2025-07-16 17:59:59 <@tdawson:fedora.im> !startmeeting EPEL (2025-07-16)
2025-07-16 18:00:02 <@meetbot:fedora.im> Meeting started at 2025-07-16 17:59:59 UTC
2025-07-16 18:00:02 <@meetbot:fedora.im> The Meeting name is 'EPEL (2025-07-16)'
2025-07-16 18:00:07 <@tdawson:fedora.im> !meetingname epel
2025-07-16 18:00:07 <@tdawson:fedora.im> !topic aloha
2025-07-16 18:00:07 <@meetbot:fedora.im> The Meeting Name is now epel
2025-07-16 18:00:12 <@nhanlon:beeper.com> !hi
2025-07-16 18:00:13 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Neil Hanlon (neil) - he / him / his
2025-07-16 18:00:35 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Hi Neil Hanlon 
2025-07-16 18:01:26 <@rcallicotte:fedora.im> !hi
2025-07-16 18:01:27 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Robby Callicotte (rcallicotte) - he / him / his
2025-07-16 18:01:55 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> !hi
2025-07-16 18:01:56 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Carl George (carlwgeorge) - he / him / his
2025-07-16 18:02:31 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Hi Robby Callicotte and Carl George 
2025-07-16 18:03:07 <@yselkowitz:fedora.im> !hi
2025-07-16 18:03:08 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Yaakov Selkowitz (yselkowitz)
2025-07-16 18:04:13 <@elguero:fedora.im> !hi
2025-07-16 18:04:15 <@zodbot:fedora.im> None (elguero)
2025-07-16 18:04:24 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Hi yselkowitz and Michael L. Young 
2025-07-16 18:04:58 <@tdawson:fedora.im> 
2025-07-16 18:04:58 <@tdawson:fedora.im> !link https://pagure.io/epel/issues?tags=meeting&status=Open
2025-07-16 18:04:58 <@tdawson:fedora.im> !topic EPEL Issues https://pagure.io/epel/issues
2025-07-16 18:05:28 <@tdawson:fedora.im> We do have one issue there, for a incompatible upgrade.
2025-07-16 18:05:37 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Morning nirik 
2025-07-16 18:06:11 <@tdawson:fedora.im> It's only been there for several hours, and it needs to be discussed for a week ... 
2025-07-16 18:06:30 <@tdawson:fedora.im> !epel 341
2025-07-16 18:06:31 <@zodbot:fedora.im> **epel #341** (https://pagure.io/epel/issue/341):**Incompatible upgrade in EPEL9: netplan**
2025-07-16 18:06:31 <@zodbot:fedora.im> ● **Assignee:** Not Assigned
2025-07-16 18:06:31 <@zodbot:fedora.im> ● **Last Updated:** 4 hours ago
2025-07-16 18:06:31 <@zodbot:fedora.im> ● **Opened:** 6 hours ago by jonathanspw
2025-07-16 18:06:31 <@zodbot:fedora.im> 
2025-07-16 18:07:12 <@tdawson:fedora.im> It sounds fairly straightforward with nothing depending on it, and although it's a soname bump, it's backwards compatible.
2025-07-16 18:07:37 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> i do wonder why they changed the soname if it's backwards compatible
2025-07-16 18:07:48 <@tdawson:fedora.im> That's a good point.
2025-07-16 18:07:55 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> mistake?
2025-07-16 18:07:59 <@salimma:fedora.im> !hi
2025-07-16 18:08:00 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Michel Lind (salimma) - he / him / his
2025-07-16 18:08:17 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Hi Michel Lind UTC-5 
2025-07-16 18:08:56 <@salimma:fedora.im> probably just because the version goes from 0.x to 1.x and they mistakenly thought the soname should be bumped
2025-07-16 18:09:07 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> at the very least, nothing else in epel depends on libnetplan.so.  it still needs to go through the incompat process just in case something outside of epel is linking against it, but overall i'm +1 at this point
2025-07-16 18:11:09 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Yep, that's how I feel.
2025-07-16 18:11:13 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> !hi
2025-07-16 18:11:16 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Neal Gompa (ngompa) - he / him / his
2025-07-16 18:11:19 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> +1 from me
2025-07-16 18:11:30 <@tdawson:fedora.im> OK, since we have a week to discuss this out of this meeting, I'm moving on to the next one.
