18:01:24 <smooge> #startmeeting EPEL (2020-02-19)
18:01:24 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Feb 19 18:01:24 2020 UTC.
18:01:24 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
18:01:24 <zodbot> The chair is smooge. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
18:01:24 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
18:01:24 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'epel_(2020-02-19)'
18:01:24 <smooge> #meetingname epel
18:01:24 <smooge> #topic aloha
18:01:24 <smooge> #chair nirik tdawson bstinson Evolution pgreco merlinm carlwgeorge
18:01:24 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'epel'
18:01:24 <zodbot> Current chairs: Evolution bstinson carlwgeorge merlinm nirik pgreco smooge tdawson
18:01:24 <smooge> #info Meeting is run from https://board.net/p/epel
18:01:41 <nirik> morning
18:01:59 <tdawson> Howdy
18:02:56 <smooge> #topic New Business
18:02:56 <smooge> #info smooge is taking a leave of absinth from EPEL
18:02:56 <smooge> #info tdawson will be taking over as chair
18:02:56 <smooge> #info https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/epel-devel@lists.fedoraproject.org/thread/BUJTJY3OE6F56MK6PCC6PTXD56VZCKVJ/
18:02:56 <smooge> #topic Old Business
18:03:05 <smooge> sorry too much cut and paste
18:03:08 <smooge> #undo
18:03:08 <zodbot> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Topic object at 0x7fdfee643090>
18:03:31 <smooge> #topic New Business
18:03:38 <smooge> ok lets try that again
18:04:22 <smooge> so a bunch of things are changing
18:05:06 <smooge> and I think that one of them will probably be meeting times and members of the committee
18:05:48 <tdawson> Oh, I didn't think meeting times would be changing.
18:06:09 <tdawson> unless others can't make it.
18:06:37 * nirik is fine with this time, but if people want to pick a better one we can try
18:06:43 <smooge> I didn't know if this worked with your schedule and it does not seem to be working well with bstinson Evolution and others
18:07:08 <tdawson> It works with mine, but if others are having a hard time, then I'm fine with changing it.
18:07:15 <smooge> so normally when the board changes we have changed meeting times
18:07:23 <tdawson> Ah, ok
18:07:36 <smooge> as of this moment, the power is all yours.
18:07:56 <smooge> #info smooge has handed the ceremonial coffee cup to tdawson
18:08:32 <bstinson> i need to just make time. my mornings are pretty brutal
18:08:55 <tdawson> #info tdawson takes the coffee cup, fills it with root-beer, and takes a sip
18:10:11 <tdawson> Well, meeting times are usually best discussed via email ... or else the ones that can't make it for this time, can't be part of the discussion.
18:10:59 <smooge> I agree witht hat
18:11:40 <tdawson> So, for at least one week, most likely two, let's keep the meeting at this current time, and have the dicussion one when to have it via email.
18:11:50 <bstinson> +1
18:11:55 <nirik> yeah. +1
18:12:24 <tdawson> Anything else before me move on to the rest of the agenda?
18:13:41 <tdawson> #topic Old Business
18:13:49 <tdawson> #info https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/issue/8558
18:14:19 <nirik> ah yeah, I can't recall where we were here.
18:14:40 <tdawson> This is the libssh2.  I don't see any progress on the ticket, or anything else via email.
18:14:54 <nirik> I think someone correctly pointed out that a bare libssh2 wouldn't work.
18:15:17 <bstinson> libssh2 is probably the most pathological case we'll ever see
18:15:35 <nirik> so, we need it to either be a module or named differently
18:16:48 <nirik> there was a thread on the list as well about this.
18:17:06 <nirik> but I think thats what it comes down to. You can do it, but it either needs to be a module or named differently
18:17:08 <tdawson> Yep, looking through it again right now.
18:17:49 <nirik> hum, or because that old libssh2 was non default modular it would work.
18:18:03 <nirik> modules are so fun
18:18:12 <tdawson> :)
18:18:35 <tdawson> Has anyone volunteered to try the libssh2 module?
