16:48:47 #startmeeting 16:48:47 Meeting started Sat Mar 6 16:48:47 2010 UTC. The chair is stickster. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 16:48:49 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 16:48:55 #meetingname Docs bug stomp party 16:48:56 The meeting name has been set to 'docs_bug_stomp_party' 16:49:04 #info Planning at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_bug_stomping_day_2010-03-06 16:50:11 jjmcd: Who's here now, you, me, joebebus, bcotton? 16:50:24 and Emad78 and I think ke4qqq 16:50:25 I am sorta here - in and out 16:50:32 #info present are stickster jjmcd joebebus bcotton Emad78 ~ke4qqq 16:50:40 laubersm was also in and out 16:51:04 Yeah, I saw that she would be back by later, good on her for getting out in the sunshine -- it's gorgeous in the MidAtlantic (finally!) 16:51:09 I'm here... playing with chroot until I have a job but here none-the-less (: 16:51:34 OK, our priority list I suggested on Thursday was this: 16:51:38 #info priority list 16:51:39 stickster, one issue we have is that most of the easier docs are still publican 0.4x and few have that capability any longer 16:51:46 #info 1. Triage NEW bugs 16:51:55 oops 16:51:57 #undo 16:51:57 Removing item from minutes: 16:51:59 #undo 16:51:59 Removing item from minutes: 16:52:07 #topic Priority list for today's work 16:52:18 #link http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/docs/2010-March/011815.html 16:52:23 #info 1. Triage NEW bugs 16:52:30 I could compile Publican 0.4x from source, seeing as I just compiled Linux from Scratch and Gnome 2.28x 16:52:36 #info 2. Go through ASSIGNED bugs < 500000 16:52:47 or can you still get the source... 16:52:48 #info 3. Attack EasyFix bugs 16:52:55 #info 4. Attack release notes bugs 16:53:25 So I didn't see anyone objecting strenuously to that plan, does it work for the folks who are here? 16:53:56 sounds good to me... but I am a new person so I don't count 16:54:06 joebebus: Of course you do, you're present! :-) 16:54:07 stickster, It isn't entirely clear which are "easy fix" given that so many guides are 0.4x 16:54:09 what joebebus said ;-) 16:54:22 jjmcd: Let's see what that list looks like 16:54:26 I'm new also. And pretty much just banging my head on the table!!!!!!! 16:54:38 hehe 16:54:46 So Emad78 did you get it to build? 16:55:08 Emad78: if you need help just ask - we can probably at least add a pillow to your head-desk adventures 16:55:10 I don't think so, I'm stuck on the old2new still 16:55:20 Oh, I thought you got that to go 16:55:32 jjmcd: Yeah, looks like rudi might not have been able to send us a set of EasyFix bugs. 16:55:39 All it does is make a publican.cfg 16:55:41 jjmcd: But we can start with triage 16:56:18 stickster, I thought rudi said there was some issue with the pot files and the conversion, but I never got what that was 16:56:31 So I'm reluctant to convert the big guides 16:56:49 jjmcd: I think rudi may be by later, we can take a look at that in a while 16:56:58 jjmcd: I'd like to see if we can agree on the priority list above. 16:57:03 Right now there are a ton for rpmguide 16:57:11 jjmcd: It will help focus our work if we're not going in a bunch of different directions 16:57:17 so i've got bcotton mentoring joebebus on getting those 16:57:47 ANd I am walking Emad78 through the cycle with about-fedora just so he can get the hang of the process 16:58:05 jjmcd: So... we're *not* going with that priority list then? 16:58:19 Well, a lot of the low numbers are rpmguide 16:58:29 but once I got Emad78 up to speed 16:58:37 I was hoping a guide owner woudl show up 16:58:44 to help with prioritization 16:58:53 jjmcd: Here's the list of NEW bugs that need triage: 16:58:53 https://bugzilla.redhat.com/buglist.cgi?bug_status=NEW&classification=Fedora&product=Fedora%20Documentation&query_format=advanced&order=bug_id&query_based_on= 16:59:28 jjmcd stickster the only issue with the rpm guide is that a lot of the bugs are not necessarily simple fixes but coverage of new features, etc 16:59:40 oh, ugly 16:59:47 bcotton: jjmcd: Which is exactly why I wanted to start with triaging NEW bugs first 16:59:49 and you need jsmith-away for that 17:00:14 The triage process doesn't mean we have to fix everything right now -- we just need to see if the bug is actionable, and if so, we can put a plan in the bug as a comment. 17:00:26 And then we can move the bug to ASSIGNED. 17:00:36 Is everyone here familiar with that Bugzilla workflow? 17:00:37 Yeah, lets do that. My quick look saw an issue with almost everything 17:01:14 stickster: I don't know if I am "familiar"... 17:01:17 * stickster notes that triage is a good exercise for new folks because (1) it brings up questions/learning; (2) you don't have to be skilled because fixing isn't part of the triage process 17:01:24 But I didn't look very hard, just scanned 17:01:56 joebebus: Basically it's like this... Triage is simply looking at a bug, and trying to determine whether the bug is applicable, and whether there's enough information for *someone* to fix it. That person need not be the triager 17:02:01 joebebus: Make sense so far? 17:02:28 Let's list the actionable ones on the wiki so we can see the list easily 17:02:44 jjmcd: Actually, no need to duplicate that content on the wiki 17:02:44 stickster: yes :-) 17:02:48 Plus, stupid bug list doesn't show the document 17:03:03 jjmcd: I think I can come up with a special query result that does 17:03:27 Easier than having the wiki page quickly get out of sync, and then spending all our time trying to fix that instead of doing other work 17:03:31 That would help. Not sure, for example, we have the experts here for the translation guide 17:03:34 * stickster likes making the tools do the work fo rus 17:03:38 *for us 17:04:12 Everyone, I will be right back... 17:04:22 Would be happy to say SELECT ID, ASSIGNEE ... etc. 17:04:44 jjmcd: Check this out: 17:04:49 #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/buglist.cgi?bug_status=NEW&classification=Fedora&product=Fedora%20Documentation&query_format=advanced&query_based_on=&columnlist=bug_severity%2Cpriority%2Ccomponent%2Cassigned_to%2Cbug_status%2Cresolution%2Cshort_desc%2Ckeywords 17:05:23 :-) 17:05:27 way better 17:05:48 If you click on a column header you can sort them by e.g. the document (component) 17:06:57 So let's do this... start by each taking a guide, round-robin, and then we can start triage 17:07:00 Here's how this works 17:07:14 * joebebus takes notes 17:08:03 1. Determine if the bug still applies. Has it been handled already? Is it a duplicate of another bug (which you might be able to tell from this list itself, or you might need to look at the whole open bug list for just that component [doc])? 17:08:37 You might need to look at the source to tell if the bug's been handled, which you can do by going to the doc's web-viewable repository. Ask if you don't know where to find that. 17:08:40 Next... 17:09:04 2. If there seems to be enough information to at least formulate a plan, describe that in the bug. 17:09:15 3. Add the Triaged keyword to the bug. 17:10:06 #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/buglist.cgi?keywords=Triaged&query_format=advanced&keywords_type=nowords&bug_status=NEW&columnlist=bug_severity%2Cpriority%2Ccomponent%2Cassigned_to%2Cbug_status%2Cresolution%2Cshort_desc%2Ckeywords&product=Fedora%20Documentation&classification=Fedora <-- better search, which will exclude already triaged bugs with the "Triaged" keyword 17:10:32 joebebus: Why don't you take the bugs for the accessibility guide. 17:10:51 stickster: ok 17:10:52 jjmcd: Take deployment guide 17:11:07 wilco 17:11:09 I'll take fedora-websites and the install-guide since the first one only has one bug 17:11:17 Then we'll rotate through the list as we get done 17:11:23 This is enough to start with and see how we do 17:11:49 bcotton: Emad78: Are either of you looking to join in with this? If you're working on something else that's fine too, just want to make sure we don't exclude anyone :-) 17:12:28 I'll try to work on something. I think I got the about-fedora done for jjmcd. 17:12:46 stickster, i just grabbed some coffee and cold pizza. let's roll! 17:13:14 bcotton: Why don't you take readme-burning-isos in that list 17:13:25 I can look at the user-guide for the little outdated areas and typos 17:13:36 Emad78: We're going through the bug list shown in the link above 17:13:38 stickster: aye, aye 17:13:39 Emad78: Did you see that link? 17:14:05 got the list 17:14:20 Emad78: OK, so you're going to triage the user-guide bugs in that list? 17:14:33 Yeah I can check that stuff out. 17:14:44 Emad78: Remember that at first, it's not your job to fix the problems 17:15:00 We're just sorting things out so we know the bugs still need fixing, and that they are properly assigned 17:15:08 Emad78: You can assign the bug to yourself if you want 17:15:12 Copy that. Just verify the bugs right? 17:15:28 Emad78: Right, see the instructions up above the previous link 17:15:48 One more point for everyone 17:15:58 I just found an example of this in bug 544656 17:16:02 stickster, how are we going to track quick, not too bad, terrible? 17:16:24 jjmcd: You can add the "EasyFix" keyword to the Keywords field if it's an easy one 17:16:39 Otherwise it's assumed to take some skill to fix 17:16:46 Anyway, back to my one more point... 17:16:50 .bug 544656 17:16:51 stickster: Bug 544656 Release notes and other documentation require Javascript to read - https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=544656 17:17:05 You'll see in one of the comments there are a whole mess of suggestions 17:17:13 I might consider filing each of those as separate bugs 17:17:34 Having one bug trying to do 3 separate things isn't always the best way to file. Sometimes it's fine, sometimes not. 17:17:44 Got some of the deployment guide ones, just got the call, back in about 20 mins 17:17:50 You have to use best judgment -- if you could do any of those tasks separately, it's good to split them up. 17:17:56 jjmcd: ok, thanks 17:18:30 helpful hint, everyone: if you want to do anything with a bug, it helps to log in (i apparently need more coffee) 17:21:11 ohhh to change state you may need access to a fas group with that authority 17:21:49 mayhaps. i can't edit the keywords or anything 17:21:58 .fasinfo bcotton 17:21:59 ke4qqq: User: bcotton, Name: Ben Cotton, email: bcotton+fedora@gmail.com, Creation: 2009-05-19, IRC Nick: bcotton, Timezone: America/Indiana/Indianapolis, Locale: en, Extension: 5130552, GPG key ID: , Status: active 17:22:04 ke4qqq: Approved Groups: +gitrpmguide docs cla_done cla_fedora 17:22:27 it is angry because i changed my login in BZ from bcotton+fedora@gmail.com to bcotton@fedoraproject.org? 17:22:48 s/it is/is it/ 17:23:14 your login in bz haqs to be the same as the email defined in fas 17:23:20 has even 17:23:38 if i change it in FAS should it start working again soon? 17:24:05 or should i change it back in BZ and worry about it later? 17:25:32 bcotton: honestly - no idea - perhaps someone in -admin can tell you 17:25:49 well let's just give it a try and see what happens :-) 17:27:28 FAS won't let me use @fedoraproject.org so i guess that answers the question 17:27:41 bcotton: Right, that would be circular. 17:29:30 stickster: FAS clearly doesn't have a wife if it can't deal with that 17:30:46 bcotton: Have you applied for the 'fedorabugs' group in FAS? 17:30:54 ke4qqq: ^^ I think that's the right one. 17:31:03 .fasinfo ke4qqq 17:31:05 * ke4qqq looks 17:31:14 ke4qqq: User: ke4qqq, Name: David Nalley, email: david@gnsa.us, Creation: 2006-02-21, IRC Nick: ke4qqq, Timezone: US/Eastern, Locale: en, Extension: 5100435, GPG key ID: E70D2357, Status: active 17:31:18 ke4qqq: Approved Groups: @gitinstall-guide @gitfedora-zikula cla_fedora cla_done ambassadors marketing news +docs fedorabugs gitelectionsguide gitrelease-notes famsco packager sysadmin sysadmin-test +gitfedora-cms @cmsadmin cvsfedora 17:31:24 I've got it too. 17:31:25 stickster probably not, will do now 17:31:36 .sponsors fedorabugs 17:31:38 stickster: yes fedorabugs 17:31:39 ianweller: Sponsors for fedorabugs: @adamwill @jack jstanley @kevin @marius @poelstra @sopwith @sundaram @tibbs @toshio @wwoods 17:31:54 stickster: applied 17:32:16 stickster: where is the web-viewable repo for the user-guide? 