation not sure if I am going to have much time
14:13:25 <mchua> sdziallas: ok, moblin first? it's closest to done.
14:13:33 <sdziallas> mchua: deal!
14:13:47 <mchua> gwerra: dude, take your vacation! I'm glad to see you're taking /some/ rest for a change. :)
14:15:22 <sdziallas> mchua: so we've got the screenshot that needs to go out to the list, we need to get rid of that edu reference and we need banners and download locations.
14:15:25 * mchua hacks together security spin email
14:15:51 <mchua> sdziallas: okeydokey. do you have commit access to the web repo?
14:15:51 <sdziallas> mchua: I think pbrobinson might also have more comments, but we could get this in a more reasonable state and puhsh more changes afterwards.
14:15:56 <sdziallas> mchua: nope.
14:16:00 * mchua think she's a sponsor for that group
14:16:10 <mchua> sdziallas: ok, can you apply and I'll see if I can get you that?
14:16:19 * sdziallas rejoices :)
14:16:38 * mchua writing up the security spin to-do list in the background, will ping gwerra when it's out
14:17:54 <sdziallas> mchua: do you know if that's a git* group or just the web group?
14:18:19 <sdziallas> mchua: there's gitfedora-web and web. mhm.
14:18:52 <sdziallas> mchua: and yes, you're a sponsor. I suppose it's the gitfedora-web...
14:19:18 <sdziallas> mchua: applied. (should I subscribe to the websites list, too?)
14:19:26 <sdziallas> mchua: wait, lol.
14:19:39 <sdziallas> mchua: I've to be a member of web to apply to gitfedora-web.
14:21:23 * mchua scratches head.
14:21:25 <mchua> uh...
14:21:28 * mchua checks inbox
14:21:50 <sdziallas> mchua: hang on, taking this slowly.
14:22:00 <mchua> sdziallas: I *think* it's the web group that gives you access to the repo you need, or at least I think that's how it worked for me. lemme see if I can get you web first, and then if you need something else we'll go about getting that.
14:22:55 <sdziallas> mchua: okay!
14:23:09 <sdziallas> mchua: applied to web.
14:23:47 <mchua> oh, simon applied to web too
14:23:51 * mchua adds in itbegins, sdz
14:23:58 <mchua> i can't believe we didn't get itbegins access to that yet.
14:24:08 <mchua> .fasinfo sdz
14:24:09 <zodbot> mchua: User: sdz, Name: Sebastian Dziallas, email: sebastian@when.com, Creation: 2007-11-30, IRC Nick: sdziallas, Timezone: Europe/Berlin, Locale: en, Extension: 5102716, GPG key ID: C945DBD3, Status: active
14:24:13 <zodbot> mchua: Approved Groups: web provenpackager sysadmin-test hosted-content @giteducation cla_fedora cla_done ambassadors marketing gitspin-kickstarts packager fedorabugs gitliveusb-creator @alt-sugar
14:24:26 <sdziallas> cool!
14:24:40 <gwerra> mchua: you need to add gitweb or something
14:24:41 <sdziallas> now I wonder... if I can remove that education note.
14:24:42 <mchua> try pushing the s/edu/moblin edit and see if that works
14:24:46 <mchua> sdziallas: jinx.
14:24:54 <sdziallas> mchua: :)
14:24:57 <gwerra> .fasinfo hiemanshu
14:24:59 <zodbot> gwerra: User: hiemanshu, Name: Hiemanshu Sharma, email: hiemanshu@gmail.com, Creation: 2009-06-19, IRC Nick: gwerra, Timezone: Asia/Kolkata, Locale: en, Extension: 5132798, GPG key ID: 0x8278A7F2, Status: active
14:25:00 <mchua> .fasinfo mchua
14:25:03 <zodbot> gwerra: Unapproved Groups: designteam
14:25:09 <zodbot> gwerra: Approved Groups: +fedoraldc +gitidentigator gitfedora-web gitfedora-tour packager irc-support-operators @gitfedora-zikula-theme +gitfedora-insight-theme gitvirt_web ambassadors gitdorrie gitsecurity-spin marketing blogadmin fedorabugs sysadmin-web sysadmin sysadmin-test web cla_done cla_fedora
14:25:13 <zodbot> mchua: User: mchua, Name: Mel Chua, email: mel@redhat.com, Creation: 2008-09-26, IRC Nick: mchua, Timezone: US/Eastern, Locale: en, Extension: 5115368, GPG key ID: , Status: active
14:25:17 <zodbot> mchua: Unapproved Groups: gitspin-kickstarts
14:25:21 <zodbot> mchua: Approved Groups: +gitfedora-web bzrpython-fedora @fedoraldc @marketing +web fedorabugs packager @gitfedora-insight-theme @gitfedora-zikula sysadmin-test ambassadors designteam giteducation cla_fedora cla_done
14:25:34 <gwerra> mchua: gitfedora-web
14:25:35 <mchua> gwerra: ah, I suppose you're right
14:25:38 <sdziallas> mchua: meh, they still didn't approve you to gitspin-kickstarts?
