17:00:12 <jbrooks> #startmeeting fedora_atomic_wg
17:00:12 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Jan 11 17:00:12 2017 UTC.  The chair is jbrooks. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
17:00:12 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
17:00:12 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fedora_atomic_wg'
17:00:19 <jbrooks> #topic roll call
17:00:25 <roshi> .hello roshi
17:00:26 <zodbot> roshi: roshi 'Mike Ruckman' <mruckman@redhat.com>
17:00:28 <kushal> .hellomynameis kushal
17:00:29 <zodbot> kushal: kushal 'Kushal Das' <mail@kushaldas.in>
17:00:32 <trishnag> .hello trishnag
17:00:33 <zodbot> trishnag: trishnag 'Trishna Guha' <trishnaguha17@gmail.com>
17:00:36 <dustymabe> .hello dustymabe
17:00:37 <zodbot> dustymabe: dustymabe 'Dusty Mabe' <dustymabe@redhat.com>
17:00:38 <coremodule> .hello coremodule
17:00:40 <zodbot> coremodule: coremodule 'Geoffrey Marr' <gmarr@redhat.com>
17:00:49 <dustymabe> coremodule: \o/
17:01:03 <bowlofeggs> .hello bowlofeggs
17:01:04 <zodbot> bowlofeggs: bowlofeggs 'Randy Barlow' <randy@electronsweatshop.com>
17:01:09 <sayan> .hello sayanchowdhury
17:01:10 <zodbot> sayan: sayanchowdhury 'Sayan Chowdhury' <sayan.chowdhury2012@gmail.com>
17:01:12 <bowlofeggs> .hello maxamillion
17:01:13 <zodbot> bowlofeggs: maxamillion 'Adam Miller' <maxamillion@gmail.com>
17:01:22 <maxamillion> .hello maxamillion
17:01:23 * sayan is finishing off another meeting
17:01:23 <zodbot> maxamillion: maxamillion 'Adam Miller' <maxamillion@gmail.com>
17:01:35 <trishnag> bowlofeggs: :)
17:01:51 <jbrooks> #chair roshi kushal trishnag  dustymabe coremodule bowlofeggs sayan maxamillion
17:01:51 <zodbot> Current chairs: bowlofeggs coremodule dustymabe jbrooks kushal maxamillion roshi sayan trishnag
17:02:09 <jbrooks> #topic action items from last meeting
17:02:15 <jberkus> here now, sorry
17:02:19 <jberkus> .hello jberkus
17:02:20 <zodbot> jberkus: jberkus 'Josh Berkus' <josh@agliodbs.com>
17:02:30 <jbrooks> #chair jberkus
17:02:30 <zodbot> Current chairs: bowlofeggs coremodule dustymabe jberkus jbrooks kushal maxamillion roshi sayan trishnag
17:02:37 * kushal has an open floor topic
17:02:54 <jbrooks> jberkus to create tickets for prerequisites for removing kube packages  from  base ostree: https://pagure.io/atomic-wg/issues?status=Open&tags=remove-kube
17:02:59 <jbrooks> ack, kushal
17:03:06 <jberkus> that's done
17:03:16 <jberkus> it seems like I'm forgetting some major prerequisite
17:03:23 <jbrooks> That's the link I posted
17:03:51 <jbrooks> I'm working on them -- the containers part is waiting on the release bits for the layered build service
17:04:31 <jbrooks> I can build the master and node containers on which the individual components are based, but can't layer on them to build those components until they're releaseable
17:04:42 <jberkus> oh
17:04:49 <jberkus> testing, knew I was forgetting something
17:05:30 <roshi> :D
17:05:37 <jbrooks> next action, dustymabe and walters to discuss new release process
17:05:59 <dustymabe> jbrooks: we've kind of already done that, no I just need to formalize and get with releng
17:06:05 <dustymabe> s/no/now
17:06:12 <dustymabe> I would say just drop it from action items
17:06:28 <jberkus> ok, added
17:06:36 <jbrooks> OK, might be good to post something to the list
17:06:43 <jberkus> roshi: https://pagure.io/atomic-wg/issue/191
17:07:17 <jbrooks> next action, dustymabe walters jberkus to explore overlayfs writeability issue
17:07:21 <dustymabe> jbrooks: agree
17:07:35 <jbrooks> some notes on overlayfs: https://pagure.io/atomic-wg/issue/186
17:08:16 <jberkus> AFAIK, that's done except discussing partitioning
17:08:19 * roshi takes a look
17:08:34 <dustymabe> jberkus: right
17:08:36 <jbrooks> jberkus, OK, carry it forward?