17:33:19 Emad78: Good question, I can't find it on Fedora Hosted. ke4qqq: any idea? 17:33:25 Or is that being drafted on the wiki only? 17:33:36 they started on the wiki 17:33:53 Ah 17:33:53 but they moved to docbook - think jsmith helped them with it 17:34:00 iirc 17:34:10 Emad78: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User_Guide I htink 17:34:12 *think 17:34:13 * laubersm pops in for about 10 minutes to see what is happening... hangs head and admits that desktop is still F10 box with Publican 0.44 installed 17:34:32 ke4qqq: Really? 17:34:36 I wonder where they put it then :-\ 17:34:48 hmmmmmm well they didn't put it in fh.o/userguide :) 17:34:55 ke4qqq: nope 17:35:06 maybe I am thinking about something else 17:35:10 stickster, git.fedorahosted.org/git/docs/user-guide.git 17:35:36 is that what you are looking for? 17:35:45 laubersm: Hm, doesn't come up for me 17:35:56 oh stupid me 17:36:10 they don't have a trac instance apparently - just a git repo 17:36:14 heh 17:36:18 Thanks laubersm 17:36:23 Emad78: http://git.fedorahosted.org/git/user-guide.git?p=docs/user-guide.git;a=summary 17:37:23 we need to get that either linked or the userguide trac instance killed to end confusion 17:37:30 bcotton: Approved 17:37:44 * ke4qqq wonders if it's appropriate to assign tasks to people who are absent :) 17:37:50 ke4qqq: Yeah, that's a mess 17:38:07 Ok got it thanks. And where do we write Triaged and make comments in the bug????? 17:38:29 Emad78: 'Triaged' goes in the keywords field. 17:38:42 The bug entry itself has a comments field along with many others. 17:38:50 Look at the individual bug by clicking on the number. 17:38:51 Has danielsmw been around any more than I have? 17:39:00 .sponsors gituser-guide 17:39:01 ke4qqq: Sponsors for gituser-guide: @danielsmw @quaid 17:39:15 I would be willing to take on the User guide but I am unsure about my availability at F13 release crunch... 17:39:24 and I haven't been around much 17:39:28 myself 17:39:30 I think I have almost Triaged a bug.... 17:39:47 laubersm: If you wanted just to do some fixing today, that would be helpful, no strings attached 17:39:52 laubersm: sadly I haven't been around docs much either - I couldn't honestly tell you 17:41:03 stickster: still can't edit keywords on 558084, unless i'm just completely missing it 17:41:11 stickster, later... I've got to go out again for much of the afternoon. Then I can focus on User Guide this evening... 17:41:25 bcotton: it may take up to an hour for it to sync 17:41:27 bcotton: Are you logged in as bcotton+fedora@gmail.com? 17:41:28 :( 17:41:45 ke4qqq, you may assign a few user guide bugs to me during the day - I'll get them done this evening. 17:41:48 stickster: yes. guess i'm waiting til it syncs 17:41:54 yeah, possibly 17:41:56 ke4qqq, if you assign too many I'll hunt you down and.... 17:42:31 lol - ok - the first one is just a coordinating with infra type item. 17:42:52 * laubersm heads out again.... 17:43:25 * jjmcd is back 17:44:32 the good news is that the bug doesn't actually need fixing 17:45:00 so once my account syncs, we can kill it off 17:45:48 #info for future bugstomping days ensure particpants join fedorabugs fas group in advance and are approved 17:45:59 bah - 17:47:14 ke4qqq: True dat :-) 17:47:28 bcotton: Which one is that? 17:47:40 Done with deployment guide - what's next? 17:47:57 stickster: burning-isos 558084 17:48:10 bcotton: Here's how you can get zodbot to provide a cool link: 17:48:13 .bug 558084 17:48:15 stickster: Bug 558084 FedoraProject doesn't provide set of CDs anymore (and one other thing) - https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=558084 17:48:22 stickster: duly noted :-) 17:48:33 jjmcd: release-notes! 17:48:41 jjmcd: I'm working on TQSG now 17:48:56 We've knocked this list down by about 50%, good work everyone! 17:49:21 I know there's no easyfixes in RNs, got them already 17:49:23 I'm working on bug #533752... slowly but surely 17:58:00 stickster: Um, I'm done looking at bug #538628 but I can't write Triaged in it??? 17:58:39 Emad78: apply for fedorabugs in fas 17:59:16 Ok got it. 18:00:03 I;ve got an RN bug that really belongs to IG .. moving it 18:00:12 jjmcd: thats for that 18:00:14 what is it? 18:00:30 Problem with installing with specific hardware 18:00:33 s/thats/thanks/ 18:00:37 what bug number 18:00:41 IG comment might only point to KNown Bugs 18:00:47 562574 18:00:56 .bug 562574 18:00:59 ke4qqq: Bug 562574 Installation / Upgrade fails with boot disk attached to pata_it821x - https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=562574 18:01:20 jjmcd: I have that about-fedora doc done and built. How do I know its at 1.0. 18:01:26 that be the one 18:01:39 Because you have a publican.cfg 18:01:44 you don't think that's a common bugs type issue? 18:01:47 and you could build it on F12 18:02:11 That's what I said, prolly should have a pointer to known bugs on the wiki 18:02:41 Emad78, did you look at the output? 18:02:54 The html? 18:02:58 Emad78, next step is to add publican.cfg and push it 18:03:06 Look at the html but also the xml 18:03:15 on that doc we use the xml with yelp 18:03:34 cd tmp/en-US/xml then yelp About_Fedora.xml & 18:04:09 USually we only use html and pdf ... that one is an exception 18:04:22 * stickster is being detained in marketing right now, brb 18:05:38 Emad78, Notice that yelp renders it quite differently than html, but its all still there 18:10:08 Ahh, I see. Ok, So how do I actually know I did this right. 18:10:36 Well, if you can see the doc in yelp, and you can see it in firefox, you are in pretty good shape 18:10:43 ke4qqq: I'm applied for the fedorabugs. 18:10:57 stickster: who did you get to sponsor bcotton?? 18:11:03 Next thing is to git add publican.cfg ... since it is a new file, you need to explicitly add it 18:11:54 Then the real fun. If your ssh key is good, if all the changes rippled through, if the moon is in the seventh house, and if you hold your head just right, a git push origin might just work 18:12:36 jjmcd: won't he have to change his .git/config 18:12:57 depends on if the approval rippled through in time 18:13:03 ahhhh ok 18:13:12 He was in gitabout-fedora before he cloned 18:13:18 * ke4qqq thought he used git instead of ssh in the url 18:13:35 oooooohhhhh, I didn't catch that. 18:13:48 I may be wrong - don't take my word for it - I am distracted here 18:13:57 Um the git add publican.cfg didn't work 18:14:09 what did it say? 18:14:21 fatal: not a git repository 18:14:25 ? 18:14:30 pwd? 18:15:07 Emad78, you need to be in the about-fedora directory 18:15:24 * ke4qqq thought I just said that..... :) 18:15:29 ke4qqq: I did it 18:15:40 ohhh can you poof Emad78 then 18:15:59 .sponsors fedorabugs 18:16:02 ke4qqq: Sponsors for fedorabugs: @adamwill @jack jstanley @kevin @marius @poelstra @sopwith @sundaram @tibbs @toshio @wwoods 18:16:12 Not sure Emad78 caught the intent of pwd although I liked it being a lot easier to type 18:16:15 must be some super fpl powers 18:16:25 * quaid sticks his head in to lurk, help, etc. 18:16:36 probably should start by reviewing bugs already assigned to me :) 18:16:58 * ke4qqq suggests that quaid review tickets assigned to ke4qqq instead :) 18:17:44 jjmcd: Ok its added. 18:18:00 OK, now .... if you are in about-fedora 18:18:04 ke4qqq: only if it's also related to Zikula so I can hit two birds :) 18:18:13 try doing 'cat .git/config' 18:18:34 quaid: iirc there aren't any open zikula bugs - at least not for the core. 18:18:49 ke4qqq: well, I'm kidding anyway 18:18:50 There should be a line like url = ..... 18:19:23 Yup, =git://................... 18:19:30 bummer 18:20:01 ke4qqq: Emad78: Done 18:20:02 OK, edit it to say url = ssh://fedorahosted.org/git/docs/about-fedora.git 18:21:20 stickster: thanks 18:21:28 ke4qqq: you were right ... paying closer attention than I am 18:21:38 Emad78: as soon as it syncs you should be able to play with bugs 18:21:45 jjmcd: doubtful 18:21:52 Ok thanks 18:22:33 Emad78, edit it to say url = ssh://fedorahosted.org/git/docs/about-fedora.git - should only need to change git to ssh at the beginning 18:22:59 jjmcd: edit where at the command line. 18:23:12 forget it got it 18:23:17 In the file .git/config 18:23:30 .git is a hidden directory so you don't see it with ls 18:23:36 unless you do ls -a 18:25:50 * stickster finishes with marketing break 18:26:00 I'm going to run and grab some food, back in about 15 min 18:26:32 Emad78, oh, we forgot to commit. After you edit, return to about-fedora and do a 'git commit -m "Updated to Publican 1.0"' 18:27:07 Emad78: have you set git.username and emailaddy? 18:27:18 * bcotton has updated his bug (there is a change that needs to be made after all) 18:27:54 ke4qqq: Not sure what mean. 18:28:03 have you already commited? 18:28:08 committed? 18:28:18 I'm doing it right now. 18:28:20 Emad78, that may have been the other day, but I;m not sure, you only need to do that once 18:28:25 OK wait 18:28:28 yeah you only do that once 18:28:40 s'ok if it happens extra times, git won't be ma 18:28:43 mad 18:29:15 bah - google fail - can't find sticksters page on setting up git the first time 18:29:51 Git_Quickref 18:30:21 you at least (once, if you have done this already ignore me) 18:30:23 git config --global user.name 'John Doe' 18:30:25 git config --global user.email 'jdoe@example.com' 18:30:34 which could use an SEO friendly, wiki friendly rename 18:30:42 Emad78, Yeah, what he said 18:30:46 Oh yeah that should be done. 18:30:55 Emad78, I don't recall whether we did that the other day or not 18:30:55 Commit is done 18:30:57 ok - then ignore me, sorry for butting in 18:30:58 cool 18:31:10 now, git push origin 18:31:16 just wanted to make sure you got attribution in git logs 18:31:25 yep, good catch 18:34:05 jjmcd: I think I'm having a problem with changing to the ssh url in the .git/config 18:34:47 * quaid closes 122693 as CANTFIX 18:34:48 jjmcd: there is nothing to change in there. It doesn't have the git url in there either. 18:34:57 only been hanging on 6 years. 18:35:43 Tell ya what, do a 'cat .git/config', goto http://fpaste.org and paste it in there. Click 'paste it" and give me the url 18:36:17 (handy tool to know anyway) 18:36:56 Emad78, is is the one in about-fedora/.git/config 18:37:17 oh no, not that one. Oops ill go in there. 18:37:39 Emad78: there shouldn't be on in ~/.git/config 18:37:46 s/on/one 18:38:59 ok I got it now. Man my head hurts. 18:39:02 * stickster returns 18:39:08 wow that was a fast lunch 18:39:32 * jjmcd notices his bugzilla folder has a lot of Today's in it 18:40:19 ke4qqq: Cold leftover Chinese food. Cures what ails ya! 18:40:40 jjmcd: ok I have it edited for the ssh 18:40:46 you are making me hungry......gotta start thinking about food soon. 18:40:50 while i was waiting for my BZ account to sync i made a fix for the bug i was working on. should i just put a git diff in the BZ or is there a preferred way to give a patch to the maintainer 18:40:59 .bug 216387 18:41:01 OK, now, do a git status just to see what it says 18:41:01 quaid: Bug 216387 No documentation for syncronizing Fedora 6 with mobile phones - https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=216387 18:41:06 bcotton: who is the maintainer? 18:41:23 quaid: patches welcome? 18:41:24 ke4qqq: zoglesby 18:41:30 ok, I think I'll close that and point at current processes; 18:41:36 ke4qqq: yeah, basically, that's what it came to. 18:42:07 jjmcd: Says my branch is ahead of origin/master my 1 commit. Looks like it worked huh.?? 18:42:17 .sponsors fedorabugs 18:42:20 bcotton: Sponsors for fedorabugs: @adamwill @jack jstanley @kevin @marius @poelstra @sopwith @sundaram @tibbs @toshio @wwoods 18:42:33 Emad78, OK, so now, 'git push origin' 18:43:08 hey everyone... I just realized I am not a part of the fedorabugs group... can anyone add me?(I applied) 18:43:25 joebebus: can you apply? 18:43:27 @sopwith! 18:43:42 there's some cruft to clean up from group :) 18:43:52 jjmcd: Ohhhhhhhhh, D@%MIT. It says permission denied. 