00:59:37 <mchua> #startmeeting 00:59:37 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Nov 11 00:59:37 2009 UTC. The chair is mchua. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 00:59:37 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 00:59:45 <mchua> Today: skills day. 01:03:03 <transbot0> Kaio has disconnected 01:03:31 <mchua> #topic The Open Source Value Proposition 01:03:41 <mchua> Harish is going through the open source value proposition. 01:03:50 <mchua> (This gives me some time to frantically prepare materials for the rest of the day.) 01:04:02 <mchua> (We have, once again, changed the schedule on the fly because of feedback we've gotten.) 01:16:12 <kinchew> Today is the 3rd day of the POSSE Workshop. 01:16:52 <kinchew> Harish has just finished a short session on the Value Proposition for Open Source. 01:17:03 <mchua> :) thanks! 01:17:19 * mchua is furiously preparing materials for the rest of the day, so other people taking notes here is appreciated 01:17:36 * mchua wonders how well the things Harish is explaining translate into how people can talk with their schools about open source 01:18:32 <kinchew> We will be doing the following today: GIT, BUGZILLA, PATCHES, BUILD, BLOGS and FUN Sugar. Hope to have fun today! 01:20:08 <kinchew> I guess we need to develop some documentation on this Open Source Value Proposition. Alternatively, if we can do a video clip, then it will be convincing! 01:20:56 <kinchew> We now have a short discussion on Cloud Computing versus Open Source. 01:21:49 <kinchew> How to build a Cloud Computing infrastructure based on Open Source Software? 01:22:50 <YeLong> the same question 01:24:12 <kinchew> The discussion is now on the security of information in the Cloud Computing infrastructure. 01:25:24 <kinchew> Harish is now asking all of us on how we can adapt his Open Source Value Proposition for use by students. 01:28:51 <kinchew> We are now talking about learning management systems, e.g. Blackboard. 01:30:35 <YeLong> e-learning? 01:31:38 <kinchew> Harish has just outlined his value proposition into the following categories: What, Where, Why, How. 01:33:08 <kinchew> Harish felt that if we can articulate his value proposition he feels that our students might be more convinced about Open Source Software. 01:33:57 <kinchew> One of the challenges that Harish knew is that many companies want to know how Open Source Software can be used for enterprise applications. 01:36:20 <kinchew> Apache is the most popular web server on the Internet. The Internet is being attacked very frequently but Apache is still very popular. Why? 01:37:45 <kinchew> Why is the IIS attacked more often than the Apache? 01:38:58 <kinchew> Is the security of Apache that good that people do not want to attack Apache? This is a question asked aby Mr. YeLong 01:39:19 <YeLong> But the biggest question is the students have been adopted to using Microsoft software. Moreover, most of Open Source software are not as easy to use as Microsoft software. 01:40:03 <kinchew> Harish is now talking about SELinux. 01:40:39 <kinchew> Harish: SUN has the Solaris and the Trusted Solaris. 01:42:47 <mchua> kinchew: I've got a camera if people want video clips :) 01:43:04 <kinchew> Harish: All our machines can now be locked by SELinux. SELinux is started by the NSA. 01:44:36 <kinchew> Mel - using the camera to take some video clips is a good idea. Perhaps we can sound out the other participants. We can do a short video clip, maybe as a deliverable of our workshop. How about doing this tomorrow? 01:46:25 <kinchew> Hi Everybody, please go over to http://blog.melchua.com to see Mel's blog. 01:48:03 <kinchew> Harish: Anybody wants to offer a definition of Cloud Computing? 01:50:12 <kinchew> Question: Do you use IT to make yourself more efficient or do you use it as your core competency? 01:50:43 <transbot0> tiansworld has disconnected 01:55:28 <martz927> hi all 01:55:59 <martz927> i think cannot ssh to fedorapeople.org, can someone assist me to tell me which grp should i join? 01:57:53 <kinchew> Hi Martyn, I was told to do the ssh on the lab PC not on your personal laptop. 