20:00:15 <tdawson> #startmeeting EPEL (2021-04-28)
20:00:15 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Apr 28 20:00:15 2021 UTC.
20:00:15 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
20:00:15 <zodbot> The chair is tdawson. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
20:00:15 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
20:00:15 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'epel_(2021-04-28)'
20:00:17 <tdawson> #meetingname epel
20:00:17 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'epel'
20:00:18 <tdawson> #chair nirik tdawson bstinson pgreco carlwgeorge michel_slm
20:00:18 <zodbot> Current chairs: bstinson carlwgeorge michel_slm nirik pgreco tdawson
20:00:20 <tdawson> #topic aloha
20:00:30 <nirik> morning all
20:00:40 <pgreco> hey everybody
20:00:55 <pgreco> I wasn't sure who was going to be in today, due to the summit
20:01:00 <tdawson> Hi nirik
20:01:02 <tdawson> Hi pgreco
20:01:26 <dcavalca> .hi
20:01:27 <zodbot> dcavalca: dcavalca 'Davide Cavalca' <dcavalca@fb.com>
20:01:35 <tdawson> There wasn't anything this late in the day that I wanted to watch on the Summit, so I'm good.
20:01:39 <tdawson> Hi dcavalca
20:01:39 <SSmoogen> hello
20:01:58 <tdawson> Whoa ... who is this SSmoogen :)
20:02:03 <tdawson> Hi SSmoogen
20:02:24 <michel_slm> .hello salimma
20:02:25 <zodbot> michel_slm: salimma 'Michel Alexandre Salim' <michel@michel-slm.name>
20:02:34 <tdawson> Hi michel_slm
20:02:43 <michel_slm> see, I'm not over-eagerly early this time
20:02:53 <tdawson> *laughs*
20:03:03 <michel_slm> really like the logo refresh finally making it to Matrix
20:03:21 <tdawson> Nor are you late
20:04:16 <michel_slm> fashionably on time
20:04:39 <tdawson> Which reminds me ... is carlwgeorge going to make it?
20:04:48 <carlwgeorge> just barely
20:04:50 * carlwgeorge waves
20:04:58 <tdawson> Hi carlwgeorge
20:05:14 <tdawson> #topic Old Business
20:05:27 <tdawson> Let's start with the EPEL Packaging SIG
20:06:29 <dcavalca> I spent some time going over stuff that we'd backported internally from Fedora for c8s
20:06:44 <dcavalca> we'll probably be filing more tickets to get packages branched for EPEL in the coming weeks
20:06:48 <dcavalca> e.g. I just did https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1954817
20:07:07 <dcavalca> I'm also still waiting on some progress on https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1942748
20:07:34 <tdawson> Does anyone know if the bodhi update is going through?
20:07:47 <nirik> we just unfroze this morning.
20:08:01 <nirik> I need to check with ryanlerch on it
20:08:22 <michel_slm> weird, the latest update on that ticket is.. it got reassigned from Paul Wouters to Paul Wouters :)
20:08:28 <michel_slm> did he leave Red Hat?
20:09:08 <carlwgeorge> seems like it
20:09:23 <nirik> yes
20:10:30 * carlwgeorge contemplates how many people avoid leaving red hat to avoid losing all the logins tied to their red hat email
20:10:48 <tdawson> *laughs*
20:10:58 <michel_slm> so the email address changing is a good sign, so many people just end up being non-responsive after leaving :p
20:11:42 <tdawson> So, hopefully by next week the change goes through ... and then we can work on the documentation and templates.  Ya!!
20:11:49 <michel_slm> whee!
20:12:02 <michel_slm> would be happy to have something we can discuss at Dojo
20:12:16 <michel_slm> (my presentation has one slide on EPEL Packagers0
20:12:23 <tdawson> When is the Dojo?
20:12:37 <dcavalca> May 13/14
20:12:41 * carlwgeorge just notices rover now lets you set your preferred email alias
20:12:54 <dcavalca> https://wiki.centos.org/Events/Dojo/May2021
20:12:58 <pgreco> maybe I'll remember to join for that one...
20:13:13 <pgreco> I haven't attended any of the virtual conferences
20:13:33 <dcavalca> fwiw the last one was pretty good
20:13:41 <tdawson> Yep, hopefully docs and templates by then.
20:14:18 <michel_slm> rover?
20:14:28 <tdawson> Anything else for the SIG that needs discussing?
20:14:32 <michel_slm> yeah, the FOSDEM-attached Dojo was great
20:14:51 <michel_slm> not much; remember to use EPELPackagersSIG tracking bug :)
20:15:02 <dcavalca> did the comaintainers can request branches thing get pushed?
