2025-03-13 16:35:03 <@tflink:fedora.im> !startmeeting fedora-ai-ml-sig
2025-03-13 16:35:04 <@meetbot:fedora.im> Meeting started at 2025-03-13 16:35:03 UTC
2025-03-13 16:35:05 <@meetbot:fedora.im> The Meeting name is 'fedora-ai-ml-sig'
2025-03-13 16:35:08 <@tflink:fedora.im> sorry, got distracted
2025-03-13 16:35:36 <@tflink:fedora.im> !hi
2025-03-13 16:35:37 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Tim Flink (tflink)
2025-03-13 16:35:55 <@trix:fedora.im> no worries, i did not see any agenda items, maybe this is short meeting ?
2025-03-13 16:36:21 <@tflink:fedora.im> yeah, looks like. probably should have just canceled
2025-03-13 16:36:27 <@man2dev:fedora.im> !hi
2025-03-13 16:36:28 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Mohammadreza Hendiani (man2dev)
2025-03-13 16:36:30 <@tflink:fedora.im> does anyone have any topics to bring up today?
2025-03-13 16:36:54 <@trix:fedora.im> i'm looking at updating pt to 2.7
2025-03-13 16:37:15 <@trix:fedora.im> it will likely have new buildrequires, i have not figured them all out now.
2025-03-13 16:37:34 <@tflink:fedora.im> !info update to pytorch 2.7 is underway in rawhide
2025-03-13 16:37:40 <@trix:fedora.im> atm i am looking at flashattention.
2025-03-13 16:38:00 <@trix:fedora.im> it has either composable_kernel or triton backend.
2025-03-13 16:38:32 <@trix:fedora.im> ck is the better supported one, but also the one we don't have, so i am also giving ck a refresh.
2025-03-13 16:39:08 <@tflink:fedora.im> did the gcc issues get figured out? IIRC, that was the problem I hit when I tried to review it
2025-03-13 16:39:19 <@trix:fedora.im> good question!
2025-03-13 16:39:47 <@trix:fedora.im> yes i did. i 'fixed' rocm-llvm on monday.
2025-03-13 16:39:48 <@xanderlent:fedora.im> !hi
2025-03-13 16:39:49 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Alexander Lent (xanderlent) - he / him / his
2025-03-13 16:40:07 <@tflink:fedora.im> cool, I'll put that review back on my todo list
2025-03-13 16:40:31 <@trix:fedora.im> issue was <array> was throwing an assert because 'size of' elment in deviceland wasn't set.
2025-03-13 16:40:55 <@trix:fedora.im> issue kicked around in pytorch upstream and landed back on me.
2025-03-13 16:41:48 <@trix:fedora.im> so i am going back and fixing where this issue also hits pytorch.  that has happened in rh.  now waiting on F42 build of rocm-llvm 
2025-03-13 16:42:10 <@trix:fedora.im> so maybe a week or two for F42's pytorch to be fixed.
2025-03-13 16:42:40 <@trix:fedora.im> i likely need to push fix to llvm upstream.
2025-03-13 16:42:48 <@trix:fedora.im> on my todo.. 
2025-03-13 16:42:55 <@tflink:fedora.im> !info there are reviews needed for new packages, rocAL and composable_kernel are among these
2025-03-13 16:43:09 <@trix:fedora.im> yes.
2025-03-13 16:43:22 <@trix:fedora.im> i also have some for ollama addons.
2025-03-13 16:43:32 <@tflink:fedora.im> F42 should be out of beta freeze before too much longer. I haven't been watching the current status terribly closely, though
2025-03-13 16:43:41 <@trix:fedora.im> python-ollama and a string that leads to emacs-ollama.
2025-03-13 16:43:56 <@tflink:fedora.im> ollama needs emacs?
2025-03-13 16:44:12 <@trix:fedora.im> emacs has an ollama mode
2025-03-13 16:44:29 <@man2dev:fedora.im> its a plugin to use llms with emacs
2025-03-13 16:44:38 <@man2dev:fedora.im> there are several for vim as well
2025-03-13 16:44:44 <@trix:fedora.im> think of cheezy copilot for emacs fans
2025-03-13 16:45:20 <@trix:fedora.im> yes, i'd like to get at least one vim in, but i am not vi fan, so would need help suggesting and verifying
2025-03-13 16:45:27 <@trix:fedora.im> or just doing the vim plugin
2025-03-13 16:45:39 <@tflink:fedora.im> ok, just figured that the plugin would require ollama, not the other way around
2025-03-13 16:46:29 <@trix:fedora.im> yes. ollama has nice network/rest interface lots of things use it 
2025-03-13 16:47:03 <@trix:fedora.im> i'd like a coding assistent in my emacs, so that's why i did emacs.
