<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:00:26
!startmeeting fedora-server
<@meetbot:fedora.im>
17:00:27
Meeting started at 2024-06-19 17:00:26 UTC
<@meetbot:fedora.im>
17:00:27
The Meeting name is 'fedora-server'
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:00:39
!topic Welcome / roll call
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:00:56
Well, let's wait a moment for everybody to shop up. I’ll post the agenda in about 2-3 minutes.
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:01:45
!hi
<@zodbot:fedora.im>
17:01:47
John Himpel (jwhimpel)
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:01:58
Hi John!
<@eseyman:fedora.im>
17:01:59
!hi
<@zodbot:fedora.im>
17:02:00
Emmanuel Seyman (eseyman) - he / him / his
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:02:14
Hi Emmanuel
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:02:15
All: Hope it's cooler where you are!
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:02:41
It's fine in northern Germay, 18 degree celsius
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:02:55
No need for AC
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:03:53
37 degrees celius here
<@eseyman:fedora.im>
17:04:01
a solid 20° over here
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:04:17
37, I would dy without AC
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:04:38
dy -> die
<@eseyman:fedora.im>
17:04:47
yeah, that's Singapore-level heat
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:04:57
Fortunately, we have a/c. We're predicted to do this for each of the next five days.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:05:38
Happy, if you dpn't need to work outside
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:05:47
but writing Ansible code inside :-)
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:06:42
We are one short of quorum, but we can discuss the matter and should do so.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:06:48
Let's start
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:06:57
!topic Agenda
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:07:10
!info Follow-up actions & announcements
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:07:23
!info Ansible assisted installation and configuration of NFS service
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:07:34
!info Open Floor
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:07:51
Anything to add?
<@eseyman:fedora.im>
17:08:04
that agenda sounds fine
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:08:12
+1
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:08:16
OK Let's start
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:08:25
!topic 1. Follow-up actions & announcements
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:08:49
Sorry, I lost track here for the time being. We shouldn't try to gather everything here. I'll create a list for out next meeting.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:09:01
But we can share information about what has happened in the meantime.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:09:09
E.G. I created an issue for our next topic
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:09:17
!link https://pagure.io/fedora-server/issue/138
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:09:27
and have to create an issue for our "file server spin" goal.
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:09:57
I've done some experimentation the past couple of weeks. I've also reviewed the Server NFS docs in stg.
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:11:10
1) The Server NFS docs seems to be a mixture of docs about NFS Server v3 and NFS Server v4 which are rather different from each other. NFS v4 seems to be what is currently distributed by Fedora.
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:12:09
2) I did a quick poll on Fedora Server email list and the responses seemed to indicate they wanted docs structured differently. They wanted one doc for installation and another doc for configuration and testing.
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:13:30
3) They wanted a textual description of what each task is attempting to accomplish. Followed by how to accomplish it via a) cli b) gui c) ansible. There seemed to be little support for ansible.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:14:31
I agree with all these items. But let's switch the topic to have it at the right place.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:14:44
!topic 2. Ansible assisted installation and configuration of NFS service
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:15:45
4) This doc assumes a centralized userid/group/password management system. The survey said the docs should assume plain vanilla and then put things like this either into an appendix or clearly noted and delineated inline. It should clearly be labeled as an assumption.
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:16:14
!hi
<@zodbot:fedora.im>
17:16:16
Jason Blackwell (blackwell)
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:16:40
Hi Jason! We meet our quorum now
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:16:43
I started working on such docs for NFS v4, but got side traced by my wife's to-do list for me. Hope to get back to it in a week or so.
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:17:25
I also discovered that NFS between systems that do and do not support selinux is a PITA.
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:17:42
*** end of rant ***
<@eseyman:fedora.im>
17:17:46
FTR, I'm now using Robert de Bock's ansible roles, including his nfsserver one : https://robertdebock.nl/ansible.html
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:17:48
:-)
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:18:30
The selinux issue might be difficult to master
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:19:28
I agree with all 4 items, specificaaly with 3, alltough we might not have a GUI serverside.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:21:14
Considering, how we can proceed.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:21:46
I thing the first step would be to split the current NFS doc into the respecive parts?
