2024-03-14 17:01:54 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !startmeeting F40 Beta Go/No-Go meeting
2024-03-14 17:01:55 <@meetbot:fedora.im> Meeting started at 2024-03-14 17:01:54 UTC
2024-03-14 17:01:55 <@meetbot:fedora.im> The Meeting name is 'F40 Beta Go/No-Go meeting'
2024-03-14 17:02:28 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !meetingname F40 Beta Go/No-Go-meeting
2024-03-14 17:02:38 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> morning
2024-03-14 17:02:45 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !info roll call
2024-03-14 17:02:55 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !hi
2024-03-14 17:02:57 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Aoife Moloney (amoloney)
2024-03-14 17:03:03 <@jskladan:fedora.im> !hi
2024-03-14 17:03:04 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Josef Skladanka (jskladan)
2024-03-14 17:03:54 <@sgallagh:fedora.im> !hi
2024-03-14 17:03:56 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Stephen Gallagher (sgallagh) - he / him / his
2024-03-14 17:05:44 <@pwhalen:fedora.im> !hi
2024-03-14 17:05:46 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Paul Whalen (pwhalen)
2024-03-14 17:06:11 <@amoloney:fedora.im> Ill give it another minute or two for folks to find their way here
2024-03-14 17:06:14 <@coremodule:fedora.im> !hi
2024-03-14 17:06:17 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Geoffrey Marr (coremodule)
2024-03-14 17:08:04 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !hi
2024-03-14 17:08:05 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Adam Williamson (adamwill) - he / him / his
2024-03-14 17:08:46 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !info purpose of this meeting
2024-03-14 17:08:54 <@amoloney:fedora.im> (boiler plate time)
2024-03-14 17:09:07 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !info Purpose of this meeting is to check whether or not F40 Beta is ready for shipment, according to the release criteria.
2024-03-14 17:09:12 <@adamwill:fedora.im> brb, switching room
2024-03-14 17:09:30 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !info this is determined in a few ways
2024-03-14 17:09:36 <@bittin:fedora.im> so are we go or no go? (confused by the US DST)
2024-03-14 17:09:47 <@bittin:fedora.im> !hi
2024-03-14 17:09:47 <@sgallagh:fedora.im> Luna Jernberg: The meeting just started
2024-03-14 17:09:48 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Luna Jernberg (bittin) - they / them / theirs
2024-03-14 17:09:55 <@bittin:fedora.im> Stephen Gallagher: ah alright i see :)
2024-03-14 17:10:14 <@amoloney:fedora.im> just going through the intro info right now :)
2024-03-14 17:10:17 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !info Release candidate compose is available
2024-03-14 17:10:19 <@frantisekz:fedora.im> !hi
2024-03-14 17:10:21 <@zodbot:fedora.im> František Zatloukal (frantisekz)
2024-03-14 17:10:35 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !info No remaining blocker bugs
2024-03-14 17:10:41 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !info Test matrices are complete
2024-03-14 17:10:44 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> (but spoiler, very likely no go. ;)
2024-03-14 17:10:59 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !info Fedora CoreOS and IoT are ready
2024-03-14 17:11:09 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !info Current Status: RC
2024-03-14 17:11:09 <@nhanlon:beeper.com> !hi 
2024-03-14 17:11:12 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Neil Hanlon (neil) - he / him / his
2024-03-14 17:11:25 <@amoloney:fedora.im> Do we have an rc to discuss?
2024-03-14 17:12:15 <@adamwill:fedora.im> we do, i guess
2024-03-14 17:12:16 <@adamwill:fedora.im> we have a lot of them!
2024-03-14 17:12:49 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> Allo
2024-03-14 17:13:22 <@sgallagh:fedora.im> adamw: Water, water everywhere...
2024-03-14 17:14:43 <@amoloney:fedora.im> any of them good enough to be a Beta release? 
2024-03-14 17:14:50 <@amoloney:fedora.im> * keeps fingers crossed
2024-03-14 17:14:56 <@adamwill:fedora.im> well, i think the other topics cover that
2024-03-14 17:15:12 <@adamwill:fedora.im> we put this one up front just on the logic that "if we have no rc we're clearly no-go"
2024-03-14 17:15:14 <@amoloney:fedora.im> so shall I move on to blodkers?