2025-07-16 18:11:35 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Hi Conan Kudo 
2025-07-16 18:11:40 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> the soname changed because it's naively handled by the build scripts
2025-07-16 18:11:45 <@tdawson:fedora.im> We have a pull request with meeting marked on it.
2025-07-16 18:11:47 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> it just takes the version and flattens it to the soversion
2025-07-16 18:12:07 <@tdawson:fedora.im> https://pagure.io/epel/pull-request/339
2025-07-16 18:12:22 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> most people don't understand how soversions work, 🤷‍♂️
2025-07-16 18:12:59 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> doesn't change the fact that if something third party linked against libnetplan.so.0.0 it needs to be rebuilt to link against libnetplan.so.1
2025-07-16 18:13:28 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> I know
2025-07-16 18:13:37 <@davide:cavalca.name> !hi
2025-07-16 18:13:39 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Davide Cavalca (dcavalca) - he / him / his
2025-07-16 18:13:42 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> but I'm just answering why the soversion changed when the API didn't
2025-07-16 18:13:51 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Hi Davide Cavalca 
2025-07-16 18:14:02 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> the wording in this pr is a bit all over the place
2025-07-16 18:14:30 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Yep.  I think we do need to have something like this in the documentation ... but I had to read it twice to understand what was being said.
2025-07-16 18:14:38 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> we're just trying to say that `epel10` refers to the upcoming RHEL 10 version, not the currently released one
2025-07-16 18:14:43 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> right?
2025-07-16 18:14:52 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Correct.
2025-07-16 18:15:09 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> this originates from a thread on epel-devel
2025-07-16 18:15:45 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> !link https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/epel-devel@lists.fedoraproject.org/thread/2ATG5MZ5PAPAEOBRZRLBJ4YPYOE3MC77/
2025-07-16 18:15:55 <@tdawson:fedora.im> The person who made the pull request is willing to change it if we come up with some better wording.
2025-07-16 18:17:19 <@elguero:fedora.im> https://github.com/canonical/netplan/pull/434
2025-07-16 18:18:13 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> i was thinking about something along the lines of "please file a separate bug for different epel majors versions.  for different minor versions of the same epel major version (e.g. epel10.0 and epel10.1) it is ok to request them in the same bug"
2025-07-16 18:18:27 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> oh good find, thanks for digging that up.  so it is a breaking change.
2025-07-16 18:19:20 <@salimma:fedora.im> "EPEL x tracks CentOS Stream, which will become the next RHEL minor release, e.g. if RHEL 10.0 is already branched or released, EPEL 10 targets RHEL 10.1. You can request a branch targeting released and still supported RHEL minor releases e.g. `fedpkg request-branch epel10.0` "
2025-07-16 18:19:30 <@salimma:fedora.im> something like that?
2025-07-16 18:19:54 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> that looks great, I think just adding a sentence about being able to request for multiple minors in the same bug would be needed and it'd be good
2025-07-16 18:19:56 <@salimma:fedora.im> maybe s/tracks/is built against
2025-07-16 18:20:28 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> keep in mind we already have https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/epel/branches/, and it would be best for this note to be short and sweet with a link to that page for more info
2025-07-16 18:20:39 <@rcallicotte:fedora.im> that looks good to me Michel Lind UTC-5 
2025-07-16 18:20:55 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> yeah
2025-07-16 18:21:14 <@salimma:fedora.im> feel free to borrow that and suggest it, since it probably looks better coming from an existing FESCo member in case followups are needed
2025-07-16 18:21:19 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> the page is also for all epel versions, not just epel10, so we'll need to capture that nuance
2025-07-16 18:22:47 <@salimma:fedora.im> add "Starting from EPEL 10" then say "For previous releases EPEL X tracks the latest RHEL X.Y" ?
2025-07-16 18:23:27 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> we should have named it epel X instead of epel 10. ;) </kidding>
2025-07-16 18:24:09 <@rcallicotte:fedora.im> hehe
2025-07-16 18:24:14 <@salimma:fedora.im> haha
2025-07-16 18:25:13 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> i'll note that while i specifically wanted to discuss this here at the meeting, we don't have to nail down the exact wording here, and probably should timebox this topic after a certain point.  maybe move on at half past?
2025-07-16 18:25:38 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Sounds good.   So, about 5 more minutes.
2025-07-16 18:27:38 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> the location of the note in the page is important too i think.  the current spot the pr puts it doesn't make much sense to me.