14:25:48 <mchua> .sponsors gitfedora-web
14:25:49 <zodbot> mchua: Sponsors for gitfedora-web: mchua @nb @quaid @ricky @sijis
14:26:07 <mchua> ...oh. hm. lemme see if I can do that then.
14:26:15 <sdziallas> mchua: should I apply there, too?
14:27:16 <mchua> sdziallas: tell you what, let's do this right - shoot an email to the websites list saying "hi, I'm a spin owner, working on spin websites, getting access to push changes directly there"
14:27:16 * gwerra has to run now
14:27:20 <mchua> thanks gwerra!
14:27:30 <mchua> gwerra: will shoot the security todo off to the websites list in a bit
14:27:38 <sdziallas> mchua: okeydokey
14:27:42 <gwerra> mchua: please do, I ll do it or someone else will
14:27:48 <mchua> can do.
14:28:01 <mchua> gwerra: i'm less worried about the security spin 'cause there is /a/ webpage up and it's okay
14:28:07 <mchua> it's mostly "what can make this better"
14:28:58 <gwerra> mchua: if you need help with anything else also, just PM me or mail me, I ll look it up for you
14:29:05 <mchua> can do, thanks gwerra!
14:29:28 <sdziallas> mchua: I'd love to write that email, but I don't get any list application confirmation emails here, meh.
14:29:28 <mchua> .fasinfo sdz
14:29:34 <zodbot> mchua: User: sdz, Name: Sebastian Dziallas, email: sebastian@when.com, Creation: 2007-11-30, IRC Nick: sdziallas, Timezone: Europe/Berlin, Locale: en, Extension: 5102716, GPG key ID: C945DBD3, Status: active
14:29:38 <zodbot> mchua: Approved Groups: gitfedora-web web provenpackager sysadmin-test hosted-content @giteducation cla_fedora cla_done ambassadors marketing gitspin-kickstarts packager fedorabugs gitliveusb-creator @alt-sugar
14:29:50 <sdziallas> mchua: hey, I didn't even apply :P
14:30:10 <sdziallas> mchua: thank you! :)
14:30:33 <mchua> sdziallas: well, you're sending the email, so I figured blocking on that would be silly
14:31:03 * sdziallas grins. okay.
14:32:17 * sdziallas goes git cloning again, mutters about that list that doesn't let him subscribe (I'll send the email as soon as I get on that list).
14:32:25 * mchua can forward if that helps.
14:32:44 <sdziallas> ah, cool. will send you something in a second then.
14:33:17 * mchua swaps to the security spin, writing todo list
14:33:25 * mchua multitasking too much atm
14:41:25 <mchua> .fas cwickert
14:41:27 <zodbot> mchua: cwickert 'Christoph Wickert' <christoph.wickert@googlemail.com>
14:42:15 <mchua> sdziallas: got it, forwarded
14:42:32 <sdziallas> mchua: cool!
14:43:37 <sdziallas> thanks!
14:43:58 * sdziallas goes cropping and resizing the screenshot Peter got us and will get rid of the edu note, too.
14:50:39 <mchua> gwerra: email sent to websites with the most extensive todo list i could think of.
14:53:01 <mchua> sdziallas: oy - ok, before the allegheny students come in, where are we wrt design and soas spin pages?
