<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:01:43
!startmeeting docs
<@meetbot:fedora.im>
13:01:45
Meeting started at 2026-02-10 13:01:43 UTC
<@meetbot:fedora.im>
13:01:45
The Meeting name is 'docs'
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:02:08
!hi
<@zodbot:fedora.im>
13:02:11
Justin Wheeler (jflory7) - he / him / his
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:02:14
Peter Boy (ServerWG, Docs): A little late, but I am here 🙂
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:02:16
Good afternoon!
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:02:27
OK, good!
<@nielsenb:fedora.im>
13:02:36
!hi
<@zodbot:fedora.im>
13:02:37
Brandon Nielsen (nielsenb)
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:02:45
How can I hand over the chair?
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:02:48
Still in a bit of recovery from all of the traveling in the last 12 days 🙂
<@shaunm:matrix.org>
13:03:10
!hi
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:03:15
Peter Boy (ServerWG, Docs): No action needed in Matrix. Meetbot in Matrix does not have the concept of chairs.
<@hricky:fedora.im>
13:03:15
!hi
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:03:16
!chair Justin Wheeler
<@zodbot:fedora.im>
13:03:17
Hristo Marinov (hricky) - he / him / his
<@zodbot:fedora.im>
13:03:18
Shaun McCance (shaunm) - he / him / his
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:04:28
Nice quorum today!
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:04:47
Peter Boy (ServerWG, Docs): Do we have an agenda prepared? Or do we need to wing it a bit?
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:04:55
I know there are topics we have been discussing… my mind is a bit blank.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:05:04
We could give an update about the Council Strategy Summit to open.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:05:11
I made a proposas in our group.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:05:24
Aha. Let me bring it forward to this room
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:05:50
Unfortunately, we didn't plan today's meeting very well. After our last meeting, we first attended CentOS connect & FOSDEM and then went straight to a week-long council meeting.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:05:50
!topic Agenda
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:05:57
!info Follow-up actions & announcements
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:06:00
!info Contributor documentation – how to proceed
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:06:04
!info Quick Docs content structure – how to proceed
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:06:08
!info Administrator Guide – Next steps
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:06:12
!info Open Floor
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:06:32
Peter Boy (ServerWG, Docs): I think we can allow ourselves some grace, given the last 12 days have been very active ones for you, me, and Petr Bokoc!
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:07:06
Yes, I think so! I'm more exausted as I expected and have got a serious flu.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:07:17
And still missing my Laptop
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:07:17
Brandon Nielsen, Hristo Marinov, shaunm: Also, hi! Nice to see all of you folks 👋
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:07:21
I hope you are all doing well 🙂
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:07:42
Peter Boy (ServerWG, Docs): Oh, I hope you get some time to recover and rest too. I am seeing a lot of folks with the FOSDEM-flu this week 😅
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:07:48
!topic Follow-up actions & announcements
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
13:08:02
!hi
<@zodbot:fedora.im>
13:08:03
Mat H (theprogram)
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:08:10
Peter Boy (ServerWG, Docs): Do you want to write a short `!info` update about the CentOS Connect docs workshop, and I will write a short `!info` about the Strategy Summit?
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:08:26
OK.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:08:43
Hi MatH, good evening! 👋
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:08:49
Peter Boy (ServerWG, Docs): Ready, set, go 🙂
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:10:23
!info The Fedora Council held its annual Strategy Summit (formerly known as Hackfest) last week in Tirana, Albania. One of the three days was dedicated to Fedora Community Initiatives. Co-leads @pboy and @pbokoc presented on the status of the Initiative, raised concerns and needs for resources, and participated in overall discussion about the next year in strategy for Fedora. Daily summaries of the Summit were shared on Fedora Discussion. Feedback and comments are welcome on Fedora Discussion about our topics, including but not limited to the Docs Initiative.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:10:25
!link https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/t/fedora-council-2026-strategy-summit-daily-briefings-summaries-tirana-albania/180535/5
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:10:31
!link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Council/2026_Strategy_Summit
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:11:02
MatH: Thanks for jumping into the discussion over there too. I have a half-finished reply in my Discussion window, I'll try to get that done today if the day will be so kind to me 🙂
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:11:22
!info We held a workshop on Docs on CentOS connect. The most important outcome: We are launching a PoC to design Fedora Docs as upstream in specific areas. W'll start with a tutorial about "Setting up a full blown mail service" first for fedora an then for CentOS (which has some different/older versions of some parts).
