16:16:26 <x3mboy> #startmeeting Fedora Marketing Team
16:16:26 <zodbot> Meeting started Thu Jun 27 16:16:26 2019 UTC.
16:16:26 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
16:16:26 <zodbot> The chair is x3mboy. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
16:16:26 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
16:16:26 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fedora_marketing_team'
16:16:50 <tg-fedmktg> <b​t0dotninja> Hi
16:16:56 <x3mboy> #meetingname marketing
16:16:56 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'marketing'
16:17:24 <x3mboy> #topic Marketing team re-build
16:18:30 <x3mboy> zodbot, Why are you so slow today
16:18:34 <x3mboy> Ok, let's move on
16:18:46 <x3mboy> bcotton, any thought since the last meeting?
16:19:06 <bcotton> not particularly
16:19:10 <x3mboy> #link https://pagure.io/fedora-marketing/issue/292
16:19:29 <x3mboy> @bt0dotninja?
16:19:39 <tg-fedmktg> <b​t0dotninja> It's fine
16:19:56 <bcotton> i think some of our problem is a symptom of a larger mindshare problem, in that we don't really know what kind of parameters we're supposed to operate under
16:19:57 <tg-fedmktg> <b​t0dotninja> Go ahead
16:20:35 <x3mboy> Well, actually I started in Mindshare to talk about our issue
16:23:38 <x3mboy> #link https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/teams/mindshare/mindshare.2019-04-24-17.31.log.html
16:26:25 <bcotton> i'm going to be provocative for a moment: does it make sense for marketing to exist as a distinct team, or can the functions that we are/should be doing live within another team
16:27:13 <x3mboy> Well, it makes sense for a couple of reasons: coordination
16:27:28 <tg-fedmktg> <b​t0dotninja> (sinister music)
16:28:21 <x3mboy> Podcast could be done by anyone, the infographics could be requested by anyone. But by being part of a "team" that manage and coordinate efforts in the same direction makes more sense that a lot of people asking for random stuff
16:28:32 <x3mboy> And that's what I think is marketing for
16:28:44 <x3mboy> To coordinate efforts in just one direction
16:28:52 <x3mboy> Maybe I'm horribly wrong
16:28:59 <x3mboy> dunno
16:29:56 <bcotton> no, you're not wrong
16:30:15 <bcotton> but in the context of the amount of time we have available to work on it
16:30:33 <x3mboy> Well, I have more time to devote to it now
16:30:51 <bcotton> there's overhead in having a distinct team. for example, coming up with a mission/vision. if it's not a distinct team, you don't have that overhead
16:30:54 <x3mboy> But I feel like in the times where I wasn't available, no work was make
16:31:03 <bcotton> you feel correctly :-)
16:31:16 <x3mboy> made*
16:31:37 <bcotton> there's a point where you have enough people doing different enough work that a separate team makes sense. i'm not sure where the dividing line is on that spectrum
16:31:53 <x3mboy> But also I think that people can't come and help to something that haven't anything to do, or a direction to take
16:32:14 <x3mboy> s/to/with/g
16:32:54 <x3mboy> Ok, so maybe we can just pause the Marketing team, and try to encourage people to do things and when we have enough people, retake the order?
16:33:03 <x3mboy> That doesn's sound good
16:33:30 <tg-fedmktg> <b​t0dotninja> Sounds a little drastic
16:34:05 <bcotton> as opposed to having a team that's not getting anything done, by our own admission?
16:34:26 <bcotton> i'm not necessarily advocating it, but it's an assumption that we should question
16:34:40 <x3mboy> Well, I still think that we can do something
16:34:43 <tg-fedmktg> <b​t0dotninja> It's a fair point
16:35:09 <x3mboy> My idea of having a M&V is to have a bullet list of task that we can ask the community to make
16:35:55 <x3mboy> e.g.: We want to promote the Editions: Ask people, hey what if you make a screencast of what you do with your desktop and we can promote it in our YT channel
16:36:16 <tg-fedmktg> <b​t0dotninja> Exactly,  we need that list
16:36:53 <tg-fedmktg> <b​t0dotninja> This can show us in an obvious way if our activities can be done outside of the team
16:37:02 <x3mboy> I know we don't need the M$V for that, but without direction we will finish asking people to send us anything that is Fedora related, and we can finish with a bunch of hats in our mailboxes
16:37:20 <bcotton> i like hats
16:37:22 <bcotton> ;-)
16:37:25 <x3mboy> Me too
16:37:31 <x3mboy> xD
16:38:27 <x3mboy> I mean, for the commintary structure we have, we don't function as a normal company's marketing department
16:40:12 <x3mboy> So, maybe it's not that bad to be in the botton right quadrant
16:40:23 <bcotton> so maybe we just need to reframe the question a bit: it's not what the marketing team should be doing, its what marketing activities shoudl be happening, regardless of where they're done
16:40:24 <x3mboy> But if we belong there, then we need to do it really well
16:41:52 <x3mboy> bcotton, that's a fair point
16:42:17 <x3mboy> So, what activities should be happening
16:44:10 <bcotton> oh... well that's the hard part
16:45:33 <bcotton> what does mindshare want the marketing team to do? what does council want mindshare to do?
16:46:28 <x3mboy> Let's thinking in another way: a new logo is coming: What should we do, as mktg, to promote the new image and make people to recognize the project when they see the new logo?
16:47:46 <x3mboy> Well, I don't have any answer for any of those questions
16:48:17 <bcotton> right, but without answers to those questions, we're just grasping around in the dark
16:48:32 <bcotton> (and for what it's worth, i don't think anyone can answer those questions, which is a different problem)
16:49:18 <bcotton> to use an american expression: we're putting the cart before the horse
16:53:23 <tg-fedmktg> <b​t0dotninja> Yeah
16:53:36 <bcotton> i worry i'm going from putting on the brakes to slow down to just being a source of stop energy. i don't mean to stand in the way
16:54:01 <x3mboy> You're not actually
16:54:02 <tg-fedmktg> <b​t0dotninja> We need split those problems in more little problems
16:54:12 <x3mboy> I'm thinking exactly in that
16:56:40 <tg-fedmktg> <b​t0dotninja> The bigger it's in IMOO the lack of man power
17:03:43 <bcotton> which came first, the chicken or the egg?
17:04:56 <x3mboy> A dinosaur probably
17:05:30 <tg-fedmktg> <b​t0dotninja> The chicken
17:06:27 <x3mboy> So, let's finish the idea to close this
17:07:11 <x3mboy> Can we come up with a list of little deliverables that we can ask people to act on?
17:07:27 <tg-fedmktg> <b​t0dotninja> Yes
17:07:52 <x3mboy> The direction is clear to me: Editions, objectives and Fedora's mission
17:10:09 <x3mboy> Those are the products to sell
17:12:42 <tg-fedmktg> <b​t0dotninja> Right
17:13:16 <x3mboy> I will think of something and will update the ticket
17:13:21 <x3mboy> See you guys
17:13:28 <x3mboy> Thanks for your comments
17:13:35 <x3mboy> #endmeeting