2024-04-17 17:00:25 <@pboy:fedora.im> !startmeeting fedora-server
2024-04-17 17:00:26 <@meetbot:fedora.im> Meeting started at 2024-04-17 17:00:25 UTC
2024-04-17 17:00:26 <@meetbot:fedora.im> The Meeting name is 'fedora-server'
2024-04-17 17:00:31 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic Welcome / roll call
2024-04-17 17:00:46 <@pboy:fedora.im> Welcome to our Server WG meeting today!
„Same procedure as every year“ We'll give a few minutes for folks to show up
2024-04-17 17:01:09 <@eseyman:fedora.im> Hi, folks!
2024-04-17 17:02:20 <@cooltshirtguy:fedora.im> Hello
2024-04-17 17:03:11 <@pboy:fedora.im> Hi Emmanuel. hi cooltshirtguy 
2024-04-17 17:03:59 <@pboy:fedora.im> Obviously, we are short of participants today.  😙
2024-04-17 17:07:53 <@pboy:fedora.im> OK, we waited now 6 mins. What shall we do? Should we start anyway? We can't decide, we need to be more than 3 members.
2024-04-17 17:08:10 <@pboy:fedora.im> But we can discuss. ob course
2024-04-17 17:08:36 <@eseyman:fedora.im> Let's start. Maybe someone will show up. If not, we just talk
2024-04-17 17:09:17 <@eseyman:fedora.im> Honestly, I'm so worn out I'm not sure I up for deciding anything anyway...
2024-04-17 17:09:24 <@pboy:fedora.im> OK, let's start.
2024-04-17 17:09:35 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic Agenda
2024-04-17 17:09:46 <@pboy:fedora.im> !info  Follow-up actions & announcements
2024-04-17 17:09:55 <@pboy:fedora.im> info  Review installation media
2024-04-17 17:10:04 <@pboy:fedora.im> !info  LVM2 default configuration change
2024-04-17 17:10:12 <@pboy:fedora.im> info  Testing F40
2024-04-17 17:10:22 <@pboy:fedora.im> !info  Revisiting Server installation media naming convention
2024-04-17 17:10:33 <@pboy:fedora.im> !info  Our "story" for F40
2024-04-17 17:10:41 <@pboy:fedora.im> !info  Fedora Server goal(s) and "story" for F41 / F42
2024-04-17 17:10:50 <@pboy:fedora.im> !info  Open Floor
2024-04-17 17:11:07 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic 1. Follow-up actions & announcements
2024-04-17 17:11:19 <@pboy:fedora.im> No open issue here
2024-04-17 17:11:47 <@pboy:fedora.im> Again, what about Flock / Richmond  in August? 
2024-04-17 17:12:02 <@eseyman:fedora.im> yes, let's talk Flock
2024-04-17 17:12:23 <@pboy:fedora.im> Emmanuel and I arfe planing to join, so far. What about you cooltshirtguy?
2024-04-17 17:13:10 <@pboy:fedora.im> I guess, Kevin and Stephen will join, too.
2024-04-17 17:13:11 <@cooltshirtguy:fedora.im> I won't be able to make it
2024-04-17 17:13:19 <@pboy:fedora.im> What a pitty.
2024-04-17 17:14:24 <@pboy:fedora.im> Well, I'll try to organize a meeting, maybe as hybrid if we have the technology available.
2024-04-17 17:14:40 <@cooltshirtguy:fedora.im> that would be great
2024-04-17 17:15:19 <@pboy:fedora.im> Emmanuel, I have a plan for a talk. I'll send you tomorrow. I'm a bit late, unfortunately.
2024-04-17 17:15:54 <@eseyman:fedora.im> No problem
2024-04-17 17:16:17 <@pboy:fedora.im> OK. So let's go on.
2024-04-17 17:16:27 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic 2. Review installation media
2024-04-17 17:16:36 <@pboy:fedora.im> !link https://pagure.io/fedora-server/issue/88
2024-04-17 17:16:46 <@pboy:fedora.im> !!link https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/server@lists.fedoraproject.org/thread/N3ELOPUB2OSJ6N7BBT6VJGGYS3VBUUBC/
2024-04-17 17:17:14 <@pboy:fedora.im> The question is, how to proceed.  I proposed 3 possible alternatives.
2024-04-17 17:17:58 <@pboy:fedora.im> Any idea here? We can't decide today.  
2024-04-17 17:18:21 <@eseyman:fedora.im> I'm in huge favour of #1, FWIW
2024-04-17 17:19:03 <@pboy:fedora.im> Yeah, may be the best option. At our next meeting F40 may be published - hopefully
2024-04-17 17:20:17 <@pboy:fedora.im> OK, we skip for now and continue with next topic.
