18:00:04 <nirik> #startmeeting Infrastructure (2017-01-05)
18:00:04 <zodbot> Meeting started Thu Jan  5 18:00:04 2017 UTC.  The chair is nirik. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
18:00:04 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
18:00:04 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'infrastructure_(2017-01-05)'
18:00:04 <nirik> #meetingname infrastructure
18:00:04 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'infrastructure'
18:00:04 <nirik> #topic aloha
18:00:04 <nirik> #chair smooge relrod nirik abadger1999 lmacken dgilmore threebean pingou puiterwijk pbrobinson
18:00:04 <zodbot> Current chairs: abadger1999 dgilmore lmacken nirik pbrobinson pingou puiterwijk relrod smooge threebean
18:00:05 <nirik> #topic New folks introductions
18:00:10 <nirik> morning everyone.
18:00:15 <marc84> hi everyone
18:00:19 <nirik> will wait a few minutes for folks to come in.
18:00:25 <puiterwijk> hi
18:00:27 <guido89> good evening
18:00:37 <jcline> .hello
18:00:37 <zodbot> jcline: (hello <an alias, 1 argument>) -- Alias for "hellomynameis $1".
18:00:44 <jcline> .hello jcline
18:00:45 <zodbot> jcline: jcline 'Jeremy Cline' <jeremy@jcline.org>
18:00:54 <doteast> hello everyone
18:01:18 <smooge> hello
18:01:20 * relrod waves
18:02:06 <dgilmore> hi all
18:02:35 <nirik> Alright. Any new folks today that might like to give a short introductiory hello?
18:02:46 <guido89> myself!
18:03:02 <nirik> hey guido89. :)
18:03:25 <guido89> hey everyone, just quick introduction, im based in romania so it's 20:02 here, im willing to contribute with whatever i can, im interested in learning linux administration in general, focusing on apache
18:04:13 <nirik> welcome guido89. :) Do feel free to chime in with questions or comments anytime...
18:04:21 <sayan> .hello sayanchowdhury
18:04:23 <zodbot> sayan: sayanchowdhury 'Sayan Chowdhury' <sayan.chowdhury2012@gmail.com>
18:04:23 <guido89> and packaqing
18:04:23 * pingou late but here
18:04:27 <guido89> thanks nirik!
18:04:39 <nirik> ok, any other new folks?
18:04:39 <bt0> .hello bt0dotninja
18:04:40 <zodbot> bt0: bt0dotninja 'Alberto Rodriguez Sanchez' <hotgalan@gmail.com>
18:05:22 <bt0> Hi everybody, I'm Alberto from Mexico, I love sysadmin stuff
18:05:33 <nirik> hey bt0. Welcome.
18:05:46 <nirik> do also feel free to chime in with questions anytime.
18:05:48 <bt0> Thanks.
18:06:15 <nirik> ok, just a few status / info items:
18:06:19 <nirik> #topic announcements and information
18:06:19 <nirik> #info A pretty quiet and peacefull holiday break was hopefully had by all
18:06:19 <nirik> #info staging wiki is now fedora 25 and has a few issues - kevin
18:06:19 <nirik> #info A few last fedora 23 instances should be gone this week - kevin
18:06:47 <nirik> anything to add or discuss there?
18:06:55 <pingou> how many F23 are left?
18:07:00 <guido89> may i help with that?
18:08:01 <nirik> There's a few qa machines ( tflink is redoing them now ). There's 2 twisted buildbot instances in cloud (they are migrating to the new f25 ones now)
18:08:28 <nirik> there's 2 autocloud-web ones which I can do as soon as sayan says the stg ones look ok.
18:08:38 <nirik> I think thats it
18:09:44 <nirik> so, not much left. ;)
18:10:16 <nirik> #topic meetings
18:10:16 <nirik> #info should we keep using the current meeting process?
18:10:16 <nirik> #info how can we make meetings more fun and informative and interactive?
18:10:21 <nirik> so, meetings. :)
18:10:38 <nirik> we have been using this current process a while, but meetings have been kinda blah of late.
18:10:46 <nirik> what can we do to make them more useful?
18:11:20 <guido89> first meeting for me so i cant comment on this :P
18:11:24 <nirik> Would bringing back the 'learn about' section be something people want? (a part of the meeting where someone teaches about some app or thing?)
18:11:51 <nirik> I was hoping the gobby document would git rid of boring parts, but dunno if it does
18:12:56 <nirik> I'm happy to change times or formats. One thing I wouldn't mind doing it rotating who runs the meeting each week... give everyone a chance to do it
18:13:02 * threebean nods
18:13:25 <threebean> it might be worth changing the time.  it is kind of late in the day for EMEA people.
