16:00:01 <jlaska> #startmeeting Fedora QA Meeting
16:00:01 <zodbot> Meeting started Mon Feb 21 16:00:01 2011 UTC.  The chair is jlaska. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
16:00:01 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
16:00:05 <jlaska> #meetingname fedora-qa
16:00:05 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fedora-qa'
16:00:08 <jlaska> #topic Roll call
16:00:15 <jlaska> Howdy folks ... it's that time again
16:00:19 <jlaska> anyone lurking for a QA meeting today?
16:00:28 <kparal> me! me!
16:00:31 <kparal> :)
16:00:44 <vhumpa> Hey there everybody! :)
16:00:49 <jlaska> our latest RHCE ... kparal :)
16:00:50 <kparal> jskladan sends his regards. he's on medical checkup right now
16:01:05 * jlaska fingers crossed for jskladan
16:01:09 <jlaska> Hi vhumpa
16:01:14 <kparal> he should be healthy already
16:01:19 <jlaska> adamw will be out today ... public holiday in Canada
16:01:26 * tflink is here
16:01:29 * Viking-Ice joins in
16:01:56 <jlaska> tflink: Viking-Ice: greetings!
16:02:24 * red_alert waves
16:02:34 <jlaska> howdy red_alert
16:02:46 <jlaska> who else ... robatino, maxamillion?
16:02:53 <jlaska> will get started in a minute
16:03:01 * robatino is here
16:03:10 <jlaska> I don't expected a long meeting today ... I know folks are busy with testing, so I won't chew up a lot of time
16:03:18 <jlaska> robatino: welcome :)
16:03:25 <jlaska> let's get started ...
16:03:32 <jlaska> #topic Previous meeting follow-up
16:03:50 <jlaska> We had no concrete action items from our last meeting ...
16:03:55 <jlaska> but we did have a follow-up from Viking-Ice
16:04:03 <jlaska> #info Viking-Ice - solicit feedback on test@lists.fedoraproject.org to see whether we need to require only bugzilla.redhat.com use during test days
16:04:19 <jlaska> Viking-Ice: I'm behind on my list updates this morning, so apologies if you already posted something
16:04:37 <Viking-Ice> forward it to next week I have not finished a proper proposal yet
16:04:53 <Viking-Ice> Even thou I mentioned a bit my point of view on this on the desktop list
16:04:53 <jlaska> Viking-Ice: okay, will do ... let's keep this for next week
16:05:42 <jlaska> Viking-Ice: anything you wanted to #link here?
16:07:12 <jlaska> well, if so ... I can add it to the minutes later
16:07:20 <Viking-Ice> No not really it was more of different perspective between maintainers side and reporters side
16:07:26 <jlaska> okay
16:07:31 * CRCinAU yawns and proposes that meetings be at a reasonable hour of the day - not 3am ;)
16:07:36 <jlaska> #topic F-15-Alpha testing update
16:07:41 <jlaska> CRCinAU: here's to that!
16:08:10 <jlaska> #info Quite a long blocker review meeting last week - http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-February/097187.html
16:08:18 <jlaska> thanks to all who attended and helped us move through the bugs
16:08:31 <jlaska> I suspect we'll need to adjust and not review *all* of the proposed blockers during the meeting
16:08:37 <jlaska> that was just too darned long for this early in the game
16:09:16 <jlaska> We are down to 1 approved installer blocker that appears during live image installs
16:09:19 <jlaska> #link http://bit.ly/f15-alpha-blocker-accepted
16:09:38 <jlaska> and then there are a small number of proposed blockers 2 installer, 1 mutter being considered
16:09:41 <jlaska> #link http://bit.ly/f15-alpha-blocker-proposed
16:09:44 * CRCinAU would like to propose that blocker emails actually include the title of the bug with the bug number and URL.
16:09:53 <Viking-Ice> jlaska: if this happens only when users manually change the hostname then I dont think it's an blocker
16:10:07 <jlaska> Viking-Ice: I'd agree, I don't think that was the case when I reproduced last week
16:10:12 <jlaska> iirc, the default value for me was causing a failure
16:10:15 <Viking-Ice> whoops sorry wrong bug I think
16:10:23 <jlaska> but if that isn't hte case ... it's an okay workaround for that live image hostname bug
16:10:26 <jlaska> imo at least
16:10:33 <jlaska> CRCinAU: which emails?