2024-04-17 17:20:30 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic 3. LVM2 configuration & ARM SBC installation
2024-04-17 17:20:39 <@pboy:fedora.im> !link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2247872
2024-04-17 17:20:54 <@pboy:fedora.im> Mainly informational today. About 5 mins

There is a response and explanation from the LVM maintainer. The matter works, but - as Vojtech Trefny put it - "unfortunately not thanks to the changes that I made". In the end, he did nothing. His attempts were unsuccessful. See the ticket above. And as far as I have seen, nothing has been changed in the kickstart file, too.
2024-04-17 17:21:11 <@pboy:fedora.im> I think we should close the case and enjoy the fact that it works now, for whatever reason.
2024-04-17 17:21:24 <@cooltshirtguy:fedora.im> agreed on that one
2024-04-17 17:21:43 <@eseyman:fedora.im> not the result I was hoping for but I'll take it
2024-04-17 17:21:50 <@pboy:fedora.im> OK
2024-04-17 17:22:00 <@pboy:fedora.im> !agreed Server WG considers the case closed.
2024-04-17 17:22:11 <@pboy:fedora.im> !action pboy will close the ticket.
2024-04-17 17:22:23 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic 4. Testing F40
2024-04-17 17:22:34 <@pboy:fedora.im> !link https://pagure.io/fedora-server/issue/125
2024-04-17 17:22:43 <@pboy:fedora.im> !link https://hackmd.io/NtO4O9vRT3a71UMZMkceoA?both
2024-04-17 17:23:07 <@pboy:fedora.im> What is the current state? As far as I know, everything works as expected. I assume we can close this topic, too? 
2024-04-17 17:23:51 <@eseyman:fedora.im> I wanted to automate my tests for the following releases...
2024-04-17 17:24:03 <@cooltshirtguy:fedora.im> I'm good
2024-04-17 17:24:33 <@pboy:fedora.im> Yes, we have to systematize the tests. Something for one of our next meetings.
2024-04-17 17:24:45 <@pboy:fedora.im> So:
2024-04-17 17:24:48 <@pboy:fedora.im> !agreed Server WG considers F40 ready for publication and closes this topic. 
2024-04-17 17:25:07 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic 5. Revisiting Server installation media naming convention
2024-04-17 17:25:17 <@pboy:fedora.im> !https://pagure.io/fedora-server/issue/126
2024-04-17 17:25:48 <@pboy:fedora.im> I think, we should not decide today. But any comment on this today? 
2024-04-17 17:27:24 <@eseyman:fedora.im> I really like offline/online terms
2024-04-17 17:27:48 <@cooltshirtguy:fedora.im> I like those too
2024-04-17 17:28:33 <@pboy:fedora.im> Yes, I too. I hope we can make it for F41 that way.
2024-04-17 17:29:01 <@pboy:fedora.im> Well. let's it open for discussion and decide next meeting. 
2024-04-17 17:29:11 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic 6. Our "story" for F40
2024-04-17 17:29:19 <@pboy:fedora.im> !link https://pagure.io/fedora-server/issue/101
2024-04-17 17:29:37 <@pboy:fedora.im> That's really a bit urgent.
2024-04-17 17:29:48 <@pboy:fedora.im> And we have to keep in mind, that we are supposed to write a release note about it.
And probably initiate some other discussion, e.g. a blog post or a pod cast in cooperation with Fedora marketing.
2024-04-17 17:30:20 <@pboy:fedora.im> I had thought we would stick with ARM SBCs. That's where we have the most groundwork. 
2024-04-17 17:30:34 <@eseyman:fedora.im> Same here, to be honest
2024-04-17 17:30:56 <@cooltshirtguy:fedora.im> arm is a good idea
2024-04-17 17:31:14 <@eseyman:fedora.im> We can do something decent for F41 with Identity Management but F40 is coming up too fast
2024-04-17 17:31:59 <@pboy:fedora.im> Yes, I've something back in my head, that we could write and present. I'll write it in the mailing list.
2024-04-17 17:33:46 <@pboy:fedora.im> I see no comment, at the moment.
2024-04-17 17:34:23 <@pboy:fedora.im> !agreed Regarding our "story" for F40 we stick sich ARM SBC.