2024-03-14 17:15:15 <@adamwill:fedora.im> if we *do* have an rc, we move on
2024-03-14 17:15:20 <@adamwill:fedora.im> yup
2024-03-14 17:15:24 <@amoloney:fedora.im> ah cool thank you :)
2024-03-14 17:15:46 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !info we do have an RC for F40 Beta, moving on to Blocker Status
2024-03-14 17:15:59 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !info Blockers 
2024-03-14 17:16:30 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !info link https://qa.fedoraproject.org/blockerbugs/milestone/40/beta/buglist
2024-03-14 17:16:42 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !chair adamw 
2024-03-14 17:16:53 <@amoloney:fedora.im> darn I dont know that one works
2024-03-14 17:17:01 <@amoloney:fedora.im> anyway turning this over to you Adam
2024-03-14 17:17:30 <@nhanlon:beeper.com> chair is not implemented in the current meetbot, so no worries
2024-03-14 17:17:43 <@sgallagh:fedora.im> Right, anyone can use the meetbot commands
2024-03-14 17:17:53 <@amoloney:fedora.im> another learning :)
2024-03-14 17:17:54 <@adamwill:fedora.im> gkimm e a sec
2024-03-14 17:18:00 <@nhanlon:beeper.com> adam told me I wasn't allowed...
2024-03-14 17:18:20 <@sgallagh:fedora.im> Anyone can use the meetbot commands from a *technical* perspective.
2024-03-14 17:18:27 <@amoloney:fedora.im> the command to disallow Neil Hanlon  *is* enabled :p
2024-03-14 17:20:27 <@adamwill:fedora.im> we do have a couple of proposed blockers
2024-03-14 17:20:33 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !topic (2269407) Fedora minimal does not boot on Raspberry Pi 4b+
2024-03-14 17:20:37 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2269407
2024-03-14 17:20:41 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !link https://pagure.io/fedora-qa/blocker-review/issue/1522
2024-03-14 17:20:43 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !info Proposed Blocker, bcm283x-firmware, NEW
2024-03-14 17:20:55 <@adamwill:fedora.im> this should probably be titled "osbuild-built minimal image does not boot on (something)"
2024-03-14 17:21:00 <@adamwill:fedora.im> not sure if we actually tried the image on other hw yet
2024-03-14 17:21:46 <@adamwill:fedora.im> it's pretty blockery, the fix would be to fall back to the older image build tool
2024-03-14 17:21:51 <@adamwill:fedora.im> Peter Robinson: around?
2024-03-14 17:22:16 <@adamwill:fedora.im> Josef Skladanka: do you know if we tested on any other hw yet?
2024-03-14 17:22:46 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> I dont know
2024-03-14 17:22:47 <@jskladan:fedora.im> Don't know. František Zatloukal ?
2024-03-14 17:23:57 <@adamwill:fedora.im> the image *does* boot on a VM, btw
2024-03-14 17:24:12 <@frantisekz:fedora.im> can reproduce that on our rpi4 too
2024-03-14 17:24:16 <@pwhalen:fedora.im> I've not tested other hardware, trying to work out the problem with it
2024-03-14 17:24:26 <@frantisekz:fedora.im> osbuild minimal image doesn't boot up
2024-03-14 17:24:34 <@adamwill:fedora.im> but anyhoo...for a vote, I'm +1
2024-03-14 17:24:48 <@frantisekz:fedora.im> +1
2024-03-14 17:24:51 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> +1 here...
2024-03-14 17:24:59 <@nhanlon:beeper.com> I can test this on some of my PIs. but, +1
2024-03-14 17:25:18 <@adamwill:fedora.im> Neil Hanlon: i'd be kinda interested to see the result on, like, a jetson nano or something
2024-03-14 17:25:24 <@adamwill:fedora.im> sadly i'm travelling so can't try on mine
2024-03-14 17:25:49 <@pwhalen:fedora.im> adamwI'll try as well 
2024-03-14 17:25:56 <@adamwill:fedora.im> thanks
2024-03-14 17:25:57 <@nhanlon:beeper.com> I have a handful of non-pi boards I can try. sadly not a jetson nano though
2024-03-14 17:26:04 <@adamwill:fedora.im> anything non-pi is good i guess
2024-03-14 17:26:25 <@adamwill:fedora.im> just kinda interested if this is some kind of 'everything outside of vm-style UEFI boot is broken' or it's somehow more pi-specific
2024-03-14 17:26:39 <@nhanlon:beeper.com> I can test Pine64, RockPro64, Libre Computer boards (4x)
2024-03-14 17:27:01 <@nhanlon:beeper.com> will ask rocky altarch sig to test too, they have orange pi, banana pi
2024-03-14 17:27:32 <@adamwill:fedora.im> proposed #agreed 2269407 - AcceptedBlocker (Beta) - this is accepted as a violation of "Release-blocking ARM disk images must boot to the initial-setup utility" on the Pi 4b+. Minimal is a release-blocking image, and Pi 4s are release-blocking ARM devices
2024-03-14 17:27:52 <@nhanlon:beeper.com> is there a link to the latest image?
