20:00:12 <tdawson> #startmeeting EPEL (2022-05-11)
20:00:12 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed May 11 20:00:12 2022 UTC.
20:00:12 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
20:00:12 <zodbot> The chair is tdawson. Information about MeetBot at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Zodbot#Meeting_Functions.
20:00:12 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
20:00:12 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'epel_(2022-05-11)'
20:00:12 <tdawson> #meetingname epel
20:00:12 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'epel'
20:00:12 <tdawson> #chair nirik tdawson pgreco carlwgeorge salimma dcavalca
20:00:12 <zodbot> Current chairs: carlwgeorge dcavalca nirik pgreco salimma tdawson
20:00:12 <tdawson> #topic aloha
20:00:45 <nirik> morning
20:01:09 <tdawson> Hi nirik
20:01:37 <salimma> .hi
20:01:38 <zodbot> salimma: salimma 'Michel Alexandre Salim' <michel@michel-slm.name>
20:01:45 <tdawson> Hi salimma
20:03:10 <tdawson> Hmm ... I was sorta getting used to everyone being here right on time.
20:03:23 <tdawson> pgreco said he wouldn't be able to make it this week.
20:03:51 <SSmoogen> hello
20:03:59 <tdawson> Hi SSmoogen
20:05:08 <carlwgeorge> .hi
20:05:09 <zodbot> carlwgeorge: carlwgeorge 'Carl George' <carl@redhat.com>
20:05:14 <tdawson> Maybe everyone is watching the Red Hat Summit
20:05:16 <tdawson> Hi carlwgeorge
20:05:26 <tdawson> #topic EPEL Issues https://pagure.io/epel/issues
20:05:26 <tdawson> https://pagure.io/epel/issues?tags=meeting&status=Open
20:05:52 <tdawson> Only thing there this week is the CVE, and it isn't CVE week this month.
20:05:59 <tdawson> #topic Old Business
20:06:36 <tdawson> We're a little slim on Old Business also
20:07:04 <nirik> hurray
20:07:13 <tdawson> I didn't get any work done on the epel7-testing cleanup, nor did I do anything this week on will-it
20:07:54 <tdawson> Am I missing anything on old business before I move on?
20:08:44 <tdawson> #topic EPEL-7
20:08:44 <tdawson> CentOS 7 will go EOL on 2024-06-30
20:09:10 <tdawson> Last week we talked a bit about a retirement party for epel7
20:09:42 <tdawson> Since we still have two years for that, I'm ok putting that off for another year.
20:09:44 <salimma> party!
20:10:13 <carlwgeorge> small fyi, i did a cve update for slurm in epel7 if anyone uses that
20:10:17 <nirik> the last of the centos linuxes
20:10:37 <tdawson> Maybe we can talk to mmiller about getting epel t-shirts for the retirement party.
20:11:07 <tdawson> carlwgeorge: Thank you for that.  Wasn't that a critical CVE or something?
20:11:32 <carlwgeorge> i don't remember the level, but the update was super simple
20:11:56 * salimma looks up slurm -- oh, nice
20:11:56 <tdawson> Anything else for epel7?
20:12:27 <tdawson> #topic EPEL-8
20:12:28 <tdawson> CentOS Stream 8 goes EOL in 2024-05-31
20:12:45 <carlwgeorge> also did the cve update thing for slurm in epel8
20:12:54 <salimma> huh, the EOL dates are off by only a month
20:13:01 <salimma> we can throw a combo party maybe
20:13:04 <tdawson> We could combine the epel7 retirement party with the epel8-next retirement party.
20:13:10 <salimma> the last of the CentOS Linuxes and the first of the Streams
20:13:13 <tdawson> Ha! ... you beat me to it. :)
20:13:58 <tdawson> I assume we are retiring epel8-next when CentOS Stream 8 get's retired.  Correct?
20:14:19 <carlwgeorge> yup
20:14:23 <tdawson> cool
20:14:37 * nirik nods
20:14:54 <tdawson> And ... of course the big epel8 news.   RHEL 8.6 was released, and it's now in the epel8 buildroot.
20:15:10 <salimma> yay!
20:15:36 <tdawson> #info RHEL 8.6 was released, and it is now in the epel8 buildroot.
20:15:54 <carlwgeorge> i retired a couple of epel8 things that are in rhel8.6
20:16:06 <carlwgeorge> gonna look a the rest of the list and see if i can help anything else along
20:16:22 <tdawson> #info Many Thanks to Smooge who synced a snapshot of epel8 into the epel archives the day before the change.
20:16:42 <tdawson> carlwgeorge: Thank you for that.