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:11:32
Hristo Marinov, Brandon Nielsen, shaunm: Would love your input on the topic too, either in #docs:fedoraproject.org or directly on the Fedora Discussion topic too.
<@nielsenb:fedora.im>
13:12:13
Neat!
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:12:22
As a consequence, we would have to "version" our docs for each release.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:13:22
e.g. F44, F45, etc. And also, the versioning for docs like Quick Docs, right? Or other docs components/sites?
<@shaunm:matrix.org>
13:13:37
Interesting. In the CentOS doc day, there were mixed opinions on CentOS even trying to do generalized docs for using the software we ship, leaning mostly against. But if we have a pipeline from Fedora for those kinds of docs, it might change opinions.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:13:54
We can chat a bit on the CentOS Connect and Strategy Summit sessions. While we chat, I will pull up the action items from the last meeting.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:13:58
QuickDocs anyway, probably other, too, e.g. Server
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:14:03
!info Quick action item review from 27 January meeting
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:14:08
!link https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/meeting_matrix_fedoraproject-org/2026-01-27/docs.2026-01-27-13.06.html
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:14:36
So, like CentOS desktop user-focused docs? Or something else?
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:14:55
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:14:55
- @pboy Update Docs Team ticket about Quick Docs with today's discussion and next steps for the 10 February 2026 meeting
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:14:55
- @jflory7 Prepare a next meeting topic for opening up the contribution call for the Fedora Docs homepage project
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:14:55
- @pboy Edit the Forgejo issue for the Docs homepage task to describe the "three phases" approach to this ticket.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:14:55
- @pbokoc Migrate the Fedora Docs "pages" repository from GitLab to Forgejo by the next team meeting on 10 February 2026
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:14:55
## Past action items
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:14:55
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:15:15
shaunm: Do you mean docs day this year? I was told it would be about tools, not content.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:15:48
So, on my action item, I need to re-action. I did not get a chance to do it before this meeting. But we did have some nice discussion in #docs:fedoraproject.org and it seems like Muneer was interested in helping with the Docs home page effort!
<@shaunm:matrix.org>
13:15:49
There was no hard agenda. There was a good turnout, and different people worked on different things.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:15:50
!action @jflory7 Prepare a next meeting topic for opening up the contribution call for the Fedora Docs homepage project
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:16:24
Petr Bokoc: Ping, are you around? If yes, could you provide an update on "@pbokoc Migrate the Fedora Docs "pages" repository from GitLab to Forgejo by the next team meeting on 10 February 2026"? If no, I will re-action.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:16:41
shaunm: We should consider for next year to do it together?
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:16:48
Peter Boy (ServerWG, Docs) Any update on these, or should we re-action too?
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:16:48
- @pboy Update Docs Team ticket about Quick Docs with today's discussion and next steps for the 10 February 2026 meeting
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:16:48
- @pboy Edit the Forgejo issue for the Docs homepage task to describe the "three phases" approach to this ticket.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:16:48
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:16:54
I like this idea!
<@shaunm:matrix.org>
13:16:57
Not desktop specifically. Admining a mail server is something many people feel is out of scope, largely because people don't feel we have the capacity for the maintenance.
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
13:17:42
It is also the multiple systems that have to be installed and work together
<@shaunm:matrix.org>
13:18:07
Absolutely love to have Fedora folks join on Monday. It would be difficult for most CentOS folks (me especially) to commit to anything during Connect.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:18:12
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:18:12
> Admining a mail server is something many people feel is out of scope,
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:18:12
Wondering, there are maye request to get information how to install a mail service.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:18:34
Wondering, there are many request to get information how to install a mail service.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:18:34
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:18:34
> Admining a mail server is something many people feel is out of scope,
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:18:45
We started a discussion about moving the Strategy Summit *before* FOSDEM, so we may be able to take better advantage of that in 2027
<@shaunm:matrix.org>
13:18:46
(going somewhat afk now as I get a kid ready for school)
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:19:09
shaunm: Monday would be perfect fo me
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:20:50
Regarding @pboy Update Docs Team ticket about Quick Docs with today's discussion and next steps for the 10 February 2026 meeting – it is "ongoing" 😉
<@nielsenb:fedora.im>
13:21:27
Is a mailserver somehow not a good fit for containerization?