18:13:29 * bt0 nods too
18:13:40 <threebean> like.. dinner time.
18:13:56 <sayan> an hour before would be good :)
18:13:57 * doteast remembers those days
18:13:59 <nirik> yeah... we could move to 16utc I suppose...
18:14:10 <sayan> It's midnight here
18:14:13 <nirik> 17utc the irc support sig has the room booked (not that they meet often)
18:14:30 <puiterwijk> sayan: an hour before would be in the middle of EMEA dinner time :)
18:14:56 <nirik> do people like the gobby document? what would make that better?
18:14:59 <threebean> I'll go on record saying that I've liked the gobby-driven agenda in the past.
18:15:00 <sayan> puiterwijk: 2-hours then :)
18:15:16 <nirik> ( I am waiting for someone to say etherpad :)
18:15:27 <puiterwijk> nirik: why don't we use etherpad? :)
18:15:28 <pingou> puiterwijk: depends :)
18:15:28 * puiterwijk bites
18:15:29 <threebean> when we first started using it it felt tricky to remember how to access the gobby doc and change it.
18:15:44 <nirik> threebean: yeah, thats my main concern... it needs a special client
18:15:45 <threebean> so, that might be a barrier to entry.
18:15:47 * threebean nods
18:16:00 <nirik> puiterwijk: you want the answer? or I think you know it...
18:16:23 <pingou> etherpad in the cloud :-p
18:16:32 <relrod> if we move an hour earlier, I'll be consistently late this semester (the current time is good for me)
18:16:33 <nirik> but times change, perhaps one of the *pads now is something we could actually package and/or run somehow
18:16:35 <puiterwijk> nirik: I do. I already maintain an etherpad instance, and I don't want another. (I already neglect the one I do have)
18:16:54 <nirik> relrod: how about 2 hours?
18:17:18 <threebean> (is using the mozilla etherpad out of the question?)
18:17:18 <relrod> nirik: that's even worse. I have a class that starts then. :(
18:17:39 <pingou> at 16utc, I'll have to leave at 16:25 (to pick up the little one)
18:17:47 <nirik> threebean: we could, or piratepad, but it seems kinda weird to depend on someone elses infrastructure to have an infrastructure meeting.
18:17:58 <threebean> :p
18:18:00 * threebean is cheap
18:18:03 <puiterwijk> nirik: GNOME etherpad! :P
18:18:06 * puiterwijk begs to please don't
18:18:09 <relrod> hah
18:18:18 <nirik> puiterwijk: what does this one button do here?
18:18:33 <puiterwijk> nirik: I will not fix it if you press that one button
18:18:37 * puiterwijk will refuse to name it
18:19:06 <nirik> I wish gobby just had a web interface. Oh well.
18:19:18 <nirik> anyhow, thats kind of a side track. I can look into the pads again.
18:19:37 <nirik> I guess I'm getting that everyone is ok with the way things are?
18:19:41 <jcline> Personally I wouldn't have a problem using one of the existing etherpads out there
18:19:48 * threebean nods
18:20:11 <sayan> nirik: yes
18:20:53 <nirik> jcline: would you be more happy with that over the gobby?
18:21:17 <nirik> I guess lets keep going the way we are, and entertain specific changes if people ask for them?
18:21:27 <doteast> what poped the question (are the meetings interesting) in the first place?
18:21:28 <jcline> Probably, the special client is annoying. Having a browser-based solution is much easier to jump into.
18:22:04 <puiterwijk> I quite like having things self-hosted in the infra. So if anyone is willing to package and then maintain a pad, we could switch is what I'd say
18:22:59 <puiterwijk> Anyway, maybe let's move on?
18:23:21 <jcline> Okay.
18:23:33 <nirik> yeah. Last I looked (years ago) the pads were bad to package... but that might have changed... also the new bundling rules might make it more possible
18:23:43 <pingou> nirik: and the cloud
18:23:53 <threebean> _the cloud_
18:23:56 <pingou> maybe a simple ansible playbook rather than a rpm could help
18:24:13 <nirik> pingou: yeah. may be possible to make a less supported instance there that still works for non critical stuff... but then people will start using it for... everything
18:24:26 <nirik> 🌦
18:24:32 <nirik> #topic 2017 short term plans
18:24:32 <nirik> #info what do we want to try and get done in the next 2 months
18:24:32 <nirik> #info end of feb is Red Hat's end of Fiscal year
18:24:33 <threebean> fwiw, taiga has fallen into that category.  people are.. using it.
