14:00:44 <bcotton> #startmeeting Docs Project Meeting - Agenda: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Project_meetings
14:00:44 <zodbot_> Meeting started Mon Jun 11 14:00:44 2012 UTC.  The chair is bcotton. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
14:00:44 <zodbot_> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
14:00:51 <bcotton> #meetingname Fedora Docs
14:00:51 <zodbot_> The meeting name has been set to 'fedora_docs'
14:00:57 <bcotton> #topic Roll Call
14:01:21 * shaiton is here
14:01:34 * Sparks is here
14:02:01 <sgordon> >.>
14:02:03 * jjmcd 
14:02:08 * sgordon 
14:04:01 * LoKoMurdoK here
14:04:55 <bcotton> #topic Follow up on last week's action items
14:05:17 <bcotton> Sparks: to follow up to ML about using koji to publish docs.fp.o?
14:05:40 * Sparks needs to file the ticket in the correct slot
14:05:53 <Sparks> I'll do that today and follow up to the list
14:06:15 <bcotton> #action Sparks to file the ticket re: publishing with koji
14:06:29 <bcotton> #action Sparks to follow up to mailing list about using koji to publish docs.fp.o
14:06:38 <bcotton> oh, speaking of which
14:06:42 <bcotton> #topic Using koji to publish docs.fp.o
14:06:48 <Sparks> Oh boy
14:06:49 <bcotton> #info List discussion https://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/docs/2012-May/014324.html
14:07:29 <bcotton> anything new to discuss since last week?
14:07:37 <Sparks> I have nothing new.
14:08:41 <bcotton> okay, well continuing with the "Sparks has things to talk about" theme
14:08:45 <bcotton> #topic Publish man pages
14:08:55 <bcotton> #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=828669
14:08:57 <Sparks> Yeah, I wanted to keep this on the schedule.
14:09:02 <bcotton> #info BZ 828669
14:09:07 * LoKoMurdoK apologizes for not being in past meetings was in the process of moving house
14:09:12 <Sparks> Just as background...
14:09:14 <bcotton> Sparks: the floor is yours
14:09:33 <sgordon> and my axe
14:09:37 <Sparks> The person wanted us to provide an update to a man page website that had Fedora logos plastered all over it.
14:10:08 <Sparks> So that was a problem all onto itself.  I opened a ticket with Fedora Legal and kept going.
14:10:39 <Sparks> But what the person really wanted was a man page website for everything in Fedora.
14:11:03 <Sparks> I'm not against the idea IF it can be automated (i.e. doesn't add to our existing workload).
14:11:21 <sgordon> i would imagine that it can be, but that means there is some infrastructure overhead as well
14:11:31 <sgordon> the other to consider is how much value such a resource actually has
14:11:32 <Sparks> There *are* other sites out there that provide some, if not all, of this information already but it may not be easy to find.
14:11:55 <Sparks> sgordon: Correct.  I'm not sure how much value there is to putting this together.
14:12:13 <bcotton> there's a perl script i foudn that fronts a web server against installed man pages. the difficulty is that if we ran a server it would have to have *every* package installed. also, the licensing is unclear, and i haven't heard back from the author yet
14:12:30 <Sparks> That said, perhaps we should/could start to walk down this path and see where it leads us.
14:12:42 <Sparks> Licensing shouldn't be a problem since the packages are in Fedora.
14:12:50 <Sparks> IMO
14:12:52 <sgordon> licensing of the script i assume
14:12:56 <sgordon> not the packages
14:12:59 <Sparks> Ah
14:13:03 <jjmcd> man to html is no biggie - the problem is making a place with all the man pages
14:13:13 <bcotton> right, licensing of the script in question
14:13:51 <Sparks> So perhaps we can call a vote here just to determine if there is interest in Docs providing a man page website for Fedora.