17:08:37 <jberkus> overlayfs may be *technically* not posix-compliant, but I can't get it to actually break anything
17:08:48 <jberkus> yes, we need to decide on the partitioning
17:09:17 <jbrooks> #action dustymabe walters jberkus to discuss overlayfs partitioning issue
17:09:38 <jbrooks> Anything to discuss on that right now?
17:10:07 <dustymabe> jbrooks: I think it might be best if we leave it to the ticket
17:10:13 <jbrooks> OK
17:10:20 <jberkus> take a look at the ticket.  I think it's almost decided, though
17:10:28 <jbrooks> dustymabe, next item is yours, blogging about overlayfs
17:10:58 <dustymabe> jbrooks: so actually there is something I'd like to talk about there
17:11:07 <jbrooks> Take it away
17:11:08 <dustymabe> so there were some new features added to docker-storage-setup
17:11:32 <dustymabe> I'd actually like to get those into fedora 25 before I blog, because I want users to be able to use the new DOCKER_ROOT_VOLUME=yes option
17:11:47 <jbrooks> Is something in bodhi?
17:11:51 <dustymabe> dwalsh has said that he is willing to merge the patches if we test it and tell him it's good
17:11:56 <jbrooks> OK
17:12:10 <jbrooks> Can you point us to a fork?
17:12:11 <dustymabe> jbrooks: I'll create an ostree that people can rebase to to test it out
17:12:15 <jbrooks> Cool
17:12:15 <jberkus> ok
17:12:22 <dustymabe> are you guys willing to hammer on it a bit?
17:12:27 <jbrooks> yes
17:12:34 <dustymabe> the most important thing to to make sure behavior stays the same
17:12:42 <dustymabe> given the same inputs as the past
17:12:43 <maxamillion> dustymabe: do we have good docs on 'how to make and host your own custom ostress' ? blog post or otherwise?
17:13:06 <dustymabe> maxamillion: good docs, probably not
17:13:15 <jbrooks> there are lots of different ones
17:13:21 <dustymabe> jason has done several blog posts and really it is in the fedora-atomic git repo
17:13:22 <jberkus> maxamillion: that's one of those things we *really* could use for our users
17:13:38 <jbrooks> I've written a bunch -- I keep meaning to unify
17:13:43 <dustymabe> maxamillion: these aren't good answers to your question
17:13:57 <kushal> maxamillion, I don't think so :)
17:13:57 <maxamillion> jberkus: +1
17:14:03 <maxamillion> dustymabe: they are not :)
17:14:16 <jbrooks> I'll update this one: http://www.projectatomic.io/docs/compose-your-own-tree/
17:14:22 <maxamillion> so "no" ... that answer is "no" ... which is fine, we should just look into making that a "yes" :)
17:14:23 <jbrooks> I wrote that a while ago
17:14:29 <maxamillion> jbrooks: +1
17:14:32 <maxamillion> jbrooks++
17:14:32 <zodbot> maxamillion: Karma for jasonbrooks changed to 3 (for the f25 release cycle):  https://badges.fedoraproject.org/tags/cookie/any
17:14:49 <jbrooks> #action jbrooks to update compose your own doc
17:15:12 <jbrooks> #action jbrooks dustymabe jberkus to collab on testing new docker-storage-setup patches
17:15:41 <jbrooks> next action?