14:53:26 * mchua chugs some more tea
14:53:50 <mchua> #info soas page needs content help, want to sync up allegheny student material with current spin page material
14:54:00 * rbergeron pokes in
14:54:02 <mchua> #info design page needs about section, think allegheny team *may* have material for that
14:54:06 <mchua> hey rbergeron!
14:54:42 <mchua> rbergeron: if you're around today (at the end after school drop-off, maybe?) can you take a look at the one-page release notes? I think we're 90% done
14:54:42 * sdziallas waves
14:54:50 <mchua> rbergeron: screenshots and design mostly now, iirc
14:55:13 <rbergeron> i can - i'm of course blocked while you guys are in class
14:55:13 * mchua is *very* pleased with how kowenh's feature profile interview on btrfs with josef turned out
14:55:16 * mchua nods
14:55:24 <rbergeron> but i can look at it when i get back
14:55:39 <mchua> rbergeron: ok - if you have a minute now to look at the current draft before you leave we can sprint on anything you think needs improvement while you're out
14:55:42 <mchua> rbergeron: (thank you!)
14:55:45 <rbergeron> suresure
14:56:17 <mchua> rbergeron: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/F13_one_page_release_notes#Draft_starts_here
14:56:21 * mchua cleans up that page
14:57:44 * mchua groans. okay, there's been more cleanup needed since i last looked at it
14:57:55 <mchua> but the cruft is out and it's starting to be formatted as the final one.
14:58:10 * mchua chunks in layout from last release as placeholder imagery
15:03:55 * mchua is going to fix one page release notes wiki page, then get back to spins (since I think we know where to point the students for soas and design spins atm)
15:04:18 <mchua> (if anyone asks, it's all on the list - emails from yesterday, marketing list.)
15:04:27 <mchua> (also the current content is on the spin wiki pages and they can edit that.)
15:04:30 <mchua> sdziallas: ^
15:08:14 <rbergeron> okay,
15:08:19 <rbergeron> i posted something
15:08:20 * rbergeron has to run
15:09:05 <mchua> thanks rbergeron!
15:09:10 * mchua still cleaning up one-pager
15:11:55 * rbergeron is off
15:12:07 <rbergeron> back in ... well, 45 minutes
15:12:08 <rbergeron> heh
15:29:58 <fedbot> Announcement: There's a Class coming up over in #fedora-classroom at 19:00 UTC. See https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Classroom or /join #fedora-classroom for more details. How to make life awesome for journalists - Joe Brockmeier
15:32:48 <mchua> thank you fedbot!
15:37:45 <EvilBob> mchua: You are welcome
15:41:54 <sdziallas> mchua: I'm going to commit in a second what I was supposed to commit an hour earlier.
15:46:14 <mchua> ok - update for folks looking for Allegheny people: this week is their last week of class to work on projects, and they're out filming video interviews about what they've done so far
15:46:28 <mchua> they also have a reflection paper that we'll be getting which should provide a lot of insight on what the new contrib experience is like
15:46:32 <mchua> so a lot of them are off doing that today
15:46:49 <mchua> but they have been encouraged to hit the lists and tell us how they're winding down their projects
15:47:10 * mchua hopes this is accurate, will send to mktg list and ask jadum and DarrenMiller to correct if needed
15:47:36 <mchua> so after class today I'll be looking at the status of each team's project and seeing what we know and what we've seen from the Fedora side of what they've done
15:48:02 <mchua> and then we can go from there (They might go "oh, we did more, here is where you haven't found it yet" or someone else in Fedora might go "oh, Mel, you totally missed X")
15:48:09 <mchua> and thursday is our chance to wind down with 'em
15:48:23 <mchua> and then... well, we'll have the release
15:48:50 <mchua> But after that we'll be sure to do a debrief about how the class experience went, and how we can do better next time.
15:48:55 * mchua is, overall, very pleased
15:48:57 <mchua> (and barely keeping up)
15:49:00 * mchua --> deliverables!
15:51:21 <mchua> sdziallas: sijis says to make sure the website changes get pushed to the master branch.
15:51:23 <sdziallas> so I just pushed the commit, can't see it, yet, though.