02:01:09 <transbot0> harish-xchat has disconnected 02:03:29 <transbot0> harish-webfront has disconnected 02:10:19 <mchua> martz927: When we go through the blogs exercise today, I'll walk everyone through joining the marketing group. That should take care of it. 02:10:48 <mchua> Unless ricky or someone else who can give people git commit access to the websites repo is around, that may be a better group for you to join. 02:11:06 <mchua> I figure since you're all going to be going back and spreading the word about Fedora to your students, Marketing is actually a good place to be. ;) 02:11:16 * mchua runs the Marketing team and is highly biased about this though. 02:11:56 <transbot0> mchua has disconnected 02:12:34 <mchua> join #fedora-websites 02:12:36 <mchua> ergh 02:24:07 <mchua> #topic installing packages, becoming root, SSH 02:24:14 <mchua> #chair 02:24:14 <zodbot> Current chairs: mchua 02:24:22 <mchua> Ok... so why doesn't zodbot change the topic? 02:24:23 <mchua> eh. 02:25:28 <transbot0> jasonchong has disconnected 02:29:24 <kinchew> OK. We are all back from our morning coffee break. Now back to work! 02:29:56 <kinchew> Yes, it will be good if we are all on the Fedora Marketing Group. But what is the expectation? 02:34:42 <kinchew> First do a yum install git at root. 02:35:17 <kinchew> Other options: yum yum search git 02:40:55 <transbot0> roger_ch has joined: #teachingopensource-posse-zh 02:41:19 <transbot0> roger_ch> I am in now. Good Morning every body. Cheersx 02:45:28 <mchua> #link http://betterexplained.com/articles/intro-to-distributed-version-control-illustrated/ 02:50:44 <kinchew> Do a ifconfig to get the IP address of your PC. 02:51:02 <kinchew> Then do an ssh: ssh root@IP-address. 02:51:38 <kinchew> Now create a user account for yourself: useradd your-user-name. 02:52:03 <kinchew> Add a password for your new account: passwd user-name. 02:57:41 <yipch> what is the last command for git. not the init 03:01:16 <transbot0> martz927 has disconnected 03:03:24 <transbot0> roger_ch> to know git, you can type this command in Bash: man git 03:06:04 <transbot0> pohyee-cheong_ has disconnected 03:21:41 <transbot0> tira has disconnected 03:24:11 <kinchew> http://dev.laptop.org/git/activities/speak/log 03:25:01 <kinchew> http://en.flossmanuals.net 03:25:54 <mchua> #link http://en.flossmanuals.net/bin/view/PracticalOSSEngineering/SourceCodeManagement 03:26:31 <mchua> #link http://teachingopensource.org/index.php/Textbook_Project 03:29:10 <transbot0> Kaio has disconnected 03:31:20 <transbot0> roger_ch has disconnected 03:38:25 <transbot0> fardad has joined: #teachingopensource-posse-zh 03:39:06 <transbot0> fardad has disconnected 03:45:54 <transbot0> martz927 has disconnected 03:54:13 <kinchew> Mel is now talking about contributions to the Fedora Project. 03:56:34 <kinchew> git branch experiment 03:56:37 <kinchew> git branch 03:58:15 <kinchew> git checkout experiment 03:58:17 <kinchew> git branch 04:02:21 <kinchew> Two different copies of the same file. Two repositories - Master and experiment. How do we resolve the conflict? 04:03:10 <kinchew> git pull . experiment 04:05:35 <kinchew> The command "git pull . experiment" will combine the two different files and consolidate the changes into a new one. 04:18:22 <jaricsng> to check the difference in file 04:18:24 <jaricsng> git diff 04:18:49 <jaricsng> for graphical view of diff, use 04:18:53 <jaricsng> gitk 04:19:57 <jaricsng> to view the branches, use 04:20:01 <jaricsng> git branch 04:59:56 <transbot0> raeLLL has disconnected 05:04:38 <jaricsng> brb, all at lunch 05:22:17 <tira> hello jaricsng 05:22:28 <jaricsng> yo 05:22:34 <tira> hello kinchew 05:22:55 <tira> jaricsng : what's up maan? 05:33:03 <transbot0> raeLLL has joined: #teachingopensource-posse-zh 05:36:58 <mchua> hey raeLLL, we just covered git, so feel free to add any tips you've got on using git in here :) 05:41:13 <jaricsng> upcoming topic to be covered ... 05:41:24 <jaricsng> to rollout on the following situation 05:42:20 <jaricsng> 1. rollback a particular change and leave those before and after this versioin 05:42:35 <raeLLL> yesterday, does someone succeed "git clone http://git.fedorahosted.org/git/fedora-web.git", there network has restrictions, the native git:// protocol use 9418 port not allowed, 05:43:28 <jaricsng> yes, we managed to get the clone and perform a make 05:43:43 <raeLLL> someone has fedora account, also can "git clone ssh://git.fedorahosted.org/git/fedora-web.git", only ssh:// protocol can commit, push back to the remote site, 05:44:34 <raeLLL> jaricsng: wait for the 1 hour periodical synchronization, then