18:43:57 Emad78, It is kind of weird because you have a local repository, with all the history and everything. So now, you want to bring the remote repo in sync with your local 18:43:59 BAH 18:44:00 wow 18:44:03 for the first time in 7 years 18:44:07 I have no bugs assigned to me 18:44:27 * quaid obviously didn't care that much or could have done this 30 minutes of work a long time ago :D 18:44:27 wow 18:44:29 ke4qqq: I have have already applied 18:44:30 quaid, you could go ahead and document so I can sync my Trea to my FC6 box 18:44:31 * bcotton assigns bugs a bunch of bugs to quaid 18:44:49 bcotton: don't worry, I also know how to do big reassignments 18:44:51 we can have a war! 18:44:59 ... of annoyance against bug reporters 18:45:06 Emad78, ok, let;s go ahead and do the fpaste thing and see if I can see any clues 18:45:15 * quaid has RT tickets, so don't worry ... 18:45:15 .fasinfo emad78 18:45:16 ke4qqq: User: emad78, Name: Eli Madrinich, email: elijahm17@gmail.com, Creation: 2010-02-20, IRC Nick: Emad78, Timezone: US/Central, Locale: en, Extension: 5144484, GPG key ID: , Status: active 18:45:22 ke4qqq: Approved Groups: fedorabugs gitabout-fedora docs cla_done cla_fedora 18:45:27 * ke4qqq <3 RT 18:45:28 stickster, how long does it take to sync a repo with FAS? 18:45:45 * quaid (/) RT 18:45:56 jjmcd: it's usually "within the hour" 18:45:57 jjmcd: Do you mean, how long does it take for the updated group info to propagate? 18:46:03 jjmcd: Yeah, what quaid said ^^ 18:46:12 hmmm, OK, it's bee 3 hours 18:46:23 so Emad78 should be good to go 18:46:34 totes 18:46:37 jjmcd: You can 'ssh fedorahosted.org' and then 'id emad78' to see the updated group info, that's definitely good to go 18:47:16 ke4qqq: was that an answer to my question or were you just forwarding it? 18:47:36 bcotton: Are you able to change bugs now? 18:47:48 stickster: yes 18:47:50 bcotton: was what an answer? 18:47:55 Wow, our un-triaged bug list is down to only 4 now! 18:47:56 Nice 18:48:04 bcotton: which probably means no 18:48:13 invalid command id emad78 18:48:28 stickster: it must require some perms-fu - same thing for me 18:48:52 ke4qqq: What's going on? I'm not caught up on the problem you're having 18:49:03 ke4qqq: should i just plop a `git diff` in the comments or is there a better way to share my patch with zach 18:49:21 git format-patch ? 18:49:34 jjmcd: bcotton: Even better... there's a 'git send-email' 18:49:42 stickster: I have #538628 Triaged but I can't edit it yet until the group apply filters through. But that ones done. 18:49:46 bcotton: ahhh - git diff is prolly the easiest way I'd imagine, unless someone here can give you commit rights - which quaid probably can - he collects sponsor roles like candy 18:49:57 Emad78, did you understand the bit about fpaste? 18:50:12 jmcd: No. what was it again. 18:50:17 stickster: in reference to the ssh fh.o id emad78 18:50:33 cat .git/config then paste it into http://fpaste.org 18:50:49 ke4qqq: jjmcd: Ah, sorry -- maybe because of my sysadmin-* membership, sorry 18:51:05 ke4qqq: jjmcd: you could do 'getent group gitabout-fedora | grep emad78' 18:51:24 A non-null result means he's in 18:51:31 so... How can I become a member of the fedorabugs group? 18:51:32 But anyway, I confirmed that 18:51:37 * bcotton should convince coworkers to switch from subversion to git so he can get familiar with it 18:51:40 joebebus: Apply via the FAS interface 18:51:48 joebebus: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/accounts/ 18:51:52 stickster: I have... 18:51:56 bcotton: after a few weeks you'll never want to use svn or cvs again 18:52:43 jjmcd: The whole output of -config or just the URL 18:52:52 The whole thing 18:53:11 When you paste it and click the button you will get a new url that I can look at 18:53:25 joebebus: Let me see if I can get you approved then 18:53:36 stickster, pretty much anything I say to fh.o says invalid command 18:53:38 .fas joebebus 18:53:39 stickster: joebebus 'Joseph Allen' 18:54:23 jjmcd: same here 18:54:27 jjmcd: http://fpaste.org/7WaL/ 18:54:37 jjmcd: You can't do much if you're not in sysadmin 18:54:40 even whoami doesn't work 18:54:45 do we have a page with links to "all docs bugs" "all new docs bugs" "all triaged docs bugs" etc.? 18:54:50 ke4qqq: That's weird. 18:55:04 But probably not worth worrying about right now 18:55:14 ke4qqq: I considered being a backup sponsor a proper leader type thing to do, so I always said yes :) 18:55:42 joebebus: Approved now 18:55:51 stickster: no, prolly not, but interesting none the less. 18:55:54 quaid: I'll put some links on our page for today 18:55:58 quaid: Give me 2 shakes 18:55:59 Emad78, that looks perfect so there is something else amiss. You did upload your ssh key to FAS, right? 18:56:13 stickster: Thanks, I can now start applying tags to the bugs I have been working on... 18:56:20 Emad78: ssh into fedorapeople.org 18:56:42 joebebus: within an hour you will be able to 18:56:56 ke4qqq: ok 18:57:33 if that doesn't work - well - either something is awry or your ssh key isn't in fas 18:57:51 Looks to me like Emad78's SSH key isn't in FAS 18:58:11 jjmcd: Really? maybe I did it wrong. 18:58:32 Well, I think FAS is a separate step 18:59:08 If you go to 'My Account' does is say 'Public SSH Key: gobbldeygook' ? 18:59:21 quaid: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_bug_stomping_day_2010-03-06 19:00:18 jjmcd: Yeah its got that...... Public SSH Key: ssh-rsa AAAAB3NzaC1y............... 19:00:40 hmmmmm .... maybe stickster has a clue. I'm out of ideas 19:00:47 hmmmm perhaps we should ask in -admin 19:00:49 thx stickster 19:01:31 quaid: Just added one for just open EasyFix bugs 19:02:24 Emad78: Can you do 'ssh fedorapeople.org'? 19:02:27 stickster, can you help us get Emad78 sorted here. I'm out of ideas 19:02:41 is the username on Emad78's command line the same as the one in FAS? 19:02:56 quaid: ooohhhh good point 19:03:00 quaid: Oh duh, thanks 19:03:56 Emad78: does that make sense? The user you are logged in to locally may be different -- e.g. I log in as 'kwade' on my laptop, but my FAS account is 'quaid' so I have to do e.g. 'ssh quaid@fedorapeople.org' to get in 19:04:56 quaid, how do I say that in .git/config? ssh://jjmcd@fedorahosted...... something like that? 19:05:33 jjmcd quaid if that's the problem, it might be simpler to include it in ~/.ssh/config ? 19:05:58 ok i put in my password and ssh'd into fedorapeople.org. so now it says emad78@people1~. 19:06:42 Emad78: can you answer quaids question about your local username 19:07:20 quaid: Yeah I did it like you said and it wanted my password for the key and got in. Right???? 19:07:34 That looks promising 19:08:01 Emad78: so your local username isn't emad78?? if so I think that's a quick fix 19:08:21 ke4qqq: no my computer name isnt emad78 19:09:31 ok - Emad78: change your about-fedora/.git/config to look like this: 19:09:33 http://fpaste.org/9cKd/ 19:11:31 * stickster brb 19:11:38 ke4qqq: Ok got it edited. 19:11:47 jjmcd: Ok what do you think. 19:11:58 now from within about-fedora try git push origin 19:12:07 I think it's time to try the push again 19:12:58 I would have tried what David suggested but I wasn't sure. My other attempt would have been ~/.ssh/config 19:13:27 yeah I think long term the fix may be in ssh config - but I have no idea what else he sshs into 19:13:30 jjmcd: Ok it looks like it worked. :) 19:13:56 OK, now go to http://git.fedorahosted.org/git/?p=docs/about-fedora.git;a=summary 19:14:28 w00t - it worked 19:14:40 You should see your commit at the top 19:14:53 If you click on commitdiff, you will see what you changed 19:15:02 jjmcd: IT WORKED!!!!!! But my local name is Optimus, so it put that on there instead of Emad78 19:15:27 Emad78: I'll show you how to fix that 19:15:30 it got sent to my inbox... So it worked! 19:15:34 Emad78: first do this: 19:16:18 git config --global user.name 'Your Full Name Here' 19:16:27 Then do this: 19:16:49 git config --global user.email 'emad78@fedoraproject.org' 19:18:41 stickster: Ok did those two things. How do I know they made changes and worked??? It didn't shoot errors so must have. 19:19:02 Emad78: do 'cat ~/.gitconfig' and you'll see them in your personal global git configuration file 19:19:54 quaid: fixed [[Git quick reference]] btw 19:20:16 stickster: Ok looks good. Has my name and emad78@fedoraproject. Thanks for all the help 19:20:29 Emad78: that's 'emad78@fedoraproject.org' right? 19:20:42 stickster: yeah thats right, sorry. 19:20:44 np 19:21:04 Emad78: A couple other helpful things: 19:21:12 git config --global color.diff auto 19:21:15 git config --global color.status auto 19:21:17 git config --global color.branch auto 19:22:21 stickster: Ok knocked those out too. 19:22:39 Emad78: That just makes the output easier to read when you're on a color-capable terminal (which you usually are) :-) 19:24:00 stickster: Ok thanks for the help. So now to edit this bug. How do I add in the keyword for Triaged. 19:24:15 Emad78: Just put "Triaged" in the Keywords field, and hit the Save Changes button. 19:25:08 jjmcd: Hey that was my "easy" bug to do. The one for the grammar issues. Man your to fast for me. Ha ha. 19:25:26 hehe 19:25:49 jjmcd: well at least I got your about-fedora done. Wow. 19:26:16 But now you have been through the entire cycle. Next time it will be easy 19:26:52 OK, stickster, I broke your new, untriaged bugs report 19:26:58 jjmcd: yeah it should be, I won't have to slow everyone down. "as much". 19:27:06 jjmcd: how so? 19:27:13 No more left 19:28:54 We only have a handful of easyfix 19:28:58 jjmcd: heh 19:29:11 one of the bugs I was working on was easyfix 19:29:16 * stickster working on a non-easyfix 19:29:20 and it wasn't tagged easyfix 19:29:38 There are a lot of "not too hard" though, we probably should have had a category for "not requiring an expert" 19:29:45 ah 19:29:48 I see 19:32:22 OK, question for you folks 19:32:28 .bug 495274 19:32:30 stickster: Bug 495274 "Run from RAM" is documented but not available - https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=495274 19:32:45 I'm trying to locate the source for this document. It's not the readme-live-image 19:32:52 Or if it *was* then the bug is already fixed. 19:33:01 I need to go afk for a bit, Feel free to grab an easyfix that looks interesting. WHen I get back I'll go after a middlin-hard one 19:33:04 I don't have a Live image from F11 handy to check where this is. 19:33:15 Emad78: congrats, you just did the trial by fire we all did -- I can't think of one person I know who didn't have some oddity occur the first time they tried to commit a change :) 19:33:56 quaid: thanks, yeah I think I need to take a break and soak it all in. Thank you for all the help. 19:34:22 * stickster always thinks momentum is best, but it's a personal thing 19:34:44 Emad78: Were you able to change the keywords in that bug? 19:34:48 stickster, under "Suggested Hardware" 19:34:57 stickster: that bug closure looks self-evident if you take katzj at face value 19:35:13 stickster: yes and no. jjmcd got to it before I could. ha ha 19:35:32 quaid: The bug's not just about the menu option being gone, it's about the reference still being in the doc 19:35:40 So I need to find out if that's happened first. 19:35:46 er 19:35:51 stickster, http://fpaste.org/jKPD/ 19:35:53 I need to find out if the reference is gone now 19:36:11 stickster, from F11 19:36:18 jjmcd: Bingo, better eyes thanks! 19:36:36 That / in less is my friend 19:37:18 OK, BBIAB 19:37:35 Emad78, joebebus, thanks for all the help 19:37:55 HAHA! http://git.fedoraproject.org/git/docs?p=docs/readme-live-image.git;a=commit;h=471e937bf37a1d1f08adf8d83f270c2579f3f922 19:37:56 I love git. 19:38:17 jjmcd: Thank you for your help. I figured I might be able to get it done with the help from you and the others. 