15:00:57 #startmeeting 15:00:57 Meeting started Wed Mar 30 15:00:57 2011 UTC. The chair is sijis. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 15:00:57 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 15:01:09 hey all, welcome 15:01:17 #topic who's here 15:01:28 * elad661 is here 15:02:07 * sijis suspects low tunrout.. since we don't have these consistently :( 15:02:24 shaiton: ping 15:02:52 sijis: we should have these meetings consistently 15:03:05 i agree. 15:03:16 let's move on. 15:03:22 #topic cron notices/email 15:03:53 so a copule of weeks ago, ricky enable website build script to send web-members emails when it failed to build 15:04:21 * hiemanshu is here 15:04:21 we noticed a couple of issues.. primarily with spins and its json feed taking forever. that's was fixed 15:04:42 this also helps us know if a recent po update borks the site build. 15:04:56 if anything, now we know when a site isn't building. 15:05:11 initially it was annoying but its getting better and more useful. 15:05:19 any thoughts aroud those emails? 15:05:30 I agree, those are indeed useful 15:06:41 ok 15:06:53 #topic f15 slides 15:07:12 I've asked at #fedora-desktop in GIMPnet 15:07:17 so f15 is a copule of months away. 15:07:28 yeah 15:07:31 elad661: oh yeah? 15:07:36 they recommend showing screenshot of the shell overview 15:07:56 oh, I can get those done 15:07:59 since my laptop runs on F15 15:08:35 the overview with few default applications open 15:08:38 anyone of you run kde/xfce/lxde by chance or have access ot one? we should also update the screenshots on the main download page 15:08:49 +1 on that 15:08:53 sijis: I run kde 15:09:00 sijis: and can install the rest if the need be 15:09:34 ok. i'm looking at the updated desktop screenshots in http://fedoraproject.org/en/get-fedora-options#desktops 15:10:08 what would we write next to the shell screenshot? we need something that basically describe the awesomeness of gnome 3... 15:10:16 elad661: so, the shell overview picture would replace that image in the 1st slide, right? 15:10:25 I don't think so 15:10:32 the overview isn't the desktop 15:10:51 it's a way of launching applications and switching windows 15:11:15 If we want a text that will describe gnome 3, we need to put it in the second slide 15:11:31 if we don't want that, we should put it in the first one 15:12:26 elad661: ah.. replacing the "a full suite of design tools" and "printing made easy" slides 15:12:29 gotcha 15:12:41 yes, one of those 15:12:47 the 2nd slide has to be updated anyway, because the new printer configuration panel of gnome 3 doesn't support driver auto-install. 15:13:06 we could also piggy back off the release-notes for information.. so we don't necessary have to write everything 15:13:11 who does the usual content writing? 15:13:17 we could email marketing to get this done 15:13:21 to get the text for it 15:13:57 true. i could reach out to mchua in mkt 15:14:16 since techincally it is marketing :) 15:14:19 well I could do that too 15:14:50 just an email to the list should do too 15:14:52 i like ot point out to release notes, since those folks put a lot of time into that and it points folks to 'other' parts of Fedora's vast web presense 15:15:11 hiemanshu: did you want to reach out to mrkt about it? 15:15:17 sijis: yeah 15:15:29 here am I, sorry still at work 15:15:30 we could do two slides of gnome 3 features, or we could do the other slide about other spin (not the design suite)... there aren't many features you can easily show in F15 that aren't part of gnome 3 (most are background stuff, like systemd) 15:15:47 #action hiemanshu will reach out to marketing about content for gnome3 shell and features 15:15:49 elad661: KDE 4.6? 15:16:08 elad661: yeah. i think we should highlight another spin in slide #3. that's a good idea 15:16:09 that is something most people are advertising about 15:16:32 hiemanshu: would confuse linux newbies 15:16:42 kde is techinically a spin :) 15:16:53 it's more then a spin... 15:16:57 (or quasai-spin) 15:17:16 sijis: security? games? 15:17:24 I think maybe the electronics lab or the games spin 15:17:56 i personally think games *may* be easier to put a quick blurb about. 