16:10:41 <jlaska> CRCinAU: when people propose blocker bugs to test@ ?
16:10:43 <CRCinAU> as linked: http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-February/097187.html
16:10:59 <jlaska> CRCinAU: you want the bug# of every bug in the email subject?
16:11:08 <jlaska> oh oh ... nm
16:11:09 <CRCinAU> for example:
16:11:10 <CRCinAU> * https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=677131  (jlaska, 17:21:21)
16:11:10 <CRCinAU> * AGREED: 677131 - Accepted as Alpha NTH, rejected as Alpha blocker
16:11:11 <CRCinAU> (jlaska, 17:24:37)
16:11:11 <jlaska> you want the bug summary included
16:11:20 <CRCinAU> no idea what it is or what its about to look at
16:11:26 <jlaska> CRCinAU: good point
16:11:45 <Viking-Ice> so what tying meeting topics to the bug in question*?
16:11:47 <CRCinAU> no idea if its something I've encountered, or even something that I might want to look at and test
16:12:08 <jlaska> I'll update  the SOP (https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA:SOP_Blocker_Bug_Meeting) noting this ... and I'll try to remember to add an #info for each bug summary so it shows up in the minutes
16:12:30 * CRCinAU nods
16:12:34 <CRCinAU> that would be fantastic!
16:12:35 <jlaska> #action jlaska - review blocker bug meeting SOP and add include bug summary by way of #info for each bug
16:12:46 * jlaska looks at alpha schedule
16:13:01 <jlaska> #info Fedora 15 QA schedule - http://rbergero.fedorapeople.org/schedules/f-15/f-15-quality-tasks.html
16:13:26 <jlaska> The Go/No Go meeting is scheduled for 17:00 EDT this Wednesday
16:13:49 <jlaska> and we don't yet have an RC ... so if we were to shake the magic eight ball ...
16:13:54 <jlaska> signs are not looking good
16:14:09 * rbergeron makes a sadface
16:14:17 <jlaska> if these installer issues are resolved today, and we have updated ISO media ... I think it still makes sense to get cracking
16:14:20 <kparal> Alpha RC was supposed to be out on 17th
16:14:24 <jlaska> and see what we can accomplish
16:14:27 <jlaska> kparal: yup :(
16:14:48 <Viking-Ice> well another show stopper is the radeon bugs
16:15:00 <jlaska> the mutter bug?
16:15:10 <CRCinAU> Has it been decided that the kernel will be 2.6.37 as yet?
16:15:25 * CRCinAU is curious as to how this will play out with Xen Dom0 support for F15 - or if it will be pushed back to F16.
16:15:37 <red_alert> why .37?
16:15:44 <brunowolff> Uh 2.6.37 is a serious problem.
16:15:46 <jlaska> CRCinAU: I think we are well beyond that -- https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/kernel-2.6.38-0.rc5.git1.1.fc15
16:15:54 <brunowolff> The live images require 2.6.38.
16:16:00 <CRCinAU> whoops, I've been behind the times ;)
16:16:06 <Viking-Ice> #link http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/desktop/2011-February/006921.html
16:16:25 <brunowolff> There will be a lot of pain to get them back under size if we don't use XZ.
16:16:26 <Viking-Ice> jlaska: see Davids response there
16:16:58 <Viking-Ice> adamw: would have probably more info on this..
16:17:07 <jlaska> Viking-Ice: I don't have a sense for frequency of that issue based on David's response
16:17:15 <jlaska> yeah likely ... adamw is all over the X issues
16:17:28 <Viking-Ice> jlaska: "Looks like all post r600 ATI cards would be affected"
16:17:45 <jlaska> how does that correlate into % of users?
16:17:46 <Viking-Ice> times the number of users using those cards
16:18:28 * jlaska added airlied feedback into the bug
16:18:39 <Viking-Ice> jlaska: adamw also was working on a list of supported hw for Gnome-Shell dam you Canadian holiday!
