20:08:23 #startmeeting 20:08:23 Meeting started Tue Jun 1 20:08:23 2010 UTC. The chair is mchua. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 20:08:23 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 20:08:28 I'll start logging anyhow... 20:08:31 ok cool 20:08:43 * mchua pastes backlog, apologies for channel flood 20:08:44 dr. white should be sending in appl today 20:08:46 20:05 < mchua> alolita: quaid just messaged, he's having lunch with Jeff_S - they will be online shortly 20:08:49 20:05 < mchua> he asked if we could wait for them - alolita, do you have a hard cutoff time today? 20:08:53 20:06 * Jefro sits corrected 20:08:55 20:06 < sdziallas> hi Jefro 20:08:58 20:06 < Jefro> hi sebastian! hows things? 20:09:00 20:06 < alolita> mchua: i can wait but not too long - did they say when they can be available 20:09:04 20:06 < mchua> alolita: "shortly after 1" 20:09:06 20:07 < alolita> mchua: i see :-) i can be online till 130 - would that work 20:09:10 20:07 < alolita> mchua: i have pinged sameer and dr. white 20:09:12 20:07 < alolita> for apps 20:09:15 20:08 < alolita> mchua: sameer was out of town so said will send as soon as he's back 20:09:18 Excellent. 20:10:44 mchua: i have contacted santa clara university - the posse info has been circulated in the cs dept; i have also contacted some of the teachers directly 20:11:54 Jefro: hiya! sorry, got pulled aside, I'm here now. 20:11:56 mchua: so this week will be focusing on contacting more local campuses - major community colleges in south bay to get teachers 20:12:14 Jefro: I hear we're supposed to talk at some point re LinuxCon in a meeting :) 20:12:40 mchua: are there any applications we need to follow up on? 20:12:42 alolita: excellent - I noticed in your email you listed 7 profs and I only see 6 applications so far - I think I listed Dr. Tseng under SFSU mistakenly 20:12:46 really? cool! let's chat separately so they can meet 20:12:51 alolita: None yet, still waiting for replies, I'll reping. 20:13:05 Jefro, sdziallas: we'll be done in 17 minutes 20:13:17 thanks mchua - we'll chat offline 20:13:28 mchua: i think there was a error in recording :-) 6 instead of 7 right now 20:14:00 alolita: which is tight, because Tony can't make the entire session so we really need 5 that aren't him. 20:14:01 mchua: i had a question about the program - are we still doing the UI bug session 20:14:47 mchua: i agree - i am hoping that we can get at least a couple more profs from the community colleges also 20:15:09 alolita: No, Karsten and I will change that to a more recent Fedora-specific bug that's active when the POSSE week arrives. 20:15:31 mchua: ok that's cool - will you update the program? 20:15:36 alolita: Yep. 20:15:41 mchua: cool. 20:15:48 * mchua just called quaid, can't get through yet (phone network issues) 20:16:05 mchua: switching gears onto the virt session at mini posse 20:16:17 i read your comments - thanks for taking a look 20:16:29 i agree that day 2 and 3 can be swapped 20:16:53 I think quaid had some thoughts on the mini posse session - if he's not back in time, we'll ask him to send those to the list. 20:16:55 i think jeff s said he was going to forward the page url to his team at osl 20:16:59 * mchua nods 20:18:15 mchua: that's cool - i am glad he has some ideas about the program; while i do agree with you that it takes time to go through the community/communications sessions; i think we should assume a certain level of knowledge for such a program 20:18:35 alolita, mchua : hello 20:18:43 quaid: hi! welcome 20:18:45 quaid: hey! do you need backscroll? 20:18:48 sorry I'm late, it's the lunch window at this conference 20:18:52 nope, I'm reading right now 20:19:42 #info 5.5 potential attendees (still waiting for apps from 2, need resubmitted apps from 2) 20:19:45 the open source lab folks have quite a bit of immersion in doing open source 20:21:31 mchua: do you want me to send email to the 2 teachers to re-submit responses to some of the questions? 20:22:01 alolita: Sure, if you could cc myself and quaid on those that'd be great. 20:22:20 mchua: will do with cc's 20:23:53 quaid: did you have a chance to talk with jeff sheltren on the mini posse proposal 20:24:24 quaid: alolita has to go in 6m, so we should wrap up here soon :) 20:24:40 alolita: if any of the schools you are talking to are on our list for having been contacted, definitely go ahead and follow up with them 20:25:06 ok - i will update the tos page - also 20:25:37 ok, I'm up 20:26:03 I guess I should follow-up on list about the mini-event 20:26:24 to summarize - reading the first draft alolita did sparked a different set of ideas in my head: 20:26:31 good 20:26:41 * shorter info sessions to get 1:1 / 1:3 with teachers to explain why POSSE matters 20:26:53 (since it seems that is a barrier of understanding that many need to be helped over?) 20:27:14 * taking over the Fedora booth for the expo floor time to run 15 min edu Q/A/lighting talks 20:27:26 quaid: that's a good idea - i think it would if we could even do a 5 minute lightning talk style video 20:27:28 #info OSL interested in talking at lighting talks 20:28:05 alolita: what I saw in that first draft was that a piece of the content introducing new technology wasn't neccesarily something unique that we had to offer, while the bits about teaching open source participation is the unique, compelling stuff 20:28:19 but how do we show people they should be compelled by it, if they don't immediately see why? 20:28:20 quaid: great idea to do 15 minute lightning talks at the oscon fedora booth 20:28:52 thus - lightning talks, etc.-- also, Mel and I have that talk on Wed "5 important things that happened in education", so all these podiums 20:29:29 so I was wondering if we wanted to put more effort in having a "guerilla education summit" at OSCON instead of doing a one-off 2-day bootcamp just after/before 20:29:45 would we get in front of more eyes with the guerilla mini-summit? 