18:24:41 <relrod> yeah, not sure we want this in the cloud (looking at the gobby docs, other groups sometimes use it too)
18:24:41 <nirik> threebean: yeah.
18:24:49 <puiterwijk> threebean: and you are the responsible person
18:24:56 <threebean> yes.
18:25:17 <nirik> ok, anyone have some short term (before end of feb) plans they want to mention?
18:25:35 <pingou> there is still hope to push FAS3 forward
18:25:41 <pingou> but no ETA yet
18:25:43 <relrod> switching to modernpaste :) I want this done and off my plate :P
18:25:53 <puiterwijk> I want to get sigul and signing stuff over to full krb, and get Ipsilon 2.2 out and in prod
18:25:53 <pingou> we updated the version in stg today: https://admin.stg.fedoraproject.org/fas3/
18:25:56 <nirik> pingou: yeah, where are we? or are we not sure?
18:26:29 <pingou> nirik: it needs some work on: fas <-> ipsilon, fas <-> oidc and fas <-> kerberos
18:26:30 <nirik> wow... we have 90k user accounts now... (sadly many spam)
18:26:39 <pingou> nirik: many many :(
18:27:05 * puiterwijk likes how it says "some work on". I think that's quite a bit of work
18:27:09 <puiterwijk> But I guess we'll see
18:27:20 <nirik> I wonder if moving to fas3 we could drop/clean up some.
18:27:56 <puiterwijk> nirik: except that there might still be spam content around and we wouldn't have an idea if it was spam user before if a new user registers
18:28:20 <nirik> yeah.
18:28:33 <puiterwijk> Especially since they might log in to other sites with Fedora OpenID
18:28:45 <nirik> could we nuke all accounts that never signed the cla? or did we/do we have places where they still could have done something?
18:29:00 <pingou> fedorahosted didn't require CLA
18:29:02 <puiterwijk> they could've used OpenID to login to another site
18:29:06 <pingou> so we would have to wait for this
18:29:09 <puiterwijk> Pagure doesn't require CLA
18:29:14 <pingou> puiterwijk: yes it does
18:29:14 <puiterwijk> Oh, sorry, it does
18:29:24 <puiterwijk> pingou: yeah, sorry, just realized it when I hit enter
18:29:27 <pingou> :)
18:30:42 <pingou> fedorahosted is the only one I can think of (in our infra)
18:31:09 <nirik> ok, just a thought
18:31:26 <pingou> do note that I'd love to get ride of them
18:31:33 <threebean> I haven't filed the RFR yet, but I hope to deploy the module build service to staging before the end of january and to prod by the end of february.
18:31:37 <threebean> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/ModuleBuildService
18:31:37 <nirik> puiterwijk: do we have logs of every openid use?
18:31:53 <nirik> if so, we could make a script?
18:31:57 <puiterwijk> nirik: we do, but not in an easily parseable way I think.
18:31:57 <pingou> maybe we could start by hiding them by default in the UI
18:32:02 <puiterwijk> But I can check
18:32:41 <nirik> ie, 'get username, check for cla_done, check for inactive/spamcheck_denied,  check if they ever used openid, if no, delete'
18:32:49 <puiterwijk> right. I got what you meant
18:32:53 <puiterwijk> I'll see what I can do
18:33:01 <pingou> cool :)
18:33:14 <nirik> threebean: cool. I'm interested to see how well it works. :)
18:33:25 <threebean> heh, me too :p
18:33:44 <pingou> suspens :)
18:33:55 <threebean> note that as discussed with fesco, we'll keep access locked down to only a few packagers during the f26 dev cycle and will open it up to everyone else in the f27 timeframe.
18:34:06 <nirik> for my part I mentioned on the list: get fedorahosted ready for sunset, mirrorlist containers, db-replication, and get s390 in main koji.
18:34:59 <nirik> ok, any other short term stuff we have pending?
18:35:45 <nirik> #topic 2017 longer term plans
18:35:45 <nirik> #info not too soon to think about longer term plans for the coming year
18:35:45 <nirik> #info Any big application changes?
18:36:01 <dgilmore> I hope we will have some koji changes soon
18:36:05 <nirik> so, how about longer term plans? We don't need to decide any of these, but would be good to start thinking
18:36:14 <nirik> dgilmore: oh? what kind?
18:36:52 <dgilmore> nirik: main one is the ability to allow tasks to complete when some arches fail for non rpm builds
18:37:07 <nirik> I thought that already landed?
