14:01:06 <spotz> #startmeeting RDO meeting - 2021-03-24
14:01:06 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Mar 24 14:01:06 2021 UTC.
14:01:06 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
14:01:06 <zodbot> The chair is spotz. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
14:01:06 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
14:01:06 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'rdo_meeting_-_2021-03-24'
14:01:07 <openstack> Meeting started Wed Mar 24 14:01:06 2021 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is spotz. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
14:01:08 <openstack> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
14:01:10 <openstack> The meeting name has been set to 'rdo_meeting___2021_03_24'
14:01:14 <spotz> #topic ROll Call
14:02:32 <rh-jelabarre> don't think anyone's here...   <g>
14:02:47 <jcapitao> o/
14:03:36 <spotz> #chair jcapitao rh-jelabarre
14:03:36 <zodbot> Current chairs: jcapitao rh-jelabarre spotz
14:03:37 <openstack> Current chairs: jcapitao rh-jelabarre spotz
14:03:39 <spotz> :)
14:03:55 <spotz> I think amoralej|lunch is the yellow on the agenda
14:04:08 <spotz> So we'll give folks a few
14:04:27 <jcapitao> spotz: I put the yellow
14:06:00 <spotz> Ahh so maybe we're good to start and others can join
14:06:26 <spotz> #topic Wallaby Release Preparation
14:07:34 <jcapitao> #link https://trello.com/c/zWyGr6C8/755-wallaby-release-preparation
14:07:44 <jcapitao> so we are currently building core RC1 projects
14:08:00 <jcapitao> #link https://review.rdoproject.org/r/#/q/topic:wallaby-branching
14:09:07 <jcapitao> we're tracking upstream https://review.opendev.org/q/topic:wallaby-rc1-deadline+(status:open+OR+status:merged)
14:10:11 <spotz> Any feedback on effects from Stream?
14:10:15 <jcapitao> also, projects synchronisation from RDO to Fedora is done
14:10:27 <ykarel_> o/
14:10:45 <spotz> #chair ykarel_
14:10:45 <zodbot> Current chairs: jcapitao rh-jelabarre spotz ykarel_
14:10:46 <openstack> Current chairs: jcapitao rh-jelabarre spotz ykarel_
14:11:09 <jcapitao> currently, everything is fine wrt CS8
14:11:38 <spotz> Nice! As I'm not sure how many projects upstream from us arre testing against it
14:12:21 <amoralej> o/
14:12:38 <spotz> #chair amoralej
14:12:38 <zodbot> Current chairs: amoralej jcapitao rh-jelabarre spotz ykarel_
14:12:38 <jcapitao> Xena CloudSIG tags are created
14:12:39 <openstack> Current chairs: amoralej jcapitao rh-jelabarre spotz ykarel_
14:12:48 <jcapitao> #link https://cbs.centos.org/koji/taginfo?tagID=2274
14:13:18 <spotz> And in time for tomorrow's Clouod SiG meeting:)
14:13:39 <spotz> ykarel and amoralej - we just finished jcapitao's items from the agenda
14:13:54 <jcapitao> worth to mention that we'll use nfv8s builds
14:14:04 <jcapitao> worth to mention that we'll use nfv8s builds
14:14:15 <spotz> Any concerns?
14:14:33 <amoralej> ack
14:16:13 <jcapitao> it'll be better as we'll use effort from another SIG
14:16:32 <spotz> Better is always good:)
14:16:58 <spotz> My scroll is going fast but I think I jusy saw Cinder will be RC-1 tomorrow
14:17:40 <spotz> jcapitao: You have anything else on the release prep?
14:17:53 <amoralej> https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/releases/+/781640
14:17:56 <amoralej> that's cinder
14:18:23 <jcapitao> I think all missing RC1s will be released by friday
14:18:41 <jcapitao> spotz: I think that's all
14:19:01 <ykarel> yes friday is deadline for those
14:19:36 <spotz> hang on cap lock
14:19:48 <spotz> So our plan is to pull them all together on Monday?
14:21:29 <amoralej> for validation with packstack and p-o-i we'll need at least puppet modules too
14:22:00 <spotz> amoralej: Ok so figure we'll trail behind 2+ weeks to be safe?
14:22:24 <amoralej> yep, we also need to wait for tripleo
14:22:42 <amoralej> but if we can do a push with rc1 that passes packstack and p-o-i would be good
14:22:43 <spotz> Doh forgot tripleo:)
14:23:03 <spotz> Was just trying to get a timeline in my head:)
14:23:18 <spotz> Ok anyone have anything else on the release?