15:17:58 oh yeah 15:17:59 FEL 15:18:11 however, FEL has been around for ages and should get some love 15:18:38 yes, FEL is something that no one else has 15:18:41 and we should show it off 15:18:48 let's do it in FEL? anyone against it? 15:18:54 nope 15:19:01 game spin is actually good to put in a slide because it shows that fedora has games (that's a typical FUD, "no games in linux") 15:19:03 I could ask the FEL maintainers for some text if you like 15:19:16 elad661: well that isnt something unique to fedora 15:19:19 but yes i say lets do FEL 15:19:28 elad661: we need to show that probably others dont have 15:19:37 like security, design, fel 15:19:55 we do have a new robotics spin, although i'm not sure if it's ready 15:20:25 #agreed slide #3 will be included 15:20:49 #actions hiemanshu will reach out to fel maintainers for slide #3 blurb 15:20:49 so FEL? 15:21:01 yup 15:21:06 ok. 15:21:38 we should hopefully have something from fel by beta release. so there is time for translator to get ot it 15:22:18 yes, and we should make sure to have an actual string freeze with no major breaks this time 15:22:30 yup. 15:22:56 so if we put the shell in slide #2 15:23:13 what do we do with the screenshot in the first one? 15:23:58 overviews with some windows open looks much alike desktop with some widows open at first glance 15:24:03 *overview 15:24:19 yeah. that sounds like it 15:24:40 we could use the shell application list in the second slide 15:24:47 i was thinking maybe something using compiz (or whatever its called these days) 15:24:58 it looks good, highres icons... 15:25:04 sijis: compiz isn't default 15:25:24 i know compiz got merge with (the other one) 15:25:28 right? 15:25:35 that's was long time ago 15:25:53 * sijis computer doens't support it :( 15:26:14 ok, so this is what we have 15:26:18 default is gnome shell, compiz will work only in fallback mode (gnome2 panel with a bit different look) 15:26:24 or the alternative DEs 15:26:50 #1 - desktop with apps open, #2 - gnome 3 shell overview, #3 - FEL, #4 - ? 15:27:02 elad661: ahh 15:27:20 4 is the community slide, do we have a new photo? 15:27:29 so for slide #4 mizmo reached out for a few groups and we got 1 response 15:27:45 its about 15 folks.. but we should use it anyhow. 15:28:11 yep, 15:28:49 we won't need new text for that slide 15:29:01 #infor #1 - desktop with apps open, #2 - gnome 3 shell overview, #3 - FEL, #4 - use new group picture 15:29:22 elad661: i dont think new text is required. 15:29:32 that's what i said 15:29:40 sijis: you got a typo there, zodbot won't record id 15:29:43 oh :0 15:29:46 you wrote infor 15:29:49 #info #1 - desktop with apps open, #2 - gnome 3 shell overview, #3 - FEL, #4 - use new group picture 15:29:52 there we go 15:29:54 :) 15:30:12 anything else on the slides? 15:30:16 no 15:30:26 should we add new features to the feature page, or just update the screenshots and icons? 15:30:36 i did some of the icon updating 15:31:16 wait a second i'll look what icons need updating 15:31:18 i would say mostly icons. the main apps used are typically basic 15:31:32 basic but some of those changed 15:31:36 totem for example 15:31:40 has a new ui 15:32:24 the shotwell icon needs updating 15:32:30 sorry, damn server got DCed 15:33:01 open office screenshots, should we replace those with libreoffice screenshots? 15:33:22 it's basically the same, but with some small visual diffrences 15:33:51 you got it 15:34:25 #topic start.fp.o -- what to do about it 15:34:41 the Ibus screenshot, NetworkManager screenshot, clock screenshot, totem screenshot and the gnote screenshot should be updated 15:34:51 now about start.fpo 15:35:01 hiemanshu: have you seen the wiki page? 15:35:15 #info Ibus screenshot, NetworkManager screenshot, clock screenshot, totem screenshot and the gnote screenshot should be updated 15:35:32 elad661: which one? 15:35:35 https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Start.fpo_redesign 15:35:42 #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Start.fpo_redesign 15:35:55 we need to decide about a long term plan for start.fpo 15:36:02 it has many problems 15:36:27 sijis suggested we will do something similar to what mozilla does with FF on updates 15:36:30 elad661: oh start.fp.o the current mockup is based on a wireframe mockup by me 15:36:39 a what'snew page 15:36:55 no 15:37:01 its not an update page or something 15:37:04 the main one is that it lacks purpose 15:37:05 its a start page 15:37:09 like an index page for a book 15:37:13 hiemanshu: current mockup? it's already implemented 15:37:30 i know the general consensus is that it should die. 15:37:41 elad661: oh yeah 15:37:43 most users change it 15:37:47 * hiemanshu dint see it 15:37:54 and using google is also a problem 15:38:03 it's non-free software 15:38:23 elad661: but do we have an alternative? 