2026-03-25 17:02:14 <@pboy:fedora.im> !startmeeting fedora-server 
2026-03-25 17:02:16 <@meetbot:fedora.im> Meeting started at 2026-03-25 17:02:14 UTC
2026-03-25 17:02:16 <@meetbot:fedora.im> The Meeting name is 'fedora-server '
2026-03-25 17:02:30 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic Roll Call
2026-03-25 17:02:41 <@pboy:fedora.im> Welcome to our weekly Server WG meeting.
2026-03-25 17:02:57 <@pboy:fedora.im> Sorry for the mistake in our Server room.
2026-03-25 17:04:08 <@eseyman:fedora.im> !hello
2026-03-25 17:04:08 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Emmanuel Seyman (eseyman) - he / him / his
2026-03-25 17:09:09 <@pboy:fedora.im> It seems we're back to being an exclusive group again today. The time change seems to be a huge hurdle. Even Council couldn't manage it again today
2026-03-25 17:09:48 <@pboy:fedora.im> What are we going to do?
2026-03-25 17:10:00 <@pboy:fedora.im> We have some business to do.
2026-03-25 17:10:20 <@eseyman:fedora.im> it's just the two of us, right ?
2026-03-25 17:10:59 <@pboy:fedora.im> Yes, the moment. And nirik who is lurking around as usual.
2026-03-25 17:11:34 <@aggraxis:fedora.im> I am lurking, but I am tied up at work.
2026-03-25 17:14:27 <@pboy:fedora.im> We can go over the agenda and see what's new. 
2026-03-25 17:15:21 <@pboy:fedora.im> Emmanuel Seyman: We should coordinate a bit with the projects we want to present at Flock. But maybe, Server room is a more appropriate location.
2026-03-25 17:16:09 <@eseyman:fedora.im> I still need to prepare my trip
2026-03-25 17:16:42 <@pboy:fedora.im> What does that mean?
2026-03-25 17:16:59 <@pboy:fedora.im> Do you have time issues?
2026-03-25 17:18:54 <@eseyman:fedora.im> No, I just need to book my flight, hotel and so on...
2026-03-25 17:19:55 <@pboy:fedora.im> OK. I was already  afraid I'd be the only one there. 😏
2026-03-25 17:20:27 <@mowest:fedora.im> !hello
2026-03-25 17:20:28 <@zodbot:fedora.im> Steve Daley (mowest)
2026-03-25 17:20:42 <@pboy:fedora.im> Welcome Steve!
2026-03-25 17:21:03 <@pboy:fedora.im> Now we would meet our quorum, at least.
2026-03-25 17:21:39 <@pboy:fedora.im> OK, so let's start, and look what we have to do.
2026-03-25 17:21:51 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic Agenda
2026-03-25 17:21:59 <@pboy:fedora.im> !info  Project "Strengthening Server updates"
2026-03-25 17:21:59 <@pboy:fedora.im> !info  Open Floor
2026-03-25 17:21:59 <@pboy:fedora.im> !info  Author a "Beginners Guide to Fedora Server"
2026-03-25 17:21:59 <@pboy:fedora.im> !info  Follow-up actions & announcements
2026-03-25 17:21:59 <@pboy:fedora.im> !info  Project "Ansible assisted installation and configuration of NFS service"
2026-03-25 17:21:59 <@pboy:fedora.im> !info  F44 release testing
2026-03-25 17:21:59 <@pboy:fedora.im> !info  Project "Ansible PXE Boot support"
2026-03-25 17:22:18 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic 1. Follow-up actions & announcements
2026-03-25 17:23:38 <@pboy:fedora.im> Nothing new here. As soon as we have an release candidate we should start to update our docs, specifically the screen shots. Currently, we have the prelease note everywhere.
2026-03-25 17:23:51 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic 2. F44 release testing
2026-03-25 17:24:02 <@pboy:fedora.im> Tracking issue:  https://forge.fedoraproject.org/server/tickets/issues/186
2026-03-25 17:24:13 <@pboy:fedora.im> Current status as far as I know: all media installation tests for Beta done and successfull.
