#meeting:fedoraproject.org log

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:01:47

!startmeeting ELN (2024-04-05)

<@meetbot:fedora.im>

16:01:49

Meeting started at 2024-04-05 16:01:47 UTC

<@meetbot:fedora.im>

16:01:49

The Meeting name is 'ELN (2024-04-05)'

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:01:50

!meetingname eln

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:01:57

!topic Init Process

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:03:08

!hi

<@zodbot:fedora.im>

16:03:10

Stephen Gallagher (sgallagh) - he / him / his

<@yselkowitz:fedora.im>

16:03:12

!hi

<@zodbot:fedora.im>

16:03:13

Yaakov Selkowitz (yselkowitz)

<@tdawson:fedora.im>

16:03:34

Hello !

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:03:41

!hi

<@zodbot:fedora.im>

16:03:44

Davide Cavalca (dcavalca) - he / him / his

<@nhanlon:beeper.com>

16:04:31

!hi

<@zodbot:fedora.im>

16:04:33

Neil Hanlon (neil) - he / him / his

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:05:26

Hello, folks. Glad you could all make it!

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:05:39

!topic Agenda

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:06:05

What would we like to discuss today? I don't have any specific topics in mind, but since we skipped last meeting I didn't want to skip two in a row.

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:06:10

So what's on your minds?

<@yselkowitz:fedora.im>

16:06:22

guest image build failures

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:07:26

!info Agenda Item: Issues with guest image building

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:07:38

wrapping up the libxcrypt-epel discussion from the other channel

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:09:34

!info Agenda Item: How to include ELN-only packages

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:10:09

nirik: That's news to me. Link?

<@nirik:matrix.scrye.com>

16:11:04

https://pagure.io/releng/issue/12053

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:12:40

!info Agenda Item: ELN buildroot retention

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:13:08

OK, let's get started. Mind if we go in reverse order, since I think the guest image topic may take a while??

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:13:12

OK, let's get started. Mind if we go in reverse order, since I think the guest image topic may take a while?

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:15:07

!topic ELN buildroot retention

<@yselkowitz:fedora.im>

16:15:36

!link https://pagure.io/releng/issue/12053

<@nirik:matrix.scrye.com>

16:15:54

I guess this was mostly a fyi, and to see if other solutions could be found for their issue

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:16:27

Currently, we don't "gate" ELN composes on any kind of CI runs. We only have two compose states: completely failed and not copied to the `latest` location or "at least the install trees composed".

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:16:57

Part of this is because we just don't have the infrastructure available to do that.

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:17:18

This is also another reminder that we need to get off of ODCS soon.

<@nirik:matrix.scrye.com>

16:17:47

I'd have to look, but IIRC koji has no way to keep just some buildroots longer, so its global. 17 days of all repos is a complete no go from a disk space standpoint

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:18:04

could we use openQA for this?

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:18:36

Davide Cavalca: We could do a great many things, but we need someone with the cycles to work on it :)

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:18:54

I mention that specifically because adamw did rig up openQA for ELN a while ago

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:19:22

Right now, keeping the lights on is easily 60% of my and yselkowitz's time

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:19:40

if that's the path we want to go with I might be able to help drum up some resourcing around it (as it would make my life easier as well on the Meta side)

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:20:51

The actual tool we use to provide promotion approval is largely irrelevant; the main problem is the lack of mechanism to do a "promotion" at all.

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:21:34

I'll admit, I'm not super-familiar with how we do this in Rawhide at the moment; is there a gating mechanism for composes there?

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:21:58

(Read: is this something we could piggyback on if we get the composes running the way Rawhide does them instead of our ODCS solution?)

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:22:34

I know Rawhide does gating using openQA but I don't know what the mechanism is for that

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:22:35

I should probably mention nirik by name for a reply :)

<@nirik:matrix.scrye.com>

16:23:39

there is a setup... I think we enabled it, but its early...

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:24:29

https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/rawhide-gating/ is the documentation for what we do in Rawhide

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:24:46

though it looks like this is geared towards individual packages, not composes

<@nirik:matrix.scrye.com>

16:25:05

yeah, we may not have enabled the compose part yet

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:25:45

OK, but regardless, it will probably be best for us to get things close to how Rawhide is working so when that gets turned on, we can do likewise

<@nirik:matrix.scrye.com>

16:26:37

yeah... gating updates should help, but doesn't fix everything

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:27:16

Damned practice, getting in the way of good theory.

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:27:50

#info No specific actions to take here at the moment, other than to schedule and work on migration of composes off of ODCS.

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:28:08

!topic How to include ELN-only packages

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:28:18

Davide Cavalca: Want to briefly summarize the question here?

<@yselkowitz:fedora.im>

16:28:25

that last #info didn't register, you need to \!info

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:28:30

Oops

<@yselkowitz:fedora.im>

16:28:38

but there is no \!undo either

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:28:44

!info (previous topic) No specific actions to take here at the moment, other than to schedule and work on migration of composes off of ODCS.