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:22:08
OK. In the interest of time, let's re-action the old action items. I think we were being too ambitious on January 27th 🙂
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:22:17
We will transition over to the main agenda topics.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:22:21
Brandon Nielsen: May be, but not necessarily. Depends on how you integrate it with other services and with basic system administration.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:22:26
If we have time in open floor, let's discuss the mail server topic in more detail!
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:22:45
!action @pbokoc Migrate the Fedora Docs "pages" repository from GitLab to Forgejo by the next team meeting on 24 February 2026
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:22:57
!action @pboy Edit the Forgejo issue for the Docs homepage task to describe the "three phases" approach to this ticket.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:23:13
!action @pboy Update Docs Team ticket about Quick Docs with today's discussion and next steps for the 24 February 2026 meeting
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:23:36
Well, "today's discussion" means 27 January, but I think we can remember that detail 🙂
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:23:42
Alrighty.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:23:53
That covers all of the past action items.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:24:05
Not much to report, but I think the CentOS Connect + Council Summit topics were big ones!
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:24:07
We can
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:24:09
Let's proceed ➡️
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:24:34
!topic Contributor documentation – how to proceed
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:24:52
Peter Boy (ServerWG, Docs): Do you want to introduce this topic?
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:25:04
Yes.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:26:37
- a local authiring part
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:26:37
- a web editing part using gitlab
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:26:37
- an introduction how to update an article or to write a new one.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:26:37
- a web editing part using pagure
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:26:37
The contributor Docs consists of various parts.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:27:06
All of these should get a review and a plan, what to improve.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:27:32
see: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/fedora-docs/contributing-docs/
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:28:02
First question is, who could take on which part.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:28:31
Of course. pagure is outdated. as to be replaced by forgejo
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:29:08
If I am seeing it right, I think we have a ticket open already for the first one, at least.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:29:10
!link https://forge.fedoraproject.org/docs/tickets/issues/1
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:29:44
!link https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/fedora-docs/contributing-docs/tools-local-authoring-env/
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:29:56
Peter Boy (ServerWG, Docs): This^^ is the specific page we want to improve. Right?
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:30:53
Yes, regarding the local authoring, which probably remains the main tool for the forseeable future.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:31:34
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/fedora-docs/contributing-docs/tools-web-ide-ui/
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:31:34
This one is about Gitlab:
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:31:57
It is quite outdated, because GitLab used to modify the GUI a lot at some times.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:32:16
OK. I am thinking this overall topic has two "branches": the strategy of what assistance we provide to new writers, and the actual labor of updating the docs.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:33:00
For the strategy, in my personal view, we should drop the GitLab and Pagure docs entirely. Later, we can replace them with Forgejo. But I think we might be stretching ourselves out too much, and duplicating other information about using git forges.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:33:12
I think we should only have two pages: the local environment and Forgejo.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:33:28
This is easier for us to maintain. The local environment instructions should not change much either over time.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:33:40
Forgejo should be mostly static/unchanging too, but I know we are in the early days of getting set up there.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:33:46
Is this a sensible idea?
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:33:59
I hope, many or all projects migrate to forgejo. Or at least their documentation.
<@hricky:fedora.im>
13:34:13
Imho, as I mentioned before, I'm not (yet) convinced that we need to teach people how to use Git, its online platforms, and text editors.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:34:28
!idea @jflory7: Drop the GitLab and Pagure pages entirely. We might be stretching ourselves too thin by maintaining all of this docs. The local environment page is more helpful as a starting point.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:34:37
Hristo Marinov: I agree too, personally
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:34:50
There are lots of docs out there for learning. We should be pointing them out, not re-writing them
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
13:35:05
I think that is what we should be aiming for
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:35:22
On the other side: many authors struggle with the Git workflow and want help!