14:24:13 <amoralej> i think that's it
14:24:20 <amoralej> one more
14:24:27 <amoralej> wrt pinning non-opentack puppet modules
14:24:42 <amoralej> ykarel, is there any blocker on promotion in master?
14:24:51 <amoralej> last promotion is one week old
14:25:46 <ykarel> amoralej, recent one is the swift one,
14:25:57 <ykarel> apart from that i think it's good currently
14:26:30 <spotz> The one from the mailing list?
14:27:01 <ykarel> also tripleo component promotion is from yesterday
14:27:16 <ykarel> https://trunk.rdoproject.org/centos8-master/component/tripleo/promoted-components/
14:27:55 <amoralej> spotz, yep, that one
14:28:02 <spotz> Just confirming:)
14:28:23 <amoralej> ykarel, so we may pin to the versions in tripleo component promotion
14:28:26 <amoralej> let's do that
14:28:38 <ykarel> okk +1
14:29:02 <jcapitao> ok
14:29:11 <spotz> ykarel: Do we need to add a topic or discuss in Open Discussion the talk we had on the TC channel on Friday or have you already talked with folks about it?
14:29:53 <ykarel> spotz, no not talked with anyone, so can start here so all have context
14:30:22 <spotz> #topic Interim Releases of other projects and affect on RDO
14:30:29 <spotz> I think it's topic worthy
14:32:14 <ykarel> spotz, you breifing or shall i do?
14:32:20 <spotz> So last Friday while I was skimming channels there was a discussion on the TC channel about Ironic and the fact they do interim releases. The question was do we make those available and what would happen if there was 1 release and interim releases throough the year
14:32:29 <spotz> I think that was the gist:)
14:32:52 <spotz> ykarel was the only one still online and he was nice enough to delay loogging out to join the discussions
14:32:54 <ykarel> yes ^ was it
14:33:45 <spotz> It was a great discussion for me to better understand our releases for sure:)
14:34:07 <ykarel> #link http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/irclogs/%23openstack-tc/%23openstack-tc.2021-03-19.log.html#t2021-03-19T13:34:45
14:34:46 <amoralej> so the topic is to change release cadence
14:34:50 <amoralej> right?
14:34:58 <amoralej> with option to do interim releases
14:35:32 <spotz> That's what I was getting out of it.
14:35:45 <ykarel> amoralej, yes for projects which don't follow rc model
14:36:12 <amoralej> so, do a yearly coordinated release
14:36:13 <ykarel> like ironic which do interim releases, what it means for RDO
14:36:28 <spotz> Or if that became a new overall model I think
14:37:08 <amoralej> i like the idea of increasing cadence
14:37:10 <amoralej> tbh
14:37:22 <amoralej> i think we are not longer in the high speed phase
14:37:34 <amoralej> but this has been discussed several times
14:37:41 <amoralej> and most people pushed for stay
14:37:48 <amoralej> it could be discussed once more
14:37:58 <amoralej> the problem with interim
14:38:11 <amoralej> is coinstallability and requirements
14:38:16 <spotz> let's ping apevac if he's about to join:)
14:38:24 <amoralej> the problem is
14:38:37 <amoralej> let's say we start xena cycle
14:38:53 <spotz> amoralej Yeah it's kind of similar to the questions I was asking a few months ago in regards to having repeatable builds in the gap between releases
14:38:59 <amoralej> and 4 months later ironic pushes a new nerelase
14:39:30 <amoralej> if that ironic release *requires* a version of oslo-* which is a xena release
14:39:34 <amoralej> that may be a problem
14:39:47 <amoralej> to be deployed with wallaby
14:40:18 <amoralej> the whole point of coordinated releases is about consistent dependencies and libraries
14:40:39 <amoralej> that's what ensures coninstallability
14:40:48 <spotz> Would the new way of doing requirements help with that? I think that was no more max only a min but I might be backwards
14:40:49 <amoralej> coinstallability
14:42:35 <ykarel> amoralej, but that release will be for xena only, not for wallaby
14:42:44 <amoralej> but then
14:42:50 <amoralej> it's exactly the same
14:42:52 <amoralej> i mean
14:43:05 <amoralej> iiuc, the proposal is
14:43:11 <spotz> But the Ironic code would be newer possibly with fixes
14:43:17 <amoralej> exactly
14:43:26 <amoralej> so, move coordinate to yearly
14:43:33 <spotz> So we shouldn't hit requeirements issues in theory
14:43:35 <amoralej> with the option of using intermediate
14:43:40 <amoralej> before next coordinated
14:44:01 <spotz> So... (typing please hold):)
14:45:05 <spotz> We have the main yearly offical OpenStack release and then maybe we do quarterly 'RDO official' releases with the interim releases of projects which eitther we get an official release schedule from TC or make and share on our own
14:45:23 <spotz> Or bu-yearly whatever OpenStack iis doing
14:47:08 <spotz> Is that plan potentially doable? spotz being naive? Add your own here:)
14:47:44 <amoralej> spotz, that may be possible
14:47:48 <amoralej> but
14:48:06 * amoralej thinks
14:48:29 <amoralej> then, what's the point of stable branches on those projects?