20:17:13 <SSmoogen> yep. I think I will put in a readme that says 'these are snapshots of epel around the time the next release. they are meant for helping transition but good luck'
20:17:17 <tdawson> I've got two -epel packages that I need to clean up too, cuz now the -devel packages are in RHEL 8 CRB
20:17:44 <tdawson> SSmoogen: That sounds like a good idea.
20:18:36 <SSmoogen> I don't have anything else to add
20:19:24 <tdawson> So, we've covered the snapshot, the duplicate packages ... anything else?
20:20:00 <tdawson> I've gone through all my epel8-next packages, and only have one that needs a rebuild ... but really it doesn't NEED a rebuild.
20:21:01 <tdawson> I'm thinking it might be time to get serious about the epel8 packages that don't install.  Start ramping Will-It-Install to start doing bugzilla's.
20:21:01 <rsc> Oh, hi (didn't notice it's that time due to Red Hat Summit)
20:21:10 <tdawson> Hi rsc
20:21:58 <tdawson> But, I'm not going to be here next week ... so ... disregard my Will-It comment for a couple weeks.
20:22:07 <tdawson> Anything else for epel8?
20:22:39 <SSmoogen> the willit was the only question I had.
20:22:50 <SSmoogen> so will disregard for a bit :)
20:22:57 <tdawson> OK.  Thanks. :)
20:23:02 <tdawson> #topic EPEL-9
20:23:46 <tdawson> Next week RHEL 9.0 will be released.   Ya!
20:24:03 <carlwgeorge> i added cogl-epel, clutter-epel, and clutter-gtk-epel so i could add gthumb.  they will also unblock a few other packages if the respective maintainers are interested such as gnome-boxes.
20:24:26 <tdawson> Is gnome-boxes not in RHEL?
20:24:50 <carlwgeorge> nope
20:25:20 <tdawson> Huh ... they took out virt-manager, I assumed they put in boxes.
20:26:11 <rsc> No more virt-manager in RHEL? Cockpit only?
20:26:26 <carlwgeorge> virt-manager is in appstream
20:26:27 <salimma> tdawson: I'm amused that it's already GA :)
20:26:49 <salimma> is the barrier for updating a bit lower for appstream?
20:27:27 <carlwgeorge> appstream packages may have different lifecycles than the overall os, i believe everything in baseos is for sure maintained for the full lifecycle
20:27:40 <tdawson> Wait ... virt-manager is in CentOS Stream 9 ... huh.  Well, I know I took it out, looks like there was a change of mind and they put virt-manager back in.
20:27:58 <salimma> and crb is like appstream except less support, right?
20:28:14 <tdawson> crb is no support
20:28:21 <carlwgeorge> and disabled by default
20:28:38 <tdawson> crb is "we'll put this here so people quit yelling at us."
20:29:11 <salimma> right. I mean lifecycle wise
20:29:27 <carlwgeorge> crb stuff has no lifecycle, it's whatever
20:29:41 <tdawson> Oh.  Lifecycle, most of crb packages are tied to a package in BaseOS and AppStream, so they get updated when those do.
20:29:50 <carlwgeorge> they may be updated in the course of updating a corresponding baseos/appstream library, or they may not be updated ever
20:29:51 <tdawson> Usually the -devel packages.
20:31:29 <tdawson> So ... for the GA release next week, I assume we need to look and make sure none of those duplicates are in RHEL 9.0 GA, and I guess if they are, take them out.
20:32:06 <carlwgeorge> i think dherrera had an epel9 thing to bring up
20:32:22 <tdawson> dherrera: Go for it.
20:32:26 <dherrera> I don't know if it's important, but I reported BZ2084131 today
20:33:35 <tdawson> Oh ... that is one of those tricky ones.
20:33:49 <rsc> Oh, that's mine?
20:33:56 <dherrera> there is a version mismach between gcc-epel and gcc on centos stream 9, this can cause LTO errors, I found it by trying to rebuild uwsgi using mock
20:34:04 <tdawson> Having a <package>-epel package, and it get's updated in CentOS Stream 9, but hasn't been updated in RHEL 9 yet.
20:34:38 <rsc> I'll fire a build to match RHEL 9 later. Not sure yet, if I want to do epel-next.
20:35:10 <salimma> tdawson: that probably needs a epel-next package then, right?
20:35:33 <carlwgeorge> rsc: why wouldn't you do an epel-next build for it?
20:35:50 <SSmoogen> crb may also be pulled out whenever they want.. like the LibRaw issue troy and I found this morning in CRB8
20:37:18 <tdawson> SSmoogen: Ya ... that one is frustrating, but at least it is now consistent with RHEL 8 and 9.
20:37:22 <rsc> carlwgeorge: is this mandatory? Can't I maintain my package on epel9 only? I've no plans to use Stream after RHEL 9 GA.