18:18:50 <tdawson> Meaning, try building it, and see if it does what we expect?
18:19:12 <tdawson> I suspect this is a job for -playground
18:20:40 <smooge> well someone would need to write a new module for it right?
18:20:58 <tdawson> correct
18:21:08 <nirik> yeah
18:21:18 <nirik> so, lets tell the reporter: sure, but it needs to be a module.
18:21:20 <smooge> I don't think anyone has volunteered to write any modules
18:21:23 <nirik> and see if they want to do it?
18:21:27 <smooge> ok will do so
18:22:45 <smooge> how does this sound: Going from the EPEL steering committee and other groups, the fix will be that a module for libssh2 will need to be written which can then be included in EPEL.
18:23:03 <nirik> hum, wait. that won't work either
18:23:25 <nirik> because we don't have/do default modules in epel? or did we say we could?
18:23:53 <nirik> what a tanged web. ;)
18:23:59 <smooge> Going from the EPEL steering committee and other groups, the fix will be for a volunteer to write a module for libssh2 will need to be written which can then be included in EPEL. It can be done in EPEL-playground for testing purposes and then done in EPEL-8.
18:24:20 <smooge> we do not have default modules
18:24:28 <nirik> then it won't work
18:24:39 <nirik> because the old default libssh2 will be used
18:25:06 <smooge> so the only libssh2 is libssh2-devel in the virt-devel module which is non default
18:26:24 <nirik> libssh2.x86_64                           1.8.0-8.module+el8.0.0+4084+cceb9f44.1                           rhel8-appstream
18:26:57 <smooge> yeah sorry..
18:27:03 <smooge> my find/grep failed
18:28:00 <smooge> so the thing is that is the same as finding ansible in RHEL-7
18:28:19 <nirik> except we can't override it
18:28:47 <nirik> a bare libssh2-1.9.0 will still not work because modular rpms always win over non modular.
18:28:53 <smooge> so the thing is that if you install the current virt module, it does not have libssh2 in it
18:29:10 <nirik> a modular libssh2-1.9.0 will work, but without being default people will never see/be able to use it unless they enable it.
18:29:59 <smooge> so that is where dnf is sort of lying. .. the package is in the cdn but the current virt module would not have it in it
18:30:03 <nirik> smooge: but an older stream thats default does?
18:30:18 <nirik> it's somewhere in the modular repodata
18:30:21 <smooge> yes. the original 3 ones do.. then after that it is removed
18:30:49 <tdawson> So, another fun thing is, that it's different for CentOS8, versus RHEL8
18:31:13 <tdawson> I  believe that is because CentOS8 is only showing the latest module, which doesn't have it, but RHEL8 has them all. :(
18:31:19 * nirik starts browsing yak ranching ads
18:31:27 <tdawson> *laughs*
18:32:48 <smooge> yeah so in the crazy cdn world of rhel8.. it is like you never clean anything out of updates in fedora so every module set still shows up.. just in case you wanted to go back to one and lock on it
18:32:56 <tdawson> On CentOS8, if I do "dnf module info virt" ... it only lists info for one module.  If I do it on RHEL8, it lists 8.
18:32:58 <nirik> so I really don't know here. perhaps we could ask the modularity sig to weigh in?
18:33:07 <smooge> sure
18:33:22 <tdawson> nirik: I think that's a very good idea.
18:33:37 <tdawson> At the very least, I don't think we're going to find the solution in this meeting.
18:33:44 <smooge> who and where do we ask them since the emails say they have changed
18:34:17 <tdawson> Oh, that's true ... I guess we need to bring it to the new team.
18:34:29 <nirik> ask them to file a ticket at https://pagure.io/modularity/ ? I don't know if thats still right
18:34:39 <smooge> my take on it has been EPEL only deals with what is in the latest in RHEL so if they drop something we should be able ot cover it. HOWEVER getting our tools to follow that when RHEL doesn't make it easy..