2024-03-14 17:27:55 <@adamwill:fedora.im> ugh
2024-03-14 17:27:58 <@adamwill:fedora.im> proposed !agreed
2024-03-14 17:27:59 <@adamwill:fedora.im> :P
2024-03-14 17:28:14 <@geraldosimiao:matrix.org> !hi
2024-03-14 17:28:17 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> ack (aside the octothorpe issue)
2024-03-14 17:28:17 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Geraldo S. Simião Kutz (geraldosimiao) - he / him / his
2024-03-14 17:28:21 <@adamwill:fedora.im> Neil Hanlon: https://kojipkgs.fedoraproject.org/compose/40/Fedora-40-20240313.1/compose/Spins/aarch64/images/Fedora-Minimal-40_Beta-1.4.aarch64.raw.xz
2024-03-14 17:28:22 <@nhanlon:beeper.com> ack.
2024-03-14 17:28:29 <@nhanlon:beeper.com> ty!
2024-03-14 17:28:32 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> ack
2024-03-14 17:28:32 <@geraldosimiao:matrix.org> Ack 
2024-03-14 17:28:40 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> is that the osbuild one?
2024-03-14 17:28:41 <@jskladan:fedora.im> ack
2024-03-14 17:28:47 <@adamwill:fedora.im> yes
2024-03-14 17:28:52 <@adamwill:fedora.im> the last non-osbuild was the 12.n.0 nightly iirc
2024-03-14 17:28:58 <@adamwill:fedora.im> so compare to that for a sanity check
2024-03-14 17:29:04 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> yeah.
2024-03-14 17:31:59 <@adamwill:fedora.im> oh sorry
2024-03-14 17:32:05 <@adamwill:fedora.im> i was waiting for someone else to do something for some reason :D
2024-03-14 17:32:11 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !agreed 2269407 - AcceptedBlocker (Beta) - this is accepted as a violation of "Release-blocking ARM disk images must boot to the initial-setup utility" on the Pi 4b+. Minimal is a release-blocking image, and Pi 4s are release-blocking ARM devices
2024-03-14 17:32:15 <@nhanlon:beeper.com> 😂
2024-03-14 17:32:30 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !topic (2269373) Fedora Media Writer (Windows Version) writes images that fail the checksum check on boot
2024-03-14 17:32:33 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2269373
2024-03-14 17:32:37 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !link https://pagure.io/fedora-qa/blocker-review/issue/1520
2024-03-14 17:32:40 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !info Proposed Blocker, mediawriter, NEW
2024-03-14 17:32:43 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !info Ticket vote: BetaBlocker (+0,0,-3) (-geraldosimiao, -kparal, -sgallagh)
2024-03-14 17:32:52 <@adamwill:fedora.im> seems like we kinda have a consensus that we don't really need to track this as a blocker
2024-03-14 17:33:10 <@geraldosimiao:matrix.org> Yeah 
2024-03-14 17:33:11 <@sgallagh:fedora.im> Yeah, I proposed it as such when I initially thought that the written images were actually broken.
2024-03-14 17:33:12 <@adamwill:fedora.im> anyone want to argue for blocker?
2024-03-14 17:33:22 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> Nope, windows application :D
2024-03-14 17:34:01 <@sgallagh:fedora.im> I do kind of want to suggest that maybe the default boot should *not* be the verification mode, since this is definitely going to keep happening to folks trying it out from Windows.