16:18:58 <jlaska> yeah, that will be a good list to monitor going forward ...
16:19:24 <jlaska> okay ... so aside from those issues, I'm not aware of any other issues on the F15Alpha front
16:19:31 <Viking-Ice> jlaska: do we have some kind of mechanist to determine the % of affected users?
16:19:45 <jlaska> manually inspect smolt
16:19:52 <red_alert> hmm...need to try to reproduce this bug with my R900 card
16:19:56 <CRCinAU> theres no auto-parsing for smolt?
16:20:04 <jlaska> CRCinAU: 'auto'?
16:20:25 <CRCinAU> something similar to Valve / Steams hardware survey
16:20:48 <jlaska> http://www.happyassassin.net/2011/01/17/potential-project-for-someone-graphics-card-generations-in-smolt/
16:21:00 <CRCinAU> ie: http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey
16:21:06 <Viking-Ice> jlaska: there might be another one lurking with gdm not parsing users password that I've come across
16:21:21 <Viking-Ice> which might be enable/disable fingerprint related
16:21:21 <brunowolff> It doesn't like the enter key.
16:21:29 <brunowolff> I filed a bug on that.
16:21:30 <jlaska> CRCinAU: I'm not familiar with those ... but there are some metrics provided by smolt, but not the data we need in order to answer these types of questions
16:21:39 <CRCinAU> hmmm ok
16:21:43 <jlaska> Viking-Ice: okay, we'll track that if it comes up
16:21:45 <brunowolff> Just use the mouse to hit the login button.
16:21:55 <Viking-Ice> brunowolff: I'll test that
16:22:02 <jlaska> brunowolff: Viking-Ice: thanks
16:22:09 <jlaska> okay ... let's move on to some quick test day updates
16:22:54 <jlaska> #info Viking-Ice noted an issue related to parsing user passwords in gdm ... brunowolff noted it was filed and use the mouse to press the 'login' button
16:22:58 <jlaska> #topic Tue (Feb 22) - Thu (Feb 24) - Xorg test week
16:23:17 <jlaska> You may have seen Adamw's post to the planet on this
16:23:18 <jlaska> #link http://www.happyassassin.net/2011/02/20/its-graphics-test-week-again/
16:23:24 <jlaska> but it's that crazy test week again
16:23:39 <jlaska> which I'm glad it's a holiday in Canada, so he can build up energy for this week :P
16:23:52 <jlaska> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-02-22_Nouveau
16:23:55 <jlaska> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-02-23_Radeon
16:23:58 <Viking-Ice> I'm guessing he will be off during his birthday
16:23:59 <jlaska> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-02-24_Intel
16:24:13 <jlaska> Viking-Ice: I don't believe so
16:24:39 <Viking-Ice> It's not uncommon here on top of the world that people take the day of during their birthday..
16:24:46 <red_alert> you now that the community loves you if their birthday present is graphics test week ;)
16:24:46 <jlaska> The xorg test week is typically a well attended series of event, so I dn't expect any changes here
16:24:53 <jlaska> red_alert: exactly!
16:25:14 <jlaska> Obviously, the xorg testing is even more important with gnome-shell enabled by default
16:25:25 <jlaska> the results of the test week will also go towards improving the default shell experience
16:25:40 <jlaska> so please do grab a live image and participate this week
16:25:52 <jlaska> note, you don't have to attend on the scheduled day ... you can always join later
16:26:12 <jlaska> you may not have as many active participants to help triage failures, but you can still attend and post results
16:26:22 <jlaska> any questions/comments on the test days this week?
16:26:40 <brunowolff> Do the Aussies really show up the night before?
16:26:49 <CRCinAU> heh
16:26:52 <CRCinAU> yes
16:26:54 <Viking-Ice> mostly if there will be newer xorg-x11-drv-* packages in koji then are currently present in koji
16:27:26 <jlaska> #info For questions about the event, or if you want to help organize, head to the ticket please -- http://fedorahosted.org/fedora-qa/ticket/156
16:27:50 <jlaska> more on the test day front ...