15:51:34 <sdziallas> mchua: yup, just pushed that there :)
15:51:34 <mchua> sdziallas: he also said websites tend to get updated 10 minutes after the hour
15:51:38 <mchua> so we may need to wait some
15:51:48 <sdziallas> mchua: yeah, but I also can't see it yet in the git repo
15:51:57 * mchua scratches head
15:51:58 <mchua> um...
15:51:59 <sdziallas> mchua: but... good to know :) (and incentive to get more done)
15:52:08 <sdziallas> maybe it take a minute to get propagated
15:52:12 <mchua> maybe?
15:52:16 <sdziallas> there it is.
15:52:19 <mchua> oh good.
15:52:30 * mchua still running on one-page release notes, will be back with spins webpages in a bit
15:52:32 <sdziallas> http://git.fedorahosted.org/git/?p=fedora-web.git;a=commit
15:52:41 <sdziallas> mchua: okay... :)
15:53:35 * mchua sets a 2-song timer on one page release notes
15:53:45 <mchua> I'll be back after two tracks on this CD.
15:53:51 * sdziallas grins. cool!
16:04:09 <mchua> ha! music done, exactly the same time I hit 'save'
16:04:16 <mchua> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/F13_one_page_release_notes
16:04:39 * mchua emails the list
16:04:40 <sdziallas> whoa!
16:04:43 <mchua> sdziallas: and then I'll be right with you on spins
16:05:08 <sdziallas> mchua: no rush :) (I just looked at the SoaS spin page, whoa)
16:07:13 <mchua> oh, is it up?
16:07:22 <sdziallas> mchua: no no, the wiki...
16:07:28 <mchua> oh.
16:07:30 * mchua looks there
16:07:32 <sdziallas> mchua: which is already impressive enough.
16:07:37 <sdziallas> with all the content there :)
16:08:03 <sdziallas> I hadn't noticed you had put that before.
16:08:16 * mchua winces at the content on the spins page section for soas, but... it's nonempty, at least
16:08:22 <mchua> hey threethirty!
16:08:30 <sdziallas> mchua: wait, it's cool, isn't it?
16:08:39 <mchua> threethirty: how're you doing? I know life has been crazy for you lately
16:09:14 <mchua> sdziallas: at this point I'm just trying to get all 4 (well, 2.5 remaining) spins pages to exist, so...
16:09:33 <sdziallas> mchua: yeah, gotcha. but I felt that content there was pretty impressive.
16:09:55 <threethirty> mchua: doing a lot better, my hearing is still fracked up (damn ear infection) but I'm mostly back :)
16:09:58 <mchua> okay. anyhow, dunno how much time you have today, but soas seems the most challenging of the 3 remaining after security (which is being taken care of, yay)
16:10:03 <mchua> moblin is the closest to dones
16:10:08 <mchua> er, done
16:10:23 <mchua> so I was thinking we could try to finish moblin, and get up design (even if it's not quite finished)
16:10:43 <mchua> and do soas on thursday; I'll try to check in with the allegheny team between now and then
16:10:49 <sdziallas> okay...
16:10:50 <mchua> sdziallas: thoughts ^ ?
16:11:10 <sdziallas> mchua: I'm game
16:11:10 <mchua> sdziallas: counterproposals welcome, btw :)
16:11:31 <sdziallas> mchua: no no, sounds good.
16:11:48 <mchua> ok. let's see how far we can get on moblin in... say... 45m.
16:12:01 * mchua needs to, at some point, pause and email the allegheny class.
16:12:02 <sdziallas> mchua: should I ask if Peter wants to join us?
16:12:11 <sdziallas> (he might be at work)
16:12:18 <mchua> sdziallas: yes, definitely - I was looking for him on IRC but didn't find him
16:12:25 <sdziallas> jabber ;)
16:12:35 <mchua> or at least he's marked as away
16:12:36 <mchua> ah.
16:12:51 * sdziallas looks.
16:13:54 <sdziallas> can't reach him there right now, either.
16:15:07 <mchua> no worries
16:15:14 * mchua taking stock of moblin page status
16:15:31 <sdziallas> okay, so the rebuilt page is up.