19:39:02 jjmcd: I haven't really helped that much thanks to problems with Bugzilla, but your welcome and I want to thank all of those who helped me! 19:39:24 stickster, quaid, ke4qqq, Thanks for all your help getting me all set up. 19:39:38 Emad78: No problem, thank you for taking the time to be here! 19:39:55 Now that you're set up it will be easier to contribute to other tasks 19:40:09 * stickster is knocking out some TQSG bugs now 19:40:22 I'm concentrating on < 500000 numbered bugs 19:40:27 stickster: For being here such a short time, and getting bombarded with stuff to learn, I'm having a blast. I think Im going to like this 19:40:28 Clearing out the old trash before working on the new 19:40:46 Emad78: It never ends, I assure you... I still learn something(s) every day :-) 19:41:16 Good that's what I want to do is learn and help out as much as I can 19:44:45 Ok have to take a break 19:55:40 Hey danielsmw 19:55:52 Looks like lots of people had their heads down and didn't hear you come in :-D 19:56:08 Who's working on the RPM guide? 19:56:10 is that bcotton? 19:56:55 present! 19:57:02 stickster: Hi! 19:57:07 sorry, stickster, you caught me whilst watching basketball 19:57:11 haha 19:57:28 bcotton: Are you the person doing rpm-guide stuff? 19:57:36 Hi danielsmw! 19:57:38 stickster i are 19:57:40 joebebus: Hi! 19:57:45 bcotton: Are you converting it to Publican already? 19:57:57 stickster the jsmith-publican branch is publican 1.0 19:58:04 nifty 20:01:23 jjmcd: .bug 510392 20:01:33 oops 20:01:36 .bug 510392 20:01:38 stickster: Bug 510392 Fedora 11 does not have cron changes documented or noted in the release notes - https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=510392 20:01:54 looks outdated and closeable wontfix, with a nice note to the contributor 20:02:21 danielsmw: laubersm said you could assign ALL UG bugs to her :) 20:02:21 quaid: I applied for the gituser-guide. Do you give approval for that? 20:03:09 ke4qqq: okay, good. as you've probably noticed, i haven't been around much this semester. 20:03:13 danielsmw: do have one thing for you to fix - so the trac instance for userguide doesn't appear to sync with the git repo - almost like they are separate "projects" 20:03:14 ke4qqq: classes have been pretty bad. 20:03:27 danielsmw: yeah $dayjob has been pretty hellacious here as well 20:03:37 are you in clemson this weekend? 20:03:40 HEY!!! 20:03:43 ke4qqq: i'm here right now 20:03:44 :) 20:03:56 ke4qqq, what did I say about too many and I hunt you down and .... 20:04:06 danielsmw, don't listen to him!!! 20:04:10 laubersm: :) 20:04:12 laubersm: that's why I was going to let danielsmw assign them to you :) 20:04:46 yeah, so, let me tell you guys about the user guide. 20:05:09 we talked about it a while back and decided it might just be time for a rewrite. I really felt like it had gone downhill 20:05:16 So i started, and got a few chapters done, 20:05:27 and then this semester started and I had no time for anything, really. 20:05:43 so it's kind of 1/4 to 1/3 written and incomplete. 20:05:45 Emad78: let me check 20:06:08 laubersm: want to finish it for me? :) 20:06:18 ummm.... 20:06:25 jk, laubersm. 20:06:35 laubersm: that's not a bug :) 20:06:54 somebody remind me of the timeline here... 20:07:00 ke4qqq, yeah, I noticed 20:07:22 Emad78: ok, gituser-guide approved 20:07:37 danielsmw, this is for F13 content? 20:08:01 laubersm: the way I've been writing is is actually fairly release-indepenent 20:08:07 bcotton, stickster - so ... I haven't had much love with Max RPM content relicensing 20:08:22 bcotton: do you know if it matters? would it be helpful to have that content to merge in to an updated RPM Guide? 20:08:29 danielsmw, ok. 20:08:31 quaid: really?? so what's been the objection? 20:08:40 laubersm: although not entirely, obviously. but most of the things that I'm writing specific instructions for are true for most distros, like using packagekit. 20:08:45 quaid: I would argue it doesn't matter... Max RPM is way old, and RPM Guide was supposed to replace it 20:08:49 as opposed to augment it 20:08:54 quaid: it might. i think there's going to be a lot of re-working required, so the more we can legally swipe from, the better :-) 20:09:00 laubersm: but overall, it's more of a "this is linux/fedora and this is how you should approach it as a user" 20:09:02 danielsmw, that is a useful plan. 20:09:18 danielsmw, that sounds good. 20:09:18 * ke4qqq forgot how much I missed hanging out with docs folks 20:09:20 laubersm: "and if you want to know how to use this specifically, read the help here" 20:09:21 bcotton: But it's not just a matter of swiping -- if you're swiping out of date content than you're taking on additional work to bring that up to date as well 20:09:28 s/than/then/ 20:09:29 laubersm: yeah, so that's the plan. 20:09:32 stickster: that's true too 20:09:33 laubersm: glad you like it. 20:09:52 quaid: Great!!, So then what does it take for me to go in and sqaush one of them Easyfix bugs. #538628. If you want to take a look 20:09:54 bcotton: So what I'm saying is blocking on relicensing of that content to me is a waste of time 20:09:59 quaid: ^^ opinion? 20:10:03 ke4qqq: the problem is three letters and the three aren't 'rpm' 20:10:34 stickster: that's fair 20:10:41 stickster: the main block has been me being lazy 20:10:52 Emad78: check out source - make changes - commit and push 20:11:03 mark bug as fixed 20:11:09 danielsmw, is what you have started on in git? what branch? 20:11:26 danielsmw, and if it isn't can you get it there and tell me which branch? 20:11:38 Emad78: you have the gituser-guide checkout? 20:11:55 quaid: No, not sure what that is. to be honest. 20:11:58 laubersm: it's not on git because I've had trouble commiting to it, so most of what i have is stored locally 20:12:28 Emad78: similar to about-fedora, you need to do a checkout of the source files that comprise the book 20:12:37 laubersm: I'm not at my computer right now, so when I get back I can work on committing it or, if all else fails, I'll send it to someone who knows how to commit it. :) 20:12:45 quaid: as in git clone? 20:13:15 git clone ssh://@git.fedorahosted.org/git/docs/user-guide.git 20:13:18 laubersm: I'll email you once I've put it in git via some way or another. 20:13:20 Emad78: ^^ 20:13:23 Emad78: yes, you can swipe the instructions from https://fedorahosted.org/userguide/ 20:14:22 Ok Ill give it a shot and see. 20:14:27 quaid: I think git quickref needs a once-over, going there now 20:14:53 laubersm: This is the layout I set up for it a long time ago. The assignments aren't really relevant anymore, but this is how rudi and I setup the XML skeleton: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Danielsmw/Desktop_Guide_tasks 20:15:02 oops, no longer need docs-common 20:15:03 I occasionally refer to [[Docs_Project_work_using_git]] 20:15:06 * quaid fixes that hosted page 20:15:26 Emad78: once you have the checkout, let me know 20:15:30 * quaid is cloning too 20:15:53 danielsmw, I'm still here.. sort of... git sommit issues, will send email... got it. looking at link now 20:17:11 ke4qqq: Ah thanks, I felt like I'd written all this before :-) 20:17:14 * quaid hugs git 20:17:51 quaid: Not letting me. Ill have to wait for it to filter down I guess. 20:18:24 I need to head out, but I'm glad I finally stopped bye. laubersm, expect that email by the end of the weekend. ttyl. 20:18:39 danielsmw, sounds good. Thanks 20:20:46 quaid: forget what i said. I got it. its on its way. 20:20:50 yay! 20:21:54 ok, it looks as if user-guide has been converted to modern Publican, but ... that doesn't matter for the bugfixes 20:23:00 quaid: Ok so go in and make the minor changes. Build, Commit, and Push 20:24:27 Emad78: right 20:24:41 Emad78: you can use 'grep' on the command line to find the file with the error 20:25:06 e.g. 'cd en-US' and 20:25:17 'grep fodler *.xml' 20:25:46 then open the file in a plain text editor - emacs, vi, gedit, kate, etc. 20:25:57 save, commit 20:26:10 in the commit log reference the bug report number 20:26:22 since it's all one bug report, you can do all the fixes and then commit them all at one time 20:26:45 if it's multiple bug reports, I usually commit each change granularly, so each bug fix has an individual commit report. 20:27:02 * ke4qqq wonders if we should have a git "classroom" session again 20:27:49 quaid: Ok I'll give it a shot. See what happens. 20:28:57 Emad78: having it build is a secondary question; if you don't make any typos in fixing typos :) you shouldn't break anything, but we need to test the build to see if it even works at the moment. 20:29:02 * quaid tests 20:29:03 ke4qqq: +1 20:34:00 Emad78: just granted your IG request 20:36:07 ke4qqq: Ok thanks, I'm just slowing trying to get going here. But thought I would apply to the basic ones. 20:50:47 makes sense 20:50:49 quaid: I made the changes in the bug report and built the doc. Everything looks good. 20:51:02 so, user-guide isn't building for me, but it builds there? cool! 20:51:19 quaid: yeah I built it and it shows me the changes i made 20:52:18 quaid: so I go into the user-guide and git commit -m 20:54:49 Emad78: yes, or do 'git commit' and it opens a text editor for you to do a full commit report 20:55:25 generally that is: One sentence describing changes, e.g. list bug number; one blank line; one or more lines describing changes in more detail. 20:59:56 Um its angry I didnt git add 21:00:13 maybe not angry 21:00:18 maybe just reporting? 21:00:22 Yes 21:00:23 letting you know there are files you didn't add 21:00:27 yes 21:00:29 such as foo~ (backup files) 21:00:34 yeah, you can ignore that 21:00:48 that report shows you what you didn't add so you know if you missed something 21:00:56 it helps you keep from adding stuff you didn't mean to! 21:01:18 Ok, cause it lists the files I did edits to. 21:02:10 does it list them as needing to be added? 21:02:13 * quaid doesn't think it should 21:02:57 Ok, I did git commit -a, and it says enter a message. Thats where the bug no. goes and message 21:07:23 Emad78: exactly 21:15:47 jjmcd: pong? 21:15:59 Hey ryanlerch 21:16:03 heyhey 21:16:21 rudi mentioned some concern wrt translations when running new2old. Do you know what that was about? 21:16:32 hmmmmm.... 21:16:42 not that i am aware of. 21:16:47 when did he mention that? 21:17:09 new2old? 21:17:13 old2new? 21:17:15 quaid: When I commit -a it stays in the terminal but still had the message of adding commit message. But I add a message and how to I apply that message 21:17:20 Some time back. It had to do with resetting RNs so it may be more related to branches, but I had the feeling there was something to do with publican 21:18:04 Emad78: when you save and close the text editor it should finish the transaction 21:18:04 RNs? 21:18:13 release notes 21:18:20 new2old heh 21:18:43 yah, quaid. Wishful thinking I guess 21:18:58 why would you want to go back? :/ 21:19:07 make is my friend 21:19:43 the performance enhancements in the new publican outweigh that IMHO 21:19:54 70% speed improvement. 21:20:36 No real complaints. Just kind of a pain typing all those --this and --that and --theotherthing 21:21:08 And until we get tfx fixed, any speed improvement is totally masked by the msgmerge which takes 5 times as long as publican 21:22:36 quaid: Thats my problem. When I git commit -a, it says it found a swap file. And then it stays in the terminal, it doesn't open a text editor?? 21:23:23 Emad78, what is your setting for EDITOR and VISUAL 21:24:00 jjmcd: The what? The text editor. 21:24:40 * jjmcd always sets them to emacs and deletes the evil default, so probably not the best case, but the environment variables EDITOR and VISUAL determine what editor comes up 21:24:48 If they are blank that might be the issue 21:25:44 maybe evil should be spelled e vi l 21:25:49 how was the msgmerge any quicker with the old publican? 21:26:00 jjmcd: ? 21:26:20 It wasn't, but when you spend an hour doing msgmerge, saving 2 minutes on publican isn't visible 21:27:02 it certainly is visible when you are writing, and test building every 10minutes... 21:27:13 Yes, I'll buy that 21:27:49 Seems like I spend more time building umpteen languages so I can make L10N happy 21:29:02 In fact, I've been working on some non-Fedora dox lately with 1.0 and now that you mention it, it does seem like I don't spend quite so much time waiting around 21:30:08 Speaking of which, is there a guide for messing with the xsl files. And I do have a bug I gotta file on publican-doc 21:35:24 ryanlerch: I just tried the new publican and it is smokin' fast. 21:37:51 :) 21:40:01 is the bugstomp in progress still? 