2025-03-13 16:47:31 <@man2dev:fedora.im> https://github.com/ggml-org/llama.vscode.git
2025-03-13 16:47:31 <@man2dev:fedora.im> https://github.com/microsoft/vscode-copilot-release.git
2025-03-13 16:47:31 <@man2dev:fedora.im> https://github.com/ggml-org/llama.vim.git
2025-03-13 16:47:45 <@man2dev:fedora.im> other simulaer packages
2025-03-13 16:48:01 <@trix:fedora.im> i also looked at vscode for fedora, and decided i didn't want to do that.
2025-03-13 16:48:04 <@man2dev:fedora.im> other similar packages
2025-03-13 16:48:37 <@trix:fedora.im> someone that uses vscode day in day out could take that.
2025-03-13 16:48:40 <@man2dev:fedora.im> yes its needs a lot of packages 
2025-03-13 16:49:01 <@tflink:fedora.im> rephrasing to make sure I understood: there are reviews that will be needed before pytorch can be updated (composable_kernel, mostly). There will also be reviews needed for bits that ollama requires to support emacs/vim/etc. plugins
2025-03-13 16:49:09 <@mystro256:fedora.im> Sorry was distracted , looking at rocal right now
2025-03-13 16:49:29 <@tflink:fedora.im> good to know, I was going to get to it later today :)
2025-03-13 16:49:52 <@trix:fedora.im> tflink: yes. multiple reviews a set for rocm, some for pytorch, some for ollama.
2025-03-13 16:50:16 <@tflink:fedora.im> are they all blocking the ML review tracker?
2025-03-13 16:50:30 <@trix:fedora.im> ah, i stopped using that.
2025-03-13 16:50:48 <@trix:fedora.im> maybe i should use it again.
2025-03-13 16:50:51 <@tflink:fedora.im> is there a list of the packages which need review somewhere?
2025-03-13 16:51:07 <@mystro256:fedora.im> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2348762
2025-03-13 16:51:07 <@mystro256:fedora.im> (rocm metapackage)
2025-03-13 16:51:07 <@mystro256:fedora.im> I was also reviewing this sorry:
2025-03-13 16:51:38 <@trix:fedora.im> oh yeah that also came up, some asked why don't we have a convience package to grab everything.
2025-03-13 16:51:44 <@mystro256:fedora.im> Tom Usually just CC's me, maybe we should get a better system :)
2025-03-13 16:52:34 <@trix:fedora.im> yes. better system.
2025-03-13 16:52:41 <@tflink:fedora.im> yeah, the only way I know of to learn about the reviews that are needed is poking Tom which doesn't scale terribly well :)
2025-03-13 16:53:46 <@trix:fedora.im> start using hc package list for the rocm things ?  what about the ai/ml things ?
2025-03-13 16:54:27 <@tflink:fedora.im> whatever works and doesn't require human input to read is fine with me
2025-03-13 16:54:44 <@tflink:fedora.im> tracking BZ, wiki page (so long as we update it), ...
2025-03-13 16:55:50 <@man2dev:fedora.im> the way i see it the problem is all of these require maintenance and they get lost easily
2025-03-13 16:56:20 <@tflink:fedora.im> I don't disagree but the other option is to not have a list of the reviews that need to be done
2025-03-13 16:56:23 <@man2dev:fedora.im> should we just use a private mailing list
2025-03-13 16:56:56 <@tflink:fedora.im> tracking BZ would probably be easiest since that gets updated when the reviews are complete
2025-03-13 16:57:20 <@trix:fedora.im> i'll start a chart like the hc one in ai/ml sig page for the non rocm ai things.
2025-03-13 16:57:56 <@tflink:fedora.im> !action trix to create a chart in the wiki to list needed ai/ml package reviews
2025-03-13 16:57:59 <@trix:fedora.im> dang, i assigned myself an action item 😑
2025-03-13 16:58:15 <@tflink:fedora.im> so long as we remember to update the list :)
2025-03-13 16:58:21 <@man2dev:fedora.im> my thought was just having separate mailing thread for each topic and ignoring it we are done with it
2025-03-13 16:58:51 <@tflink:fedora.im> we don't have a mailing list, though and new Fedora mailing lists are discouraged in lieu of discourse
2025-03-13 16:59:06 <@trix:fedora.im> email ?!? what's that.
2025-03-13 17:01:40 <@tflink:fedora.im> !info today's meeting has been less organized so as a summary - F42 looks good, updates are coming in rawhide and reviews are needed. There will be a renewed list of needed package reviews coming soon (lists of reviews for both hc/rocm and ai/ml)
2025-03-13 17:01:45 <@tflink:fedora.im> does that look OK to everyone?
2025-03-13 17:02:03 <@tflink:fedora.im> rather, does anyone disagree with my single-sentance-summary?