16:16:37 <sdziallas> mhm, we still need the banners, too (for all three)
16:16:52 * mchua looks, winces at image sizing
16:17:03 <mchua> sdziallas: the image is up there, but it's... formatted... oddly
16:17:09 <mchua> both on the page and when you "click to see more"
16:17:21 <sdziallas> mchua: well, we need a small one there, apparently.
16:17:45 <mchua> ouch, and the tabs are off. /me writing up to-do list for moblin spin in the background
16:17:47 <sdziallas> mchua: so I cropped the main one to fit on the page (I dunno if that's necessary, but they did that for the edu one back then, too).
16:18:03 <sdziallas> mchua: the tabs are off because we don't have the download location, yet, iirc.
16:18:29 <sdziallas> mchua: the screenshot peter got me is too large, though, which is why there's this strange overlap when you click on "see more".
16:19:03 <sdziallas> maybe it'd make sense to exchange the images and put the one that's currently on "click more" on the main page and have the smaller one there when you click on it (hence, the text wouldn't be in the image)
16:20:25 * sdziallas wonders whether that makes sense and whether he's rambling too much :D
16:22:20 <mchua> sdziallas: that makes sense
16:22:31 <mchua> sdziallas: I just made a list of everything that needs to be done for moblin and shot it to mktg/websites/peter
16:22:36 <sdziallas> okay :)
16:22:48 <sdziallas> mchua: so I'll go and exchange the images already now, okay?
16:23:04 * sdziallas was also finally able to subscribe to websites
16:23:14 <mchua> sdziallas: go for it, I'm going to check out the git repo and see if I can fix the css.
16:23:22 <sdziallas> mchua: which one?
16:23:43 <mchua> the "support" tab is dropped below the other tabs.
16:24:04 <sdziallas> mchua: I thought that was because of the obfuscated download section.
16:24:47 * rbergeron tries to figure out when 1900 UTC is. my brain hurts
16:24:54 <rbergeron> mktg meeting is 2000 UTC right?
16:27:06 <mchua> rbergeron: yes.
16:27:36 <mchua> sdziallas: is it? /me fixing git/make instructions in spins page sop right now
16:27:50 * mchua takes a long time to do stuff the first time on account of documentation habit
16:27:57 <mchua> actually, i should not do that now, and just get this done first
16:27:58 <mchua> then doc
16:28:03 <sdziallas> mchua: I thought somebody posted about that, but I might be wrong.
16:28:07 <sdziallas> mchua: it's cool :)
16:28:28 * mchua downloading and building current website now
16:29:05 <sdziallas> mchua: I think I'm not going to let my laptop do that ;)
16:29:08 <sdziallas> (pushed.)
16:29:34 * mchua wonders if this process takes way too long for most webdesigners to do. i mean, git checkout? make?
16:30:08 * mchua still building. mrhgnfh. okay, another blocker in the meantime... oh, I can fix the 'about' text
16:30:14 <sdziallas> mchua: mhm... I'd feel it's practical, but... I'm no webdesigner :)
16:31:00 * mchua rebalances https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Moblin_Spin#Spin_description and https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Moblin_Spin#About
16:31:11 * sdziallas looks.
16:31:16 * mchua is not a web designer either. we should ask some of them someday
16:31:25 <mchua> sdziallas: oh I haven't done it yet, I'm just starting now
16:31:37 <sdziallas> mchua: ayup!
16:31:49 <sdziallas> mchua: if anything, I can push that change, if you want
16:32:02 <sdziallas> (then, I mean)
16:34:20 * mchua tries to figure out what the hell clutter, gupnp, and mojito do
16:35:37 <mchua> and what good links to them are
16:36:51 <sdziallas> "dear internet, please stop disconnecting me. thank you."
16:37:01 <sdziallas> mchua: wouldn't this be good questions for Peter?
16:37:44 <sdziallas> (I know that clutter is some toolkit behind it using opengl or something, but oh well.)
16:37:55 <sdziallas> (I guess he could answer these much faster than either of us will.
16:38:02 <sdziallas> )
16:40:44 <mchua> actually I think I got it, one sec
16:41:15 <mchua> sdziallas: hm, it seems like the moblin spin is aimed towards mobile... developers?