17:15:45 <jbrooks> scollier to update ticket on Future of Fedora Dockerfiles
17:16:02 <jbrooks> https://pagure.io/atomic-wg/issue/180
17:16:18 <jbrooks> I don't think we have him atm
17:16:33 <jbrooks> jberkus jbrooks to do initial draft of PRD and ping dusty and group  for further review
17:16:59 <maxamillion> on the topic of that ticket, I wrote a porposal for a workshop at DevConf (we would host it both in-person and virtually for those who can't attend)
17:17:05 <jberkus> so, we started on that
17:17:08 <jbrooks> OK, Josh and I went through this, we made a bunch of edits, and I put in several comments: https://public.etherpad-mozilla.org/p/fedora_cloud_PRD
17:17:15 <jberkus> the former Cloud PRD is llllooooooonnnnnggggg
17:17:20 <jberkus> longer than the other PRDs
17:17:33 <jberkus> we're wondering if we can just cut a bunch of stuff
17:17:37 <dustymabe> jberkus: did you ping us for feedback :)
17:17:38 <maxamillion> we'd divvy up all the work into taiga cards (I'd pre-populate them when we get there) and then work on the Fedora-Dockerfiles at the workshop ... please check the mailing list and reply there
17:17:42 <jbrooks> jberkus, yesterday I more or less got to the end, but I put in a bunch of "can we cut this?" comments
17:18:02 <jbrooks> dustymabe, consider yourself pinged now
17:18:08 <jbrooks> :)
17:18:51 <jbrooks> maxamillion, could you add a link to that proposal in the issue?
17:18:59 <maxamillion> jbrooks: will do
17:19:03 <jbrooks> thanks
17:19:22 <scollier> .hello scollier
17:19:23 <zodbot> scollier: scollier 'Scott Collier' <emailscottcollier@gmail.com>
17:19:29 <jbrooks> #chair scollier
17:19:29 <zodbot> Current chairs: bowlofeggs coremodule dustymabe jberkus jbrooks kushal maxamillion roshi sayan scollier trishnag
17:19:35 <jbrooks> Hey Scott
17:19:43 <scollier> heya jbrooks apologies.
17:19:56 <jbrooks> no prob
17:20:28 <jbrooks> So, on the PRD, if people could check it out and comment, that'd be great
17:21:17 <dustymabe> jberkus: jbrooks: thank you for putting that together!
17:22:31 <jbrooks> I don't know if it's legit to do:
17:22:48 <jbrooks> #action all comment on PRD draft to discuss next week
17:23:37 <jbrooks> The last action on the list is jberkus to lead planning some fedora-atomic work sessions around devconf
17:23:51 <jbrooks> Any updates there, Josh?
17:24:08 <jberkus> maxamillion proposed something for FDLIBS for Friday afternoon
17:24:25 <jberkus> what other work sessions do we need
17:25:07 <dustymabe> FOSP ?
17:25:19 <dustymabe> we really haven't made much progress there from what I can tell
17:25:47 <jberkus> well, the folks who know how to do OS+Fedora seem to have no access to the HW
17:26:02 <maxamillion> and if there's any real interest in Project FAO anymore, we would meet on that ... system containers and the like might be in a better place to actually get some action items lined up for it
17:26:31 <jberkus> there's still interest, we even put it in the draft PRD ;-)
17:26:42 <jbrooks> These are session ideas for devconf?
17:27:11 <dustymabe> are these sessions or just meetings that we can have "around" devconf? i.e. they don't have to happen on the actual days of devconf
17:28:12 <jberkus> yah, so the problem with meetings outside devconf
17:28:21 <jberkus> is that I'm not sure there are days that most of us are there
17:28:32 <jberkus> I'm there for 1 day before and 2 days after
17:28:48 * misc will be present 1 week before devconf but leave on monday
17:28:53 <maxamillion> jberkus: +1
17:28:59 <dustymabe> yeah I think the day before is the most likely day
17:29:09 <misc> there is also the need to get a room
17:29:23 <maxamillion> I'm there 2 days before, zero days after and I already have a lot of meetings lined up for the 2 days before
17:29:42 <kushal> I wish this was discussed before hand. Could have been a case for us to attend.
17:30:10 <jbrooks> Yeah, I probably would have come
17:30:20 <trishnag> Count me in. :)
17:30:31 <dustymabe> kushal: just like almost anything else, we waited til the end to plan things
17:30:38 <dustymabe> there is an easy solution here
17:30:41 <dustymabe> :)
17:30:50 <maxamillion> kushal: it's going to be a 2 hour session and anything done in person can easily be done online ... so if we want to make this for after DevConf, we can setup a Virtual FAD if that is preferred
17:30:55 <misc> dustymabe: plan for devconf 2018 now ?