14:14:16 * jjmcd would like to see it, but concerned about the effort
14:14:35 <sgordon> yeah
14:14:41 <sgordon> i will second what jjmcd said
14:14:49 <Sparks> Okay, if effort was a simple cron job
14:15:10 <jjmcd> A lot of packages seem to have their man pages in separate packages.  I'm constantly looking for man pages it seems
14:15:25 <sgordon> probably some initial effort styling up a container page for it all
14:15:46 <jjmcd> I don't think the problem is putting them up on the web.  That's a no brainer.  It is identifying all of them
14:15:49 <lnovich> as the content may change, maybe just a list of links?
14:15:51 <sgordon> what is the easiest way to identify all packages providing a man page?
14:15:57 <sgordon> yeah
14:16:08 * pkovar is late
14:16:20 <lnovich> you don't want to spend time maintaining fluid content that is not yours
14:16:23 <sgordon> how often would we want it to update also?
14:16:25 <sgordon> all the time
14:16:29 <sgordon> or just for each major release
14:16:39 <jjmcd> And I suspect not all of them have their build directories organized in the same way, so it would require some smarts if reading RPMs
14:16:43 <Sparks> Perhaps we could have the script update when the package updates
14:16:51 <sgordon> i can almost guaruntee that jjmcd
14:17:01 <sgordon> just on the handful i build let alone any others
14:17:08 <jjmcd> yep
14:17:34 <sgordon> not all necessarily have the man page output in the source tree either
14:17:43 <sgordon> i have one that builds the man from docbook...
14:17:44 <sgordon> :p
14:18:53 <Sparks> So there seems to be some interest.
14:19:13 <Sparks> Let's take this to the list and perhaps we'll have more information by next week.
14:19:25 * jjmcd would enjoy working on it if he could get dug out from current cybersecurity activities
14:20:06 <bcotton> #agreed publishing a man pages site merits further investigation and discussion
14:21:51 <bcotton> sparks, you want this as another #action for you?
14:21:56 <Sparks> Sure
14:22:10 <bcotton> #action Sparks to take man page website to mailing list
14:22:33 <bcotton> #topic QA recap
14:22:44 <bcotton> i should look at last week's minutes. where did we leave off with this
14:24:02 <bcotton> ah yes, randomuser and i weregoing to come up with a definition of a QA Wrangler who would be more on top of QA than i was :-)
14:24:13 <bcotton> #action bcotton to draft QA Wrangler role description
14:24:27 <bcotton> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_QA_Procedure
14:24:40 <bcotton> anything else about QA, or did we say all that needed to be said last week/
14:25:45 <bcotton> #topic Open Help Conference
14:25:53 <bcotton> #link http://openhelpconference.com
14:26:00 <bcotton> #info Open Help Conference is Aug 11-15 in Cincinnati, OH
14:26:12 <lnovich> Anyone going? speaking?
14:27:14 <jjmcd> Still looking for someone to do a publican presentation
14:27:33 <pkovar> fnadge is going
14:28:05 <pkovar> you can ping him on fedora-docs
14:28:25 <randomuser> me slinks into the back row
14:28:49 <jjmcd> Is fnadge going to do the publican presentation?
14:28:59 <pkovar> jjmcd: not sure
14:29:27 <jjmcd> I was trying to lean on Jaromir to do it, but he doesn't seem so keen on the idea.
14:29:50 <pkovar> jjmcd: AFAIK Jaromir is not going
14:30:09 <pkovar> he's going to fudcon in paris though
14:30:12 <jjmcd> In a pinch, jsmith or myself might do it, but I think it would be better for an actual RedHatter to do it, esp one from Brno or BNE
14:30:57 <pkovar> jjmcd: ok, in that case can you please ping fnadge?
14:31:47 <jjmcd> consider him pinged
14:31:55 <pkovar> cool, thanks
14:33:12 <bcotton> anything else on the OHC?