16:41:20 * mchua looking at the packages included now
16:42:13 <sdziallas> mchua: I'm not exactly sure, I mean it includes Moblin, sure... but... mhm.
16:42:34 <sdziallas> mchua: I'll argue again that this is something Peter will know for sure.
16:42:38 <threethirty> shouldnt it be aimed at "normies with netbooks"
16:43:48 <sdziallas> mchua: where does it say developers?
16:45:32 <mchua> sdziallas: it doesn't, but look at the packages included
16:45:40 <mchua> sdziallas: hang on, I'll save my work in progress and you'll see why I'm saying that
16:46:09 <mchua> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Moblin_Spin#Spin_description
16:46:36 * sdziallas looks.
16:47:06 <mchua> great, moblin renamed mojito
16:47:11 <mchua> http://moblin.org/projects/libsocialweb
16:47:13 <sdziallas> mchua: I'm not sure. as far as I know, Moblin itself is based on Clutter.
16:47:20 * mchua groans, takes out that bullet point
16:47:26 * mchua hunts through .ks file for a third thing to highlight
16:48:03 * sdziallas looks, too.
16:49:07 <sdziallas> mchua: I don't know, but might it make sense to argue with the features of Moblin itself, like web 2.0 account integration and connection to people / friends.
16:49:16 <sdziallas> actually, s/./? :)
16:49:39 <mchua> hm, yeah.
16:50:02 <mchua> (spins.fp.o now building locally on my machine, will be able to push changes Real Soon Now)
16:50:09 <sdziallas> mchua: whoa, cool!
17:00:40 <fedbot> Announcement: There's a Class coming up over in #fedora-classroom at 19:00 UTC. See https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Classroom or /join #fedora-classroom for more details. How to make life awesome for journalists - Joe Brockmeier
17:03:45 <wonderer> fedbot works, cool!
17:04:55 * mchua posts https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Moblin_Spin#Spin_description and thinks about what to split out into the "about" section
17:05:07 <threethirty> fedbot is so waesome
17:05:20 <mchua> threethirty: also, you can ask your questions in here :)
17:05:56 <wonderer> the only thing is that fedbot should wake me up at the right GMT time here ;-)
17:06:22 <mchua> there we go, that's a simple split. The result is an integrated software experience suitable for use on multiple platforms, including netbooks, nettops, mobile internet devices, and embedded usage models such as vehicle infotainment systems.
17:06:27 <mchua> Try the future of the mobile internet today. '''Learn more.'''
17:06:28 <mchua> er, paste FAIL
17:06:31 <mchua> whoops.
17:06:35 <mchua> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Moblin_Spin#Spin_description
17:06:40 <mchua> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Moblin_Spin#About
17:06:46 <threethirty> mchua: lol didnt want to derail the work on the moblin page :)
17:06:57 <mchua> now, did my build finish?
17:07:01 <mchua> threethirty: nah, ask away :)
17:07:13 <mchua> threethirty: i'm trying to understand what you're trying to do
17:07:33 * mchua takes a break from spin stuff
17:07:40 <mchua> #topic howto use the Fedora Marketing Trac queue
17:07:46 <mchua> #link https://fedorahosted.org/marketing-team/report/1
17:07:51 <mchua> threethirty: so, tickets are listed there
17:08:07 <mchua> threethirty: the ticket queue may not be 100% up to date in terms of being an accurate description of what mktg needs done at any point in time
17:08:15 <mchua> threethirty: it should be :) I do a poor job of maintenance
17:08:18 <mchua> rbergeron is a lot better
17:08:41 <mchua> #info the ticket queue is supposed to be an accurate description of what mktg needs done at any point in time
17:08:57 <nmarques> 'lo
17:09:03 <mchua> #info our ticket queue is based on Trac, an open source python-based ticket tracker
17:09:11 <mchua> hey nmarques! explaining trac to threethirty here.
17:09:26 <mchua> #info you can log into our Trac instance - there's a login link at the top right - using your FAS credentials
17:09:37 <mchua> #info clicking on a ticket gives you more details about that ticket
17:10:01 <mchua> #info let's look at an example, ticket #11.
17:10:06 <mchua> #link https://fedorahosted.org/marketing-team/ticket/11
17:10:51 <mchua> ok, so there are some fields in the ticket that we can explain here
17:11:00 <mchua> threethirty: (is this the sort of stuff you were wondering about?)
