18:00:04 <felixfontein> #startmeeting Ansible Community Meeting
18:00:04 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Aug 24 18:00:04 2022 UTC.
18:00:04 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
18:00:04 <zodbot> The chair is felixfontein. Information about MeetBot at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Zodbot#Meeting_Functions.
18:00:04 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
18:00:04 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'ansible_community_meeting'
18:00:04 <felixfontein> #topic Agenda https://github.com/ansible/community/issues/645
18:00:05 <felixfontein> acozine andersson007_ baptistemm bcoca briantist cyberpear cybette dericcrago dmsimard felixfontein geerlingguy gundalow gwmngilfen ikhan_ jillr jtanner lmodemal misc nitzmahone resmo samccann tadeboro cidrblock thaumos zbr: ping!
18:00:08 <andersson007_> o/
18:00:08 <felixfontein> #info Agenda: https://github.com/ansible/community/issues/645 / Topics: https://github.com/ansible-community/community-topics
18:00:11 <felixfontein> #topic Updates
18:00:20 <felixfontein> #chair andersson007_
18:00:20 <zodbot> Current chairs: andersson007_ felixfontein
18:00:36 <cybette_> o/
18:00:36 <samccann> 0/
18:00:51 <felixfontein> #chair cybette_ samccann
18:00:51 <zodbot> Current chairs: andersson007_ cybette_ felixfontein samccann
18:01:12 <briantist> o/
18:01:15 <DonNaro[m]> o/
18:01:33 <felixfontein> #chair briantist DonNaro[m]
18:01:33 <zodbot> Current chairs: DonNaro[m] andersson007_ briantist cybette_ felixfontein samccann
18:02:16 <mariolenz[m]> o/
18:02:19 <felixfontein> #chair mariolenz[m]
18:02:19 <zodbot> Current chairs: DonNaro[m] andersson007_ briantist cybette_ felixfontein mariolenz[m] samccann
18:02:25 <felixfontein> #info Ansible 6.3.0 has been released!
18:04:39 <felixfontein> is anyone else feeling tired after a long day? :)
18:04:52 <felixfontein> ok, not all of you had a long day yet... ;)
18:05:33 <misc> you can still before tired after a short day
18:05:50 <DonNaro[m]> I'm with you felixfontein looOOooong day today. I mysteriously woke up at 5 am.
18:05:55 <cybette_> I'm tired after a long week. oh wait it's only wednesday...
18:06:08 <felixfontein> DonNaro[m]: haha, here it was no mystery, but one of our cats...
18:06:27 <felixfontein> misc: cybette_: indeed!
18:06:44 <mariolenz[m]> Not only long, too hot, too.
18:07:06 <felixfontein> how hot is it for you?
18:07:16 <felixfontein> here it got up to 28 degrees (celsius), but not more fortunately
18:07:51 <DonNaro[m]> it's a balmy 17C here
18:07:55 <mariolenz[m]> 31
18:08:17 <mariolenz[m]> Should we do something about [dellemc.os6/9/10](https://github.com/ansible-community/community-topics/issues/128#issuecomment-1225846837)? Theay look unmaintained to me.
18:08:34 <briantist> currently 31°C here too
18:08:36 <felixfontein> DonNaro[m]: oooh, nice!
18:09:11 <felixfontein> 31 is definitely too hot for working
18:09:11 <felixfontein> (at least for me)
18:09:11 <felixfontein> maybe we should consider moving to ireland ;)
18:09:19 <felixfontein> seems like a cool place
18:09:34 <DonNaro[m]> the tradeoff is rain, lots of rain
18:09:48 * briantist has to change the weather app to °C to compare to everyone else ;)
18:10:21 <mariolenz[m]> Ireland is nice. I've been to Cork several times and it was always great.
18:10:53 <DonNaro[m]> Galway is the best though (ofc I'm biased)
18:11:04 <felixfontein> mariolenz[m]: thanks for actually bringing us back to topic...! should we start the unmaintained process for them?
18:11:31 <felixfontein> I've only been to Dublin once so far
18:12:24 <mariolenz[m]> Thats the question. If we agree that they look unmaintained, I would start the process. OK?
18:12:34 <felixfontein> DonNaro[m]: I like this joke, like it only rains three times per year in Ireland... once from January to April, once from Mid-April to August, and once from September to December
18:13:04 <DonNaro[m]> felixfontein: rofl. that's spot on though.
18:13:24 <felixfontein> commit histories: https://github.com/ansible-collections/dellemc.os10/commits/master https://github.com/ansible-collections/dellemc.os9/commits/master https://github.com/ansible-collections/dellemc.os6/commits/master
18:14:22 <felixfontein> dellemc.os10 apparently had a commit since the 1.2.0 release... except that that release was never published
18:14:57 <felixfontein> but maybe starting the removal process (by announcing this in The Bullhorn and in the collection repos) would be a wake-up call to the maintainers
18:15:01 <remindbot[m]> @cybette:ansible.im cyb-clock chimes every 15 minutes during the community meeting
18:15:09 <felixfontein> either they wake up, or well, that's probably it
18:15:21 <felixfontein> might also be useful to get some input from the ansible network folks on this
18:15:48 <felixfontein> they might know more about these collections (maybe even rumors from users?)
18:16:54 <andersson007_> afaik dell maintains them on their own
18:17:38 <andersson007_> anyway, if we had corresponding topics/issues, it'd look more serious
18:17:51 <mariolenz[m]> Additionally, the last commits to dellemc.os10 were from andersson007_ whos just tried to fix some things but isn't really a maintainer of the collection, as far as I can see.