2025-03-13 17:02:32 <@xanderlent:fedora.im> Looks good to me
2025-03-13 17:03:02 <@trix:fedora.im> 👍️
2025-03-13 17:03:14 <@tflink:fedora.im> cool, any other topics to cover today?
2025-03-13 17:04:23 <@xanderlent:fedora.im> Update from me on the Intel NPU:
2025-03-13 17:04:32 <@tflink:fedora.im> !topic intel NPU update
2025-03-13 17:04:45 <@tflink:fedora.im> sorry, trying to keep some level of organization to the minutes :)
2025-03-13 17:06:16 <@xanderlent:fedora.im> 
2025-03-13 17:06:16 <@xanderlent:fedora.im> I'm still debugging the build since it is complicated; I'll leave that discussion for the usual chat.
2025-03-13 17:06:16 <@xanderlent:fedora.im> It looks like we will be able to use packaged LLVM 18 instead of building from their sources.
2025-03-13 17:06:16 <@xanderlent:fedora.im> 
2025-03-13 17:06:16 <@xanderlent:fedora.im> First, I've made substantial progress on the remaining compiler component. I have a draft package that mostly finishes the CMake configure step.
2025-03-13 17:07:21 <@trix:fedora.im> errr.. llvm18 umm isn't that going away with llvm20
2025-03-13 17:07:43 <@tflink:fedora.im> hasn't it gone away in rawhide now that llvm20 has landed?
2025-03-13 17:07:52 <@tflink:fedora.im> !info Alexander Lent has made progress on the bits needed for using Intel NPUs in Fedora and it looks like the llvm18 packaged in Fedora will be usable instead of having to build a fork from source
2025-03-13 17:08:02 <@xanderlent:fedora.im> Second, the Intel NPU firmware is going upstream to linux-firmware. I will file a bug and/or PR when the next release happens, and hopefully we will have the firmware in Rawhide shortly.
2025-03-13 17:08:55 <@tflink:fedora.im> !info the intel NPU firmware will be landing upstream in linux-firmware, updates will come once that process is complete
2025-03-13 17:09:33 <@xanderlent:fedora.im> Finally, I have submitted the first review for one of the Huggingface Python packages, which the NPU Python library uses. More to come in the following days/weeks.
2025-03-13 17:09:46 <@xanderlent:fedora.im> (This first one is python-safetensors.)
2025-03-13 17:09:55 <@tflink:fedora.im> I assume you need a reviewer for python-safetensors?
2025-03-13 17:10:34 <@tflink:fedora.im> !info review needed for one of the huggingface python libraries needed for intel's NPU
2025-03-13 17:10:38 <@xanderlent:fedora.im>  @trix has already claimed the review.
2025-03-13 17:10:45 <@tflink:fedora.im> ah, cool
2025-03-13 17:10:47 <@tflink:fedora.im> !undo
2025-03-13 17:11:09 <@tflink:fedora.im> !info review is in progress for python-safetensors (one of the huggingface python libraries)
2025-03-13 17:11:35 <@trix:fedora.im> yes, and we got past why shouldn't the rust-* take it.
2025-03-13 17:11:53 <@tflink:fedora.im> it's a python wrapper around rust?
2025-03-13 17:12:01 <@trix:fedora.im> yes. 
2025-03-13 17:13:07 <@tflink:fedora.im> great to see progress on this
2025-03-13 17:13:14 <@tflink:fedora.im> anything else on the NPU situation?
2025-03-13 17:14:54 <@xanderlent:fedora.im> I've gently probed the AMD NPU packages (amd-xdna and xrt). I have a draft package that builds but all of the install paths are weird. I'll bring it up in the normal chat with @trix who was also poking at it, I think.
2025-03-13 17:15:40 <@tflink:fedora.im> wow, you've been busy
2025-03-13 17:15:59 <@trix:fedora.im> i am interest in seeing it in Fedora but don't have time to do it.
2025-03-13 17:16:14 <@zodbot:fedora.im> man2dev gave a cookie to xanderlent. They now have 2 cookies, 2 of which were obtained in the Fedora 41 release cycle
2025-03-13 17:16:29 <@tflink:fedora.im> !info some progress has been made on the AMD NPU packages as well, draft packages are ready but will need more work
2025-03-13 17:18:49 <@xanderlent:fedora.im> That's all from me for today.
2025-03-13 17:19:06 <@tflink:fedora.im> that was quite a bit, thanks
2025-03-13 17:19:12 <@tflink:fedora.im> any other topics to cover today?
2025-03-13 17:19:28 <@tflink:fedora.im> !topic open floor
2025-03-13 17:22:17 <@tflink:fedora.im> ok, thanks for coming everyone
2025-03-13 17:22:44 <@tflink:fedora.im> Next meeting will be in 2 weeks - March 27
2025-03-13 17:22:47 <@tflink:fedora.im> !endmeeting