15:39:04 what should the purpose of this page be? search? help for beginners? well designed one-page release notes? 15:39:24 elad661: everythigng 15:39:27 anyway it can't stay how it is now, it has to much visual clutter 15:39:44 well I remember seeing something about this being replaced by isnight 15:39:46 insight 15:39:47 or something 15:40:12 really? 15:40:22 hmm... 15:40:43 sijis: I am not really sure 15:40:44 i'll reach out to stickster and see if that's the idea. 15:40:55 most users change this page, new users won't be interested in news about fedora 15:41:15 insight is just doing FWN if i recall 15:41:44 I think we need to conduct a survey about this page, what most contributors think it should be used to 15:42:08 yeah, i think that's agood suggestion. 15:42:26 elad661: we did try, but I dont remember where that is now 15:42:28 not sure how we've conducted polls before. 15:42:41 sijis: email 15:42:49 sijis: send one to devel-announce or something 15:42:59 and ask them to email web@fp.o 15:43:21 i was actually thinking logistics@ since plenty of folks are on there 15:43:28 yeah 15:43:30 that or that 15:43:39 this or that** 15:44:10 ok. i'll send out somethign to that list and point to the wiki page too 15:44:17 so there is some history around that 15:44:24 hmm... i think we should have something automatic for these things, email is not anonymous voting 15:44:45 i don't expect this to be in effect before GA. 15:44:54 sure. 15:45:02 we need to do that after GA, 15:45:12 elad661: true.. but we'd also like to know what 'options' there are. 15:45:19 elad661: well if they want to remain anonymous, we can have them email us, and we can post that 15:45:26 and that can't be done w/out some sort of discussion 15:45:36 sijis: +1 15:46:01 BRB 15:46:10 sijis: true 15:46:31 #action sijis will send email to logistics@, web@, marketing@ on feedback for start.fp.o 15:48:10 back. 15:48:36 ok, let's see what the feedback is on that and then we'll see where we are at 15:49:09 sounds good 15:49:48 #info hiemanshu emailed the FEL maintainer for the screenshot and content 15:50:46 ok what's the next topic? 15:51:04 ypu. moving on 15:51:20 #topic website build errors on F15 15:51:35 so, elad has run into a problem with our script on F15 15:51:41 #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=691042 15:52:32 ok, I am going to look at it and try and fix it 15:52:33 sijis: note that i've changes ugettext to gettext in the script itself (without commiting), and only then the gneshi issue came up 15:52:49 without the change 15:52:52 it didn't work 15:52:59 elad661: with the cahnge it did? 15:53:00 just with the same error 15:53:21 hiemanshu: with the change no, because there is a line to change in gneshi 15:53:22 * sijis will be right back.. 15:53:36 tried to create a patch, didn't succeed 15:53:39 topics left: tickets 41 and 45, then open floor 15:53:47 #chair elad661 hiemanshu 15:53:47 Current chairs: elad661 hiemanshu sijis 15:54:04 elad661: I dont seem to understand you 15:54:11 ok i'll explain 15:54:15 thanks 15:54:33 there was a python error 15:54:37 AttributeError: 'function' object has no attribute 'ugettext' 15:54:44 so after a little google search 15:54:54 i found out that ugettext is no gettext 15:55:01 changed the script 15:55:08 and the error remained 15:55:15 oh ok 15:55:18 I'll check that 15:55:26 it's a problem in genshi 15:55:40 anyway i won't be able to update screenshots and icons until it's fixed 15:55:50 both my machines run F15 15:55:50 well I am on F15 too 15:56:32 if its something wrong with genshi, I'll create a patch, and send it to the maintainer to fix it 15:56:39 #action hiemanshu will try to fix the problem 15:56:42 fix the package i.e 15:56:55 moving