18:35:25 <nirik> right. I don't object to the goal at all.
18:35:30 <smooge> well I think we have another solution :)
18:35:35 <nirik> I just don't think it's currently techncially possib
18:35:37 <nirik> possible
18:35:38 <smooge> if CentOS doesn't show it...
18:35:49 <bstinson> to add further complications...
18:36:23 <bstinson> we're looking into keeping some modules around longer but not the entire history like RHEL
18:36:33 <bstinson> basically going back to point-release time
18:37:38 <tdawson> Well, that wouldn't be too bad.  This still wouldn't show up.  Since it was 8.0 only, not 8.1
18:37:39 <smooge> tdawson, I realized that if I open the ticket with the modularity team, then I am going to 'own' this
18:38:14 <tdawson> smooge: I take it, you want me to do that deed. :)
18:39:41 * pgreco arrives late again and reads...
18:39:41 <smooge> ok I have updated the ticket in infrastructure. If you could add the ticket number or thread in modularity when you start, I would appreciate it
18:40:09 <tdawson> I'm fine with that.   This will give me some experience
18:41:24 <tdawson> #info The EPEL Steering Committee with take the libssh2 issue up with the modularity team.  Links will be put into the epel issue pointing to the discussion.
18:41:52 <tdawson> Anything else on the libssh2 issue before we move on?
18:42:58 <tdawson> #topic EPEL-6
18:43:05 <tdawson> #info EPEL-6 is End of Life in 2020-11. It will be moved to archives in 2020-12
18:43:13 <tdawson> #info THIS IS NOT A DRILL.
18:44:10 <tdawson> #topic EPEL-7
18:44:19 <tdawson> Anything for EPEL7 ?
18:44:50 <nirik> nope
18:45:12 <tdawson> #topic EPEL-8
18:45:55 <tdawson> I don't have anything for epel8 either, anyone else?
18:46:07 <nirik> there's still an outstanding thing with devtoolset...
18:46:20 <nirik> I think smooge was looking, but he might want to hand that off?
18:46:26 <tdawson> Ah, that's true.
18:47:06 <nirik> I guess I could take it on... if I could find the ticket.
18:47:25 <nirik> https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/issue/8528
18:47:26 <smooge> that is on my todo
18:47:33 <nirik> ok, cool.
18:47:41 <smooge> it is getting synced down.. I just need to put in some symbolic links
18:47:55 <smooge> and then someone needs to add it to koji like the current scl one is
18:48:29 <nirik> ok. I can add it if you ping me when it's ready/with info
18:49:18 <smooge> so man.. I did those already
18:49:24 <smooge> I just need the last step
18:49:58 <tdawson> #info devtoolset being worked on - https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/issue/8528
18:50:20 <smooge> rhel-7-devtools-for-${arch}-server-rpms and rhel-7-rhscl-for-${arch}-server-rpms
18:50:27 <smooge> will do this after this meeting and the next one
18:51:22 <tdawson> Anything else for epel8 ?
18:51:28 <smooge> not from me
18:51:31 <nirik> nope
18:51:53 <tdawson> bstinson: Any estimate on when we might be able to get the -devel packages?
18:52:52 <tdawson> Oh, just saw the time, maybe that is best for email.
18:53:11 <tdawson> #topic Backlog
18:53:13 <bstinson> pay attention to centos-devel this week
18:53:16 <smooge> my internet is crashing
18:53:33 <tdawson> bstinson: Ooohhh ... cool.  I will. :)
18:53:39 <nirik> the internet was a mistake. ;)
18:53:49 <bstinson> computers were a mistake
18:54:26 <tdawson> I think once we have access to those -devel packages, we'll be able to close alot of those backlog issues. ... but ... moving on.
18:54:42 <tdawson> #topic Open Floor
18:55:17 <tdawson> Anyone have anything for any other topic?
18:55:33 * nirik has to get coffee for the next meeting. :) so no...
18:55:57 <tdawson> Ok ... then let's close this.
18:56:06 <tdawson> #endmeeting