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:35:35
That's a long term critical issue!
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:35:36
A strength and weakness of Antora is that you can use any git forge. I think we need to have strong opinions. Our strong opinion is that Forgejo is the preferred place to work. If a team chooses to use another tool, then that team should take responsibility to help their new contributors.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:35:56
So we need something like "Git for authors".
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:36:25
I also think it is not our job to solve this issue for the entire open source world. We can provide pointers and advice, but we should not re-invent the wheel by re-writing what already exists too
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
13:36:40
Git is really well documented in a number of places already
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
13:36:40
And we have a lot of people willing to teach Git in Join and Devel etc
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:36:58
That is also true too, we can lean on our friendly, neighborhood Join SIG for help with the basics.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:37:15
!idea The Fedora Join SIG has capacity and interest in helping newcomers with basic git skills.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:38:07
> I also think it is not our job to solve this issue for the entire open source world.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:38:07
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:38:07
Tell this those authores who struggled with Git and then choose to drop off, because it is too far away from workflows an author is used to.
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
13:38:53
Having Git tutes would be good, but I do not think it is the low hanging fruit
<@nielsenb:fedora.im>
13:39:24
Wasn't this kind of my point in the first two meetings, any friction we add leads to fewer contributors, and Arch Wiki is successful because there is so little friction.
<@nielsenb:fedora.im>
13:39:53
I think we just have to accept going with a Git flow is higher friction, no matter how well we document it.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:40:34
Brandon Nielsen: Yes, but we have Antora / git now. And we should make the best of it, resp. help our authors as best as we can.
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
13:40:43
Don't we already have a Git for Docs tutorial somewhere?
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:41:07
So, I think we are all agreeing in a sense. But stating the agreement in different ways 🙂
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:41:08
MatH: I wrote kind of that for Server.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:41:42
I think we agree that docs for helping new authors is helpful.
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
13:41:48
Yes - that is what I was thinking of - it was comprehensive and could be repurposed?
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:41:53
I _think_ we agree that we do not need to write all of this and maintain it ourselves too.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:42:07
We can be tactical and provide pointers to other advice, information, and docs online.
<@shaunm:matrix.org>
13:42:16
Im certain we wrote that in gnome over a decade ago. This feels like a problem that should have a generalized solution.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:42:18
MatH: I wrote kind of that for Server.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:42:18
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/server-working-group/usr-docs-maintenance/gitcheatsheet-for-authors/
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:42:18
I think we need to "refactor" our pages to consider this point.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:42:22
Does this sound right?
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:43:07
To make sure we have time for other topics, let me try and write a proposal for an `!agreed` comment, and then we can try and action the first step.
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
13:43:15
I agree with Justin on this point. There is a lot of work to do, and we want to radically increase our docs autor base - so we need to remove as many issues as much as we can in the next year.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:44:34
!proposed The Fedora Docs Team agrees that providing starting points for new authors in Fedora Docs is useful. However, the Fedora Docs Team has limited capacity to maintain several different docs for several different writing workflows. The team needs to have strong opinions about what tools we recommend for working. Therefore, we will drop the GitLab and Pagure pages, refine the local authoring page to link out to other information, and later, create a new Forgejo page.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:44:38
MatH: Most authors don't want to "learn" git. It is somethinge they will never use elsewhere. Thes need simple instructions what to do to reach a specific authoring goal.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:44:40
What do we think of this? ^^
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:44:44
+1 / 0 / -1?
<@hricky:fedora.im>
13:45:28
Again, this is just my humble opinion and I completely agree that we need more and new contributors, but can someone who doesn't know how to use Git and a text editor contribute to the technical docs of a Linux distro?
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:46:09
## 14 minutes remaining: time check!
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
13:46:13
I agree with you Peter, however the over-riding principle is 'getting the job done, so I am voting +1 with Justin at this time
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:46:15
Well, Does that include a Git recipe for specific authoring tasks during local authoring?
<@nielsenb:fedora.im>
13:46:21
There is no way out of the "learn git" hole if the architecture we're going on uses git...