on? 15:56:57 yeah 15:57:07 .ticket 41 15:57:09 elad661: #41 (Please 'svn load' contents ofnss_compat_ossl tarball : svn.fedoraproject.org/svn/hosted/identity/common) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/41 15:57:23 .webticket 41 15:57:23 is that it? 15:57:24 #41 (Inaccurate rendering in Join fedora page under Latest Announcements section.) - fedora-websites - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-websites/ticket/41 15:57:25 oh 15:57:40 #topic ticket 41 15:57:45 #topic Ticker #41 (Inaccurate rendering in Join fedora page under Latest Announcements section.) - fedora-websites - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-websites/ticket/41 15:57:53 #topic Ticket #41 (Inaccurate rendering in Join fedora page under Latest Announcements section.) - fedora-websites - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-websites/ticket/41 15:58:11 * hiemanshu is sorry about all that noise 15:58:41 strange i don't see it now 15:58:55 but the problem was that the RSS code didn't remove HTML 15:59:09 ah 15:59:16 but the html was also not rendered (it was displayed) 15:59:25 did you try what was suggested in the ticket? 15:59:30 * sijis is back 15:59:56 i think shaiton was working on it, 16:00:01 not sure 16:00:16 if i recall, the 'fix' was just removing the summary and just use the subject 16:00:37 ideally i've love to be able to remove hte html tags in the feed. 16:01:15 i haven't been able to find anything like strip_tags() as in php 16:01:30 btw. why does it show messages from devel? doesn't fit there 16:02:09 devel is part of community. ideally it would been devel-announce but that doesn't have an rss feed (if i recall) 16:02:20 yes we should fix that 16:02:32 (or infra or whoever runs the lists) 16:02:54 elad661: you wanna create a track infra ticket to add rss feed to devel-announce? 16:03:07 sure, in a moment 16:03:10 anyway could we remove HTML with regex? 16:03:23 not that i was able to find 16:04:21 try using beautiful soup? 16:04:38 me.. nope 16:04:55 also there is https://github.com/aaronsw/html2text/blob/master/html2text.py 16:06:05 i'll have ot check that out 16:07:27 there is loads of stuff out there, just gotta find the right one to use 16:07:50 i only spent a few mins looking for something 16:08:06 i was focused on something native to python. 16:08:17 meaing in python-core. 16:09:20 elad661, ? Iam shaiton_ right now :) 16:09:25 * shaiton_ is reading back 16:10:38 I haven't seen those html tag issues.. 16:11:00 huh? well obviously i'm confused 16:11:42 oh I know why I confused 16:11:57 you talked about another problem in there 16:12:06 related to those feeds 16:12:53 yep 16:13:06 about the FWN link to the mail archive 16:13:11 not to the wiki 16:13:42 where is that? 16:14:01 sijis: both start.fpo and join-fedora page 16:14:06 .ticket 2689 16:14:06 (I've created an infra ticket to add a RSS feed for devel-announce) 16:14:07 elad661: #2689 (Add an RSS feed for devel-announce) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/2689 16:14:38 elad661: thanks 16:14:45 no problem 16:15:37 you mean the links inside the feed go to the mailing list archive? 16:15:50 sijis: yes. 16:16:10 because it is taken from the mailing list rss 16:16:15 that's pulled from announce rss feed that's why. 16:16:37 yeah shaiton_ want it to link to the wiki instead 16:16:56 there is a big part called "Fedora weekly news" by the icons 16:16:59 that points to the wiki 16:17:10 (on the same page) 16:17:12 not on start.fpo 16:17:34 i think its in the footer. 16:17:42 oh right. 16:17:46 sijis, is it the direct link to the last FWN release? 16:17:50 anyhow, i'm not too concerned with start.fp.o.. but it should work. 16:18:07 http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FWN/LatestIssue 16:18:09 we don't need to link to the mail archive, that's ugly while we have a wiki page :) 16:18:39 shaiton_: that stuff on start.fp.o is pulled from the announce@fp.o list.. 16:18:45 yeah sijis I forgot about this page 16:19:17 so that FWN message will get filtered down when more annoucments go out 16:19:34 shaiton_: we would need to parse the feed and extract the link to the wiki, i don't know if it worth the effort 16:21:14 i agree that that linking to the wiki is nicer but not worth the effort for that, since its getting info from the feed 16:21:23 +1 16:21:45 and the fist link in the message is a link to the wiki page 16:21:50 http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FWN/Issue268 16:22:00 couldn't just use the /FWN/LatestIssue link ? 