2025-07-16 18:28:25 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> perhaps right at the beginning of the "file a bug" section?
2025-07-16 18:28:59 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> yeah
2025-07-16 18:29:38 <@rcallicotte:fedora.im> yes 
2025-07-16 18:31:10 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> we could also differentiate it from the existing two notes about bz fields by using a different admonition type (important, tip, caution, warning)
2025-07-16 18:31:23 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> https://docs.asciidoctor.org/asciidoc/latest/syntax-quick-reference/#admonitions
2025-07-16 18:31:25 <@salimma:fedora.im> I feel like whenever I see a tip I should get some cash
2025-07-16 18:31:34 <@rcallicotte:fedora.im> hah
2025-07-16 18:31:36 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> I think it should be considered important
2025-07-16 18:31:44 <@tdawson:fedora.im> OK, Here is my latest stab ... and then we can timebox this.
2025-07-16 18:31:52 <@tdawson:fedora.im> For EPEL 8 and 9 you just need to file a bug for the major versions.
2025-07-16 18:31:52 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Starting from EPEL 10, EPEL x tracks CentOS Stream, which will become the next RHEL minor release, e.g. if RHEL 10.0 is already branched or released, EPEL 10 targets RHEL 10.1.   See branching for more details. So if you want your package built on all current releases, you will need to request it.  This request can be in the same bug requestion.
2025-07-16 18:31:52 <@tdawson:fedora.im> 
2025-07-16 18:31:52 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Please file a separate bug for differen EPEL major versions.
2025-07-16 18:32:42 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> getting there
2025-07-16 18:32:55 <@tdawson:fedora.im> I don't think that's totally right either ... but ... let's timebox this.
2025-07-16 18:32:57 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> throw that in a pr comment and we can tweak from there
2025-07-16 18:33:22 <@tdawson:fedora.im> OK, moving on.
2025-07-16 18:33:30 <@tdawson:fedora.im> !topic Old Business
2025-07-16 18:33:51 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Does anyone have any Old Business they wanted to bring up?
2025-07-16 18:34:36 <@tdawson:fedora.im> There was an open floor item from last week that we didn't finish ... did we want to talk about that some more?
2025-07-16 18:35:40 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> oh yeah, the office hourse
2025-07-16 18:35:42 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> oh yeah, the office hours
2025-07-16 18:36:12 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Yep.
2025-07-16 18:36:21 <@salimma:fedora.im> FWIW Hyperscale had the same issue with our monthly hangout
2025-07-16 18:36:25 <@salimma:fedora.im> and I just fixed it by hand
2025-07-16 18:36:43 <@salimma:fedora.im> (making sure everyone in the ACL has access to edit the calendar makes it easier)
2025-07-16 18:36:45 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Michel Lind UTC-5: How did you fix it?
2025-07-16 18:36:47 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> "fixed it by hand" == "create each entry manually forever"?
2025-07-16 18:37:05 <@salimma:fedora.im> I just set it to recur every 4 weeks, then when it's off, edit the wrong entry and set it to the correct date, presto
2025-07-16 18:37:17 <@salimma:fedora.im> then it's correct until the next 5-day-in-a-month month
2025-07-16 18:37:55 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> that is some fonz-kicks-the-jukebox stuff right there
2025-07-16 18:37:58 <@rcallicotte:fedora.im> We're just dealing with limitation in fedocal? 
2025-07-16 18:38:06 <@salimma:fedora.im> oh man this month has *5* Wednesdays so it's wrong again next month
2025-07-16 18:38:15 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> yup, exactly
2025-07-16 18:38:25 <@salimma:fedora.im> yep, fedocal does not do Nth-week-of-month cadence
2025-07-16 18:38:55 <@rcallicotte:fedora.im> is it styll being actively developed? Can we attempt a new feature?
2025-07-16 18:39:49 <@rcallicotte:fedora.im> seems like it would solve problems for multiple groups is all
2025-07-16 18:39:58 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> seems very much in maintenance mode by the commit log https://pagure.io/fedocal/commits/master
2025-07-16 18:40:33 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> i see one feature added 10 months ago
2025-07-16 18:40:47 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> I'm sure we could merge a pr / deploy...
2025-07-16 18:41:58 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> (if someone was wanting to implement one/file the pr)
2025-07-16 18:42:16 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> absent someone volunteering to write the code for that, i'd like to try out doing the office hours every other week, but move it down from an hour to just 30 minutes.  would anyone be outright opposed to that?  we can always revisit it later.