20:15:12 <tdawson> dcavalca: I don't know why, but those two bugz have run together in my head softhsmvmtouch ... soft-touch
20:15:13 <michel_slm> yes, a couple of months ago
20:15:32 <michel_slm> but if they can't submit updates it's not that helpful (though I guess I can use my provenpackager bit for that)
20:16:34 <tdawson> Moving on to epel8-next
20:16:59 <tdawson> carlwgeorge: I know the freeze ended just this morning, but ... any progress
20:18:31 <carlwgeorge> i have not worked on it in the last week, but like you said i'm unblocked by the freeze now so hopefully i can make progress this week
20:19:25 <tdawson> OK, so we'll see how things progress this next week.
20:19:43 <tdawson> Anything else on -next before we move on?
20:19:59 <carlwgeorge> nope
20:20:36 <tdawson> EPEL Fails-To-Install ... I haven't done anything with this last week.
20:21:05 <tdawson> I'm starting to see some daylight in my schedule, so I'm hoping the beginning of next week I can make some testing progress.
20:21:31 <tdawson> #topic EPEL-7
20:22:03 <tdawson> I didn't see anything for EPEL7 this week.  Did anyone else?
20:22:50 <tdawson> #topic EPEL-8
20:23:33 <tdawson> I can see everyone is waiting with eager tension for the Open Floor ... but anything for EPEL8?
20:23:57 <pgreco> not hear, moving on... ;)
20:23:58 <michel_slm> a bit tangential, we're hoping to have EPEL8 available for building Hyperscale packages against
20:24:06 <michel_slm> but it needs to be discussed in centos-devel first
20:24:07 <nirik> I finally caught up on some packaging work last weekend and got some epel8 builds pushed out.
20:24:11 <dcavalca> ah, I was going to bring that up for open floor
20:24:18 <nirik> (ansible-collections and a few misc python things)
20:24:19 <dcavalca> I just posted to centos-devel: https://lists.centos.org/pipermail/centos-devel/2021-April/076793.html
20:24:22 <michel_slm> ah, yeah let's wait for that
20:24:52 <tdawson> nirik: Ya!!   I heard a couple people asking for the ansible stuff.
20:25:02 <tdawson> #topic General Issues / Open Floor
20:25:21 <tdawson> michel_slm: Please continue
20:25:22 <carlwgeorge> epel got a shout out in the centos stream summit talk, which was nice
20:25:44 <michel_slm> carlwgeorge: ooh, link?
20:25:51 <michel_slm> wait, did I miss RH Summit
20:25:56 <nirik> oh, and I split out ansible-test in the 2.9.x ansible 'classic' package to try and match the ansible.com and red hat engine builds.
20:26:16 <tdawson> I heard that ... now I feel bad.  I watched the first 10 minutes, realized I'd heard everything at least three times and turned it off.
20:26:35 <tdawson> michel_slm: Yep ... or at least the April edition
20:27:06 <carlwgeorge> it was this talk https://events.summit.redhat.com/widget/redhat/sum21/sessioncatalog/session/161223156919800114VW
20:27:17 <carlwgeorge> but i don't think there is an on-demand option
20:27:47 <carlwgeorge> oh wait yes here is the on-demand link https://events.summit.redhat.com/widget/redhat/sum21/sessioncatalog/session/1612985596209001PwQJ
20:27:50 <tdawson> Yes, there is an "on demand" button on that page.
20:27:56 <michel_slm> <carlwgeorge "oh wait yes here is the on-deman"> thanks!
20:28:01 <tdawson> Sorry, not button, but a very small text link.
20:28:13 <carlwgeorge> yeah that's why i missed it at first
20:28:13 <michel_slm> I am registered, just that between Fedora 34 and forgetting to put it in my calendar, I totally forgot
20:28:43 <michel_slm> the fingerprint login misconfig broke some people at work who eagerly upgraded on day 0 :p
20:31:42 <pgreco> those of us who upgraded on day -30, we suffered a bit too ;)
20:31:55 <pgreco> specially with gnome40 and extensions....
20:32:00 <tdawson> If someone finds where in the on-demand they talk about EPEL, let me know
20:32:19 <tdawson> michel_slm: I think that's great that they are at least talking about making EPEL available for the SIG's.
20:32:55 <tdawson> Or was that dcavalca ... sorry, got you mixed up.
20:33:13 <dcavalca> tdawson: we were both talking about it, no worries :)
20:33:30 <dcavalca> tdawson: do feel free to weigh in on the thread in centos-devel if you'd like
20:34:46 <tdawson> Will do.  Although I think it would be best if it was optional, or per SIG.  Cuz I could see a SIG or two that don't want that.