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:22:09
I'll try to review R. de Bock's roles for nfsserver (and possibly other services) and report back next meeting.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:22:23
A secend step to create a location to share our Ansible efforts.
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:22:28
I agree the first thing is to split the NFS doc into the respective parts.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:23:04
Should I do that or is it better done by one or you?
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:23:40
Can we setup a repository in pagure and keep our work (docs/files/roles/etc) there?
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:24:25
Yes, should we create a new directory? e.g. Ansible or AnsibleScripts, or another proper name?
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:24:40
what would be a proper name?
<@eseyman:fedora.im>
17:25:23
'fedora-ansible' gets my vote
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:25:34
I would suggest that before we start re-writing the nfs docs, let's create an empty (and well documented) template(s) showing how to structure our docs.
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:26:02
I think since many different groups use pagure, we need to have "fedora server" in the name somewhere.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:26:58
I think we can continue our repor "fedora-server" and create an additional directory e.g. fedora-ansible (in addition to the current docs and wg)
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:27:52
+1
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:28:21
Fedora-ansible is self-documenting and generic, so we can create meaningful subdirectories if needed.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:28:46
OK, I'll add a directory "fedora-ansible"
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:29:15
!action pboy will create an additional directory fedora-ansible in fedora-server repo
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:29:48
And yes, it is a good idea to create a docs template!
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:30:11
I have one here, that I use. I'll copy it to our wg docs.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:32:40
John, you were typing?
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:33:22
I was, but then I noticed you were going to create the template, so I don't need to volunteer
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:33:44
OK, thanks. Probably you could review it?
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:34:12
Sure, Just post of the mailing list when it's ready for review.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:34:23
OK, I'll do.
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:34:37
s/post of/post on/
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:34:49
:-)
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:35:03
What is next to discuss?
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:37:52
Sometime in july I would like to begin exploring how to generate a Fedora Server image (don't know which one yet) via the next tools that Release Engineering has developed. But first I need to learn Python 3. I would like to see if the new tools can generate an exact (or explainable different) image as the old tools. When we can do that for all of our images, then we can begin fixing some of our distribution issues.
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:38:59
I know python so if you need any help with that let me know depending on what access is required.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:39:25
Where can I find these "next tools" that Rel Eng has developed? Somehow I missed that.
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:39:32
Peter Boy I have a question about the release blocking stuff from last week. Let me know when is the appropriate time for that.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:39:57
Jason Blackwell: noted for OpenFloor
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:40:03
Jason, Thanks. Hopefully, I can get by simply reading the existing code to see what is causing any issues that I encounter.
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:42:05
When we had our "special video" meeting (a couple of months ago), the new (sorry I typo'd that into "next") method of generating images was discussed. There were links given on how all of the pieces go together (both old and new).
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:42:35
Was that recorded?
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:42:43
Several of the cloud and immutable images are already being generated using the new tools.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:43:00
Jason Blackwell: No recording
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:43:24
Yes, that is KIWI.
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:44:26
But notes and comments were posted to the mailing list. Release Engineering has some documentation on this subject available. I will try to post links to some of this on our mailing list sometime next week.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:44:52
John Himpel: Thanks!
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:46:18
Be aware that Release Engineering admits that there is probably no one individual that knows how all the pieces work internally. We may be 'lab rats' for some of this effort.
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:46:38
Understandable
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:47:11
Adventurous times ahead :-)
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:47:15
The hardest part may be finding/changing all of the wiki and other documentation when we change file names for the various Fedora Server distributions.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:47:42
Yeah, that can be hard.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:47:52
I don't want to interrupt, but shouldn't we take some more time for Open Floor?
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:48:21
"Go " for open floor
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:48:33
OK, then
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:48:36
!topic 3. Open Floor
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:48:51
Jason, it's yours
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:49:14
!link https://pagure.io/releng/issue/12163
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:49:23
!link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/FedoraServerReleaseBlockingDeliverable
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:49:51
Okay, I'm looking for some clarification around what images we desire to be release blocking to add to the change proposal.