2025-07-16 18:42:46 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> and as always, keep in mind the office hours are completely optional
2025-07-16 18:43:21 <@rcallicotte:fedora.im> I'm +1 for every other week
2025-07-16 18:43:44 <@tdawson:fedora.im> If we keep it the same time (right before this meeting), I'm good with trying that out.
2025-07-16 18:44:45 <@salimma:fedora.im> if it's half an hour then start it later I guess? so half past the hour
2025-07-16 18:45:10 <@salimma:fedora.im> or keep it same time and give people a buffer before the meeting - but IIRC it normally just blends into the main meeting and people might choose to stay on the line, so that'snice
2025-07-16 18:45:38 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> yeah i like it being next to this meeting, so moving to 1730 utc
2025-07-16 18:46:21 <@tdawson:fedora.im> I'm good with that.
2025-07-16 18:46:53 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> i don't see anyone outright opposed, so i'll make that change in the calendar and we'll give it a go.  after a few months if anyone doesn't like it please bring it up again and we'll revisit.
2025-07-16 18:46:58 <@tdawson:fedora.im> I'm good with that. => 1730 UTC
2025-07-16 18:47:07 <@yselkowitz:fedora.im> starting next week?
2025-07-16 18:47:28 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> right now the next scheduled one is august 6th, i could start it then, or start next week.  doesn't matter to me.
2025-07-16 18:48:13 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> actually it would be easy to communicate as "starting in august", so lets start with the august 6th meeting
2025-07-16 18:49:32 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Thanks for doing that meeting Carl.
2025-07-16 18:49:33 <@rcallicotte:fedora.im> fyi - https://pagure.io/fedocal/issue/151
2025-07-16 18:49:45 <@rcallicotte:fedora.im> 10 year old ticket
2025-07-16 18:50:01 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> also just found https://pagure.io/fedocal/issue/168, 7 year old
2025-07-16 18:50:07 <@salimma:fedora.im> vintage bug
2025-07-16 18:50:28 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Our time is getting a little short, so I'm going to move to Open Floor incase we have any open floor items.
2025-07-16 18:50:37 <@tdawson:fedora.im> !topic General Issues / Open Floor
2025-07-16 18:51:30 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Does anyone have anything for Open Floor?
2025-07-16 18:53:20 <@tdawson:fedora.im> That sounds like a no to me.
2025-07-16 18:53:35 <@tdawson:fedora.im> I nobody has anything else, I'm ok ending the meeting early.
2025-07-16 18:53:45 <@tdawson:fedora.im> If nobody has anything else, I'm ok ending the meeting early.
2025-07-16 18:54:18 <@salimma:fedora.im> good seeing y'all folks
2025-07-16 18:54:33 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Thank you to everyone for the good discussions.  And thank you all for all you do for EPEL and it's community.
2025-07-16 18:54:36 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> small fyi, centos showcase cfp is open
2025-07-16 18:54:47 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> https://www.centos.org/events/showcase-2025-07/
2025-07-16 18:54:52 <@salimma:fedora.im> it was originally going to close on Monday :P
2025-07-16 18:55:18 <@salimma:fedora.im> but I think there's an issue getting it announced in the blog (Pagure under attack by AI scrapers again)
2025-07-16 18:55:19 <@carlwgeorge:fedora.im> yeah cfp closes on monday the 21st, the event is on the 28th
2025-07-16 18:55:49 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> news to me? pagure has been fine since we dropped blame/history stuff.
2025-07-16 18:56:10 <@salimma:fedora.im> oh we should sign up even if we already submit too right
2025-07-16 18:56:16 <@salimma:fedora.im> git.centos.org, not the fedora pagure
2025-07-16 18:56:24 <@salimma:fedora.im> that's where the CentOS blog is hosted
2025-07-16 18:56:43 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> ah, ok. Yeah, saying 'pagure' it like saying 'apache' :)
2025-07-16 18:57:17 <@rcallicotte:fedora.im> "apagure"
2025-07-16 18:57:47 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Anything else before we close?
2025-07-16 18:58:48 <@tdawson:fedora.im> Then I'll talk to ya'll next week, unless I talk sooner.
2025-07-16 18:59:04 <@rcallicotte:fedora.im> bye Troy!
2025-07-16 18:59:06 <@tdawson:fedora.im> !endmeeting