2024-03-14 17:34:13 <@sgallagh:fedora.im> But we can discuss that elsewhere
2024-03-14 17:34:14 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> If, maybe a final one
2024-03-14 17:34:22 <@adamwill:fedora.im> we've kicked that around before
2024-03-14 17:34:48 <@adamwill:fedora.im> proposed !agreed 2269373 - RejectedBlocker (Beta) - this is rejected as not violating any release criteria
2024-03-14 17:34:56 <@sgallagh:fedora.im> ack
2024-03-14 17:35:05 <@geraldosimiao:matrix.org> ack
2024-03-14 17:35:06 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> ack
2024-03-14 17:35:25 <@jskladan:fedora.im> ack
2024-03-14 17:35:27 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !agreed 2269373 - RejectedBlocker (Beta) - this is rejected as not violating any release criteria
2024-03-14 17:36:05 <@adamwill:fedora.im> and we should note that we have four other outstanding, unaddressed blockers:
2024-03-14 17:36:13 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !info other outstanding, unaddressed blockers:
2024-03-14 17:36:34 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !info (2267968) Raspberry Pi 400 shows nothing on screen when booting Fedora 40 images (even before grub)
2024-03-14 17:36:38 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2267968
2024-03-14 17:36:48 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !info (2269385) rhgb breaks custom/minimal install on most filesystem layouts
2024-03-14 17:36:52 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !link !link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2269385
2024-03-14 17:37:00 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !info (2113005) Live image made with BOOTX64.EFI from latest shim-x64-15.6-2 fails to boot on some boards
2024-03-14 17:37:06 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2113005
2024-03-14 17:37:18 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !info (2259264) Fedora fails to boot via BOOT/bootaa64->fbaa64 on UEFI machines with EFI_MEMORY_ATTRIBUTES_PROTOCOL
2024-03-14 17:37:21 <@adamwill:fedora.im> !link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2259264
2024-03-14 17:37:41 <@adamwill:fedora.im> so...unless we want to consider waiving every single one of those plus the arm minimal one...we can probably go to a decision at this point?
2024-03-14 17:37:59 <@geraldosimiao:matrix.org> A blocker frenzy 
2024-03-14 17:38:03 <@adamwill:fedora.im> does anyone want to waive all of those :D
2024-03-14 17:38:11 <@amoloney:fedora.im> a....bloc-party?
2024-03-14 17:38:17 <@amoloney:fedora.im> sorry :D
2024-03-14 17:38:31 <@amoloney:fedora.im> but to answer Adams q, no
2024-03-14 17:38:40 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> I think this should be a matter of decision of how much we really need to block the release for ARM.
2024-03-14 17:38:51 <@adamwill:fedora.im> well, the rhgb bug is not arm
2024-03-14 17:38:57 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> There has been a discussion about that...
2024-03-14 17:38:58 <@adamwill:fedora.im> but yes, the other non-shim bugs are all arm
2024-03-14 17:39:00 <@sgallagh:fedora.im> lruzicka: As of right now, ARM remains a blocking arch
2024-03-14 17:39:13 <@frantisekz:fedora.im> that rhgb thing is late blocker though! 😅
2024-03-14 17:39:32 <@geraldosimiao:matrix.org> The rhgb bug meets the blocking criteria 
2024-03-14 17:39:50 <@adamwill:fedora.im> it's a waiver candidate, but i would vote against waiving it i think
2024-03-14 17:39:55 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> I know, but I guess we would not have to hold this meeting if people were not fiddling with the thought of waiving.
2024-03-14 17:40:26 <@sgallagh:fedora.im> The rhgb issue is enough to block the release, to my mind.
2024-03-14 17:40:36 <@sgallagh:fedora.im> Even coming in late, it's too big to ignore
2024-03-14 17:40:45 <@geraldosimiao:matrix.org> It seems a week more on this can help 
2024-03-14 17:40:52 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> I guess even if we waived everything, really the only thing we could ship is 1.2 right? (the non kiwi build one)?
2024-03-14 17:41:19 <@adamwill:fedora.im> why not the kiwi build ones again? i am forgetting stuff
2024-03-14 17:41:24 <@adamwill:fedora.im> but...it seems kinda academic
2024-03-14 17:42:22 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> the only one where they exist is 1.5 and it's DOOMED due to toolbox failing.
2024-03-14 17:42:45 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> and we can't actually ship 1.2 anyhow, because we added some packages to fix some blockers after it.
2024-03-14 17:42:49 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> so, yeah... no go.
2024-03-14 17:43:40 <@geraldosimiao:matrix.org> Yeah, I agree. Can't ship beta like this. 
2024-03-14 17:45:57 <@amoloney:fedora.im> shall I go to the formal vote then?
2024-03-14 17:46:46 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> sure.