21:40:27 if not, how did it go? 21:42:19 I _think_ it's still in progress 21:43:33 * jjmcd is getting his shoes all gooey 22:23:54 ke4qqq: It is 22:24:03 I'm going to have to run to dinner shortly 22:24:23 But I stomped a few bugs earlier before getting a little sidetracked with FPL'ish stuff :-\ 22:24:46 * stickster is going to dive back in and find some content bugs he can fix 22:26:16 hi, 22:26:32 I heard there is a bug stomp party tomorrow 22:26:46 what would oen do? 22:36:31 mustu: Actually today is the bug stomp party: http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/docs/2010-March/011815.html 22:37:01 * stickster has to depart for dinner but I think we may have a few people in different timezones who can help you get started with an easy bug or two. 22:41:02 btw I updated https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Project_work_using_git 22:49:48 jjmcd, quaid: I did finally get the user-guide to push back up to the repository. But the message did not appear, just the bug number. ?? 22:50:33 wait one 22:51:46 hmmm, I never dit trush commit -a. Did you get an editor to enter the commit message? 22:52:24 mustu, I'd like to help you out but I need to go afk for dinner in a couple of minutes, too 22:53:24 jjmcd: No it did not pop up and editor. It ended up working like the about-fedora doc we did this morning. Just enter message right as you commit. 22:53:53 Try typing echo $EDITOR 22:53:59 and echo $VISUAL 22:55:01 Didn't do anything. Just skipped a line and restarted terminal 22:55:45 We can work on the later. Its no biggy, but I wondered what I needed to do to get the message on there. 22:55:54 OK, do EDITOR=gedit, then VISUAL=gedit Tthen export EDITOR VISUAL 22:56:06 Should be in your .bashrc probably 22:56:16 Assuming you like gedit rather than vi or emacs 22:56:31 OK, I gotta go. Back around 0000Z 22:57:21 jjmcd: Ok, thanks i really appreciate all the help. Hope I didn't slow you down to much. 00:11:52 Emad78, mustu, still around? 00:14:56 I am. 00:15:19 Need anything? I saw almost everyone had bailed 00:15:36 Wanted to make sure no questions/issues go unresolved 00:18:53 I am just soaking it all in right now. I'm sure I will have questions later though. 00:19:09 Probably good to spend some soak time 00:19:53 yeah, it seemed to work a couple times this week. 01:25:16 jjmcd, stickster_afk anyone still around? 01:25:28 hi Susan 01:25:52 how did things go? I saw some work on the user guide happening... 01:26:05 A little happened 01:26:27 We have a list of easy fixes. At least got a look over all the NEW/ASSIGNED bugs 01:26:38 I guess quite a bit got done, really 01:26:54 Mostly, tho, we got a couple of new folks up to speed so that is way cool 01:26:56 yeah, last I looked everything had at least been triaged 01:27:14 I saw a couple I can take care of real quick... 01:27:20 There's about a half-dozen EasyFix ones left I think 01:27:30 I been hitting the Release Notes ones 01:28:11 remind me the link for todays work... it had links to the bugs. 01:28:21 * laubersm swtiched machines and doesn't have the logs 01:28:42 https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_bug_stomping_day_2010-03-06 01:29:00 that is the one... thanks 01:29:04 (typed in tho so maybe typos - up on the other puter) 01:29:45 they worked earlier... the links from there at least. I don't know about other typos :) 01:30:09 danielsmw is going to send me some info about reworking user guide for next release. 01:30:17 good deal 01:30:28 I'm gonna hit the couple of other bugs I saw that I can deal with and close. 01:30:49 sounds like a plan - thanks 01:31:16 asuming I can remember how to get into my bugzilla account... hmmm 01:49:11 jjmcd, when are we closing bugs? when we commit to git source or when they make it into a live version? I would assume in source with "next release" 01:49:46 * laubersm notes that the easy fix in user guide that emad was working on is fixed in source but bug is stilll "new" 01:50:36 laubersm: I haven't got that far. Still learning. And forgetting. I'll close it right now. 01:51:02 oh, hi Emad78 01:51:09 For some reason I thought you had left... 01:51:13 no problem. 01:51:25 I did for a sec., back on now. 01:51:42 let me know if you need any help closing the bug. 01:51:45 laubersm, I've been marking them nextrelease on commit, but closed when I make the RPM. But that is Release Notes, might not be best for guides 01:51:47 Had to close out computer and move local's. 01:52:24 it has been a while but I should be able to help you out... and look jjmcd is here too, how convenient! :) 01:52:47 * jjmcd has to bail shortly 01:53:20 Emad78, (and jjmcd ) since it is your bug that you opened ... your choice. 01:53:54 I would suggest for the guides that once it hits git and the course it be closed with next release but I don't own the guide or the bug :) 01:54:28 I think most people are closing them when they commit. I find it easier to have the bugs available when I make the RPM for the specfile is all 01:54:29 * laubersm still need to learn more about how guides get from git commits to published web site 01:54:46 * laubersm finds it still a blur 01:55:03 Well, the web things ain't that bad, a pita but not complicated 01:55:08 I was wondering the same thing. I wanted to see my handy work. Ha Ha 01:55:44 Basically, clone the website, add the new doc, commit. Thing is it is CVS so it is a major pain and sleaux, too 01:56:24 It;s the testing before the commit that is part of the pain 01:56:25 jjmcd: Do you want me to close this bug then. Or wait for the owners to do it. 01:56:38 You basically need a local website 01:56:55 Emad78 I would go ahead and close it. I think all the guide owners are doing that. 01:57:14 OK 01:57:17 In any case, they will get an email when you close it so they won't be blindsided 01:58:42 OK, I'm off. See y'all tomorrow or so 01:59:17 I'm gonna jet for good also. Thanks for everyone's help. 01:59:44 good night Mrs. Kalabash, wherever you are 03:31:05 ke4qqq, you still around? 23:11:56 hi, i want some help regarding wiki.. where should i ask? 23:15:40 mustu, here 07:26:04 hi 07:26:23 how can i make a picture link in wiki.. means a picture links to a webpage 09:04:05 Any tips to get into the job of translating ? 14:34:32 Ugh 14:57:02 ugh? 14:59:17 ke4qqq: Yeah 14:59:30 The sound I make when I walk into the office and check my email 14:59:59 sparks, ke4qqq - I updated a bug on each of your guides this weekend... that should be in your mail too :) 15:00:23 yeah - I saw the udev one 15:01:29 ke4qqq, yeah, you got the rough end of that one... 15:01:46 sparks, gets it easy - I applied the patch, he just needs to verify and close 15:02:15 laubersm: I honestly don't know when I'll have time to even look! 15:02:56 laubersm: The only reason I'm up here now is that we use IRC at work. 15:03:46 sparks, I know the feeling. 15:04:26 today is a catch up day for me - finally - the first in 6 weeks. 15:04:50 I usually get one every 2-3 weeks. 15:04:57 catch up = paperwork 15:05:02 instead of teaching 15:05:07 or traveling 04:44:59 Hey, does anybody know what the link to the f13 alpha release notes is? 04:45:18 Never mind, got it: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_13_Alpha_release_notes 15:38:02 the alpha release notes are very incomplete if someone has time please fix that 15:40:22 mether, the alpha release notes are always very brief 15:41:15 http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_13_Alpha_release_notes?anF13a 15:41:19 not talking about brief 15:41:22 but incomplete 15:41:26 see FIXME 15:41:38 or incomplete descriptions for example 15:41:59 dont see it as a huge deal since the announcement has the important details 15:42:15 gtg 16:05:23 thanks 20:58:48 quaid, around? 20:59:25 mmcgrath, you there? 21:00:00 itbegins: yo 21:00:31 mmcgrath, do you have some time to talk about getting Zikula to staging (again)? 21:00:43 quaid would probably be interested in this too 21:01:05 itbegins: I can do it now if you can stand lots of lag, I'm multi-tasking a couple of issues at the moment 21:01:27 hiemanshu has also been working on it, perhaps #fedora-admin would be a good place to discuss? 21:01:51 mmcgrath: That's fine, I might be the same. I'll talk at you and if you have any questions feel free to chip in? 21:01:57 #fedora-admin is fine by me 05:26:27 http://fossdocs.wordpress.com/2010/03/10/publican-not-just-for-beer/ 13:29:32 can wikitags work inside 
 tags?  Fedora-{{FedoraVersion||current}}-i386-DVD.iso
13:39:04  templates expansion, rather, or whatever the term is. and the answer seems to be no
18:33:29  stickster: You around?
18:42:28  sparks: Just got back from gym+lunch, whassup?
18:43:53  My weight is up... does that count?
18:43:58 * jsmith ducks and hides
18:45:13  stickster, sparks, someone pointed out a bug in the alpha release notes around the installer and it needs fixed but I haven't been able to free the time to research it
18:49:42  jjmcd: URL?
18:49:49  Or any reference would be fine :-)
18:50:29  https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_13_Alpha_release_notes
18:50:59  You touched it up yesterday, but the section on the installer only has a couple of words, and it sounds as if maybe the changes are significant
18:51:11  But the feature list doesn't seem to ref those changes
18:51:29  and I haven't been able to dig much further -- continuing drama up here :-(
18:51:34  so is the bug actually an enhancement request?
18:51:41  or is it really a bug
18:51:55  as in incorrect information
18:52:17  Well, I would call it a bug because it is so lame, but I have no idea whether it is correct
18:52:35  It simply says:
18:52:46  /home is a separate partition
18:52:58  /boot defaults to 500 MB instead of 200 MB as the default to help preupgrade and dracut.
18:53:02  ANd that's it
18:53:22  are those details correct? If so I'll flesh it out a bit and remove the fixme
18:53:35  ke4qqq, I have no idea
18:54:00  I don't recall what the feature list said, but it seems like it was unrelated
18:54:06  ke4qqq: I haven't done an installation, only an upgrade.
18:54:23  ke4qqq: jjmcd: But that should be darn easy to check real quick like
18:54:25  I didn't pay attention during the fresh install I did on a vm
18:54:33  yeah - let me run install on my vm again
19:09:27  ke4qqq: What the deal with Zikula 1.2?
19:09:50  stickster: Things have turned for the worse at work so I may need some relief of my duties, temporarily.
19:10:03  sparks: Yikes!
19:10:16  sparks: I'll talk with jjmcd and see what we can do
19:10:20  stickster: Unless I loose my job, whereas I'll have lots of Fedora time
19:10:30  sparks: That's not good, don't do that
19:10:36 * sparks would probably be happier with the latter
19:11:06  jjmcd: Perhaps you and I can split up meeting and followup duties for a bit -- chairing alternating weeks, for example
19:11:49  stickster: I've begun to take work home with me just to keep up.  Between the research and the paperwork I'm fighting a loosing fight against time.  :(
19:12:00  stickster, To tell the truth, I was half expecting it.  I have some real challenges right now but I expect it to die down in a couple days.
19:12:40  sparks: Trust me, I sympathize. My days are pretty long as it is and I still have to figure out daily what I need to let drop
19:12:53  But I suspect you are acquainted with the sort of on and off drama you get when you have a couple thousand volunteers to keep happy
19:13:05  jjmcd: heh :-)
19:13:48  But I still need to call the State Police to get bawled out for something I don't know what is, so maybe I won't be quite so positive in a few days
19:28:34  sparks: Would be good to make this a list conversation if you don't mind. That way more people than the three of us have a chance to put a hand up and say, "I'd like to help more."
19:28:48  sparks: Do you need someone to lead tonight's meeting then?