17:11:11 * nmarques loves the fedorahosted icon, reminds me of Blackwater USA
17:11:32 <mchua> #info We'll explain the various "fields" in a ticket now
17:11:47 <fedbot> Announcement: There's a Class coming up over in #fedora-classroom at 19:00 UTC. See https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Classroom or /join #fedora-classroom for more details. How to make life awesome for journalists - Joe Brockmeier
17:12:02 <mchua> #info Reported by - who created the ticket? (usually the person who requested the task/found the problem or bug that needs to be fixed)
17:12:11 * ke4qqq is amazed at the fedbot carpet bombing :)
17:12:12 <mchua> #info Priority - how important is this? (major, minor, etc)
17:12:24 <mchua> ke4qqq: I guess someone *really* wants people to go to Zonker's talk :)
17:12:24 <sdziallas> ke4qqq: LOL :)
17:12:27 <Southern_Gentlem> sorry
17:12:58 <mchua> #info Component - what is the ticket about? is it a release deliverable, part of a project (limesurvey, fedora insight, etc)?
17:13:19 <mchua> #info Keywords - we don't really use this except to mark things as meeting topics, so you can ignore this for now
17:13:40 <mchua> #info Assigned to - who is working on this ticket? You can assign a ticket to yourself if you want to take on a task, we'll cover this in a moment.
17:13:49 <mchua> #info Milestone - when does this task need to be completed by?
17:14:26 <mchua> #info Severity - how quickly does this taks need to be completed? (which is different from "priority" - things can be important but not urgent, or urgent but not important. this is the "urgent" part.)
17:14:56 <mchua> #info Cc - who is watching this ticket? these are the people who are interested in the ticket but are not working on it themselves, they will get notifications when anything about the ticket changes.
17:15:09 <mchua> #info Description - the actual task that needs to get done.
17:15:24 <mchua> #info And then below that is the conversation - comments on the ticket, which may be further clarification of the task, or notes about what people are doing to work on it.
17:17:17 <mchua> #info and then below that is the interface you can use to make changes to the ticket. we'll go through three kinds you may want to make if you're working on a ticket: (1) taking it, (2) commenting on it, and (3) closing it
17:18:03 <wonderer> additional info: keywords will be interrestig for inexing and rapid searchable database things. If you search e.g. for some Ticket over the whole Trac Instance about the Keyword "SSSD" there should be results for FWN, Development, MKTG, etc. So we do not use that much, but it "can" be interresting.
17:18:43 <mchua> #info: To take a ticket - meaning to say "yes, I will work on this!" - go to the "action" section at the bottom and either click "accept ticket" (if nobody is working on it yet) or "reassign to:" and then select your username (if you want to take over a task from its existing owner - it's good etiquette to ask first though!) - and then click "Submit Changes."
17:19:10 <mchua> #info If you just want to watch a ticket but don't want to work on it yet, type your name in the "Cc:" box at the bottom of the ticket (right above the "Action" section) and click "Submit changes."
17:19:53 <threethirty> ahh thats cool
17:19:58 <mchua> #info Now, you're either watching a ticket (Cc) or working on it (accepted/reassigned). As you go along, you should keep others updated on your progress. To do that, type your notes in the comment box and then click "Submit changes."
17:20:15 <mchua> #info for instance, "I wrote half the text the ticket said was needed, and uploaded it to <LINK!> but didn't finish the rest yet."
17:21:15 <mchua> #info Finally, when a ticket is complete - when you think the work is done - you comment one last time with a link/pointer to the finished work, and then in the "action" section, click "resolved as:" and select "fixed", then click "Submit changes" and you're done.
17:21:36 <mchua> #info It's also good to email the Marketing list if you've closed a ticket so we know about the work you just completed. ;)
17:21:43 <mchua> threethirty: I think that's it, actually... thoughts/questions?
17:21:45 <mchua> oh!
17:22:02 <mchua> #info If you have a task you'd like to see someone on the Marketing team do, you should make a ticket and add it to the queue!
17:22:21 <mchua> #info log into the Trac instance, and then click the "new ticket" link in the top right hand corner.