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:46:39
Peter Boy (ServerWG, Docs): For my proposal? I think we need to let the person who takes on ticket #1 craft the proposal.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:46:56
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:46:56
> to use Git and a text editor contribute
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:46:56
Any author knows how to use a text editor, but not git!
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
13:47:08
I disagree, Linux is massive and not everyone is a developer using Git
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:47:29
Peter Boy (ServerWG, Docs), Hristo Marinov, Brandon Nielsen: We need to move the discussion forward, and I am not sure we have the time to discuss this further on the strategy. As a compromise, could you please give a vote on the proposal above?
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:47:43
+1
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
13:47:51
+1
<@nielsenb:fedora.im>
13:47:52
+1
<@hricky:fedora.im>
13:48:08
+1
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:48:14
OK. Great, thanks!
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:48:15
!agreed The Fedora Docs Team agrees that providing starting points for new authors in Fedora Docs is useful. However, the Fedora Docs Team has limited capacity to maintain several different docs for several different writing workflows. The team needs to have strong opinions about what tools we recommend for working. Therefore, we will drop the GitLab and Pagure pages, refine the local authoring page to link out to other information, and later, create a new Forgejo page.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:48:23
Now…
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:48:28
Does anyone want to take on Ticket #1? 🙂 https://forge.fedoraproject.org/docs/tickets/issues/1
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:49:00
I think this ticket would be the best "first step" on the authoring docs piece, and once we have a Pull Request, we can debate more.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:49:04
Some tome ago, Eli want to take this.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:49:21
Eli?
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:49:24
I can contact her after our meeting
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:49:31
Ah, okay.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:49:37
Just curious though…
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:49:45
Yes, Eli is part of our initiative team.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:49:46
Does anyone here in the meeting right now have a strong interest in working on this?
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:50:08
Oh, I think I have a new name to meet 🙂
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:50:46
!info @pboy will follow up with Eli to see if they want to work on Ticket #1, on improving the local authoring workflow for Fedora Docs.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:51:14
!halp Interested in helping with Ticket #1, on improving the local authoring workflow for Fedora Docs? Please add a comment to the issue, and we will continue working asynchronously ahead of our next meeting.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:51:44
Since we only have a few minutes remaining, let's move to the next topic. I think we covered some important points, and I'll make sure to write up a summary of today's meeting discussion for Fedora Discussion after we finish.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:51:51
Moving ahead… ➡️
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:52:00
!topic Quick Docs content structure – how to proceed
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:52:21
My brain is a bit hazy, but if I remember right, Brandon Nielsen was the person who spent a lot of time cataloguing the Quick Docs pages. Am I remembering right?
<@nielsenb:fedora.im>
13:52:37
Yes
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:52:52
!link https://pagure.io/fedora-docs/quick-docs/issue/923
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:52:53
The thing is, QD is a complex beast. We must somehow braek
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:53:04
break it down.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:53:46
One idea: to pick one or 2 articles that are outdated and are about complex hardware
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:53:59
Peter Boy (ServerWG, Docs): I think Brandon Nielsen did a great first step here of cataloguing the Quick Docs by maintenance status, and the last time they were updated
<@nielsenb:fedora.im>
13:54:07
By the way, whatever magic is allowing link previews to not just be the Anubis "making sure you're not bot..." thing is great
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:54:56
Then try to get needed information and establish a kind of subgroups
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:55:03
I have a question. Maybe a big one, for the six minutes we have remaining 😄
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:55:12
Probably candidates: kernel, graphic cards
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:55:15
Is the goal to change the information architecture? Or just to update the outdated things?
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:55:24
Do we want better organization? Or better content?
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:55:48
Both. 😀
<@nielsenb:fedora.im>
13:55:54
Are we agreed "quick docs" in persisting?
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
13:56:03
Content. As there is for most users (I assume) a link from a search engine to the content.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:56:07
There is a saying, "it is not prioritization until it hurts" 😄 Which one do we want more?
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:56:36
Brandon Nielsen: I think we _do_ want Quick Docs to exist in some format, but we might need to revisit how we present the info to readers.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:56:40
Brandon Nielsen: QD will kind of persistent as an "non-edition related" documentation. And will include Admin Guide.