19:30:42  stickster: Unless I can get all my homework done before I go home then I'll probably need some backup tonight.
19:31:04  sparks: I'll be happy to lead tonight's meeting then, unless jjmcd says he can.
19:31:09  I'll be there either way.
19:34:28  jjmcd: Are all the pages on this category listing correct? Meaning not "the content's all ready," but rather, "this is a complete list of beats, and none of this is obsolete"?
19:34:35  https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Category:Release_Notes
19:34:44 * stickster applauds the use of categories, yay!
19:35:45  stickster, Yes, the beats were all cleared, what is there is new, I'm not opposed to new beats if needed, and if nothing happens this release in some beats we won't put fluff in there
19:36:07  jjmcd: Crisp! :-)  \m/
23:37:05  jjmcd: I won't be in the meeting
23:37:32  the local organizer thinks we won't have problems with a firewall.  I'm taking care of the hardware either way
23:37:49  I've set up a temporary mailing list to discuss stuff: http://syllogist.net/mailman/listinfo/dhs2010_syllogist.net
23:38:14  anybody who's interested in doing remote participation should join as well.  it's just so we can keep each other informed
23:38:20  qed
23:49:38  shaunm, outstanding. thanks
23:52:53  Meeting in 8!
00:03:25  jsmith-away: rudi: ryanlerch: quaid: *: Meeting is over in #fedora-meeting
01:11:26  stickster, are you still around
01:11:40  I was just heading out jjmcd -- have to put kids to bed
01:11:46  finishing up an email too :-)  But go ahead!
01:12:21  I was thinking of a plea for new contributors on 2600.  Could draw some excited types, but has the potential to draw some pretty reckless folks, too.
01:12:35  Hrm
01:12:36  Still, I think it may be fertile ground.  WHat do you think?
01:13:01  Let's talk about this on the list, I think
01:13:11  Needs more eyeballs than just me
01:13:13  OK, we could do that
01:13:26  I have concerns... but we are an open project, and all that!
01:13:28  I have been to some of their cons and they aren't that bad, but still ...
01:13:53  LOL - the only guys there my age have done time for hacking, tho!
01:14:44  But there were also an awful lot of wicked smart kids
01:15:35  Take care of the kids, I need to get upstairs myself
02:23:51  ummm...  when did we move from live CD to live DVD (or USB)?  not that I mind using usb instead of cd but....
02:23:53  Did I miss a memo?  The Alpha Live CD is 835M  and the Live-kde is 714M
02:24:19  I was gonna burn a cd to take with me this weekend and not worry about loosing or leaving behind with friends...  oh well.
04:23:14  susan: ping
04:52:52  laubersm: yeah -- it was a desktop team decision at the beginning of the cycle.... I think they only posted it on fedora-desktop but they might have posted to devel list and I just missed it.
04:54:03  laubersm: btw, Were the Packaging Guidelines changes that were in the git repository somewhat automatically generated or were they entirely manual?
04:54:47  laubersm: The last time I had to fly I did a bit of work on some aspects of that (moving some things to Meeting:, updating categories)
05:12:34  G, pong
05:29:26  dfj: hey :)
05:34:25  G: sup!~
05:34:44  dfj: not much, yourself
05:35:32  well we've finished depopulating the Earth, now it's just time to finish the genetic engineering research and we can enter 'phase 2'
05:36:03  really though, just busy, since university started back
05:36:54  dfj: ahhh okay
05:40:13  when are you going to open up Red Hat NZ?
05:40:58  dfj: haha, no idea
13:22:19  abadger1999, they were manual.  We (read ianweller and the other person he was working with) never got the automation going.
13:22:45  laubersm: Okay.
13:22:49  abadger1999, they - being the renaming of pages in the wiki which I think is what you were asking about?
13:23:08  Well... sorta -- I was asking how the file in git was generated.
13:23:24  abadger1999, you are awake?  I thought you were west coast... and would be snoozing
13:23:30  laubersm: I did work on most of the categories for the pages, didn't get to renamin
13:23:37  laubersm: I'm really a robot :-)
13:24:09  laubersm: Truthfully, lot's of work to do so I'm pulling a (less frequent these days) all nighter.
13:24:11  the file in git was manually done too but that is easier with some of the special pages listing pages then search and replace in editors
13:25:10  unless you want to hand off a bunch of page naming to a new recruit, I would just move the pages and skip the wikirename git
13:25:29  I gave up all nighters a long time :)
13:25:50  Okay.   I was just curious because I don't necessarily know what pages are out there needing categories/renames.
13:26:24  hehe -- I'm trying but it's the most productive time of day so I still use them occassionally.
13:26:36  http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Special:SpecialPages  helps a lot
13:26:53  there is a page of uncatoragized pages
13:27:04  and uncatoragized categories
13:27:24  Coolness.  That does help.
13:27:26  then there is just pages in categories you use that might be better elsewhere (meeting or archive)
13:27:54  also recent changes and most changed pages
13:28:21  and new pages
13:29:04  Where are you flying to?  anyplace good?
13:29:40  laubersm: Was -- I flew to ATL for pycon about 2 weeks ago.
13:29:57  Pretty good time although I didn't get out into the city near enough.
13:30:26  So I didn't get a chance to actually see much of atlanta
13:30:46  there really isn't much of ATL to see
13:31:06  yay, Looks like I fixed all the Packaging: categories.  Next time I'll get all the PackagingDrafts
13:31:15  I would like to go to the "new" aquarium there though.  It is still new to me... but has been there a few years now
13:31:51  
13:32:20  cool.  Have people finally gotten use to using the category page for their drafts and such?
13:32:36  Or are they still just asking for something to be looked at that is a random page?
13:32:44  I haven't looked lately
13:32:56  Nope :-(  I still correct the categories whenever a new draft is posted.
13:33:07  sigh
13:33:21  I think I know how to fix that... but just haven't done it.
13:33:38  Make the Packaging Committee's TODO list a Category page.
13:34:04  Then people will have to add the category to have it show up.
13:34:24  The only problem being that we have several different states.
13:34:46  you can use sub categories for that
13:34:47  drafts ready for voting, for discussion and modification, in need of someone to finish it up
13:35:09  each sub is in your TODO category and then the page goes in the correct state sub
13:35:10  Those won't be expanded on the same page though, correct?
13:35:22  I think features uses that method
13:35:36  no they would not be expanded on the same page...
13:35:43  Oh, but something that might work would be transclusion combined with subcategories.
13:35:47  There might be a way....
13:35:53  but I would have to look...
13:36:05  yeah - that is the one transclude
13:36:07  The todo list transcludes a bunch of subcategories of packaging drafts
13:36:26  Alright, I'll look at doing that my next plane trip :-)
13:37:00  you get internet on the plane these days?  or just in airports/hotels?
13:37:17  My flights have been short enough I do not bother on the plane itself.
13:37:27  But then I am generally just up and down the east coast.
13:37:49  max 2 hours gate to gate, less in the air when they would let me be online anywyas.
13:37:51  The airport.
13:38:00  
13:38:14  laubersm: (/me is slowly working on automation :) )
13:38:18  I have my wife drop me off at the airport so I sometimes end up being there for many hours
13:38:34  I have been on several flights where they are offering it now...
13:38:36  thanks ianweller
13:38:58  sacramento has free wireless and the new terminal has a reasonable number of outlets.
13:39:04 * laubersm has thought about thinking about doing some more wiki cleanup  :)
13:39:20  My delta flight had wireles.
13:39:25  :-)
13:40:15 * laubersm has to go pack and print a boarding pass now and find breakfast
13:40:32  Thanks for the information!
13:41:14  np
23:57:12  Hey, we just finished the transifex upgrade and we've tried to convert all docs projects to the new publican type
23:57:21  However we've been getting some errors when trying to refresh the stats:
23:57:23  2010-03-11 23:56:32,048 DEBUG There is no 'pot' directory in the set of files. docs-about-fedora.f12-tx does not seem to be a Publian like project.
23:58:12  Oh, I think I know why.
00:01:29  I'd like to open the file filter up to .*\.po for those projects.
00:11:41  ricky -- thank you so much for all the hard work you've put into this
00:12:42  No problem :-)
00:13:02  Before opening up the file filters, each doc owner should make sure that the PO files in the language directories are up-to-date
00:13:36  ie, that changes made to the master, merged PO file have been carried across.
00:13:47  OK, should I send an email to the docs list about this then?
00:13:55  The first step now would be to temporarily *disable* submissions to all docs
00:14:04  I guess the po/ directory will end up being removed then, right?
00:14:11  Then let us do the splitting, and then open up submissions again
00:14:20  Right.
00:14:31  OK, I'll look at disabling them for now then
00:14:58  I'll send email to both docs-list and trans-list with this advice
00:15:49  Great, thanks!
00:16:31  If it's useful, here is the list of components which I have closed submissions for: http://dpaste.com/171035/
00:18:03  I thought the days of splitting were over
00:18:11  with the new tfx
00:24:52  ke4qqq -- yeah; this will be the final split
00:26:03  We have to make sure that what's in the individual language directories is up-to-date with regard to work that translators have been doing in the big, merged, PO files...
00:26:13  We don't want anyone to lose work! :)
00:39:04  ahhhh ok
00:39:46  Thanks for the email
00:41:47  ricky -- you're a hero! :)
02:14:30  rudi, you around?
02:14:36  laubersm -- yo
02:15:06  I am looking at the User Guide git repo.  It appears that the devel branch does have Matthew's suggested outline.  But it also looks
02:15:10  like it is the old publican
02:15:18  I suppose it is time I learned how to convert.
02:15:24  Is it as easy as a old2new command?
02:15:47  "master" already has a publican.cfg instead of Makefile so that is set for now.
02:17:39  It is indeed as easy as that:
02:17:44  publican old2new
02:18:09  And yeah, I doubt there's been any traction on that since before Publican 1 came out
02:18:19  ok...
02:18:41  I get a publican.cfg file now...  I also get:
02:18:42  found: BRAND COMMON_CONFIG DOCNAME PRODUCT XML_LANG
02:18:43  COMMON_CONFIG is not used anymore.
02:18:43  PRODUCT is not used anymore.
02:18:43  DOCNAME is not used anymore.
02:18:58  Yep; that's just informative, not an error
02:19:29  Just verify your Publican version for me?
02:19:35  publican -v
02:19:57  version=1.6
02:22:22  thanks rudi - I have it trying to build single-html en-US - now I just have to track down the mismatch tag...  I should be good to go for a while.
02:22:50  I'm not going to do much with that branch until dainelsmw gets me what he was working on already.
02:23:06  I'm just poking around to see where everything is at
02:23:20  Yeah; I have high hopes for that version, but I don't think it's realistic to expect it for F13 :)
02:24:19  I agree.  I have some time this week but then my schedule gets tight again.
02:24:52  If I can get it set up enough maybe something will happen.  And I might get a pony too.
02:25:00  lolz
02:26:09  My dream is that this could become so useful for people new to Fedora (and Linux in general) that we could ask the Steering Committee to fund reserving some ISBNs and then get ambassadors to get dead-tree versions into public libraries across the planet :)
02:26:18  ...but I'd settle for a pony too :)
02:29:34  lol
02:31:22  You have to clean up after a pony
02:39:54 * laubersm has a pony... and pays someone else to clean up after him
17:50:13  jsmith-away: if you haven't seen it, the textbook for Teaching Open Source is heating up to conclusion
17:52:05  we'll be converting out to docbook soon; haven't set the schedule yet but likely next weekend or therafter by a bit
17:52:24  jsmith-away: if you get a chance to catch up on the list and see if you have time to participate, that'd be great
21:17:17  jjmcd: I got my git config to work in my bash.rc file. The one that keeps track of where I am at in git. Remember I was having that error come up?? Its working now.
21:17:48  Oh cool.  Did I respond to your last email?  I tried, had a problem, and don't recall whether I tried again
21:18:39  I don't remember either. But I'm just reading and learning all the beats stuff.
21:19:11  Well, if you find some with nothing but links to feature pages, don't be shy about writing
21:49:22  jjmcd: I wanted to look at something that would be a good start. Something basic, if not easy, but just something I could wrap my head around. Like the livecd.
21:50:10  Emad78, yeah, some of the beats are a little arcane, it can take a bit to get your head around them
21:34:55  good morning docs
21:36:04  docs, not sure who is the maintainer. https://translate.fedoraproject.org/projects/p/fedora-web/c/master-fedoraproject/#ja
21:37:32  One para is missing from the above POT... any one can help?