18:18:10 <andersson007_> yep
18:18:58 <andersson007_> moreover, independent folks submit PRs but they haven't been reviewed by dell's maintainers
18:19:58 <andersson007_> looks abandoned
18:20:08 <andersson007_> issues are also ignored
18:20:20 <mariolenz[m]> OK, so I'll start the process to declare those collections unmaintained? Agreed?
18:21:26 <cybette_> +1
18:21:30 <andersson007_> +1
18:21:34 <felixfontein> +1
18:22:13 <DonNaro[m]> +1
18:23:10 <felixfontein> cool, I think we agree then to start the process
18:23:25 <mariolenz[m]> Good, then I'll do. Anything else to discuss?
18:23:40 <felixfontein> so we'll announce that we will vote about determining whether the collections are unmaintained in ~one month, and then see whether something happens
18:23:49 <felixfontein> (in case anyone forgot how this works)
18:24:40 <felixfontein> #info We want to start the unmaintained removal process for dellemc.os(10|9|6) to determine whether they are unmaintained, and if they are, remove them from Ansible in the future
18:25:38 <felixfontein> dmsimard started working on sanity testing all collections some months back
18:25:52 <felixfontein> and also posted about errors in the collection repos
18:26:01 <felixfontein> (I noticed when looking at the dellemc.os* repos ;) )
18:26:17 <felixfontein> maybe we should follow-up on the collections which ignored that so far
18:26:45 <felixfontein> and/or discuss what to do if a collection continues to ignore this
18:27:04 <felixfontein> I guess there are two possiblities: the collection actually is unmaintained; or the maintainers actively ignore it
18:27:14 <andersson007_> ignore = unmaintained
18:27:26 <felixfontein> in the latter case, we might want to think about throwing them out as well
18:27:50 <felixfontein> andersson007_: could also be not enough time to fix 1000s of sanity errors, but still fixing other stuff (which actually breaks some users)
18:28:19 <mariolenz[m]> Why is "ignored" different from "unmaintained"?
18:28:24 <felixfontein> I would still expect at least a response in that case (along the lines of 'sorry, we have too little time for that, and are busy with other maintainer things')
18:28:35 <andersson007_> +1
18:28:51 <felixfontein> you can ignore a specific issue, but still fix bugs, implement features, ...
18:29:00 <felixfontein> the latter two things do not count as unmaintained
18:29:11 <andersson007_> you can't ignore issues with collection requirements:)
18:29:24 <felixfontein> well, you can, it's mainly that you should not :)
18:29:28 <andersson007_> you can if your collection is out of the package:)
18:29:44 <felixfontein> (so far we never enforced the requirements on already included collections, so so far the strategy 'ignore' worked well...)
18:30:01 <remindbot[m]> @cybette:ansible.im cyb-clock chimes every 15 minutes during the community meeting
18:30:01 <mariolenz[m]> Well, yes. A specific PR or issue. But it looks like they igonre all PRs and issues.
18:30:14 <felixfontein> (it's like saying that the person jumping from a skyscraper is still reporting "everything's fine so far" also on the second floor)
18:30:16 <andersson007_> yeah
18:30:54 <felixfontein> mariolenz[m]: you mean dellemc? yes. I meant in general, some collections might ignore our sanity errors issue, but not others
18:31:10 <felixfontein> (I was about to write 'ignore our sanity issue'...)
18:33:01 <cybette_> I don't have sanity issue because I don't have sanity
18:33:16 <felixfontein> haha!
18:33:27 <felixfontein> sanity is for .... sane people, I guess
18:33:34 <cybette_> :D
18:34:10 <andersson007_> my collection is absolutely sane, it doesn't need to be checked
18:34:22 <mariolenz[m]> felixfontein: Sorry, I didn't see this. But yes, it's a problem if collections are maintained but ignore our sanity errors issues.
18:34:26 <andersson007_> once is enough
18:34:34 <andersson007_> at inclusion
18:34:47 <felixfontein> :)
18:36:02 * felixfontein just opened one tab for every sanity issue referenced in https://github.com/ansible-community/community-topics/issues/96
18:37:28 * andersson007_ thinks that felixfontein has a lot of memory in his laptop
18:37:31 <cybette_> felixfontein: did that crash your browser?
18:37:51 <felixfontein> not yet
18:38:07 <felixfontein> I usually have a lot of tabs open anyway, my firefox is pretty battle tested ;)
18:38:56 <andersson007_> robust and proven
18:39:03 <andersson007_> can be relied on
18:39:27 <andersson007_> :)
18:39:58 <felixfontein> ok, so I guess we should re-run the sanity tests on all included collections as well, to see how much changed
18:40:25 <felixfontein> andersson007_: I think dmsimard worked on this while being in your team, do you have access to the scripts / results / ... he created?
18:41:07 <andersson007_> felixfontein: i should check, though i think i have the same as you all have
18:41:50 <andersson007_> i saw only the issues
18:42:51 <andersson007_> iirc there's a link to the script he used somewhere in the issues
18:43:12 <felixfontein> ok, I guess we can investigate and ask him when we cannot figure it out ourselves :)
18:43:26 <felixfontein> is there anything else someone wants to talk about?
18:45:00 <remindbot[m]> @cybette:ansible.im cyb-clock chimes every 15 minutes during the community meeting
18:49:38 <felixfontein> if nothing else comes up, we should stop early :)
18:50:31 <mariolenz[m]> I'm trying to find the issue / discussion from dmsimard about the collections that have sanity problems. I f someone knows it please post it here as a kind of reference. Apart from this, I don't think I have anything else to discuss.
18:51:02 <felixfontein> mariolenz[m]: do you mean https://github.com/ansible-community/community-topics/issues/96 ?
18:52:18 <felixfontein> #endmeeting