17:31:07 <kushal> dustymabe, yup, and that also means we will miss.
17:31:26 <kushal> maxamillion, not for this particular meeting, but if we have any other meeting etc as mentioned.
17:31:38 <maxamillion> kushal: oh
17:31:40 <maxamillion> fair
17:32:00 <maxamillion> the only one I really know that has any agenda is that one that jberkus and I were talking about
17:32:07 <dustymabe> maxamillion: yeah, virtual FAD would be useful once every two months or so I would say?
17:32:08 <roshi> I can do a virtual FAD
17:32:17 <roshi> I won't be at DevConf anyways :)
17:32:20 <jberkus> time zones might be a problem
17:32:26 <roshi> was planning on being in the IRC though
17:32:34 <jberkus> hmmm
17:32:45 <maxamillion> dustymabe: that's not a bad idea
17:32:49 <jberkus> given the number of people who *won't* be there, I'm dubious about doing anything around DevConf
17:32:57 <jbrooks> Does someone want to take the ball on setting up a virtual FAD?
17:32:58 <dustymabe> jberkus: true, unless we decided that we wanted to make that our #1 priority for that day
17:33:08 <jberkus> dustymabe: maybe you and I should just do an FAO hack session after devconf?
17:33:22 <maxamillion> dustymabe: we can make a taiga kanban board for it, plan and groom before hand and then just have one day every couple months where we hack on things
17:33:36 <dustymabe> jberkus: sure, just let me know what you are wanting out of it and I can try to make sure I deliver from a technical perspective
17:33:51 <dustymabe> maxamillion: yeah
17:34:14 <dustymabe> I don't want to overcommit to making it a bigger deal than it is
17:34:41 <dustymabe> but i think just having us all together for a period of time periodically would make things start to "move"
17:34:43 <maxamillion> dustymabe: +1
17:34:43 <dustymabe> faster
17:34:50 <jbrooks> yep
17:35:12 <dustymabe> i'll open a ticket for us to discuss
17:35:17 <jbrooks> Excellent
17:35:33 <roshi> makes sense to me
17:35:38 <jbrooks> dustymabe, is this discuss devconf or discuss virtual fads
17:35:55 <dustymabe> virtual fads
17:35:59 <jbrooks> #action dustymabe to start ticket to discuss virtual fads
17:36:04 <jbrooks> on to tickets
17:36:15 <jberkus> isn't a "virtual fad" a meme?
17:36:34 <jberkus> ;-)
17:36:46 <maxamillion> alright, new generic Atomic WG kanban board https://taiga.fedorainfracloud.org/project/maxamillion-fedora-atomic-wg/kanban
17:36:47 <jbrooks> Ah, I haven't been breaking these action items into topics
17:36:55 <jbrooks> #topic November 21 ISO is not bootable on UEFI
17:37:03 <jbrooks> https://pagure.io/atomic-wg/issue/185
17:37:04 <maxamillion> I'll reply to the mailing list with this discussion for posterity and I'll start putting cards in
17:37:35 <maxamillion> I'll make an Epic for the Fedora-Dockerfiles stuff and I'll write up some docs on the process ... anyone have any preferences on where that stuff goes?
17:37:44 <jberkus> maxamillion: where's our kanban?
17:38:12 <dustymabe> maxamillion: I created a ticket  https://www.petfinder.com/petdetail/37080834
17:38:14 <dustymabe> sigh
17:38:19 <dustymabe> https://pagure.io/atomic-wg/issue/192
17:38:24 <scollier> maxamillion, new wiki page linked to from the build service wiki page docs?
17:38:32 <dustymabe> side note, we might adopt a dog
17:38:36 <jberkus> heh
17:38:58 <trishnag> hehe
17:39:01 <kushal> maxamillion, btw, what is the full form of Epic?
17:39:06 <jberkus> a chihuahua, though?
17:39:09 <jbrooks> heh
17:39:28 <maxamillion> jberkus: https://taiga.fedorainfracloud.org/project/maxamillion-fedora-atomic-wg/kanban
17:39:32 <maxamillion> sorry, I forgot to link it
17:39:33 <dustymabe> jberkus: yeah, we already have one chihuahua, so...