2024-04-17 17:34:36 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic 7. Fedora Server goal(s) and "story" for F41 / F42
2024-04-17 17:34:45 <@pboy:fedora.im> !link https://pagure.io/fedora-server/issue/134
2024-04-17 17:34:55 <@pboy:fedora.im> !link https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/server@lists.fedoraproject.org/thread/CYBDCSRVIIBDEL3ZQ2GY7XWWB2KIN63P/
2024-04-17 17:35:13 <@pboy:fedora.im> That's the most important today.
2024-04-17 17:35:26 <@pboy:fedora.im> We have to start something about it soon.
2024-04-17 17:35:36 <@pboy:fedora.im> Time is running fast.
2024-04-17 17:36:56 <@pboy:fedora.im> Neil also opted for item d, identity server
2024-04-17 17:37:28 <@eseyman:fedora.im> Public File server (NFS/Samba) sounds like a nice option
2024-04-17 17:38:11 <@pboy:fedora.im> Yes, do we have someone who is actually working with it? I'm currently all Web Service.
2024-04-17 17:38:15 <@eseyman:fedora.im> I would have thought F was a done deal
2024-04-17 17:39:34 <@pboy:fedora.im> Yes, we talked about it. And about a (Server VM as VPS), with is something I'm working on a bit
2024-04-17 17:40:54 <@jwhimpel:matrix.org> I use nfs but it's all internal
2024-04-17 17:40:55 <@eseyman:fedora.im> My workstation doubles as an NFS server that exports my music, video and audio books. If someone find this interesting, I can write about that
2024-04-17 17:41:10 <@pboy:fedora.im> Hi John !
2024-04-17 17:41:32 <@eseyman:fedora.im> but I've never touched Samba in my life and this seems to be the only thing people use.
2024-04-17 17:41:52 <@cooltshirtguy:fedora.im> yea, there'd a couple that would be ok,  d or e
2024-04-17 17:43:04 <@cooltshirtguy:fedora.im> I've done samba and nfs before. samba has been a while. 
2024-04-17 17:44:16 <@pboy:fedora.im> Well, I think we need a short plan for each altgernative, about 5 - 19 sentences, specifically what the "product" or "outcome" should be.
2024-04-17 17:45:26 <@pboy:fedora.im> I can do it for a, Emmanuel, could you do it for d (identity), and cooltshirtguy and jwhimpel for e (file server). ?
2024-04-17 17:45:35 <@pboy:fedora.im> On mailing list, I think.
2024-04-17 17:45:52 <@pboy:fedora.im> So we can discuss and imnprove it step by step
2024-04-17 17:45:54 <@eseyman:fedora.im> I will be glad to
2024-04-17 17:47:06 <@jwhimpel:matrix.org> do you want just client side or server side or both for nfs?  Also, do you want how-to or high-level?
2024-04-17 17:47:57 <@cooltshirtguy:fedora.im> good question. high-level i would think. 
2024-04-17 17:48:08 <@pboy:fedora.im> I think specifically server side, but a bit about client, too. And it is about how to configure server, more howto, i think
2024-04-17 17:48:22 <@eseyman:fedora.im> Stories seem to be high leevel
2024-04-17 17:48:32 <@eseyman:fedora.im> Stories seem to be high-level
2024-04-17 17:49:01 <@pboy:fedora.im> As a first step, John, could you have a look on my NFS doku in staging? The problem is, I don't get it working. Something must be wrong
2024-04-17 17:49:28 <@jwhimpel:matrix.org> I'll look at it if you provide the URL.
2024-04-17 17:50:08 <@pboy:fedora.im> Emmanuell: yes, the story is high-level, but the "product" more or less howto
2024-04-17 17:50:26 <@eseyman:fedora.im> jwhimpel: https://docs.stg.fedoraproject.org/en-US/fedora-server/services/filesharing-nfs-installation/
2024-04-17 17:50:59 <@jwhimpel:matrix.org> Thanks.  I"ll get to it either late Saturday or Sunday.
2024-04-17 17:51:25 <@eseyman:fedora.im> If you have any input, I'ld love to hear it as well
2024-04-17 17:52:46 <@farribeiro:matrix.org> !hi
2024-04-17 17:52:48 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Fábio Ribeiro (farribeiro) - he / him / his
2024-04-17 17:52:52 <@pboy:fedora.im> We have now narrowed this down to 3 alternatives. That is already a step forward.
2024-04-17 17:53:23 <@pboy:fedora.im> hi Fábio Ribeiro Welcome
2024-04-17 17:53:41 <@pboy:fedora.im> Let's talk at the next topic (Open Floor) 
2024-04-17 17:54:05 <@farribeiro:matrix.org> Ok
2024-04-17 17:54:18 <@pboy:fedora.im> Anything to this topic now? Otherwise we would proceed on the mailing list.