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:28:58

Low-tech solution :)

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:31:07

OK, we may have lost Davide

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:31:40

Does anyone else want to try to summarize this or shall we jump to the guest image topic?

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:31:47

I'm here, sorry got sidetracked

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:32:24

tl;dr there are some subpackages that aren't build in ELN but we want to include in ELN Extras composes by providing them in a -epel compat package

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:32:48

these packages don't have a `rawhide` branch, they'll have an `eln` branch now (and an `epelX` branch down then road when EPEL branches)

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:33:17

So, essentially these are the equivalent of EPEL packages that add missing subpackages to RHEL?

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:33:24

case in point: https://github.com/minimization/content-resolver-input/pull/1124 (which is libxcrypt-epel)

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:33:28

yes, exactly

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:35:34

There's not a lot that needs to happen here, and most of it is already in place.

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:36:06

We need a request to add it to the content resolver (which you have above) and we want to also exclude it from trying to auto-rebuild in Rawhide in case anyone (for some reason) builds/tags it there.

<@yselkowitz:fedora.im>

16:36:51

so my concern is it may not be that simple

<@yselkowitz:fedora.im>

16:37:07

e.g. libxcrypt-compat is a subpkg of libxcrypt in rawhide

<@yselkowitz:fedora.im>

16:37:23

we need libxcrypt in eln, but there it is built w/o -compat

<@yselkowitz:fedora.im>

16:37:47

so if we add libxcrypt-compat to CR, what will EBS try to do?

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:37:51

https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/libxcrypt/blob/rawhide/f/libxcrypt.spec#_10 is the specific gating for context

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:38:03

what's EBS?

<@yselkowitz:fedora.im>

16:38:29

ELNBuildSync, the replacement for DBS (DistroBuildSync), although the latter name is still used in places

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:39:10

Strictly speaking, both EBS and DBS exist, but they forked so far back that it was more sensible to rename ours.

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:39:24

They still share a config file format, but are otherwise entirely divergent

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:40:04

yselkowitz: They need to behave exactly as they would in EPEL.

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:40:28

Which means that the package they build for ELN would have to provide *only* the `-compat` subpackage and no other subpackages that would replace the RHEL package

<@yselkowitz:fedora.im>

16:40:56

of course, but that wasn't the question

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:41:16

Maybe I'm misunderstanding your question.

<@yselkowitz:fedora.im>

16:42:36

how will EBS handle a package like libxcrypt-compat that is built from libxcrypt in rawhide but not in ELN, and built (manually) from libxcrypt-epel for eln-extras

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:43:07

It is based off what is in the compose for ELN

<@yselkowitz:fedora.im>

16:43:47

also, does this risk eln-extras "contaminating" eln if something in eln (mistakenly) depends on it (e.g. the current issue with nbdkit wrt libxcrypt-compat)?

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:44:40

yselkowitz: I think that's where "unwanted packages" comes in

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:44:50

It *may* get scooped up, but we'll be aware of it.

<@tdawson:fedora.im>

16:45:14

That is my biggest worry. I'm still a little fuzzy on how eln-extras doesn't contaminate eln builds, even without this proposal.

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:45:45

Troy Dawson: Define "contaminate" please?

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:46:03

As far as "they're available in the buildroot"?

<@tdawson:fedora.im>

16:46:41

Correct ... and now my mind just rememberd that recommends doesn't have a BuildRecommends.

<@tdawson:fedora.im>

16:47:15

I withdraw my worry

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:51:02

We might need to ensure that such builds have a different SRPM name to avoid some hiccoughs with tracking.

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:51:43

that should be fine if we keep the `-epel` convention

<@yselkowitz:fedora.im>

16:52:54

so sounds like we go ahead and add these to CR *after* a manual eln-extras build from an -epel SRPM?

<@yselkowitz:fedora.im>

16:54:26

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:54:33

I think that's probably the best approach.

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:54:43

And we should write this down in the docs for future reference

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:57:09

!info ELN-only packages should be built into eln-extras from a separate SRPM name than the Rawhide package.

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:57:48

!info That separate SRPM name will be added to the exclusion list in ELNBuildSync to avoid accidental rebuilds

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:58:05

!info The needed subpackage(s) will be added to Content Resolver for ELN Extras.

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

16:58:19

Any volunteers to capture this in the docs?

<@davide:cavalca.name>

16:58:40

I can get this written up

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

17:00:41

!action Davide Cavalca to update the docs

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

17:00:43

Thanks!

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

17:01:15

We're at the top of the hour, so why don't we take the virt image issue back to #eln:fedoraproject.org for now

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

17:02:09

Thanks for joining, folks!

<@sgallagh:fedora.im>

17:02:12

!endmeeting