2026-03-25 17:24:24 <@pboy:fedora.im> Outstanding our special tests. As far as I know:
2026-03-25 17:24:24 <@pboy:fedora.im> 
2026-03-25 17:24:24 <@pboy:fedora.im> !action eseyman: Test PostgreSQL and MariaDB on a fresh installation of F44 Server.
2026-03-25 17:24:24 <@pboy:fedora.im> 
2026-03-25 17:24:24 <@pboy:fedora.im> pboy: test removing Java 21 from media and writing Release note
2026-03-25 17:24:42 <@pboy:fedora.im> There were some more potential items, unfortunate I don't remember. And we missed to add them to our tracking ticket.
2026-03-25 17:25:17 <@pboy:fedora.im> I have to do my Java testing and writing.
2026-03-25 17:25:24 <@pboy:fedora.im> Anything new here? 
2026-03-25 17:26:43 <@pboy:fedora.im> OK, obviously nothing new here. Let's go on.
2026-03-25 17:26:57 <@eseyman:fedora.im> I've tested both Pg and MariaDB; everything seems to work ok
2026-03-25 17:27:26 <@pboy:fedora.im> OK, good to know. Could you add this as comment to our ticket?
2026-03-25 17:27:51 <@pboy:fedora.im> And what about the other potential issues you identified previously? 
2026-03-25 17:29:25 <@eseyman:fedora.im> Yes, will do
2026-03-25 17:30:09 <@eseyman:fedora.im> There's not much, tbh. The databases work, I can run docker images using podman... So far, everything work
2026-03-25 17:30:32 <@eseyman:fedora.im> I have the next two days off. The plan is to test dnsmasq and pxe
2026-03-25 17:31:05 <@eseyman:fedora.im> Ah, yes, I want to try and debug the backup/restore roles so these don't work as they should
2026-03-25 17:32:00 <@mowest:fedora.im> Thanks Emmanuel Seyman for all of the great work on testing. You have covered a number of areas already.
2026-03-25 17:32:10 <@pboy:fedora.im> OK, good to know  that we won't be in for any surprises, at least not so far. :-) 
2026-03-25 17:32:24 <@pboy:fedora.im> Let's go on
2026-03-25 17:32:33 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic 3.  Project "Ansible PXE Boot support"
2026-03-25 17:32:42 <@pboy:fedora.im> Project: https://forge.fedoraproject.org/server/tickets/projects/240
2026-03-25 17:33:19 <@pboy:fedora.im> I think, we get news here after your days off?
2026-03-25 17:33:28 <@pboy:fedora.im> So we can skip now?
2026-03-25 17:33:54 <@eseyman:fedora.im> yes, let's skip it and revisit next week
2026-03-25 17:34:08 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic 4.  Project "Ansible assisted installation and configuration of NFS service"
2026-03-25 17:34:22 <@pboy:fedora.im> We skip ths too, same reason as previous topic.
2026-03-25 17:34:32 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic 5.  Project "Strengthening Server updates"
2026-03-25 17:34:42 <@pboy:fedora.im> Project: https://forge.fedoraproject.org/server/tickets/projects/406
2026-03-25 17:35:03 <@pboy:fedora.im> Here are morew news.
2026-03-25 17:35:50 <@pboy:fedora.im> Emmanuel Seyman: I addid some proposals about project text, milestones and tickets in our forge. Did you already see them.
2026-03-25 17:37:31 <@eseyman:fedora.im> I'm going to abandon timeshift, it looks a) tightly coupled to Gnome technologies and b) in need of more maintainers
2026-03-25 17:38:10 <@pboy:fedora.im> Agreed. That's not the way to go.
2026-03-25 17:38:42 <@eseyman:fedora.im> On paper, it looked great for our usecase. Once you get up close,  not so much
2026-03-25 17:38:59 <@pboy:fedora.im> Yeah
2026-03-25 17:39:24 <@pboy:fedora.im> I hope the timeshift dnf5 script is more useful.
2026-03-25 17:39:46 <@pboy:fedora.im> Did you had a look ath that? 
