17:00:31 <EvilBob> #startmeeting
17:00:31 <zodbot> Meeting started Thu Jun 16 17:00:31 2011 UTC.  The chair is EvilBob. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
17:00:31 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
17:00:31 <EvilBob> #meetingname irc-support-sig
17:00:31 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'irc-support-sig'
17:00:31 <EvilBob> #meetingtopic IRC Support SIG Meeting
17:00:31 <EvilBob> Feel free to bring up additional topics in the "Open Floor" section of the meeting.
17:00:36 <EvilBob> Feel free to bring up additional topics in the "Open Floor" section of the meeting.
17:00:54 * thomasj here
17:00:59 <EvilBob> Will get started here in about 5mins
17:01:00 * Southern_Gentlem 
17:01:06 * jayson_r 
17:01:09 * N3LRX 
17:01:19 * nirik 
17:01:42 <EvilBob> This is always the longest 5 minutes ever
17:01:52 * zcat ☕
17:02:31 * Nushio 
17:02:50 * DiscordianUK is here
17:03:30 * mock is vaguely here
17:03:32 <EvilBob> #topic Week in Review
17:03:32 <EvilBob> #link http://fedora.theglaserfamily.org/ircstats/fedora-weekly.html
17:03:54 <nirik> busy week, lots of f15 folks again.
17:04:42 <EvilBob> Looks like 5 kicks
17:04:52 <EvilBob> Not sure the reasons
17:05:30 <EvilBob> Some how DrM got to the top of the list, was it all bad advice, noise or asking questions?
17:06:00 <nirik> I'm not sure the stats are updating correctly. I glanced at it this morning eariler and it looks exactly the same...
17:06:03 <zcat> Would've been 6 kicks, but fedbot ignored me for 5 mins before i could identify
17:06:09 <DiscordianUK> A lot of it was grumblings but he did help some folks
17:06:30 <EvilBob> I know some of it was breaking users systems and then trying to fix them after the fact
17:06:32 <nirik> he helped some folks out. Some of it was unrelated information messages...
17:06:59 <mbouffard> howdy
17:07:09 <EvilBob> two hours trying to get nvidia drivers on and off a machine with intel graphics
17:07:21 * thomasj chuckles
17:07:23 <EvilBob> I'm still not sure what that was about
17:07:48 * nirik welcomes anyone who wishes to help others and learn how best to do so.
17:07:53 <EvilBob> We need to try and watch for these things, help those that need help and teach those that try.
17:08:01 <nirik> we all make mistakes, thats why peer review is very important.
17:08:07 * nirik nods.
17:08:17 <EvilBob> OK anything else for the week?
17:08:26 <bodhi_zazen> nirik: and others - thanks for the welcome
17:08:42 <EvilBob> #topic Feedback Tickets
17:08:42 <EvilBob> #link https://fedorahosted.org/irc-support-sig/report/1
17:08:42 <EvilBob> Three tickets open this week.
17:08:43 <nirik> bodhi_zazen: thanks for spending so much time helping out. ;)
17:08:54 <bodhi_zazen> I am new to the fedora community, and am on a bit of a learning curve, but will help if I can
17:08:58 <EvilBob> #link https://fedorahosted.org/irc-support-sig/ticket/56
17:09:07 <mbouffard> expert - someone who has made every mistake in his field
17:09:24 <EvilBob> is still open, we were going to discuss it on list and no one cared enough to bring it up that I saw.
17:09:26 <nirik> I made some proposed changes to the faq.
17:09:35 <nirik> https://fedoraproject.org/w/index.php?title=Fedora_Channel_FAQ&action=historysubmit&diff=241755&oldid=197555
17:09:58 <nirik> what do folks think? I added a note about the short lines/incomplete thoughts and removed a section that seemed redundent.
17:10:01 <bodhi_zazen> fenrus02: and Southern_Gentlem have both been quite helpful =)
17:11:04 <Flare183> bodhi_zazen: >.> oi I see you've dropped out of the evil group as well? :x
17:11:29 <thomasj> I wasn't able to file a new ticket (as discussed last week), based on #56 this week. Too busy. Will try this weekend.
17:11:29 <nirik> If those changes look ok, I can add that to the ticket and see if that meets needs?
17:11:32 <EvilBob> nirik: Added a link to that in the ticket
17:11:42 <nirik> EvilBob: one step ahead, thanks.
