19:00:33 <kussmaul> #startmeeting POSSE Meeting 2 19:00:33 <zodbot> Meeting started Fri Dec 7 19:00:33 2018 UTC. 19:00:33 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location. 19:00:33 <zodbot> The chair is kussmaul. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 19:00:33 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 19:00:33 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'posse_meeting_2' 19:00:50 <kussmaul> #chair Heidiellis kussmaul lorip 19:00:50 <zodbot> Current chairs: Heidiellis kussmaul lorip 19:01:16 <kussmaul> Any thoughts or questions while we wait? 19:01:34 <kussmaul> spersinger: I think you are the only POSSE participant at the moment :-) 19:01:43 <spersinger> Oh 19:01:51 <kussmaul> no pressure :-) 19:02:17 <spersinger> My thoughts - the end of the semester is busy even for me. I'm only teaching one course. 19:02:57 <kussmaul> I'm taking a leave of absence this year, so I'm not teaching any class, and I'm busy too 19:03:10 <kussmaul> lorip: welcome! 19:03:20 <lorip> Hi, sorry I'm late - just bailed out of a meeting 19:03:33 <kussmaul> cmerlo: welcome! 19:03:38 <cmerlo> Hi everyone. I’m in the end stage of a meeting, and I’ll be joining you for real in about 10 minutes 19:05:38 <kussmaul> Well, let's start with the people we have, and others can join late. 19:06:02 <kussmaul> #link http://foss2serve.org/index.php/IRC_Meeting_2 is the agenda for today 19:06:12 <kussmaul> #topic role call 19:06:34 <kussmaul> We'll start with a roll call - reply with #info followed by your info, like this: 19:06:50 <kussmaul> #info Clif Kussmaul, Muhlenberg College, POSSE organizing team, POGIL fanatic :-) 19:07:12 <lorip> #info Lori Postner, Nassau Community College, I'm one of the POSSE organizers 19:07:33 <cmerlo> #info Chris Merlo, Nassau CC, POSSE rookie 19:07:50 <kussmaul> spersinger: your turn? 19:07:54 <spersinger> #info Sharon Persinger, Bronx Community College, another POSSE rookie 19:08:05 <kussmaul> great! 19:08:25 <kussmaul> #topic Updates and Questions on POSSE stage 1 activities 19:08:25 <kussmaul> #link http://foss2serve.org/index.php/Stage_1_Activities has the overview of Stage 1 19:08:25 <kussmaul> How are the stage 1 activities going? 19:08:57 <kussmaul> (remember to log your comments in the Google spreadsheet) 19:09:14 <lorip> #link https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1HvgclSLZE4f1fDrw9S7ywP6MrMsAaWjWXATQ3W7H3Wg/edit#gid=0 19:09:35 <cmerlo> I was telling Lori that doing the reading has been very inspiring, and I’m ready to dive in! 19:10:20 <kussmaul> what about the other Stage 1 activities? 19:10:22 <spersinger> I've logged most of Part A. Need to read the FOSS anatomy again. 19:11:07 <kussmaul> spersinger: thank you for alphabetizing the list of participants 19:11:23 <cmerlo> I’m a little behind, and I have some catch up to do - plus we have a developmental math training all weekend 19:11:24 <lorip> I know this is a tough time of year - are people's terms almost over? 19:11:26 <spersinger> copy editor for other things 19:11:59 <spersinger> I have one more week of classes, then exam on 12/19 19:12:12 <kussmaul> many FOSS projects needs that sort of editing/cleanup for wikis, docs, & code - sometimes this is called "gardening" - which can be an easy way to get started, even for non-developers 19:12:23 <cmerlo> But I’ve also been a FOSS user for a long time, and so I hope I can catch up fairly quickly 19:12:27 <lorip> that sounds like us, so you are probably in crunch time at the moment 19:13:07 <kussmaul> any other comments or questions about stage 1 activities? going once, going twice... 19:13:52 <lorip> hopefully once grades are in you'll have time to dig into the remaining activities 19:14:08 <kussmaul> #topic Courses in which you plan to use HFOSS 19:14:08 <kussmaul> Have you thought about the course(s) where you might try HFOSS activities? 19:14:49 <cmerlo> A little. We’re sort of constrained by SUNY with how much we can do, so we have to be creative 19:15:01 <kussmaul> creative is good! 19:15:20 <spersinger> A bit. Maybe our Course 2 which is OOP in Python. We are constrained too by departmental syllabus. 19:15:28 <cmerlo> Meeting is over! I’m walking across campus, and will rejoin in 5-10 minutes 19:15:51 <lorip> spersinger: how much does CUNY dictate what needs to be taught from a transfer perspective? 19:16:40 <spersinger> I'm not toally sure. We used to negotiate articulation agreements with specific colleges. 19:16:57 <kussmaul> people often think of Software Engineering as an obvious place for students to participate in FOSS, but we've been trying to come up with ideas and activities for things that could fit in other courses, especially intro or non-major courses 19:17:07 <spersinger> Then CUNY did this Pathways project which undid all those agreements. 19:17:50 <lorip> Is there a CS Pathway? We have a SUNY CS Transfer Path that we must follow (which Chris alluded to). 19:17:52 <kussmaul> how specific is the dept syllabus? how much flexiblity do you have? 19:19:00 <spersinger> Dept syllabus is pretty specific about general concepts but flexible in terms of projects. 19:19:52 <kussmaul> so it might be helpful to have labs/assignments/projects that use HFOSS to address concepts in the course? 