14:48:58 <amoralej> if a version which is released in master branch is intended to work with last stable
14:49:11 <amoralej> then, it should be tested
14:49:34 <spotz> Definitely tested!
14:50:02 <amoralej> but tested with both master and last stable, i mean
14:50:30 <spotz> I think the idea is to accomidate projects that want to move fasteer but adding stability with a possible longer main release cycle. But don't hold me to it
14:50:51 <amoralej> yes, that's also my understanding
14:50:54 <ykarel> #link https://releases.openstack.org/reference/release_models.html#cycle-with-rc
14:50:58 <amoralej> and makes sense
14:51:10 <ykarel> #link https://releases.openstack.org/reference/release_models.html#cycle-with-intermediary
14:51:27 <spotz> Currently I know our testing is for master in zuul, so what would need to be added is past release testing. ooh link:)
14:51:36 <ykarel> ironic is following cycle with intermediary
14:51:57 <amoralej> yes, but we don't ship intermediary until next coordinated
14:51:58 <spotz> No mention of testing in there:(
14:52:04 <spotz> And we're at 10 minutes FYI
14:52:17 <ykarel> yeap right that's what i answered to tc question
14:52:29 <amoralej> so, from RDO point of view
14:52:30 <ykarel> wrt changing release cadence that's a different topic,
14:52:37 <amoralej> that intermediary is not shipped
14:52:52 <amoralej> in stable branches we follow releases in stable branches
14:53:02 <amoralej> but intermediary is created from master branch
14:53:29 <amoralej> my understanding is that the whole point is about deliverying intermediary *with* the last stable release
14:53:47 <amoralej> as a whay to provide fast line to fast projects
14:54:26 <amoralej> in fact, i'd say that should be not a problem but i'd ask those projects to test their upstream branches against both master and last stable
14:54:35 <amoralej> i.e.
14:55:04 <amoralej> ironic may test ironic from master on top of master *and* on top of wallaby deployments
14:55:34 <amoralej> then, we are sure we can ship intermediary release in ironic with wallaby
14:55:37 <amoralej> makes it sense?
14:56:02 <ykarel> yes looks fine
14:56:04 <spotz> Yep and totally fair for us to ask and have the discussions BEFORE we can make a decision
14:56:33 <jcapitao> yes makes sense
14:57:32 <spotz> We have 4 minutes left, do we want to maybe have another meeting or discuss more next week? Maybe invite some guests like fungi, Ironic and other intermediary release projects?
14:58:02 <spotz> While we decide on that who wants to chair next week?:)
14:58:11 <amoralej> it'd be good to start discussion in ML
14:58:22 <amoralej> if they think in proposing that change
14:58:33 <amoralej> i guess they will
14:58:41 <spotz> Anyone want to take that action item?
14:58:51 <spotz> amoralej: ML, chair, or both?:)
14:59:04 <amoralej> i'd say it's more an action for TC members :)
14:59:22 <ykarel> or from ironic who are proposing changes in there release management
14:59:24 <amoralej> or the ones willing to change the cadence
14:59:26 <amoralej> yep
14:59:30 <ykarel> yeap
14:59:40 <spotz> Ok I'll keep an eye on the channel then and we'll keep ideas on the backburner for noow
14:59:55 <spotz> 1 minute warning
14:59:57 <ykarel> wrt chair i can take it, iirc amoralej is on ptos next week
15:00:06 <spotz> Thanks ykarel
15:00:36 <spotz> Last thoughts before I close as we're at time
15:00:52 <spotz> Great discussions BTW!
15:00:58 <spotz> #endmeeting