17:22:25 <mchua> #link https://fedorahosted.org/marketing-team/newticket
17:22:49 <mchua> #info You'll be able to describe the task you'd like completed - more information/details is better, so that whoever starts on this can actually just launch in without having to ask a lot of questions.
17:23:30 <mchua> #info remember to click "submit ticket" to actually create the ticket - and emailing the Marketing list with the link to your ticket and a summary asking for help is a good idea, as is asking around the #fedora-mktg IRC channel if anyone can take the ticket
17:23:46 <mchua> #note it may be a good idea to set up automatic emailing of ticket opening/closing from this queue to the mktg list.
17:23:59 <mchua> Honestly, I don't know how well a ticket queue works for a Marketing team workflow
17:24:13 <nmarques> mchua, should work fine
17:24:27 <nmarques> mchua, the problem is that marketing people usually are not much into the bug reporting tools stuff
17:24:44 <nmarques> mchua, but the concept should actually apply and be as good as for developing
17:24:47 <nmarques> mchua, imo
17:24:57 <threethirty> mchua: i think i understand it now
17:25:00 <mchua> nmarques: trac is one of the most user friendly bugtrackers I've ever used, but that's like saying "fire torches are the least difficult flaming object to learn to juggle"
17:25:15 <mchua> nmarques: so yeah, I agree... how can we make this easier for marketers who aren't necessarily from the tech world?
17:25:18 <mchua> as a workflow?
17:25:22 <rbergeron> i really don't think it's all that terrible
17:25:23 <mchua> threethirty: okeydokey. find a ticket you like? :)
17:25:25 <wonderer> mchua: with ticketing its the same as with all others - you have to use it then you knew ;-)
17:25:28 <nmarques> mchua, want my opinion ?
17:25:36 <mchua> nmarques: yes please.
17:25:40 <mchua> wonderer: true :)
17:25:43 <rbergeron> it's a nice way to slide marketers into the tech world :)
17:25:51 <nmarques> mchua, pretend and adress to them as if they were educated in the penal system :)
17:26:07 <nmarques> mchua, no techie slang, just focus on procedure and benefits of it
17:26:09 * mchua scratches head
17:26:11 <mchua> nmarques: not sure what that means
17:26:20 <rbergeron> it's a trouble ticket
17:26:22 <mchua> rbergeron: agreed. :) I wonder how they'd redesign the interface though.
17:26:39 <threethirty> mchua: not yet... but i do know where and what im doing :)
17:26:43 <rbergeron> everyone has had a trouble ticket at some point or another
17:26:47 <nmarques> mchua, it's a interface for a roadmap ;)
17:27:11 <rbergeron> nmarques - not necessarily, some people use it that way, but not everyone
17:27:11 <mchua> threethirty: yay!
17:27:19 <mchua> threethirty: thanks, I think we needed this tutorial out at some point :)
17:27:24 <mchua> threethirty: aaaactually! I have something you could do
17:27:29 <mchua> threethirty: I will make it a ticket in fact :)
17:27:31 <mchua> one second
17:27:33 * rbergeron knows what's coming next :)
17:27:40 <wonderer> For an integrated workflow we should probably have something like a Trac instance combined with a etherpad thing combined with fedoratalk combined with gobby combined with git combined with IRC (with several bots) combined with a CMS with PDF and prepress ready made convertions.
17:27:47 <nmarques> mchua, the problem, not only marketeers, is that many don't know this tools
17:27:56 <wonderer> THAT would be my wich for the next Century ;-)
17:28:02 <threethirty> rbergeron: i hope its hassel you about cookie devilery
17:28:14 <nmarques> mchua, u did fine, even I got to learn something ;)
17:28:43 <nmarques> mchua, most problem is that people usually get a whole different tool set from school
17:28:48 <threethirty> wonderer: you should be kicked for even bringing all that up :)
17:29:04 <nmarques> mchua, and old habits die hard :(
17:29:06 <wonderer> threethirty: I only summarize ;-)
17:29:43 <mchua> In order to do that, I need to end this meeting... one moment...
17:29:47 <mchua> rbergeron: oh do you? ;)
17:29:50 <mchua> #endmeeting