17:39:42 <maxamillion> also, I have no idea why maxamillion is in the URL ... taiga just does that
17:39:48 <jberkus> nice
17:39:50 <maxamillion> I didn't slap my name in there ... I'd prefer it not be there
17:40:02 * jberkus needs to set up a personal kanban now that Atlassan bought Trello
17:40:21 <dustymabe> ok, I guess we should talk about the topic
17:40:31 <jbrooks> any updates on that?
17:40:40 <jbrooks> or other dog options?
17:40:46 <jbrooks> ;)
17:40:51 <dustymabe> so.. the story is that there is some bug in pungi blah blah.. I'm still working with releng on it
17:40:55 <maxamillion> jberkus: taiga.fedoraproject.org is open for business :)
17:41:17 <jbrooks> OK
17:41:43 <jbrooks> We already talked about #180
17:41:50 <jbrooks> and #170
17:42:13 <jbrooks> I guess I'll update #170 w/ call for comments
17:42:31 <jbrooks> #topic Ship fedora-motd in F24 atomic image
17:42:36 <jbrooks> https://pagure.io/atomic-wg/issue/160
17:42:40 <jbrooks> Any updates  on this one?
17:42:49 <kushal> Is rtnpro here?
17:43:00 <sayan> nope
17:43:13 <jbrooks> ok
17:43:29 <jbrooks> #topic Proposed website changes for Cloud Base → Atomic Host switch
17:43:34 <jbrooks> https://pagure.io/atomic-wg/issue/158
17:43:49 <jbrooks> This was last modified two months ago
17:44:21 <jbrooks> that mentions a dustymabe meeting on this
17:44:40 <dustymabe> so.. we haven't announced yet because there is an issue with the reported amis
17:44:43 <dustymabe> but check it out
17:44:47 <dustymabe> cloud.fedoraproject.org
17:45:07 <jbrooks> Seems legit
17:45:08 <jbrooks> :)
17:45:17 <jbrooks> Maybe update that ticket?
17:45:23 <dustymabe> i'll close this ticket
17:45:31 <jbrooks> cool
17:45:36 <dustymabe> and let the ticket in the websites repo serve for fixing the remaining issues
17:45:36 <jbrooks> #topic  design, deploy and document Fedora OpenShift Playground (FOSP)
17:45:54 <jbrooks> misc, Do you have any news on this front?
17:46:11 <misc> jbrooks: nope, didn't I posted on the bug ?
17:46:22 <jbrooks> right, sorry
17:46:26 <jbrooks> https://pagure.io/atomic-wg/issue/153
17:46:27 <jbrooks> OK
17:46:30 <misc> well, I do have news we are getting hardward
17:46:39 <jbrooks> awesome
17:46:41 <misc> but for that, I need to decipher the catalog of super micro
17:46:58 <misc> that's like doing RSA computation but without a computer
17:47:17 <jbrooks> I know you can do it :)
17:47:27 <jbrooks> OK, let's move to
17:47:30 <jbrooks> #topic open floor
17:47:37 <jbrooks> kushal, you have an item?
17:47:44 <kushal> Yes
17:48:10 <kushal> Yesterday sayan and me proposed https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Automated_AMI_test_and_release as F26 change.
17:48:22 <kushal> What else have we put in from Atomic WG?
17:48:40 <jbrooks> As changes?
17:49:06 <maxamillion> kushal: have you sync'd with puiterwijk about autosigning that stuff?
17:49:27 <kushal> jbrooks, Yes.
17:49:34 <kushal> maxamillion, autosigning what?
17:49:40 <maxamillion> kushal: also, is this something that could be incorporated with the releng-automation work? https://pagure.io/releng-automation
17:49:40 <jbrooks> kushal, What's the deadline for this?
17:49:52 <kushal> jbrooks, standard F26 change.
17:50:11 <maxamillion> kushal: aren't there checksum manifests that are gpg signed? or some AMI record that's gpg signed?
17:50:21 <kushal> maxamillion, I don't know any.