17:11:59 <bodhi_zazen> Flare183: =)
17:12:00 <EvilBob> We will keep it open at least another week
17:12:14 <Flare183> bodhi_zazen: I dropped out of it due to that bar
17:12:18 <Flare183> and you know what I'm talking about >.<
17:12:21 <EvilBob> bodhi_zazen Flare183 Can we stick to the topics at hand please
17:12:25 <Flare183> mhm
17:12:34 <EvilBob> It is a meeting afterall
17:12:37 * dcr226 late
17:12:39 <nirik> EvilBob: +1 on another week
17:13:01 <EvilBob> Flare183 bodhi_zazen Can we move on?
17:13:07 <Flare183> EvilBob: go for it.
17:13:26 <EvilBob> #link https://fedorahosted.org/irc-support-sig/ticket/59
17:14:22 <Southern_Gentlem> bodhi_zazen, thank you for the report
17:14:24 <EvilBob> bodhi_zazen: this is your ticket, anything to add or questions on my comments?
17:15:00 <bodhi_zazen> Nothing to add
17:15:06 <EvilBob> bodhi_zazen: Thanks again for submitting it.
17:15:14 <mbouffard> gnome trolling is annoying indeed
17:15:31 <mbouffard> go up to first subject for an offender ><
17:15:44 <bodhi_zazen> My experience has been mostly positive and the trolling has lessened, sorry if I contributed to it
17:15:47 * nirik suggests using http://freenode.net/catalysts.shtml skills to redirect/get folks to move on from ranting about gnome3.
17:15:47 <EvilBob> #link https://fedorahosted.org/irc-support-sig/ticket/60
17:16:20 <nirik> kudos fenrus02
17:16:22 <EvilBob> "Just wanted to give kudos to fenrus02. Very knowledgeable and willing to help "
17:16:28 <mbouffard> I try to flood with advice on how to use gnome shell effectively when I see it but i havent been around much lately
17:16:30 <dcr226> fenrus02++
17:16:33 <EvilBob> WTG fenrus02
17:16:50 <EvilBob> I know fenrus02 is busy at $DAYJOB today.
17:17:12 <dcr226> s/busy/slacking off drinking free coffee....but yeah
17:17:16 <Southern_Gentlem> mbouffard, better yet work with bodi with the page on fedorasolved.org
17:17:18 <EvilBob> OK nothing else for tickets
17:17:33 <Southern_Gentlem> that way we all can link to them
17:17:56 <EvilBob> #topic Open Floor
17:17:56 <EvilBob> Does anyone have anything to add?
17:17:56 <bodhi_zazen> mbouffard: FYI : http://fedorasolved.org/Members/bookwar/gnome-3-tips
17:18:17 <mbouffard> gotcha. unfortunatly it has alot to do with learning new ways ;P
17:18:27 <EvilBob> I am also working on a gnome3 gnome shell page on FEdoraSolved.org
17:18:40 <dcr226> were we not going to have a grub-multi howto and a migrant cheat-sheet?
17:18:43 <EvilBob> it will probably end up on the wiki
17:18:49 <jayson_r> just wanted to say - i'm just getting involved in the community, and hi
17:18:59 <DiscordianUK> I will do the multi-grub one
17:19:01 <jayson_r> will be around the IRC channel - i idle 24/7, i'll answer when i can
17:19:04 <Southern_Gentlem> As of Tuesday I have submitted my resignation as a #fedora op
17:19:13 <dcr226> ah, yeah it was DiscordianUK ....can't remember who the other was
17:19:36 <DiscordianUK> when I get my own DSL back next week
17:19:59 <dcr226> DiscordianUK, neighbors using wep?
17:20:02 <dcr226> (kidding)
17:20:05 <dcr226> ;-)
17:20:17 <nirik> Southern_Gentlem: I do wish you would reconsider... but it's your choice of course.
17:20:18 <bodhi_zazen> I am willing to assist with documentation if anyone wishes to collaborate of if there is a need for a page / topic
17:20:20 <DiscordianUK> Nah at a friends till Monday
17:20:45 <dcr226> Southern_Gentlem, I (as you already know) agree with nirik
17:20:45 <totem> Southern_Gentlem: please no
17:20:46 <EvilBob> Yeah Southern_Gentlem quit #fedora as an op, butted heads with a user.
17:21:13 <Southern_Gentlem> nirik,  i am the second longest serving op in the channel, I am burned out and i am tired of the  BS
17:21:16 <EvilBob> Seemed like a bad day sort of thing, people need to learn to relax a little
17:21:22 <zcat> Southern_Gentlem, why not just cut your involvement back a bit this summer, instead of leaving?