2024-04-17 17:54:43 <@eseyman:fedora.im> jwhimpel, can you come to Flock?
2024-04-17 17:55:20 <@jwhimpel:matrix.org> Maybe.  I should know in a week or two.
2024-04-17 17:56:06 <@pboy:fedora.im> @jwhimpel That would be great !!!!!!!
2024-04-17 17:58:42 <@pboy:fedora.im> I see no further comment?  But jwhimpel is typing?
2024-04-17 17:59:57 <@jwhimpel:matrix.org> I'm becoming rather frustrated trying to match ARM SBC's and Fedora Server.  The hardware that Server runs on is either not powerful enough or is a full-sized rack-mount board.  It has taken several years to get Raspberry Pi 4 up and running and it is not powerful enough.  Raspberry Pi 5 is out now, but the software (OS) isn't really ready yet.  I know all of this is open source and work is done by volunteers, but something to run Postgresql and/or a mail server on  as well as a system that can Wildfly/Nginx is not really there. I'm thinking of moving to N100 (X66/64) arch.  </end rant>
2024-04-17 18:01:20 <@pboy:fedora.im> @jwhimpel I just bought a N100 (Zotac ci 343). It's great!
2024-04-17 18:01:25 <@jwhimpel:matrix.org> Note that the above services would be okay on individual machines, but either the memory is too limited or the i/o is too slow.
2024-04-17 18:01:43 <@farribeiro:matrix.org> I think very similar
2024-04-17 18:01:53 <@eseyman:fedora.im> I have to admit my ARM boards are for tinkering. All my production stuff is on Intel CPUs
2024-04-17 18:02:21 <@pboy:fedora.im> And a Raspi it not powerful enough, but e.g. a Radxa Rock 3399 is. And it is cheaper as a Raspi
2024-04-17 18:02:30 <@eseyman:fedora.im> TBH, you're not supposed to run PostgreSQL on ARM SBCs.
2024-04-17 18:02:51 <@cooltshirtguy:fedora.im> I'm the same. PI4 for fun 
2024-04-17 18:03:37 <@farribeiro:matrix.org> There are all kinds of people
2024-04-17 18:04:08 <@jwhimpel:matrix.org> I will try to further flesh out my thinking for our next meeting.
2024-04-17 18:04:29 <@pboy:fedora.im> @jwhimpel I would like to compare a n100 and a Radxa Pi 4 (3399) and a Radxa model 5b. I think, you have some experience with performance tests?
2024-04-17 18:05:08 <@pboy:fedora.im> OK, I think we should switch to Open Floor now   :-) 
2024-04-17 18:05:23 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic 8. Open Floor
2024-04-17 18:05:53 <@eseyman:fedora.im> it very much depends what you do. ARM and x86 are optimized for different things
2024-04-17 18:06:17 <@pboy:fedora.im> Emmanuel, could you specify? 
2024-04-17 18:07:26 <@pboy:fedora.im> @farribeiro:matrix.org Welcome again. Do you specific questions or issues? 
2024-04-17 18:08:10 <@eseyman:fedora.im> I've seen RPi5 beat N100 CPUs in some tests and get wasted in others
2024-04-17 18:08:32 <@eseyman:fedora.im> it really depends on what you're planning to run on it
2024-04-17 18:08:38 <@cooltshirtguy:fedora.im> I'm going to load Home Assistant on 1 of my Pi4s. Good for testing. 
2024-04-17 18:09:22 <@pboy:fedora.im> Home Assistant - would be great!  I want install it, too. But couldn't manage yet. 
2024-04-17 18:10:00 <@pboy:fedora.im> Could be a great part of "Fedora Server as environment aware personal Server and NAS replacement"
2024-04-17 18:10:38 <@eseyman:fedora.im> Check out https://gladysassistant.com/
2024-04-17 18:11:02 <@pboy:fedora.im> @eseyman ++1
2024-04-17 18:11:18 <@cooltshirtguy:fedora.im> Good find. I hadn't see that one
2024-04-17 18:12:06 <@pboy:fedora.im> Anything else to discuss? 
2024-04-17 18:13:50 <@eseyman:fedora.im> Nope. Let's wrap it up
2024-04-17 18:13:55 <@pboy:fedora.im> OK. I see no further comment. We have already overdrawn and should close. 
2024-04-17 18:14:28 <@pboy:fedora.im> So I close now. See you in 14 days, May 1st if I'm right.
2024-04-17 18:14:40 <@eseyman:fedora.im> See you then.
2024-04-17 18:14:45 <@pboy:fedora.im> !endmeeting