17:50:36 <kushal> maxamillion, if there is any, we should sign those with help from puiterwijk
17:50:48 <jbrooks> change due dates: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/26/Schedule
17:50:59 <maxamillion> kushal: alright, just checking ... for some reason I thought there was something to establish a chain of trust for the AMI images
17:51:02 <maxamillion> maybe not
17:51:54 <kushal> maxamillion, and for the second query, this is done on the fedimg side, I don't know how that fits in the automated release tools story. it should, but just don't know the steps/details.
17:52:04 <sayan> maxamillion: also, is it possible to know when the compose id changes?
17:52:12 <kushal> Correct.
17:52:26 <sayan> Fedora-Docker changed to Fedora_Docker and autocloud and fedimg broke
17:52:27 <kushal> Sudden change in the compose id breaks the other systems.
17:52:53 <dustymabe> kushal: yes, dgilmore made that change I believe
17:53:25 <kushal> dustymabe, that is okay, just that we should have been informed to update autocloud and fedimg.
17:53:32 <kushal> dustymabe, as that breaks 2WA etc.
17:54:02 <dustymabe> kushal: sure, I agree, I'm just telling you where to go have a conversation about it
17:54:03 <sayan> Yes, I asked dgilmore later. At the first go I thought it was a typo
17:54:03 <dustymabe> :)
17:54:14 <sayan> :)
17:54:18 <puiterwijk> maxamillion: no current chain of trust to AMIs exist, no.
17:54:23 <kushal> dustymabe, I know, just saying here.
17:54:32 <dustymabe> sayan: so when can we expect to get those things fixed?
17:54:40 <dustymabe> i know you were working on it earlier
17:54:53 <dustymabe> we have a release that we will need to do early next week
17:55:16 <maxamillion> puiterwijk: rocking
17:55:27 <sayan> dustymabe: yes, that's the thing I'll do after the meeting
17:55:28 <kushal> For future, I also want to remove the local qcow2 image testing, and then test only on the Fedora Infra Cloud.
17:55:46 <jbrooks> dustymabe, https://bodhi.fedoraproject.org/updates/FEDORA-2017-6ae65d21bd
17:55:55 <maxamillion> sayan: know when the compose id changes? you mean like when a compose is done? or something else?
17:56:06 <jbrooks> We could have current stable kube in it if we test/karma
17:56:28 <sayan> maxamillion: so the compose id used to be Fedora-Docker-* which changed to Fedora_Docker-*
17:56:32 <maxamillion> kushal: why is that? didn't the local testing find a bug recently that wasn't showing up in Fedora Infra Cloud?
17:56:36 <dustymabe> jbrooks: that should be in the updates-testing tree then
17:56:49 <dustymabe> so.. should be pretty easy to get a system with it on there
17:56:50 <jbrooks> Oh, we have that tree now?
17:56:57 <dustymabe> jbrooks: we "should"
17:56:59 <jbrooks> I've been meaning to ask you
17:57:03 <jbrooks> sweet
17:57:08 <maxamillion> sayan: that should all be in fedmsg/datagrepper just like it always has been, if it isn't then please let me know
17:57:57 <sayan> maxamillion: dgilmore changed it to underscore, and would be changing the same for atomic too
17:57:58 <kushal> maxamillion, It did, then we should mention running qcow2 images locally also as an option to people.
17:57:58 <dgilmore> kushal: it does not break 2wa
17:58:04 <kushal> I mean we should market more.
17:58:07 <dgilmore> kushal: its a docker base image only compose
17:58:11 <jbrooks> https://kojipkgs.fedoraproject.org/atomic/25/refs/heads/fedora-atomic/25/x86_64/testing/
17:58:15 <jbrooks> looks like it
17:58:33 <sayan> Fedora-Atomic would become Fedora_Atomic
17:58:52 <maxamillion> sayan: I guess I don't understand the question
17:58:55 <kushal> dgilmore, ^^^
17:58:57 <maxamillion> sayan: what is it that you're trying to find out?
18:00:16 <sayan> maxamillion: the value of the compose id in the fedmsg message changed
18:00:26 <maxamillion> sayan: ok
18:00:38 <sayan> the format changed so autocloud and fedimg started throwing errors
18:00:47 <maxamillion> sayan: why does the format matter?
18:01:01 <jbrooks> we're at the top of the hour, should we adjourn to #fedora-cloud
18:01:13 <maxamillion> +1
18:01:17 <jbrooks> #endmeeting