04:41:57 <cmurf> #startmeeting Workstation WG (2020-06-30)
04:41:57 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Jul  1 04:41:57 2020 UTC.
04:41:57 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
04:41:57 <zodbot> The chair is cmurf. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
04:41:57 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
04:41:57 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'workstation_wg_(2020-06-30)'
04:41:58 <cmurf> #meetingname workstation
04:41:58 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'workstation'
04:42:00 <cmurf> #chair aday
04:42:00 <zodbot> Current chairs: aday cmurf
04:42:17 <cmurf> #topic Rollcall
04:42:18 <cmurf> #info present: aday, otaylor, tpopela, mclasen, langdon, jens, neal
04:42:20 <cmurf> #info regrets: cmurf, kalev
04:42:22 <cmurf> #topic Approve minutes for 16 Jun meeting
04:42:24 <cmurf> #link https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/teams/workstation/workstation.2020-06-18-16.49.log.html
04:42:26 <cmurf> #topic Approve minutes for 23 Jun meeting
04:42:28 <cmurf> #link https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/teams/workstation/workstation.2020-06-25-04.07.log.html
04:42:30 <cmurf> #topic Announcements
04:42:32 <cmurf> #info earlyoom change is being added to the kde spin
04:42:34 <cmurf> Today is the last day for system-wide change proposals. We have another month for self-contained changes.
04:42:36 <cmurf> Speaking of which - this happened. https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/ThermalManagementWS
04:42:38 <cmurf> - Help, why is this happening?
04:42:40 <cmurf> - Row back, row back.
04:42:42 <cmurf> - Let's speak to the authors.
04:42:44 <cmurf> - The WG needs to discuss it before it goes forward - we'd like to delay the discussion for a bit.
04:42:46 <cmurf> #topic Follow-ups and status reports
04:42:48 <cmurf> #info btrfs change proposal went out
04:42:50 <cmurf> - Neal: generally good discussion; we've got some useful feedback
04:42:52 <cmurf> - Michael: it could go either way.
04:42:54 <cmurf> - Owen: it's a specialist topic. There are some concerns about stability/performance that people will want to get data on. We got some comments from Red Hat storage people, which was good to see.
04:42:56 <cmurf> - Owen: if it passes, we still need to figure out validation steps and the roadmap. It's not *done*.
04:42:58 <cmurf> #info nano change proposal went out
04:43:00 <cmurf> - Michael: our implementation plan was unworkable - it's been updated to use profile shell scripts, which should work everywhere. Things are generally looking positive.
04:43:02 <cmurf> #topic thermald change proposal
04:43:04 <cmurf> Ben: it should give a performance boost. There was a proposal back in XXX, but there were some unanswered questions at the time.
04:43:06 <cmurf> Why has it been proposed again? We got some feedback from Dell that it's needed.
04:43:08 <cmurf> Does it need the proprietary tool? There are machines where it will improve performance without the proprietary tool. Some do need it. However, it doesn't do any harm for without the proprietary bits.
04:43:10 <cmurf> Michael: the WG discussed this in March https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/71?#comment-634021 and decided against it, based on the proprietary tool.
04:43:12 <cmurf> Ben: the configurations generated with the binary blob isn't as needed now as in the past.
04:43:14 <cmurf> Owen: would like model numbers and some performance data. Isn't convinced by the claim that it's an improvement.
04:43:16 <cmurf> Michael: would like to pressure Intel to play nicely.
04:43:18 <cmurf> Neal: can we ship Matthew's reverse engineering? Owen: would like to see more testing and/or it merged first.
04:43:20 <cmurf> Ben: 1. can look into what's in thermald, 2. ask Dell for laptop model numbers where it's needed.
04:43:22 <cmurf> Owen: the minimum bar is details on whether the change is useful without the proprietary bits.
04:43:24 <cmurf> #action Owen to mail @devel to explain what we've discussed and what's happening
04:43:26 <cmurf> #action Ben to come back to the WG with more details
04:43:28 <cmurf> #agreed We will discuss this again next week.
04:43:30 <cmurf> #125 Guidelines for preinstalled and non-removable apps
04:43:32 <cmurf> #link https://pagure.io/fedora-workstation/issue/125#comment-661584
04:43:34 <cmurf> #agreed Deferred until next week
04:44:19 <cmurf> #endmeeting