2024-03-14 17:47:13 <@sgallagh:fedora.im> I vote Go! ... to starting the formal vote ;-)
2024-03-14 17:47:51 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !topic F40 Beta Go/No-Go decision
2024-03-14 17:48:09 <@amoloney:fedora.im> I will poll each team. Please reply 'Go' or 'No Go'
2024-03-14 17:48:15 <@amoloney:fedora.im> FESCo?
2024-03-14 17:48:18 <@sgallagh:fedora.im> No Go
2024-03-14 17:48:20 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> No Go
2024-03-14 17:48:40 <@amoloney:fedora.im> Releng?
2024-03-14 17:49:02 <@jnsamyak:matrix.org> No Go
2024-03-14 17:49:07 <@jnsamyak:matrix.org> :D
2024-03-14 17:49:41 <@amoloney:fedora.im> QA?
2024-03-14 17:49:52 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> No go
2024-03-14 17:49:56 <@jskladan:fedora.im> No Go
2024-03-14 17:49:57 <@geraldosimiao:matrix.org> No Go
2024-03-14 17:50:22 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !agreed The Fedora Linux 40 Beta is NO-GO
2024-03-14 17:50:59 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !info The next F40 Beta Go/No-Go meeting will be on Thursday 21st March @ 1700 UTC
2024-03-14 17:51:13 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> Hopefully we can be in better shape then...
2024-03-14 17:51:31 <@jnsamyak:matrix.org> 🤞
2024-03-14 17:51:34 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !info F40 Beta will now shift to target date #2: Tuesday 2024-03-26
2024-03-14 17:51:37 <@adamwill:fedora.im> yep
2024-03-14 17:52:05 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !action amoloney to announce decision and adjust schedule
2024-03-14 17:52:30 <@amoloney:fedora.im> I wonder should I have @'d myself there...but anyway, I know I have to do it :)
2024-03-14 17:52:44 <@amoloney:fedora.im> and now...
2024-03-14 17:52:50 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !topic Open Floor
2024-03-14 17:53:04 <@amoloney:fedora.im> anything else to discuss before we wrap?
2024-03-14 17:54:40 <@adamwill:fedora.im> not...really, i guess just this has been a great lesson in why we shouldn't try and change two major image build systems during freeze :P
2024-03-14 17:54:51 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> I think we should consider a change to the release cycle that keeps everything frozen from Beta freeze until Final so that we can really focus on nuances and stuff. 
2024-03-14 17:55:12 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> Otherwise, we will be always finding blockers late in the process.
2024-03-14 17:55:50 <@amoloney:fedora.im> would there be anything to be said about doing a little retrospective after this release? 
2024-03-14 17:56:13 <@amoloney:fedora.im> I dont know how yet....but something like that might be useful...
2024-03-14 17:56:42 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> yeah, probibly we shouldn't have tried to land those things, but oh well, we did...
2024-03-14 17:57:02 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> retro is good.
2024-03-14 17:57:26 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> and if we want to adjust the release cycle we can, but I don't think a extended freeze will go over too well.
2024-03-14 17:57:32 <@adamwill:fedora.im> looks like someone worked out the osbuild arm bug, yay
2024-03-14 17:57:44 <@nhanlon:beeper.com> there might be riots :D
2024-03-14 17:58:04 <@adamwill:fedora.im> lruzicka: i don't think that's practical. maintainers would revolt. people already hate the existing freezes
2024-03-14 17:58:24 <@adamwill:fedora.im> Aoife Moloney: we used to do retrospectives in qa, kinda dropped the ball on those lately
2024-03-14 17:58:44 <@frantisekz:fedora.im> what would be the harder way to handle that and not annoy maintainers - freeze only stuff affecting blocking deliverables...
2024-03-14 17:58:46 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> it's also possible with CI/gating we could do less freezing...
2024-03-14 17:58:56 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> I know. But this somehow feels like trying to extinguish a forest fire. When you think you are done, it starts elsewhere.
2024-03-14 17:59:29 <@adamwill:fedora.im> lruzicka: i'm not sure i agree? i don't really recall many cases where we had a flood of blocker bugs introduced between beta and final? maybe i'm not forgetting them
2024-03-14 17:59:47 <@adamwill:fedora.im> i mean, it *happens*, but it doesn't stick out in my mind as a huge problem
2024-03-14 18:00:38 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> Well, I remember something like a couple releases ago when we were having like three go/no goes meetings for Final and we always found another blocker on Thursday, that was quite frustrating.