21:38:05 * noriko is looking at stickster
21:41:25  noriko: I think I can
21:41:26  Hang on
21:41:50  stickster: thanks. here is the string in question
21:41:53  http://fedoraproject.org/ja/get-fedora
21:42:14  "Export Regulations
21:42:15  By clicking on and downloading Fedora, you agree to comply with the following terms and conditions:
21:42:15  Read full export regulations"
21:43:44  noriko: Is that in fedoraproject.org?
21:44:17  stickster: https://translate.fedoraproject.org/projects/p/fedora-web/c/master-fedoraproject/#ja
21:44:26  http://git.fedorahosted.org/git/?p=fedora-web.git;a=history;f=fedoraproject.org;hb=HEAD
21:44:31  OK
21:46:13  noriko: I believe that is a non-translatable on purpose
21:46:26  It's legal text on Export regulations and I'm not sure we can translate it
21:46:43  noriko: This would be a question to ask legal@lists.fp.o I think
21:48:01  oh... ok. then I will post legal. thanks stickster !
21:48:19  noriko: I'm writing an email for you, don't worry :-)
21:48:48  oh. ok :-))
21:50:35  noriko: http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/legal/2010-March/001183.html
21:51:12  noriko: I'm going off line now for a bit, it's dinner time and people are waiting on me :-)
21:51:19  Let me know if I can help further
21:51:30  I'll let you know about the answer to that email I just sent, no matter what.
21:53:02  stickster_afk: thank you. this is exactly what I wanna know!!  see ya later.
00:33:07  https://secure.adppayroll.com.au/
00:33:45  wrong channel :)
00:40:42  lolz
01:30:52  oops
04:13:58  noriko: http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/legal/2010-March/001184.html
04:14:13  noriko: ^^ answers your question from a night or two ago
04:14:48  stickster: yup! thank you so much!!  I've forwarded the post to trans@fp.o
04:14:58  okey dokey
04:15:07  :-))
04:25:21  jjmcd: stickster: I saw that email to the Docs List with the huge list of "bugs" that the person who wrote them had some ideas about the User-Guide. Do we do something with that. Take it an run with it??
04:26:17  Murray's email? Yes. He's a great contributor who helped us in the past too
04:26:52  stickster: Yes that was it. Do we have someone looking into that?
04:27:01  Emad78: No, you're welcome to work onit
04:27:03  *on it
04:28:14  Emad78 -- if you want to pick that one up, it might be a good idea to paste it into a bug
04:28:29  That way, you/we have a way of tracking progress on it
04:28:41  (or maybe a few bugs, depending how much sorting you want to do)
04:28:56  rudi: Yes, that was in the back of my mind to ask also.
04:28:57  Yeah -- it's a lot of little bugs, but it might take more time to separate them than it would to fix them
04:29:14 * stickster tends to use the command line bugzilla program in some cases like that
04:29:24  But... it's really up to you Emad78
04:29:36 * stickster is heading to bed, it's totally late here and he's beat
04:29:37  Well since I don
04:30:31  don't know how to use the command line BZ I'll have to use the web based. I'll take a look and see how hard it would be.
04:31:39  rudi: Is there any chance of getting that email again. I think it got lost to the delete button??
04:32:57  You can always grab past messages from the archives -- http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/docs/
04:33:20  So Murray's email is here -- http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/docs/2010-March/011885.html
04:34:32  rudi: Ok thank you. Sorry if I ask questions more than once. I'm still getting into the flow with all this. And I'm sure it's going to take awhile.
04:34:45  NP :)
04:34:55  Never be afraid to ask :)
04:35:34  Do you want me to fix every bug. Or kind of go through and confirm and fix.
19:54:49  ianweller - ping
20:04:56  jjmcd: hi
20:05:06  ianweller, the wiki is broke
20:05:12  Well, not totally
20:05:28  {{package|something}} always leads to a bad page
20:05:49  "the wiki is broke" is always the worst problem description in the world :)
20:05:57  YEah, well
20:06:02  But it is broke
20:06:04  jjmcd: you have an example i can click on?
20:06:10  Just not especially specifiv
20:06:30  Dpcumentation_beat_changes
20:06:38  whoops B capital
20:08:27  Doesn't seem to care what package you head for ... perhaps there was a change in the packagedb
20:08:44  there as
20:08:45  was*
20:08:47  fixing template now
20:10:47  a'ight, that should do it
20:11:25  Do I need to edit pages containing the macro?
20:11:34  ianweller!  You're alive!
20:12:13  AHhh great - thanks!!
20:12:15  jjmcd: no, once the job queue clears up,pages willhave been purged if they used that template
20:12:24  jsmith: kinda ;)
22:58:47  jjmcd -- you around?
23:21:40  rudi - here now
23:21:51  Hey!
23:22:16  Just a heads-up that I was about to start doing the git plumbing so that we can start on the F13 RN
23:22:35  Oh good.  I wanted to ask you what we needed to do to make the branch
23:23:07  I have no issue with the publican create and all that, but you were sprinkling some magic pixie dust on the po's
23:23:15  Yeah; we shouldn't actually branch yet -- not till we're ready to drop to translation
23:23:30  yeah -- just a case of making sure that nothing gets lost
23:23:37  Shall I go ahead and start making the xml
23:23:44  and push to git when we are ready?
23:24:03  Just bear with me -- I'll have it ready to start rolling within the hour :)
23:24:10  NP
23:24:23  I'll still be working on the wiki tomorrow
23:24:27  lots to do there
23:24:52  You can start on the XML if you like, but you'll need to do it in a separate directory, then do a fresh pull from git, then copy/paste, then push back into git
23:25:40  OK -- so when can we tell noriko and L10N that they will have some content to start working with? The original schedule said we'd have this done on the 15th :S
23:26:11  rudi - oh yeah, well, we will copy almost nothing over anyway, so a clean dir makes the most sense
23:26:58  Yeah, we're scrambling.  I've been dragging my feet trying to exploit some new contributors, and thought I would crunch over the weekend, then stuff happened and I didn't even get to look at it until today
23:27:34  NP -- I've been away in secret-RHEL-stuff land for quite a few weeks now
23:27:55  Hopefully we can get the lifting done in the next few days :)
23:28:47  I ended up going a few counties away yesterday to stroke some fire chiefs, law enforcement types, a 911 director and those kind of folks in a jurisdiction that  can't get along
23:29:10  Heh -- awesome
23:29:13  Caught me by surprise
23:29:44  ANd of course, I hop on the big bird friday, so tomorrow and the next I gotta get cracking
23:30:19  But I wasn't all that concerned about L10N because we really don't usually do beta notes translated, so they are starting for GA
23:37:19  jjmcd -- OK -- I need to take another look at that schedule and tell L10N to stand down :)
23:37:46  Well, there will be some stuff to translate, but I didn't expect they would be crunching for beta
23:37:50  I think *their* schedule has them translating them...
23:38:31  I think we left that there but not enough time to do anything really
23:38:42  Yeah -- task 21 here -- http://poelstra.fedorapeople.org/schedules/f-13/f-13-trans-tasks.html
23:38:48  Even if we had the POTs, they would only have a week
23:38:54  Indeed.
23:39:15  OK -- I'll reply to noriko on the list
23:39:25  IT would be nice to have a few strings for testing, but getting the whole thing translated in that time is nuts
23:39:33  And still go ahead with getting the repo set up
23:39:40  yep - great
23:39:47  I'll keep crunching on content
23:39:56  (I agree -- although we probably have a couple of translators who are that energetic :) )
00:00:28 * noriko picked the word of translators
00:00:34  what was the topic rudi ?
00:01:08  Hi noriko -- jjmcd just pointed out to me that we *never* translate the Beta Release Notes
00:01:28  So that item should not have been on the L10N schedule
00:03:52  rudi: hum... there was the entry 'translate beta rel-note' in F12 too
00:04:56  rudi: this can make beta rel-note trans available in beta release PA
00:05:14  OK -- but that didn't happen for F12 either
00:05:34  I'm not sure what you mean by that second message
00:06:47  rudi: that means, translation only available after GA, no?
00:07:04  That's how it's always been, yeah.
00:08:11  translation team just finished software translation by 16-Mar, it is very good time to work on rel-note.
00:08:51  I am not sure if this entry can be removed...
00:10:16  So there probably needs to be some discussion between docs, l10n, and possible other stakeholders about whether we want or need Beta release notes translated
00:10:56  I suspect that one of the issues is how much we expect the RN to change between Beta and GA
00:11:09  (and I don't know the answer to that -- jjmcd might, though?)
00:13:00  rudi: I agree. we have to discuss this issue. It would be good time to know the importance of that entry.
00:13:45  to know / sorry / to understand the true meaning of that entry if there is
00:16:09  Yep
00:20:46  rudi: how can we start the discussion?
00:21:47  I don't like to push docs team unnecessary
00:22:15  It might be a good idea to ask John where the idea came from?
00:22:42  on the list?
00:23:12  By emailing him first maybe?
00:23:33  I don't think John knows the reason of the entry existence.
00:23:51  that is more to ours.
00:23:51  OK -- so how did it get on the schedule?
00:24:09  heehee, good question. I don't have the answer.
00:24:14  Somebody must have made a decision to include it at some point
00:24:36  That said, maybe it is indeed useful -- but I have no idea whether that's true or not.
00:25:03  translators are happy to work on beta-rel, so I see no reason to remove it.
00:27:07  Sure, but a better question might be: There's not that much time between Beta and GA. If most of the Beta content was going to be thrown away a few weeks after it was translated, do you think that community translators would want to work on it?
00:27:39  (and just to clarify -- I don't know whether that's true -- we would need to research the question)
00:28:27  rudi: what is rel-note progress atm?  the situation is hard to make POT&POs?
00:29:22  Looks like the wiki version is not yet complete; so there's nothing in the XML yet; so it will be easy to make POT&POs, but they will be empty....
00:32:01  i was disconnected....
00:32:23  NP -- Looks like the wiki version is not yet complete; so there's nothing in the XML yet; so it will be easy to make POT&POs, but they will be empty....
00:32:38  thanks.
06:19:12  hi
06:19:46  hey hanx
06:28:38  not more ingles
06:33:18  Sorry :(
06:33:24  Which language did you want?
06:33:39  Fedora translations are in #fedora-l10n
06:44:00  spanish
06:45:27  The docs team works in English, then the L10N team translates.
06:46:01  hanx_ -- http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/L10N
06:46:32  also -- http://docs.fedoraproject.org/translation-quick-start-guide/es/
06:46:46  seeting
06:52:52  hanx_: you can join #fedora-es
06:55:25  Yes, but I want to learn English so I use English channels
14:39:40  jjmcd, ping
14:39:50  mether - yo
14:40:04  for the installation release notes
14:40:19  have you checked with anaconda-devel list
14:40:28  there has been several major changes
14:40:57  No I haven't.  Last time rudi did that beat and I was going to ask him if there were any issues.  Is there a feature page or something?
14:41:22  no unfortunately
14:41:24  Or is anaconda-devel-list manageable enough that I can pick out the interesting bits in finite time
14:41:34  off the top of my head
14:41:42  Or better yet, is there someone who wants to add prose to the beat page?
14:42:24  home is now a sep partition.  you can pass "btrfs" as a option to select the filesystem,  the group selection ui and storage selection ui has changed considerably
14:42:39  i could write what i know of
14:42:44  No more icantbelieveitsnotbtr?
14:42:47  no
14:43:03  i could write what i know of
14:43:08  but i might be missing details
14:43:14  Oh, I see we have a LOT of feature pages
14:43:27  https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Documentation_Beats_Installer
14:43:43  yeah i will note down the changes
14:43:50  I would appreciate that
14:43:52  and please pass them on to anaconda team for review
14:43:55  before finalizing on that
14:44:08  Right now I am going through the beats looking at what needs done
14:44:15  alright
14:44:22  i saw the recent changes
14:44:22  Super - thank you so much
14:59:46  jjmcd: I just sent a detailed schedule reminder and update to the list
15:00:08  I am about to tickle the new contributors on stuff available to do
15:00:16  jjmcd: Has anyone started moving the wiki content to Publican?
15:00:26  No, haven't branched yet
15:00:30  That should have been completed about 36 hours ago according to our schedule
15:01:03  I know, the plan was to crunch over the weekend but then stuff happened and I couldn't touch it Fri-Mon
15:01:14  jjmcd: Was there a message to the list to let people know that?