14:33:38 <bcotton> #topic Outstanding BZ Tickets
14:33:44 <bcotton> #link http://tinyurl.com/lbrq84
14:34:01 <bcotton> So now's a good time to look through the bugs and catch anything from new releases
14:34:11 <bcotton> #info Squashing bugs is a good place for new contributors to start
14:34:54 <shaiton> I haven't opened a ticket for the index.html as I didn't find the right component
14:35:03 <lnovich> bcotton: all BZs assigned to the Virtualization Guide need moving
14:35:05 <shaiton> (index showing F12-F13)
14:36:17 <bcotton> shaiton: maybe homepage
14:36:37 <bcotton> shaiton: that's a component under Fedora Documentation
14:36:46 <bcotton> lnovich: is there a new component to move it to?
14:36:53 <lnovich> not yet
14:37:17 <lnovich> but there is no need to work on something that shouldn't exist at this point
14:37:54 <bcotton> lnovich: okay, well once there's a destination BZ component, we can move them. in the meantime, we don't want to lose track of the bugz
14:38:09 <lnovich> agreed, but maybe a comment should be made on them?
14:39:25 <shaiton> bcotton: thanks, reported.
14:39:26 <lnovich> maybe just assign them all to me and that way i can move them when we're all set?
14:39:45 <bcotton> lnovich: you should be able to do that
14:39:49 <Sparks> bcotton shaiton: homepage is for fp.o.  Just put it under docs-requests
14:40:09 <bcotton> Sparks: thanks for the clarification
14:40:25 <lnovich> ok changed the default and changing all the rest\
14:40:46 <bcotton> anything else about open bugs?
14:42:18 <bcotton> okay
14:42:24 <bcotton> #topic Open Floor Discussion
14:42:34 <pkovar> shaiton: see the fedora-docs channel
14:42:46 <bcotton> #info congratulations to our very own Sparks, one of the newly-elected Board members
14:43:27 <Capesteve> congrats
14:43:39 <Sparks> bcotton: I'll be paying you back for this somehow... when you least expect it.
14:43:46 <shaiton> :)
14:44:15 <shaiton> as you've probably seen, I've computed more stats about docs merge request…
14:44:37 <shaiton> that would be great if by July we could close this (i.e. remove old teams)
14:45:25 <Sparks> Ack!  My inbox is filling up with BZ messages!
14:46:31 <pkovar> shaiton: i'll send an email to the list with some updated info re duplicated teams
14:47:00 <bcotton> shaiton: some instructions would be helpful, too. not all of us are very familiar with how TX works
14:47:42 <jjmcd> bcotton, or even have a clue, for that matter
14:48:03 <bcotton> jjmcd: yeah, i'm in that camp
14:48:36 <shaiton> bcotton: the instructions are on the linked README file :)
14:48:47 <bcotton> shaiton: now i have to *read*?
14:49:18 <shaiton> bcotton: you could also pay me and add me as maitainer, I would probably do it for you
14:49:19 <shaiton> :p
14:49:34 <bcotton> shaiton: i'll have to consider that
14:49:56 <pkovar> bcotton:also see my comment here: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=816765#c1
14:50:31 <bcotton> pkovar: great, thanks
14:50:53 <bcotton> do we have anything else that needs to be discussed in formal meeting, or can we move the party over to #fedora-docs?
14:51:14 <lnovich> do you want me to bug Rudi about this bug
14:54:00 <bcotton> last call
14:54:02 <lnovich> I have a new item - the Virtualization Guide is being re-submitted (shortly I hope) as 5 separate guides within the next few weeks, I have already updated the table and will be adding the rest of the new guides to this table this week
14:54:23 <lnovich> just an FYI for everyone
14:54:41 <bcotton> lnovich: excellent
14:55:23 <lnovich> and if anyone has any issues / questions re: KVM, Libvirt, or Qemu, let me know as I work w/the developers on these projects
14:55:54 <lnovich> that's it!
14:56:17 <bcotton> okay, thanks to everyone for being awesome. see you all next week
14:56:19 <bcotton> #endmeeting