2024-03-14 18:00:41 <@amoloney:fedora.im> things phase in and out of being needed, it might be time to look at doing some kind of retro again and more holistically across the release teams ( I know thats not a term, but I dont know what else to call everyone ) :)
2024-03-14 18:00:47 <@geraldosimiao:matrix.org> Some last hour blocker bugs aren't with brand new packages. Usually is just something we dind saw earlier 
2024-03-14 18:01:40 <@geraldosimiao:matrix.org> Some last hour blocker bugs aren't with brand new packages. Usually is just something we didn't saw earlier 
2024-03-14 18:02:00 <@geraldosimiao:matrix.org> Some last hour blocker bugs aren't with brand new packages. Usually is just something we didn't catch earlier 
2024-03-14 18:02:31 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !idea #proposed: try to do a retrospective of the F40 release
2024-03-14 18:02:58 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> Having a longer time with a rc avialable helps... then it can get a lot more testing of corner cases.
2024-03-14 18:03:18 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> We usually get one day. Two at most.
2024-03-14 18:03:22 <@adamwill:fedora.im> i know i say this every cycle but we really need to test stuff *before* candidates
2024-03-14 18:03:29 <@adamwill:fedora.im> we should've caught the rhgb thing earlier
2024-03-14 18:03:38 <@adamwill:fedora.im> (maybe i would've noticed it if i wasn't spending all my time fixing kiwi stuff, sigh
2024-03-14 18:04:15 <@adamwill:fedora.im> but if we just can't get testing of nightlies, maybe we'll have to do more non-rc candidates
2024-03-14 18:04:40 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> I caught it on PiKVM when testing something else.
2024-03-14 18:05:17 <@frantisekz:fedora.im> maybe, it'd make sense to start doing rcs even with known blockers? simply once the freeze starts? it may attract more testing... idk
2024-03-14 18:05:38 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> at that point... they would be nightlys right?
2024-03-14 18:06:06 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> Perhaps a call for testing nightly right after freeze starts?
2024-03-14 18:06:40 <@adamwill:fedora.im> František Zatloukal: that's what a 'non-rc candidate' is
2024-03-14 18:06:46 <@adamwill:fedora.im> i don't like doing them because they are kind of pointless
2024-03-14 18:06:49 <@adamwill:fedora.im> theoretically speaking
2024-03-14 18:06:54 <@adamwill:fedora.im> but if it would make people test, sure, we can do them
2024-03-14 18:07:18 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> cp -a development/40 alt/stage/SUPER_GREAT_RC1.0
2024-03-14 18:07:26 <@adamwill:fedora.im> nirik: it would at least let releng shake the bugs out of the candidate script a bit earlier i guess :P
2024-03-14 18:07:31 <@nhanlon:beeper.com> it might be interesting to see if people don't feel a branch is "ready" until it's a "Candidate" 
2024-03-14 18:07:33 <@adamwill:fedora.im> nirik: hehe
2024-03-14 18:08:02 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> I was thinking about that. If we could ever get time, it would be nice to get staging working for composes... so we could test there.
2024-03-14 18:08:35 <@geraldosimiao:matrix.org> Names, names, what the right nomenclature can do for us...
2024-03-14 18:09:06 <@geraldosimiao:matrix.org> But yeah, I agree 
2024-03-14 18:11:38 <@amoloney:fedora.im> Is there a summary I should/could take from this discussion? Or is it more just general 'musings among friends for a better release world'? :)
2024-03-14 18:11:56 <@nirik:matrix.scrye.com> I think discussion should go do list or... discussion. ;)
2024-03-14 18:12:46 <@geraldosimiao:matrix.org> Discussion is fine 
2024-03-14 18:13:16 <@adamwill:fedora.im> it was musing
2024-03-14 18:13:17 <@adamwill:fedora.im> we like to muse
2024-03-14 18:13:40 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> But sometimes it would be nice if the world became a better place.
2024-03-14 18:13:49 <@nhanlon:beeper.com> i like Muse 
2024-03-14 18:14:11 <@amoloney:fedora.im> That world is in a place, somewhere only we know...
2024-03-14 18:14:59 <@geraldosimiao:matrix.org> 😁
2024-03-14 18:15:48 <@lruzicka:matrix.org> Too complicated for me, Musescore, Lilypond, Ardour ...
2024-03-14 18:17:08 <@amoloney:fedora.im> ok on that *note* I think this meeting is at its end
2024-03-14 18:17:11 <@amoloney:fedora.im> !endmeeting