20:35:03 <dcavalca> oh yeah, the idea is definitely to make it optional
20:35:19 <michel_slm> so I upgraded at the beginning of beta and apart from GNOME 40 design being a bit in flux, missed most of the excitement
20:35:22 <michel_slm> like iptables not being upgradeable :p
20:35:59 <michel_slm> tdawson: yeah, agreed. technically limiting this could be tricky as I hear it's basically just at the network level right now
20:36:26 <pgreco> I'm worried about the epel rebuilds that have already been done in cbs
20:36:37 <pgreco> that will screw up koji with the hash changes
20:36:44 <pgreco> at least until the next rebuild
20:37:24 <dcavalca> pgreco: fwiw, in hyperscale we use a custom disttag to avoid that
20:37:31 <dcavalca> also so we can tell apart our packages
20:37:52 <nirik> yeah, thats the only issue I see... mismatches btween epel and things built/shipped in cbs
20:38:17 <pgreco> dcavalca: I'm talking about the other groups, I don't know which disttag they use, and if it will overlap with epel
20:38:29 <dcavalca> yeah that's fair
20:38:37 <pgreco> but that's fixable by an update
20:40:03 <carlwgeorge> tdawson: it's at 29:28
20:40:06 <michel_slm> `this-is-the-real-epel`
20:40:09 <tdawson> Well, if you do inheritance right, so that EPEL is farther down the tree, I would think it wouldn't matter.  The SIG package should win out.  So if the SIG wanted to change to the EPEL package, they would just untag that.
20:40:37 <dcavalca> yeah that would be the ideal outcome
20:40:57 <tdawson> Anyway, ya, I'll give my feedback on the email.
20:41:12 <dcavalca> thanks!
20:41:21 <tdawson> carlwgeorge: Thanks. :)
20:41:26 * nirik nods
20:41:56 <tdawson> Anything else to talk about this week?
20:42:17 <dcavalca> I'll bubble up https://github.com/fedora-eln/eln/issues/45 as we'd discussed about this in previous epel meetings
20:42:28 <michel_slm> oh yeah
20:42:29 <dcavalca> though it's not really relevant/related to epel anymore
20:42:58 <michel_slm> kind of related, as I could see this will make the issue of "how to bootstrap a new EPEL branch" easier to solve
20:43:35 <dcavalca> yeah, I can see this being leveraged down the road for some epel stuff, but I also agree with tdawson's comments in the ticket that it's best to keep it decoupled for the time being
20:43:36 <tdawson> Wow ... did I just head "make EPEL a first class participant in the ecosystem"
20:43:54 <michel_slm> if we could start by collating what are the "leaf" EPEL packages we really, really care about and add them to this workload, what EPEL Packagers need to make sure is available is just "look at what dependencies get pulled in by this workload"
20:44:54 <michel_slm> yup. EPEL can be a downstream user but let's not emphasize that for now, in case people object. if there's a new workload and we can easily add packages, and the packages just happen to be the ones we care about in EPEL, then... bonus
20:45:24 <dcavalca> yup, I think that's the best course of action
20:45:29 <nirik> I'd suggest: all those packages that aren't in rhel that are in epel8-build
20:45:34 <nirik> in koji
20:45:49 <tdawson> Ya, sorry for being stern in that comment, I'm just really trying to keep EPEL and ELN Extras seperate, even though logically, one flows into the other.
20:46:33 <michel_slm> nirik: that might be too many packages :) I think we want to keep it minimal
20:46:52 <dcavalca> I think it's more that we'll need to attach a name to these packages
20:46:54 <nirik> well, I doubt it's that many... most of them will be in rhel/eln base or whatever
20:47:05 <dcavalca> and I doubt a single individual wants to sign up to own all the packages
20:47:13 <dcavalca> but if the number is manageable, surewhynot
20:47:32 <michel_slm> agreed with Miro, I don't think tdawson sounded harsh at all
20:47:34 <nirik> fedpkg-minimal being the obvious one.
20:48:18 <tdawson> I could give you the number if you really want ... I haven't checked, but I currently know what packages are built in RHEL9, and what are released ... simple subtraction.
20:48:52 <tdawson> And you know what's soo coool with RHEL9 vs RHEL8 ... is that in a few weeks, ya'll will have that info as well.   Ya!!
20:49:21 <tdawson> weeks/months ... sometime
20:50:15 <michel_slm> developing in the open, so refreshing
20:50:39 <tdawson> Sorry, I'm really excited about RHEL9 / CentOS Stream 9 ... not necessily for the technical progress, but for the open-ness.
20:51:41 <tdawson> But, I diverge :)  and I'm the one usually tasked with keeping us on task ...
20:51:51 <tdawson> Anything else EPEL related?
20:52:08 <carlwgeorge> what's happening with 9 was jim's sales pitch to hire me (not this retroactive mess with 8)
20:52:43 <tdawson> carlwgeorge: And you've been stuck mainly with 8 haven't you. :(
20:53:46 <tdawson> Don't need to answer that.
20:54:00 <tdawson> Anyway, time is getting short, anything else before we close the meeting?
20:54:01 * carlwgeorge laugh/cries
20:55:05 <tdawson> Thank you all for comming this week, and for the good discussions.
20:55:12 <tdawson> Talk to you all next week.
20:55:19 <dcavalca> thanks tdawson
20:55:26 <michel_slm> thanks tdawson
20:55:30 <tdawson> #endmeeting