19:20:10 <spersinger> yes, that would be good. 19:20:35 <kussmaul> e.g. looking at how control structures, data structures, etc are used in HFOSS, not just in short textbook examples? 19:21:43 <spersinger> for my course I'd like to look at objects, in context of some overall project 19:21:45 <kussmaul> we've also talked about finding or creating HFOSS projects designed to work well in CS1/CS2 19:22:26 <kussmaul> exactly 19:23:19 <kussmaul> any other thoughts or questions about HFOSS in courses? The face-to-face workshop has several sessions intended to help you think more about these issues 19:23:30 <kussmaul> speaking of which... 19:24:18 <kussmaul> #topic Questions about POSSE Stage 2 Activities 19:24:19 <kussmaul> We have a draft agenda for Stage 2. It will be updated, but it gives you a sense of what will happen. 19:24:19 <kussmaul> #link http://foss2serve.org/index.php/Stage_2_Activities for the Stage 2 draft agenda 19:24:19 <kussmaul> Any questions about the face-to-face workshop? 19:26:23 <kussmaul> cmerlo: welcome back! Have you thought about which course(s) you might add HFOSS activities into? 19:26:40 <kussmaul> or any questions about the face-to-face workshop in January? 19:27:10 <cmerlo> I have. My first thought was to add an elective at the end of the second year on C, FOSS, etc., but I don’t know if SUNY will let us or if it will transfer 19:27:36 <cmerlo> So like I said before, then we have to get creative 19:27:41 <kussmaul> lorip & spersinger were talking about these issues while you were away 19:27:42 <lorip> we are still working on the agenda for Jan, so we don't have an exact schedule yet... 19:27:45 <cmerlo> We only get our students for four semesters 19:28:06 * lorip thinking it is supposed to be 4, but often it is longer :) 19:28:16 <cmerlo> And so what’s most likely is to fold stuff into, say, CS 2 or Data Structures 19:28:24 <cmerlo> True :) 19:29:01 <spersinger> I might be missing it but I don't see a room for the workshop listed on the schedule. Do you have one? 19:29:05 <lorip> is there anything you are curious about with regard to the Jan workshop 19:29:30 <spersinger> January 9-10 is very close. 19:29:34 <lorip> spersinger - yes, we have one 19:29:51 <cmerlo> I recently gave a CS 1 in-class assignment where students had to download some stuff, and it occurred to me after reading the Teaching Open Source stuff that I could/should be putting that stuff on Github/Gitlab 19:30:09 <lorip> actually I think we may have a few in case we wanted to have breakout rooms, but I don't have the room numbers in front of me 19:30:12 <cmerlo> At least to get them started 19:30:46 <lorip> the faculty at John Jay have been awesome in terms of local arrangements 19:30:48 <kussmaul> we will send a message to the Google Group with all of the logistic details 19:30:57 <cmerlo> But, you know, some of them come in knowing absolutely nothing, and we have to get them up to speed thinking, typing, debugging, etc 19:31:59 <cmerlo> So it’s hard to know where to fix extra stuff into a course 19:32:23 <kussmaul> yes, definitely a challenge 19:32:55 <kussmaul> sometimes "extra" stuff can increase student motivation / enthusiasm to learn the core stuff 19:33:10 <cmerlo> Sure! 19:34:24 <kussmaul> but it can be tricky to figure out which extra stuff will increase motivation, and which might make things worse - e.g. examples that appeal to some students but turn off others 19:34:39 <cmerlo> But I feel at least in CS 1 that we have to get them over the hump first 19:34:52 <kussmaul> OK, last topic for today - 19:35:46 <kussmaul> #topic Signing up for Stage 2 project and course groups 19:35:47 <kussmaul> At the S2 workshop we work in small groups. To help organize groups, we ask you to sign up for both a course as well as an HFOSS project that interest you. It's not a long term commitment - just a way to organize discussion at the workshop 19:35:47 <kussmaul> #link http://foss2serve.org/index.php/Stage2_Groups is the page to indicate your course and project interest 19:36:10 <kussmaul> so I've heard CS1/CS2 from spersinger and cmerlo 19:36:29 <kussmaul> other courses? have you looked at any HFOSS projects that seem interesting & appropriate? 19:36:45 <cmerlo> I would love to include Data Structures, but it’s only 3 credits and there’s so much to do already 19:37:40 <cmerlo> As for a project, I’m torn between Firefox and the food stuff 19:37:47 <lorip> I'm trying some HFOSS stuff in our mobile app class this semester 19:38:11 <lorip> chris - I'm wondering if our C course might have any opportunities for HFOSS 19:38:19 <cmerlo> Possibly 19:38:39 <kussmaul> spersinger: are you still with us? what do you think? 19:40:31 <lorip> I'm going to have to log out in a few minutes to go pick up my daughter... 19:40:48 <kussmaul> cmerlo: any other questions or comments 19:41:08 <cmerlo> Now that Lori tells me that the Firefox stuff is on python, I’ll have to see what progress our colleague makes on transforming our web dev class to python 19:41:18 <cmerlo> I think I’m ok for now 19:41:37 <lorip> I think Firefox is JavaScript and CSS, but I'll have to check 19:41:40 <cmerlo> s/python/JavaScript 19:42:01 <kussmaul> ok - thank you for your time & attention. 19:42:11 <lorip> thanks clif! 19:42:15 <kussmaul> good luck with the end-of-term 19:42:32 <spersinger> thanks 19:42:44 <cmerlo> Thanks, you too! 19:42:48 <kussmaul> #endmeeting