16:28:03 <Viking-Ice> and we have to make note on the radeon driver package that users with post r600 ( like me I got r300 ) cant participate
16:28:24 <jlaska> I believe there are tests you can do that don't require hardware accel
16:28:33 <jlaska> but yes, noting that failure on the wiki would be good
16:29:09 <jlaska> #topic Mar 1 and Mar 3 - i18n/l10n Test Days
16:29:31 <jlaska> #info Several i18n and l10n events coming up next week, and he following week
16:29:56 <jlaska> #info For questions, or participation, check-out the ticket please -- http://fedorahosted.org/fedora-qa/ticket/158
16:30:23 <jlaska> #info Mar 1 - l10n/i18n Installer test day - https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-03-01_L10n_i18n_Installation
16:30:37 <jlaska> #info Mar 3 - i18n desktop test day - https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-03-03_I18n_Desktop
16:31:01 <jlaska> those were also fairly popular last release, so I expect we'll shake out a large number of bugs in the next 2 weeks
16:31:17 <jlaska> okay ... I had no other big updates for today ... so moving to open discussion
16:31:20 <jlaska> #topic Open discussion - <Your topic here>
16:31:29 <jlaska> anything not already discussed, that folks would like to raise?
16:31:34 <CRCinAU> ISO generation...
16:31:35 <Viking-Ice> Tim requested a test day for s-c-p
16:31:42 <Viking-Ice> which has gone unapproved
16:31:58 <CRCinAU> how far in the future would be expect F15 ISOs to hit the normal public mirror system?
16:32:17 <kparal> after Alpha Final is released
16:32:28 <kparal> RCs and TCs don't go to public mirrors
16:32:33 <kparal> AFAIK
16:32:35 <Viking-Ice> #link https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-qa/ticket/172
16:32:40 <jlaska> CRCinAU: I don't have any feedback on how long it takes mirrors to update once official ISO's are create
16:32:43 <jlaska> d
16:32:48 <vhumpa> What about Beta RC's and so on?
16:32:56 <kparal> vhumpa: nope
16:32:59 <CRCinAU> kparal: I believe you are correct. I wanted to check though :)
16:33:04 <jlaska> Viking-Ice: feel free to comment on that if you like ... I mentioned earlier, I haven't caught up on fedora-qa yet
16:33:23 <jlaska> #info twaugh proposed a printing test day - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-qa/ticket/172
16:33:40 <brunowolff> There are nightly live images built though if you are looking for somewhere to point people to.
16:33:44 <Viking-Ice> jlaska:  Do I wield power of approve ?
16:34:05 <Viking-Ice> I can work with him on it
16:34:12 <jlaska> Viking-Ice: well, "approve" is a loose term :)
16:34:30 <CRCinAU> brunowolff: I am aware of those, but I usually test DVD installs - which requires the DVD ISO - and in backwards Australia, we have rather small monthly data allowances.
16:34:41 <jlaska> Viking-Ice: for how to handle, take a look at https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-qa/ticket/169#comment:1
16:34:42 <kparal> "help out test day preparation" is better term :-)
16:34:51 <CRCinAU> however a lot of the major mirror sites in AU are excluded from the data allowance
16:35:29 <jlaska> CRCinAU: we also have delta ISOs that robatino manages for folks with bandwidth concerns
16:35:38 <jlaska> CRCinAU: for the TC and RC images
16:35:52 <tflink> jlaska: I thought that there were issues with the iso deltas recently
16:35:59 * CRCinAU nods. I love robatinos work - however theres the issues between the TC stuff
16:36:00 <tflink> or was that just going from 14 -> 15
16:36:01 <jlaska> there are ... I'm not up on the details
16:36:07 <CRCinAU> afaik, it should work from now on in.
16:36:10 <jlaska> okay
16:36:20 <jlaska> it was only coming from 14, right?
16:36:26 <CRCinAU> however only for stuff very recent and hopefully the future
16:36:26 <red_alert> the next blocker bug meeting is on Friday, right? what happend to proposed alpha blockers regarding the go/nogo meeting on wednesday?
16:36:38 <jlaska> #info CRCinAU asked about whether test composes and release candidates were mirrors -- they are not
16:36:41 <CRCinAU> jlaska: I believe some F15 ISOs were also affected
16:36:51 <jlaska> red_alert: that is correct, we may host another blocker meeting on Friday
16:36:54 <jlaska> CRCinAU: okay
16:37:08 <jlaska> red_alert: we still are on track for the wednesday 17:00 EDT go/nogo meeting
16:37:50 <jlaska> anything else on the radar?