your changes will appear on the web, 05:45:25 <jaricsng> so far cannot ssh, got permission denied for id@fedorapeople.org 05:46:06 <jaricsng> 2. rollback all to a particular point 05:47:41 <jaricsng> instead of using long weird version number with can give them a tag label, as follows 05:47:59 <jaricsng> git tab <the version number here> 05:48:12 <jaricsng> to display the available tags, do 05:48:14 <jaricsng> git tag 05:48:37 <transbot0> raeLLL has disconnected 05:49:05 <transbot0> raeLLL has joined: #teachingopensource-posse-zh 05:49:35 <raeLLL> /whois raeLLL 05:52:37 <jaricsng> 3. to display or view content for a particular version 05:52:53 <jaricsng> for viewing a particular version for pt 3, do 05:52:59 <jaricsng> git checkout <the version id> 05:57:13 <jaricsng> for revert checkin for a particular version point, do 05:57:22 <jaricsng> git revert <version id> 05:58:52 <kevix> '/whois MY-NICK-NAME' in irc tells you something about the person - ip address -clues to where they are geographically located -- but this can be masked/hidden 06:02:24 <jaricsng> to remove all revision from a point, do 06:02:42 <jaricsng> git reset <version id> 06:06:11 <raeLLL> jaricsng: you're the tutor yesterday? 06:10:39 <jaricsng> no, i am attending the class, Mel is conducting, I am taking notes :) 06:15:17 <mchua_> I'll dump some links on git here before we change the topic to bugzilla 06:15:23 <jaricsng> to publish changes to others, we uses 06:15:39 <jaricsng> git push <target git project location> 06:16:00 <jaricsng> and to get others stuff on our own repo 06:16:13 <jaricsng> git pull <source git project location> 06:16:43 <mchua_> #link http://betterexplained.com/articles/intro-to-distributed-version-control-illustrated/ 06:17:07 <mchua_> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Git_Quickref 06:17:20 <mchua_> #link http://spheredev.org/wiki/Git_for_the_lazy 06:17:37 <mchua_> #link http://www.kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/everyday.html 06:17:59 <mchua_> #link http://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git-core/docs/v1.2.6/tutorial.html 06:18:07 <mchua_> #link http://www.kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/user-manual.html 06:18:52 <mchua_> #info the last link is *ridiculously* extensive 06:18:54 <mchua_> #topic bugzilla 06:31:44 <mchua_> #link http://bugzilla.redhat.com 06:54:35 <transbot0> tiansworld has disconnected 06:57:59 <kinchew> Mel and Harish have just finished explaining and show how Bugzilla works. 07:12:25 <transbot0> mchua has disconnected 07:14:08 <transbot0> raeLLL has disconnected 07:14:08 <transbot0> ianweller has disconnected 07:14:08 <transbot0> kevix has disconnected 07:17:45 <transbot0> ekpalmer_afk has disconnected 07:31:39 * mchua is upfront now 07:32:05 <mchua> ricky: we used you and ian and sebastian as examples of good student work ;) 07:32:12 <mchua> #chair 07:32:12 <zodbot> Current chairs: mchua 07:32:19 <mchua> Cool, I have bot privs. 07:45:50 <martz927> hi kin chew 07:45:54 <martz927> u there? 07:51:28 <kinchew> Yes, Martyn, I am still here. 07:51:36 <kinchew> Mel is just covering patches. 07:51:50 <kinchew> Are you familiar with patches? 07:52:08 <kinchew> It is easy to do patches in Linux. 07:52:37 <kinchew> There are only 6 of us left in the class. 07:53:58 <kinchew> Do a "man patch" if you want to know more about the patch command. 08:00:27 <martz927> icic 08:00:49 <martz927> only left with 6? 08:01:46 <mchua> Ok - time to talk about IRC logging. 08:01:55 <mchua> #topic IRC logging with zodbot 08:02:03 <mchua> You might notice a user in this channel called zodbot. 08:02:19 <mchua> zodbot is an automatic IRC bot that we use to log IRC channels in Fedora. 08:05:37 <mchua-logging> Typing stuff into channel! 08:05:39 <mchua-logging> Have things to log! 08:05:43 <mchua-logging> Look, it's conversation! 08:05:50 <jaricsng> learning about logging using x-chat 08:05:54 <mchua-logging> yay! 08:06:06 <transbot0> raeLLL has joined: #teachingopensource-posse-zh 08:06:34 <tira> mchua: does the teachingopensource-posse pass through freenode and fedora chat servers? 08:09:10 <mchua> #link http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org 08:09:24 <tira> mchua : fedora uses freenode and the logging of the fedora channels is done by zodbot automatically. Zodbot runs on fedora site. 08:12:28 <mchua> #endmeeting