2026-03-25 17:40:11 <@pboy:fedora.im> I hope it is not vala, too
2026-03-25 17:40:54 <@ahmedalmeleh:matrix.org> I saw the forge page about making updates stronger on server
2026-03-25 17:41:05 <@mowest:fedora.im> Are we looking for a tool that is... 1. In Fedora Repos 2. A backup solution 3. Actively maintained?
2026-03-25 17:41:07 <@ahmedalmeleh:matrix.org> ahmed he him
2026-03-25 17:41:16 <@mowest:fedora.im> What about BORG?
2026-03-25 17:41:21 <@eseyman:fedora.im> The timeshift dnf5 script looks like a wrapper around timeshift
2026-03-25 17:42:34 <@eseyman:fedora.im> Here, we're looking for something that can snapshot /usr, apply the system updates and free the snapshot once the system has been determined as still working
2026-03-25 17:42:53 <@eseyman:fedora.im> More disaster recovery than backup/restore, per se
2026-03-25 17:43:11 <@pboy:fedora.im> Maybe, we can reuse the part with the hook into dnf5? And replace timeshift by something elseß 
2026-03-25 17:43:13 <@mowest:fedora.im> Ok, that is not really what BORG is for.
2026-03-25 17:43:27 <@pboy:fedora.im> Maybe, we can reuse the part with the hook into dnf5? And replace timeshift by something else?
2026-03-25 17:44:38 <@mowest:fedora.im> If we shift to btrfs on the main system drive, wouldn't we be able to snapshot using the btrfs utilities, I thought that was one of the advantages of btrfs?
2026-03-25 17:45:28 <@pboy:fedora.im> The btrfs part doesn't work either.
2026-03-25 17:45:43 <@pboy:fedora.im> What works ist the hard link path
2026-03-25 17:46:59 <@ahmedalmeleh:matrix.org> I mean isn't btrfs sort of snapshot if part of it is bad but not the entrie system
2026-03-25 17:47:43 <@pboy:fedora.im> Yes, but Servers LVM by default anf by technical specifications. So btrfs is not relevant here.
2026-03-25 17:48:04 <@pboy:fedora.im> We want to use LVM snapshots
2026-03-25 17:48:18 <@eseyman:fedora.im> and we're looking for a UI more than the tools themselves
2026-03-25 17:48:51 <@pboy:fedora.im> OK, let's continue at our room and next meeting.
2026-03-25 17:49:17 <@pboy:fedora.im> I would like to add a short notice i forgot in the agenda:
2026-03-25 17:49:26 <@pboy:fedora.im> !topic 5a.  Project "home server spin-off"
2026-03-25 17:49:35 <@pboy:fedora.im> Tracking ticket: https://forge.fedoraproject.org/server/tickets/issues/185
2026-03-25 17:50:58 <@pboy:fedora.im> Steve and I consider, to replace LVM by btrfs for the home server spin-off. The pro is, it is easier administrative work for (unexprienced) home adminitrators. The con is, it deviates from our technical base.
2026-03-25 17:53:32 <@eseyman:fedora.im> Please tell me that's not the only difference between the two versions
2026-03-25 17:53:47 <@mowest:fedora.im> I love the idea of going more in line with the rest of the editions for the home server spin off and use btrfs, but still keep cockpit, but also start with all of the cockpit plugins installed by default. Not sure what other enhancements could make it more user friendly, especially when it comes to automatically running containerized apps in a home lab setting. Also having a TUI or WebUI backup solution installed and configured out of the box might be nice too.
2026-03-25 17:54:13 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> there's ongoing work to support exposing and managing btrfs in cockpit too
2026-03-25 17:54:42 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> especially with the folks at suse also interested in cockpit for SLE
2026-03-25 17:54:52 <@ahmedalmeleh:matrix.org> I agree, although podman is just a click away in normal server cockpit from being installed
2026-03-25 17:55:01 <@pboy:fedora.im> Emmanuel Seyman: It's not the only difference, for sure. But it affects our core foundation. 
2026-03-25 17:55:08 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> so there's more energy in general around btrfs in the cases that server would care about these days
2026-03-25 17:56:16 <@mowest:fedora.im> I would entertain any other changes that make the user experience more streamlined. for the home lab enthusiast. But I know we might be limited by what is packaged for Fedora.