20:29:55 or would we lose depth that 2 days get us? I'm not sure ... 20:30:07 and thus a topic for the list, to get opin from other educators. 20:30:24 quaid: i look at it as getting as many eyeballs as possible - we never lose depth 20:31:00 we focus our topic areas 20:31:24 and then get folks to do the week long hands-on class with posse's current format 20:32:06 quaid: i think a guerilla education summit is a good idea but organizing time is tight at this point 20:32:58 quaid: can you elaborate on what a guerrilla education summit would focus on 20:33:20 well, if both the OSU workshop and the OSCON lightning talks are geared towards getting people interested in a full POSSE - I'm not sure we need 2.5 full days at OSU, then... why not a lunchtime info session instead? 20:33:45 * mchua making a somewhat radical proposal here, based on percieved goals from this discussion 20:34:07 mchua: at oscon that may make sense 20:34:39 mchua: however from my feedback from silicon valley schools - they would like specialized topics in a posse like program 20:35:49 so it may not be a 1 off for oscon ; if our focus is oscon right now then going after fedora booth edu sessions and a info session at lunch time are all good 20:37:13 mchua: i will have to break off at 145 (max) 20:37:41 * mchua nods 20:38:04 mchua: it looks like you would like to keep a full POSSE format and have info sessions to gather people into it - which works for a conference :-) 20:38:41 alolita: I'd like to keep a full POSSE format... I think 2.5 days works for technical skills training, but isn't enough time for community immersion, just because of the speed at which some of these conversations need to move. 20:38:56 alolita: I'm also a little nervous that neither of us (afaik) are actually virt hackers ourselves 20:39:10 however the universities who are not at such a conference - how do we get them involved? 20:39:30 so I'm not sure whether, if the goal is "silicon valley area professors are interested in technical skills acquisition," it might make more sense to just try and get a developer to give a tech talk at one of the unis 20:39:33 understood - so our mantra is open source participation 20:40:02 alolita: Slowly. :) I think this is something we start building locally over a period of 2-3 years. It'l take longer to get more traction than a few professors. 20:40:11 Academia moves at a pace that's very different from the FOSS world. 20:40:34 basically, I'm interested in working with those who are already interested - at least in the beginning - no matter who they are or where they're from. 20:40:52 mchua: i know :-) but you still have to intersect with faculty goals in order to have them participate 20:40:55 focus on making those folks succeed. And then once they do, a few others will start looking at them and trying to figure out how to replicate that work. 20:41:23 alolita: Right, but we don't need more than a few more each time - I guess what I'm trying to say is that we should look for profs whose goals are already aligned with ours 20:41:33 because they are out there, we just didn't look for them early enough this time. 20:43:24 mchua: well - the profs exist at diff levels and we have been scouring for them in the last 3 months - however i agree that different layers exist and such an activity to scour the ecosystem and work with teachers to come to a POSSE needs more organized resources 20:43:34 alolita: I know you have to go now, though - when do we need a go/no-go on the virt workshop by? 20:44:21 mchua: we should do it by next week since the later we introduce it to osu ; the slimmer the chances of it happening around oscon 20:44:38 I think we're set on POSSE - the go/no-go for that is Thursday, so it's just aggressive pinging 'till then, and you and quaid and I all know what we need to do. 20:44:55 if we need to pick up the phone and call people, that's what needs to happen. 20:45:09 mchua: yes - that is Thursday 20:45:35 quaid: did you hear back from the colleges you emailed? 20:46:14 can we get some of the osl folks to be at the calif posse if they don't do a mini posse around oscon 20:46:21 * quaid gets network back 20:46:39 we should try to maximize our reach (to the extent possible) in the month we have now 20:46:56 alolita: that would be great, if OSL folks are interested! 20:47:59 i can send them an invitation to attend posse in california if we are sure we don't want to do any thing else with osl at oscon 20:48:22 I haven't heard back from any schools that I mass mailed. 20:48:29 alolita: I think we should send them an invitation regardless, but sure. :) 20:48:41 quaid: that's ok - cold calling is a long shot, and the template emails are reusable for later (and very good!) 20:48:44 thanks for doing that. 20:48:45 mchua: ok i will send an invite then 20:48:50 * mchua is a fan of planting seeds for later, in any case. 20:48:54 alolita: thank you! 20:48:56 quaid: i agree cold calling will not help 20:49:06 Really, education is a long-term game... it's the sort of thing that takes several years to even get started. 20:49:19 which, for me, is a difficult mindshift, being from the FOSS world where 6 months is an eternity. 20:49:25 well, I think one of the people (O'Brien) might have come from that sweep. 20:49:59 mchua: yes but there are lots of short term engagement steps - nothing works long term (in my experience) if there is nothing short term with it 20:50:03 even in education 20:50:13 * mchua agrees. 20:50:55 so think of engagement - constant engagement - its always ends up being long -term in terms of iterative development :-) 20:51:44 so anyway - i should have more progress to report on thursday - i better buzz off now - quaid do send your ideas on activities around oscon so that we all can help 20:52:03 * mchua has to jet 20:52:21 mchua, quaid: ttyl then! bye! 20:53:08 #endmeeting