16:37:59 <CRCinAU> jlaska:
16:38:00 <CRCinAU> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=677578
16:38:00 <CRCinAU> Due to this bug, the DVD deltaisos from TC1 to TC2 were corrupted, hence
16:38:00 <CRCinAU> nonfunctional. Unlike the diso from 14 Final to 15 Alpha TC1, this was
16:38:01 <CRCinAU> unexpected.
16:38:15 <jlaska> CRCinAU: ah great, thanks for the details
16:38:30 <jlaska> #info CRCinAU pointed to bug#677578 which impacted delta ISOs from TC1->TC2
16:38:44 <jlaska> will TC2 -> RC have the same issue
16:39:05 <Viking-Ice> Dont think that bug is an alpha blocker
16:39:14 <dgilmore> we dont support deltaisos
16:39:17 <jlaska> Viking-Ice: it's not proposed as one
16:39:22 <robatino> jlaska: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=677578 only affected TC1->TC2 and only makedeltaiso
16:39:29 <CRCinAU> jlaska: I believe TC2 onwards should be ok
16:39:32 <robatino> there's a patch now so i can make working deltas from now on
16:39:36 <Viking-Ice> jlaska: ok
16:39:42 <jlaska> robatino: CRCinAU: Gotcha, thanks for the update
16:39:55 <CRCinAU> robatino: and once again, love your work ;)
16:40:03 <robatino> but people will need to use either F15 and up, or a patched F14 system, to use them
16:40:07 <jlaska> #info robatino and CRCinAU noted that a patch is in place for bug#677578, and TC2->RC delta ISOs will work
16:40:11 <robatino> due to the new xz compression
16:40:23 <robatino> s/patched/temporarily modified
16:40:35 <jlaska> robatino: looks like you already added an {{admon/warning}} to https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Delta_ISOs ?
16:41:14 <jlaska> okay ... if not other topics, we'll close out in 2 minutes
16:41:16 * jlaska sets fuse
16:41:45 <CRCinAU> Xen Dom0 support.
16:42:07 <jlaska> CRCinAU: hmm, not sure about that ... might want to send out a mail on virt@lists.fedoraproject.org ?
16:42:15 <CRCinAU> Are there any plans to have it in F15, or will be it knocked back to F16?
16:42:31 <CRCinAU> as it looks like lots of the wiki pages are out of date.
16:42:33 <jlaska> #info CRCinAU - asked about F15 status of Xen dom0 support
16:42:48 <jlaska> CRCinAU: yeah ... sorry, I don't have any updates.  Can you reach out on virt@lists.fedoraproject.org ?
16:43:14 * jlaska resets the fuse at 1 min
16:43:55 <jlaska> 20 seconds until #endmeeting ...
16:44:07 <Viking-Ice> brunowolff: maybe a link to your bug report regarding gdm
16:44:14 <CRCinAU> just grabbing to linkage
16:44:16 <CRCinAU> one tick
16:44:24 <brunowolff> Just a sec...
16:44:31 * jlaska waits for bruno link
16:44:41 <CRCinAU> theres work on this: http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/xen/2011-February/005338.html
16:44:55 <CRCinAU> however I'm not sure where it lies with the 'stock' f15 kernel
16:45:11 <jlaska> CRCinAU: I don't know either ... best to go to the source
16:45:13 <brunowolff> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=678948
16:45:26 <jlaska> brunowolff: thanks
16:45:27 <brunowolff> .bug 678948
16:45:29 <CRCinAU> in fact, theres an even newer dom0 kernel: http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/xen/2011-February/005361.html
16:45:29 <zodbot> brunowolff: Bug 678948 Using enter to send password doesn't work - https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=678948
16:45:39 <jlaska> okay gang ... it's #endmeeting time ...
16:45:46 <jlaska> thanks for your comments and attendance
16:45:49 <jlaska> I'll send minutes to the list
16:45:56 <jlaska> #endmeeting