<@nielsenb:fedora.im>
13:56:40
If "Quick Docs" is going to be a thing going forward, I would brush up the content first
<@perpetrator1:matrix.org>
13:56:53
[@jflory7:fedora.im](https://matrix.to/#/@jflory7:fedora.im) im really sorry, something came up so i can't be there
<@nielsenb:fedora.im>
13:56:55
Which includes jettisoning anything that is better served elsewhere, or should be elsewhere
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:56:57
We created Quick Docs in 2018 as a place to dump useful Wiki pages that had no other good home in Fedora Docs.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:57:13
Muneer: No worries! We will have meeting summary later. We'll catch up in #docs:fedoraproject.org 👍️
<@nielsenb:fedora.im>
13:57:27
Which will step on some toes, but we need to reduce the burden
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:57:30
We want to make structural modifications, too. -> Categories & tags instead of navigation bar.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:57:52
Oof. I always get sad when we have big, fun topics and not enough minutes to discuss them in depth 😄
<@nielsenb:fedora.im>
13:58:00
I'm not sure we can say how best to navigate the content, until we know what content there will even be
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:58:06
I am thinking, a great first step is perhaps figuring out which Quick Docs pages we can "jettison", as you said
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:58:20
Because some things may belong better in other Docs sites that we did not have in 2018-2020
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:58:51
what is "jettison" ?
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:58:52
It would be good to audit that list of pages in the Quick Docs issue to see if pages should be "owned" by another team or group
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:59:06
Peter Boy (ServerWG, Docs): Like to eject them from Quick Docs. Drop them and move them somewhere else.
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
13:59:09
Out the hatch. to get rid of, th throw overboard
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
13:59:42
Brandon Nielsen: Unfortunately we are nearly out of time for today's meeting, but is this a research task you would feel comfortable owning for the next meeting?
<@pboy:fedora.im>
13:59:50
Folks, read the initative paper. There is a lot about restructuring QD and how and what goal 😀
<@nielsenb:fedora.im>
14:00:08
Sure
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
14:00:30
It is a lot easier to restructure valid and minimal content
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
14:00:41
Peter Boy (ServerWG, Docs): I see this:
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
14:00:43
!link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Initiatives/Fedora_Docs_2025#Expanded
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
14:00:50
Jettison is a great first task
<@nielsenb:fedora.im>
14:00:55
I'll just tack it on that ticket, with whatever justifications for my thoughts, kinda how I figured this was going anyway
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
14:01:03
Peter Boy (ServerWG, Docs): I think we likely need a new Docs Team ticket to break down the big picture view for the Quick Docs.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
14:01:19
Let's discuss in our next Initiatives co-lead chat with Petr about this one too.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
14:01:39
Brandon Nielsen: I will action you for the research task, and then we will wrap up for today!
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
14:02:10
!info More discussion is needed about the bigger picture view for Quick Docs. There is some context in the Initiative proposal about organization, but it has not yet been moved into a ticket.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
14:03:05
!action @nielsenb Add a new comment to Quick Docs #923 to audit what Quick Docs pages might fit into another Fedora Docs site or be owned by another team, and what pages still make sense to keep inside of Quick Docs. Also, consider if some pages should be retired altogether if they are no longer relevant.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
14:03:14
I think this will cover it.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
14:03:17
!topic Open floor
<@theprogram:fedora.im>
14:03:25
RE: mail servers, here is an interesting link that makes things a lot easier to deploy https://www.xmox.nl/
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
14:03:35
!info Our meeting was packed to the brim! We have no time for open floor and must yield the meeting room.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
14:03:43
Let's keep the conversation going over in #docs:fedoraproject.org!
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
14:03:58
And now that me, Peter, and Petr are done traveling, expect things to stabilize a bit more in the coming weeks too.
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
14:04:04
Thanks everyone for your time and attention!
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
14:04:14
!action @jflory7 Post a meeting summary of today's meeting on Fedora Discussion
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
14:04:18
See you next time 👋
<@jflory7:fedora.im>
14:04:20
!endmeeting