18:37:07 <dgilmore> so we can tell koji make the lives but its okay if i686 fails
18:37:10 <nirik> oh, non rpms
18:37:12 <dgilmore> nope :(
18:37:22 <nirik> gotit
18:37:38 <dgilmore> the rpm support that did land still fails the overall task
18:38:09 <nirik> I wonder if it would be easier to split things and do each arch as a seperate job... but whatever
18:38:20 <dgilmore> there was a few other minor things I can not remeber right now
18:38:20 <threebean> pingou: for the f27 timeframe, we're going to need to figure out how rpm branches change in pkgdb like we talked about at Flock.
18:38:36 <dgilmore> hopefully we will also get arm disk images with livemedia-creator
18:38:44 <pingou> threebean: planning to seat down w/ you at devconf to talk about this if you have the time :)
18:38:58 <nirik> dgilmore: great!
18:39:40 <smooge> 80% of the accounts are spam.
18:39:47 <threebean> +1
18:39:54 <smooge> oh shoot the hexchat scrolled up a while ago.
18:39:55 <threebean> pingou: me too :)
18:40:02 <pingou> threebean: awesome
18:40:16 <nirik> for my big dreams this year I also posted to the list a few things... if we can give some love to askbot, doing a FAD if we can figure out what would be a good topic, more apprentice work days...
18:40:18 <dgilmore> 80% of smooge is spam :D
18:40:37 * threebean nods
18:40:50 <smooge> with pineapple
18:40:57 <nirik> I'd also love to get our cloud updated and using HA and allowing users to do their own stuff. (happy to work with puiterwijk on all that)
18:40:59 <threebean> a bodhi fad for containers and modules could be good once we know a bit better what we want to do there.
18:42:11 <pingou> modularity will likely bring a fad topic
18:42:20 * threebean nods
18:42:21 <nirik> some gating on rawhide would be nice to get done this year (but thats not really an infrastructure thing)
18:42:53 <threebean> heh, the line is blurry for me.
18:43:30 <nirik> yeah, always some overlap of things.
18:44:11 <sayan> nirik: are we planning to add features to askbot upstream?
18:44:50 <smooge> sayan are you going to do the work? :)
18:45:02 <nirik> sayan: well, perhaps... but mostly get it running on rhel7 and django 1.8 and the latest version. Currently it's on rhel6, old django thats not supported anymore and is an ancient version of askbot
18:45:30 <nirik> which also means getting it running on python3.
18:45:49 <sayan> smooge: I worked on it 4 years back :) one of the PR from that period closed 8 days back
18:46:21 <nirik> if someone who is more python savvy than me wants to take that on, that would be lovely. I don't know if it's even possible tho
18:47:03 <nirik> https://github.com/ASKBOT/askbot-devel/issues/186
18:47:57 <nirik> anyhow, any more dreams or ideas for longer term stuff?
18:48:03 <pingou> sayan: great so if we want to work on it this year it'll be ready for Fedora 33?
18:48:08 <pingou> :D
18:48:30 <nirik> oh, I did have another one I will probibly work on: move all the staging hosts to a subnet... so we can just block that subnet and not have to block each ip
18:48:56 <sayan> pingou: :p
18:49:14 <nirik> #topic Apprentice Open office hours
18:49:25 <nirik> any apprentices with questions or comments or looking for things to do?
18:49:31 <pingou> nirik: would that still allow communication b/w some of the hosts sometime?
18:49:50 <nirik> pingou: sure. we could still have the staging friendly stuff.
18:49:52 <pingou> ok
18:49:58 <pingou> cool then :)
18:50:11 <guido89> yes, me, where can i find more info about the infrastructure, and, can someone tell me exactly how to get started? (maybe based on experience, etc), for example, i see an easyfix ticket, but.. how do i get accesses to fix it, etc etc etc?
18:50:11 <nirik> it just means we don't have to change iptables on all prod hosts everytime we add a staging host.
18:50:23 <guido89> sorry if it's a very n00b question
18:50:59 <nirik> if you see an easyfix ticket you want to work on, usually you would just comment on it that you want to work on it... then gather info or whatever you need and propose a patch to fix it (attached to the ticket)
18:51:49 <nirik> you can ask questions of the ticket filer and/or #fedora-admin or the list. :)
18:52:01 <guido89> cool
18:52:10 <guido89> thanks :)
18:53:34 <nirik> #topic Open Floor
18:53:40 <nirik> anyone have anything for open floor?
18:55:51 <nirik> ok, will close out in a minute if nothing else.
18:55:59 <smooge> not from me. I can give stats on various accounts
18:56:11 <smooge> and will work with puiterwijk on that
18:56:21 <smooge> beyond that close it
18:56:26 <smooge> say goodnight gracie
18:56:28 <nirik> it would definitely be nice to clean them up... but we can only do what we can do
18:56:33 <nirik> #endmeeting