17:21:29 <nirik> Southern_Gentlem: well, take a break...
17:21:32 <Southern_Gentlem> comments like EvilBob  just stated help make up my mind
17:21:49 <EvilBob> Yup, it's my fault
17:22:05 <EvilBob> BLame me, everyone else does. I can take it
17:22:15 * zcat blames canada
17:22:20 <dcr226> EvilBob, hey...I blame flash
17:22:21 <nirik> lets go back on topic?
17:22:32 <Southern_Gentlem> EvilBob,  there are times you just need STFU
17:22:33 <drmbouffard> I prescribe 12 months vacation, use PRN
17:23:00 <Southern_Gentlem> so i am stepping down as #fedora op
17:23:08 <EvilBob> Southern_Gentlem: And there are times you need to not act like a 2 year old, I hope after a break you can come back.
17:23:16 <Southern_Gentlem> in the future who knows i may want to be an op again
17:23:50 <Southern_Gentlem> i have been an op in #fedora for about 6 years so its time for a break
17:24:10 <zcat> Southern_Gentlem, didn't we agree that op accounts aren't cleaned out unless inactive for more than a year?
17:24:10 <nirik> Southern_Gentlem: good luck and I hope you will still help out.
17:24:51 <Southern_Gentlem> zcat i can be the exception to the rule and be removed as requested
17:25:36 <EvilBob> Anything else for open floor?
17:26:17 <mbouffard> yup
17:26:23 <EvilBob> mbouffard: Bring it
17:27:02 <mbouffard> when there's a big mouth in #fedora flooding the channel about rolling back to F14 to avoid gnome shell (instead of using alternatives, or you know, saying something intelligent), I feel an ur
17:27:07 <mbouffard> urge for my fist to meet their face
17:27:14 <mbouffard> it's completely useless
17:27:32 <EvilBob> mbouffard: this is discussed in ticket #59
17:27:48 <mbouffard> that's my emphasis
17:27:51 <mbouffard> EOF
17:28:08 <EvilBob> https://fedorahosted.org/irc-support-sig/ticket/59
17:28:37 <Southern_Gentlem> mbouffard,  i am also one of the people who suggest it to people as well as suggest using another DE how is this a bad thing?
17:28:49 <dcr226> mbouffard, I've got a blog article about that you might find interesting
17:28:51 <dcr226> momento
17:28:53 <mbouffard> to try other DEs is not a bad thing
17:29:13 <dcr226> mbouffard, http://dcr226.co.uk/blog/?p=79
17:29:14 <mbouffard> I'm talking about the "oh don't even try it, it sucks, go back to gnome 2" type
17:29:20 <Southern_Gentlem> mbouffard,  some people hate gnome 3 and want gnome 2
17:29:55 <dcr226> mbouffard, fwiw, you can't change people's opinion, just try to avoid it flaming in the channel :-)
17:29:56 <mbouffard> if they want it they know how to get it, if someone installed F15 and comes inquiring about gnome shell, well you know how it goes, you all are there too
17:30:12 <Southern_Gentlem> i try to keep people on f15 but if they really want gnome 2 point them at a supported release
17:30:14 <mbouffard> nothing wrong with pointing how to get G2 back
17:30:30 <mbouffard> maybe I'm not making myself clear here :P
17:31:42 <mbouffard> flaming gnome shell, or advising a new user of it (say <10 minutes) with that bias on their mind. etc
17:32:27 <Southern_Gentlem> mbouffard,  i really have not seen that
17:32:56 <mbouffard> it was more prominent 1-2 weeks ago. haven't been here this week
17:33:46 <EvilBob> SO we try to calm users who are hot
17:33:52 <mbouffard> yeah
17:34:06 <EvilBob> keep them from disrupting the channel with anti-<DE> hate
17:34:15 <EvilBob> just like we would anything else disruptive
17:34:36 <EvilBob> again, nirik catalyst link?
17:34:38 <EvilBob> ;)
17:35:01 <nirik> http://freenode.net/catalysts.shtml
17:35:20 <EvilBob> OK Anything else?
17:35:38 <dcr226> we should add that link to the bot
17:35:57 <dcr226> with a helpful message to helpers/ops that are getting frustrated maybe
17:37:32 <EvilBob> OK Anything else?
17:37:35 <mbouffard> I give em the shortcuts I use to get around the DE, i think it made a few 'converts', not everyone is going to like it but it's gnome, it's where it's going and it's worth giving a shot and seeing where it goes
17:38:03 <mbouffard> ctrl d
17:39:07 <EvilBob> #endmeeting