16:22:09 couldn't we* 16:22:47 * shaiton_ has probably read too fast, still at work ;) 16:22:50 shaiton_: since its automatically generated, we'll hvae ot parse out the feed and see if the message is "FWN" then change the link to FWN 16:23:01 .. linke to wiki 16:23:20 oh yeah, got it 16:23:49 ok, we should wrap this up.. 16:24:04 #topic open floor 16:24:12 anything else? 16:24:44 sijis: there is another ticket, no? 16:24:44 * hiemanshu has nothing 16:25:09 sijis: how big is the repo? its at 120 mb and still downloading 16:25:14 sijis: ticket 45 we didn't do that? 16:25:19 hiemanshu: ~300 16:25:35 oh.. so ticket #45. 16:25:39 sijis: wat, last I recall it was about 30-ish mb 16:25:56 QA wants a link on the beta/alpha pages, so folks go to them with issues on those releases 16:26:16 hiemanshu: yeah, don't mention that to ricky :) 16:26:38 sijis: sounds like a good idea 16:26:46 we should add it before beta 16:26:50 so they just want a note/blurb about that. 16:27:00 elad661: yeah, that was my goal. 16:27:17 i would do that if i could build the website... 16:27:31 yeah 16:27:43 add it after the "This is pre-release software..." 16:27:56 :) 16:28:20 hiemanshu: the repo is 172.4 MiB on my machine 16:28:22 I would do that if I could get the repo to clone and if sijis promises to decrease the size of it 16:28:36 elad661: well 150mb, and only 35% done 16:28:42 strange... 16:29:01 535Mfedora-web 16:29:05 well it doesn't count size it counts the number of files 16:29:39 sijis: so no christmas presents to you, you cant do naughty stuff and hide your files in .git repos :P 16:29:46 s/to/for/ 16:29:57 hiemanshu: if you just wanted to do a quick checkout.. you could have done a shallow one 'git clone --depth 1' i think would have been the option 16:30:05 lol 16:30:35 sijis: well I still need to have a copy of it 16:32:18 hiemanshu: rikcy wants to use svn to decrease the size of pulling the repo 16:32:28 oh no 16:32:34 svn?! 16:32:36 i think shallow clone is good enough 16:32:48 sijis: well svn is worse, if you use svn, except patches instead of commits from me 16:32:53 he's thinking more along the lines of build time 16:32:59 sijis: also what is so huge? 16:33:20 its because we have images in the repo 16:33:26 you can't really compress those. 16:33:38 sijis: you can compress them 16:33:44 png supports compression 16:33:49 another working thought was move images out of the repo and put them somewhere else 16:34:14 hiemanshu: those are already compressed with optipng -o9 16:34:19 sijis: well yeah, we can talk about it later, continue with the meeting 16:34:21 hiemanshu: i think its more of the previous versions of it 16:34:22 elad661: ah ok 16:34:47 moving it out from the repo is a good idea 16:35:18 but it will make it a bit harder to change the images that way 16:35:22 +1, we don't need versionning on them 16:36:01 move the older version out 16:36:07 to some other repo? 16:36:21 well i think that's impossible with git... 16:36:24 sijis: or just move the images to a new repo 16:36:32 elad661: nope it isnt 16:36:37 elad661: sub-repos are supported 16:36:51 i meant removing the older ones 16:37:09 ah that 16:37:10 no 16:37:14 thats in the history 16:37:17 nevermind 16:37:33 anything else? i think we can finish this meeting. 16:37:56 yes 16:37:56 sorry. 16:38:00 could we have 16:38:04 an automatic 16:38:08 unless you want to talk about ticket 45? 16:38:08 tx pull/push ? 16:38:12 or if you already did 16:38:41 yeah, moving it to another repo maybe OK by me 16:38:45 +1 on automatic tx pull and push 16:38:48 subrepo is an interesting thought 16:39:10 tx can pull translations automaticlly from a url so we won't need to do an actual push 16:39:14 elad661: yeah, i'm hoping to put something for GA on that 16:39:27 oh goof 16:39:30 *good 16:39:36 stupid keyboard 16:39:40 alright. anything else. otherwise i'll end this 16:39:43 endmeeting? 16:39:47 5 16:39:48 4 16:39:49 3 16:39:50 2 16:39:51 1 16:39:54 #endmeeting