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:49:54
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:49:54
Cloud/x86_64/images/Fedora-Cloud-Base-RELEASE_MILESTONE.x86_64.qcow2
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:49:54
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:49:54
Cloud/x86_64/images/Fedora-Cloud-Base-RELEASE_MILESTONE.x86_64.raw.xz
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:49:54
Cloud/aarch64/images/Fedora-Cloud-Base-RELEASE_MILESTONE.aarch64.qcow2
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:49:54
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:49:54
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:49:54
For example here are the Fedora Cloud Entries:
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:49:54
Do we expect both the aarch64 raw and the x86_64 qcow2's or just the qcow2s?
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:49:54
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:49:54
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/releases/f40/blocking/
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:50:48
Jason Blackwell: Good question. I think in anycase the qcow2 one
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:51:28
And i would think we should pick the aarch64 image too. But maybe, it's not professional enough?
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:52:15
what do you guys think?
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:53:10
for some context here is a similar proposal that has been announced for Fedora KDE AArch64 https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/Fedora_KDE_AArch64_ReleaseBlocker
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:54:14
I see, for your Rel Eng ticket they say, we have to create a change proposal, Rel Eng is not the appropriate address.
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:54:36
Yep ^
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:55:02
So, OK. I think we need a change proposal for each image.
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:55:58
I think we can join them up but I can look for some more references for the other projects
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:56:17
But we are going to probably have testers commited and lined up for next release if we hope for it to actually block release
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
17:56:18
I see the issue was marked as "closed". Was the proposal rejected/approved by Fesco? Or did something else cause this status change?
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:56:37
It was filed to wrong location, needs to be change proposal wiki sent to wranglers.
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:56:55
They have some info in the fesco meeting logs this week
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:57:05
John Himpel: they closed it because it is the wrong place. No decision yet.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:57:22
We have to write a change proposal.
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:57:24
here is the page for this effort ATM https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/FedoraServerReleaseBlockingDeliverable
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:58:16
Jason Blackwell: ++1
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
17:58:17
If there is not preference on the images I can just request them all and see if we get pushback. I just don't have a good picture of what our current QA group is for Server so hopefully we would have resources to support the testing.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
17:59:23
I thing the basic testing is already done! Maybe we have to add some QA automated testing.
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
18:00:36
Ok if no objections, I'll ask for the images I mentioned above and get this wiki ready for Annoncement and review by the wranglers.
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
18:01:16
Didn't either the idm folks or the ipa folks offer to share some of their extensive library of tests that we could use?
<@pboy:fedora.im>
18:01:43
Jason Blackwell: What do you mean with "ask for images". We aready distribute the images, don't we?
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
18:02:10
Request those specific images be marked for release-blocking deliverables
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
18:02:20
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/releases/f40/blocking/
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
18:02:24
Added to this page for F41
<@pboy:fedora.im>
18:02:27
John Himpel: I don't know about those, we chould check
<@pboy:fedora.im>
18:03:41
Jason Blackwell: Intereresting page!
<@jwhimpel:fedora.im>
18:04:01
Sorry, I have to go to Physical Therapy appointment. Good meeting!
<@blackwell:fedora.im>
18:04:41
Agreed. I'll send out the wiki link to the mailing list, once I have the draft completed.
<@eseyman:fedora.im>
18:04:58
yeah, if I'm going to get diner, I need to go pretty soon
<@pboy:fedora.im>
18:05:12
OK, we are out of time.
<@eseyman:fedora.im>
18:05:36
John Himpel: any intention to go to Flock?
<@pboy:fedora.im>
18:05:55
Jason Blackwell: Can we discuss by mail or on mailing list! I've some experience with change proposals.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
18:07:40
OK, I think we are done for today.
<@pboy:fedora.im>
18:07:58
Anything to add before we close?
<@pboy:fedora.im>
18:08:03
3
<@pboy:fedora.im>
18:08:12
2
<@pboy:fedora.im>
18:08:30
1
<@pboy:fedora.im>
18:08:33
!endmeeting