15:01:51  I don't think so, there has been some discussion, but you might not pick up on it if you weren't engaged
15:02:09  jjmcd: Definitely sympathize with getting caught up in stuff, it happens.
15:02:26  jjmcd: Please make a habit of emailing the list -- you can't depend on IRC as a channel for letting everyone know
15:02:36  I could have helped a bit over the weekend had I known you needed it.
15:02:42  I have one county determined to make my life miserable
15:02:47  I understand
15:03:05  You can only do what you can do :-)
15:03:22  jjmcd: All I'm asking is that you let us know when you need help so we can give as much of it as we can :-)
15:03:41  I spent Monday talking with a bunch of public safety agencies that can't get along.  Kinday shitty when the cops and firefighters can't even get along
15:04:06  Yeah, I am minutes from posting about a list of what there is to do and the compexity of each
15:04:07  *sigh... turf wars suck.
15:05:13  The county has had some hard knocks, but you really expect some public officials to be professional
15:11:51  jjmcd: I'll look for that email when I return from the gym + lunch
15:14:16  Looks like Jason has already picked one up
15:43:16  stickster: is that the same python-mwlib that's broken?
15:44:35  or is it something else that's broken
15:45:12  ke4qqq, there are a couple of beats with your name on them, I think they may have little change this release.  Could you take a peek?
15:45:28  jjmcd: I will have it done by CoB today
15:45:34  thanks
15:45:36  if that's ok?
15:45:48  or rather - I'll have it reviewed by CoB
15:47:28  Yeah, we're behind, crunching for beta.  For beta we'll get what we can.  I'll be away Fri-Mon for the Gnome thing.  Hopefully we can put some others to work on the XML conversion over the weekend
15:48:01  I'll try and be here for the weekend - and my weak docbook skills can be used.
15:48:14  jjmcd: so do you use python-mwlib to convert wiki to docbook??
15:48:22  no
15:48:36  is there a reason?
15:48:37  Last time it wasn't ready so we just did it manually
15:48:49  ahhh ok
15:48:58 * ke4qqq will read up on it today as well
15:49:23  ANd the manual thing actually goes pretty well.  I would like to see something automated, but you know how that goes
15:50:20  yeah
16:43:10  stickster, not sure what the correction you to send to fedora-desktop list is about?
16:43:41  stickster, i wasnt talking about http logs in my mail
18:36:21  I'm finally testing the latest python-mwlib
18:36:34  we are also needing it for the Teaching Open Source textbook conversion happening RSN
18:40:33  quaid: how's it working out?
18:40:53  just started, setting up the environment
18:41:48 * Jeff_S stops putting on the pressure
18:42:03  :)
18:55:12 * ianweller goes to see what the status of that package is
19:03:15  quaid: you're testing git HEAD or tag 0.12.12?
19:06:33  python-mwlib-0.11.2-4.20090522hg2956.fc12.i686
19:06:48  that's the one that Paul rebuild and is in bodhi
19:07:50  https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/python-mwlib-0.11.2-4.20090522hg2956.fc12
19:08:31  anyone remember how to use mw-render?  recall any wiki pages we wrote on it?
19:08:35  I can't find squat.
19:11:39  From IC logs: /usr/bin/mw-render -c http://fedoraproject.org/w/ -w docbook PageTitle -o output.xml
19:11:43  **IRC
19:11:46  ah!
19:11:57  yep, I remember grepping irc logs last time, too :)
19:12:04 * quaid adds that to the right page
19:12:05  Heh, looks like time to make a wiki page then :_)
19:14:59  quaid: oh ok.
19:15:08  quaid: well i'm gonna test building a new rpm with the latest version. :)
19:15:25  it's going to fail massively. i know it
19:17:45  http://fpaste.org/Q5Bh/
19:17:51  not happy here
19:18:00  pkg_resources.DistributionNotFound: twisted-core>=8.2
19:18:27  hmm, not installed
19:18:28 * quaid installs
19:36:38  ok, it was failing on the wiki url, so i tried one where I knew it for certain
19:36:53  http://fpaste.org/6hB9/
19:37:59  needs python-twisted-web?  installing to see
19:40:12  hmm, getting there ...
19:40:56  works a charm
19:41:57  stickster: two missing dependencies and working package noted in Bodhi
19:55:25  quaid: i might just add that to cvs, rebuild, and add new updates
19:55:55  sounds good to me
19:56:02  I'll retest and rekarma if you do
19:56:21 * quaid shouldn't have given it good karma he realizes
19:59:30  ianweller: quaid: Done.
19:59:43  My stupid mistake, my fix :-)
20:00:07  I'll post the new links for karma, or you can add yourself to cc for .bug 486678
20:00:30  .bug 486678
20:00:33  stickster: Bug 486678 Failing with 'mw-render' due to needing python-dateutil >=1.4.1 - https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=486678
20:01:10  (The bug got munged with other dep problems, but the new package should *actually* take care of it now.)
20:34:48  stickster, hey
20:35:02  stickster, did we get legal sign off on enabling uuid via yum
21:02:09  mether: Well, technically we're not blocking on legal, but no
21:02:30  can you rephrase that
21:02:34  we are not doing it?
21:02:44  The Board specifically wants some research into whether there's any leeway for us to have that as an opt-out feature without violating privacy laws in some parts of the world.
21:03:15  If we made it an opt-in feature, we would have little problem turning it on -- but then it would be not as useful
21:03:26  alright
21:03:26  Which is not to say that we would absolutely want to make it opt-out by default
21:03:35  We're just trying to find out what our options are.
21:03:50  why dont we make it opt-in for this release and investigate our options further?
21:03:51  Unfortunately that research is not zero-cost to us so I've been trying to find ways to fund that inside Red Hat.
21:05:05  Because the whole idea is to have a system that's better than what we have now (smolt + IP check-ins)
21:05:46  huh, mw-render can't recognize the teacingopensource.org URL
21:06:01  it doesn't use the traditional /w/, it's all at the www root
21:06:01  If the only thing we get out of it, is having to explain to everyone why this UUID exists and why we're presenting Yet Another Dialog/Option during post-install, the cost outweighs the benefits.
21:07:09  http://fpaste.org/4oci/
21:07:28  ^^^ final error from 3 separate stacktraces
21:09:50 * quaid tries other variations and sub-domains to no avail
21:19:35  stickster: I'm asking about this on #pediapress; if that doesn't come to fruition, I can only think to file a bug report -- do you want me to file in bugzilla and you'll contact upstream, or should I file it directly with them?
21:19:51  I'm not sure it's a bug, but my syntax doesn't seem incorrect ..
21:22:28  quaid: Keep in mind we're on an earlier release right now
21:22:50  oh, it's an earlier
21:22:52  I'd like to get a newer one out for F13 before Beta but it's another Round Tuit for me
21:22:57  ok, I have a workaround
21:23:13  I can copy the 8 chapters in to a different wiki then render from that base URL that works
21:24:07  not too ugly of a hack :)
21:26:56  quaid: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/python-mwlib-0.11.2-5.20090522hg2956.fc12?_csrf_token=2dc3835d9a26df2701e66a0401e41c633f4f1d4f
21:27:00  oops, that won't work for you :-)
21:27:07  quaid: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/python-mwlib-0.11.2-5.20090522hg2956.fc12
21:29:51  well, I just grabbed the fc13 build
21:29:55  seems to work fine
21:41:02  jjmcd: Are you taking the Docs meeting chair tonight?
21:41:16 * stickster thought we'd agreed on alternating weeks, just checking
21:52:43 * quaid goes ahead and removes the package and the dependencies, then reinstalls with the new package
21:53:04  stickster: don't think that did it ...
21:53:13  it's not pulling python-twisted-web
21:53:27  rr?
21:53:35  one sec, let me check ...
21:54:08  yeah, it also needs python-twisted-web
21:54:15  Oh for frak's sake
21:54:15  which is not a dep for twisted-core
21:54:43  http://fpaste.org/O699/
21:55:00  fwiw, I did mention it above and in the bodhi comment I made :)
21:58:41  Yay, thanks quaid :-)
21:59:44 * stickster hits dinner
22:46:14  ianweller, ke4qqq, laubersm, quaid, rudi, sparks, stickster -- meeting in #Fedora-meeting in 15 minutes
22:47:09 * stickster will be here
22:48:03  stickster, did you inadvertently delete my summit topic?  It wasn't left over, I added it
22:48:13  O noez
22:48:17 * stickster goes back to re-add
22:48:34  I thought maybe thats what happened
22:48:37  Wouldn't be the first time I screwed up wiki thru editing :-(
22:49:41 * stickster guesses at a time and sticks that in too
22:49:58  I think ianweller added some special wiki feature to encourage screwing up
22:50:26  it's called the command line ^_^
22:50:53  sorta like rm -Rf *
22:51:05  http://github.com/ianweller/mw/blob/master/src/mw/clicommands.py#L197
22:51:12  actually working on fixing that tonight, maybe
22:51:16  brb
22:51:19  depends on whether or not i'll have a life tonight
22:52:46  ianweller, ke4qqq, laubersm, quaid, rudi, shaunm, sparks, stickster -- meeting in #Fedora-meeting in 8 minutes
22:56:08  ianweller, ke4qqq, laubersm, quaid, rudi, shaunm, sparks, stickster -- meeting in #Fedora-meeting in 4 minutes
22:56:25  i wonder if we have a meeting tonight
22:56:41  hmmmm, I suppose we could look at the schedule
22:57:02  do you think that jjmcd might be running it tonight?
22:57:19  sparks seems to be playing hooky
22:57:46  I should be drinking Guinness
22:58:03  i thought there was a rule where you can't drink and run meetbot
22:58:23  Yeah, well, I'm waiting
22:59:04  ianweller, I *knew* there was a reason I do not run the meetings...
22:59:15  ianweller, ke4qqq, laubersm, quaid, rudi, shaunm, sparks, stickster -- meeting in #Fedora-meeting in 1 minute
22:59:28  I'll get ianweller for making that rule
23:00:20  jjmcd, he might change his tune in a few years when he is old enough to drink and run a meeting at the same time...
23:09:58  jjmcd: sorry I was afk.  thanks for taking care of the conference phone thing
00:03:39 * stickster is trying to figure out what's going on with python-mwlib
00:04:39  stickster: Having problems with it, eh
00:05:18  jsmith: Just stupid dep problems finally being fixed
00:05:25  Well, and I need to remember how to use it ;-D
00:05:38  Ah, gotcha
00:05:42  jjmcd: rudi: *: new build coming to bodhi shortly
00:06:57  OK, will it work?
00:07:34  Will it blend?
00:07:34  laubersm, were we going to talk about relnotes in total, or just xml?
00:08:32 * jjmcd has gray hair because brain leaking out all over
00:10:02  jjmcd -- tables blown away from RN "master"
00:10:10  Thank you sir
00:10:37  After I get the rpm out the door I'll start pestering ricky for the stuff for the new doc
00:14:08  jjmcd, no clue.  This was you and stickster suggestion... I noticed it in the logs is all
00:15:59  jjmcd, ok, so you want me to help people this weekend to move content from wiki to git for rel notes... right?
00:16:11  correct
00:16:35  ok - so how about you walk me through one...
00:16:44  jjmcd: Wait... I thought we were going to do this over the next 24 hours
00:16:44  although, if we have a few helpers tonight (and it looks like everyone bailed) then we could prolly get it done
00:17:06  jjmcd: laubersm: We can't wait for the weekend, translators already have less than a week to get it done because we're late producing the material
00:17:06  I'll start - from the beginning..  care to turn on logging so it can go to an email too?
00:17:28  stickster, thats what I was saying.  I thought we could make a lot of progress tonight, but I don't see anyone except us three
00:17:37  Oh, bcotton is here
00:17:49  I can probably donate an hour or so tonight
00:17:58  jjmcd: Error: Can't start another meeting, one is in progress.
00:17:59  Maybe more, if I can stay awake
00:18:06  ?
00:18:14  Doh!
00:18:22  jsmith: jjmcd: laubersm: quaid: http://koji.fedoraproject.org/koji/buildinfo?buildID=162442
00:18:28  hmmmm - another meeting?
00:18:29  That's a fixed python-mwlib for F12.
00:18:52  jjmcd, so end it...
00:19:00  I didn't start it
00:19:13  I don't know what it is, or how to ask meetbot about it
00:19:22  #endmeeting