2026-03-25 17:57:21 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> but that's fixable :)
2026-03-25 17:57:23 <@pboy:fedora.im> mowest: We are free to package one or the other software. E.G. I would like to add an ebook web library. 
2026-03-25 17:57:23 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> we can package more things
2026-03-25 17:57:40 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> getting urbackup into fedora would be great too
2026-03-25 17:57:54 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> because then we can create synergy between server and desktop versions of fedora
2026-03-25 17:58:27 <@pboy:fedora.im> Yes, urbackup sounds great. I'm just trying it out
2026-03-25 17:58:31 <@ahmedalmeleh:matrix.org> I've had issues with ubackup in the past particularly with boot interrupts
2026-03-25 17:58:59 <@conan_kudo:matrix.org> a fedora server on btrfs with urbackup would be able to give us a good flow for fedora kde/gnome to fedora server and bring a lot more interest in server
2026-03-25 17:59:56 <@ahmedalmeleh:matrix.org> I've had issues with urbackup in the past particularly with boot interrupts
2026-03-25 18:00:14 <@pboy:fedora.im> Folks, our time is up. What started off a bit stiff today has turned out well
2026-03-25 18:00:31 <@pboy:fedora.im> Just a note about
2026-03-25 18:00:44 <@pboy:fedora.im>  Author a "Beginners Guide to Fedora Server"
2026-03-25 18:00:54 <@pboy:fedora.im> Tracking ticket: https://forge.fedoraproject.org/server/tickets/issues/190
2026-03-25 18:01:19 <@pboy:fedora.im> It is another example of cooperation between server and desktop.
2026-03-25 18:01:59 <@ahmedalmeleh:matrix.org> Would this be on server in general or more homelab server subspin?
2026-03-25 18:02:04 <@pboy:fedora.im> It's an idea from my, when I had several discussions mit users, who struggeld to get on after having installed Server.
2026-03-25 18:02:39 <@pboy:fedora.im> Originally ist is about default Server. But we may have a special edition for home server
2026-03-25 18:04:22 <@pboy:fedora.im> Ahmed Almeleh: By the way, You're welcome to join us at our next meeting! Especially if you're interested in home servers.
2026-03-25 18:04:48 <@ahmedalmeleh:matrix.org> Definitely would how may I join the server sig?
2026-03-25 18:05:09 <@pboy:fedora.im> Just participate!
2026-03-25 18:05:50 <@ahmedalmeleh:matrix.org> So is it if active we get added to members?
2026-03-25 18:06:44 <@pboy:fedora.im> There is the SIG, and specifically for Fedora editions, there is also a special type called the WG. See
2026-03-25 18:06:52 <@pboy:fedora.im> https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/server-working-group/docs/server-governance-charter/
2026-03-25 18:07:00 <@ahmedalmeleh:matrix.org> I see
2026-03-25 18:07:25 <@pboy:fedora.im> The WG is a kind of subgroup of SIG with special commitmens.
2026-03-25 18:08:16 <@pboy:fedora.im> But what matters more than formalities is taking action! And bring Server forward.
2026-03-25 18:09:35 <@pboy:fedora.im> And specifically for home server spin-off we would like to involve interested users from the very beginning.
2026-03-25 18:09:51 <@ahmedalmeleh:matrix.org> Indeed, I think on the note of the docs are we considering the core services like nginx, cockpit and samba?
2026-03-25 18:10:24 <@ahmedalmeleh:matrix.org> Thats what I'd associate with server
2026-03-25 18:10:30 <@pboy:fedora.im> Yes, not necessary nginx, but apachje (due to apache being Fedoras supporte web server)
2026-03-25 18:11:18 <@eseyman:fedora.im> I need to go. See you next week, folks!
2026-03-25 18:11:25 <@ahmedalmeleh:matrix.org> True nginx is user install and a preference 
2026-03-25 18:11:27 <@ahmedalmeleh:matrix.org> See you
2026-03-25 18:11:36 <@pboy:fedora.im> Bye Emmanmuel!
2026-03-25 18:12:17 <@pboy:fedora.im> We are really overdue now. Let's continue in #server:fedoraproject.org 
2026-03-25 18:12:27 <@pboy:fedora.im> !endmeeting