20:38:30 <carlwgeorge> nothing in epel is mandatory, but not doing it screws over other epel maintainers that build require that and need to do an epel-next build
20:39:07 <carlwgeorge> if you're not willing to do it perhaps someone in the epel packagers sig can help
20:39:38 <SSmoogen> i would suggest that the packagers-sig be put as a comaintainer then and people in it do that
20:39:55 <carlwgeorge> but i'll point out it's work that you have to do for 9.1 anyways, so it's not really more work to do it now versus kicking it down the road ~6 months (just an extra build)
20:39:57 <SSmoogen> the issue is that the -next channel will need a lot more watching
20:40:23 <tdawson> One problem I see with that one in particular (gcc) is that in Stream branch, it's going to change several times, while it is stable in the RHEL 9.X branchas.
20:40:27 <salimma> SSmoogen: oh god. libraw again
20:41:02 <tdawson> Err ... what SSmoogen said.  :)  ya'll are quick with the typing today. :)
20:41:22 <SSmoogen> tdawson, you actually wrote out the reason I just summarized
20:41:23 <carlwgeorge> for anyone curious, the difference we are talking about is gcc 11.3.1 in c9s and rhel9 is going to launch with gcc 11.2.1
20:41:41 <carlwgeorge> i.e. gcc 11.3.1 is a rhel9.1 change
20:42:31 <SSmoogen> doesn't it need to also be updated for every 'minor' so 11.3.1-1 11.3.1-2 ? so koji doesn't explode
20:42:49 <carlwgeorge> i don't know gcc well enough to say for sure
20:42:52 <tdawson> salimma: I'm going to build libraw-epel for epel8, just like it is in epel9.  That should fix the problem.
20:42:58 <salimma> you can relax the version constraint probably
20:43:08 <rsc> SSmoogen: yes, because gcc in RHEL9 obsoletes any older version than itself.
20:43:20 <salimma> oh shoot, that doesn't help
20:43:56 <SSmoogen> and say you have gcc-ada-11.3.1-2 it will require gcc-11.3.1-2
20:44:06 <rsc> No, that is relaxed.
20:44:16 <rsc> But gcc-11.3.1-2 will obsolete gcc-ada < gcc-11.3.1-2
20:44:43 <SSmoogen> ah ok.. different nightmare
20:44:47 <SSmoogen> same outcome
20:45:11 <rsc> Yes. And c9s gets much more changes compared to c8/c8s.
20:45:54 <salimma> I wonder what the obsolete mechanism is, maybe the solution is to make gcc-epel not provide whatever it is that's being used to obsolete
20:45:55 <salimma> looking...
20:46:25 <rsc> IIRC that means package renaming, which makes it non-intentional, because package names differ then to Fedora/older RHELs
20:47:14 <carlwgeorge> if keeping gcc-epel in sync with both rhel9 and c9s gcc is too much work, perhaps it should be retired outright
20:47:59 <SSmoogen> I think that is more like throwing the baby with the bathwater
20:48:02 <rsc> Retiring gcc-epel for RHEL9 is not really an option for me, my employer has dependencies on it.
20:48:32 <salimma> oh this is really mean. if build_ada is set to false, gcc obsoletes gcc-gnat
20:48:50 <rsc> Yes. Maybe RHEL is willing to change that?
20:48:55 <salimma> what if.. we make stream's gcc-epel has a really high release?
20:49:10 <salimma> so it doesn't get obsoleted until there's an actual version change
20:49:44 <rsc> Yes, that might be an idea.
20:50:42 <tdawson> Beyond gcc-epel is there anything else for epel9?
20:50:49 <carlwgeorge> i don't think the gcc version will change that terribly often, it was at 11.2.1 in c9s the entire time until 11.3.1 hit
20:50:55 <tdawson> W'ere getting close to our time and I wanted to make sure we hit the OpenFloor.
20:51:11 <SSmoogen> go for openflor
20:51:17 <SSmoogen> go for openflur
20:51:26 <tdawson> #topic General Issues / Open Floor
20:51:28 <salimma> openflar
20:51:38 <tdawson> The floor, it is open
20:51:54 <tdawson> I have one, hopefully quick, item.
20:51:56 <nirik> nice floor. open
20:52:16 <tdawson> I will not be here next week.  Does anyone want to run the meeting?
20:53:14 <carlwgeorge> i can
20:53:14 <rsc> I'm not here next week as well, so I won't volunteer.
20:53:25 <tdawson> carlwgeorge: Thank you
20:53:57 <tdawson> Thats all I had for open floor
20:54:12 <SSmoogen> i say close the meeting
20:54:26 <tdawson> I'm good with that.
20:54:46 <tdawson> Thank you all for coming and the good discussions.  And thank you all for the work you do for the EPEL community.
20:54:47 <SSmoogen> thanks tdawson and everyone
20:55:00 <tdawson> #endmeeting