17:32:58 <riecatnor> #startmeeting Mindshare
17:32:58 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Aug 12 17:32:58 2020 UTC.
17:32:58 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
17:32:58 <zodbot> The chair is riecatnor. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
17:32:58 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
17:32:58 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'mindshare'
17:32:58 <riecatnor> #meetingname Mindshare
17:32:58 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'mindshare'
17:32:58 <riecatnor> #chair bt0dotninja codeblock hhlp nb pbokoc riecatnor x3mboy tatica
17:32:58 <zodbot> Current chairs: bt0dotninja codeblock hhlp nb pbokoc riecatnor tatica x3mboy
17:32:58 <riecatnor> #info Agenda is at: https://board.net/p/fedora-mindshare
17:32:58 <riecatnor> #info About Mindshare: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/mindshare/
17:32:59 <riecatnor> #topic Hello
17:33:16 <riecatnor> .hello riecatnor
17:33:18 <zodbot> riecatnor: riecatnor 'None' <mnordin@redhat.com>
17:33:27 <bt0> .fasinfo bt0dotninja
17:33:28 <zodbot> bt0: User: bt0dotninja, Name: Alberto Rodriguez Sanchez, email: hotgalan@gmail.com, Creation: 2016-07-25, IRC Nick: bt0, Timezone: America/Mexico_City, Locale: en, GPG key ID: E74B5808, Status: active
17:33:28 <siddharthvipul> .hello siddharthvipul1
17:33:31 <zodbot> bt0: Approved Groups: marketing cla_fpca cla_done dotnet-team ambassadors @fedora-mx +fedora-join mindshare +ask-fedora +summer-coding +advocates packager fedorabugs neuro-sig @commops
17:33:34 <zodbot> siddharthvipul: siddharthvipul1 'Vipul Siddharth' <siddharthvipul1@gmail.com>
17:33:44 * siddharthvipul is here in full meeting mode.. i.e tired and cranky
17:33:44 <nasirhm> .hello2
17:33:45 <zodbot> nasirhm: nasirhm 'Nasir Hussain' <nasirhussainm14@gmail.com>
17:34:12 <riecatnor> #topic nest experience
17:34:25 * relrod checks in a few minutes late
17:34:32 <siddharthvipul> relrod: \o hey there
17:34:33 <riecatnor> I had a great time as well :) plenty to learn and improve, but I think it went very well
17:35:25 <nasirhm> It was pretty great and the UI made it pretty simple to find things like Booths, etc.
17:35:32 <siddharthvipul> same as you riecatnor.. but I guess we have been through my experience :P
17:35:36 <nasirhm> We've some awesome feedback from a wider community here: https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/tickets/issue/315
17:36:06 <riecatnor> I am putting together a survey to send out to attendees with the help of the nest planning folks
17:36:19 <nasirhm> One of the things what were not so great was when time was over the sessions were closing automatically .
17:36:39 <riecatnor> They should have run for 2 whole hours, I think that is the max
17:36:54 <siddharthvipul> nasirhm: were they? I didn't notice any session auto closing? only if the recording was enabled, sessions closed after 2 hours
17:37:15 <siddharthvipul> riecatnor: that's only if they are recorded from my understanding
17:37:26 <riecatnor> at the very end it did boot us out 5 minutes after the end :p
17:37:45 <riecatnor> Any feedback on our Mindshare session?
17:37:46 <siddharthvipul> riecatnor: hah, yeah! well we did push it's 72 hours to its limit XD
17:38:05 <riecatnor> Do people feel that was useful?
17:38:41 <siddharthvipul> riecatnor: no involvement from community - which means no questions/answers.. does this mean people are not sure what we are responsible for or things we do or we have been super clear that there were no issues? I think it's the former
17:38:41 <nasirhm> riecatnor: I'm looking forward to the recording of the session.
17:39:02 <siddharthvipul> (well, it can also mean some other great session clashed)
17:39:13 <x3mboy> .hello2
17:39:14 <zodbot> x3mboy: x3mboy 'Eduard Lucena' <eduardlucena@gmail.com>
17:39:39 <bt0> yeah, Always is good to know the people in our committees and give other contributors the chance of ask about our work
17:39:45 <riecatnor> it was conflicting with [Talk-50]: Datto ❤️ Fedora and lessons from getting involved in Fedora
17:39:45 <tg-fedmindshare> <s​umantro93> I am waiting for recording of most of the session
17:39:53 <tg-fedmindshare> <s​umantro93> but nest was awesome
17:40:26 <riecatnor> I was hoping people would show up with questions, we came up with stuff on the fly, which worked, though I think we could do better
17:40:31 <x3mboy> I had a great time, sadly I couldn't make it on Sunday
17:40:42 <nasirhm> I think I was running the Getting Involved with Fedora session
17:41:23 <nasirhm> In the first day I've had a Power outage at my side, so was only able to join for running the i3wm and Getting involved with Fedora sessions.
17:41:23 <siddharthvipul> nasirhm: heh, it was Neil :)
17:41:36 <siddharthvipul> nasirhm: https://pagure.io/flock/issue/271
17:41:37 <riecatnor> So, I guess I would like us to be better prepared when we do that session again :)
17:42:24 <nasirhm> siddharthvipul: Oops, My bad 😂
17:42:30 <siddharthvipul> riecatnor: I guess it will have to start before the session itself in spreading what mindshare is and all the responsibilities
17:42:46 <siddharthvipul> but we already have a plan for this with blogs and emails iirc
17:43:44 <riecatnor> I am trying to pull of the session chat
17:43:49 <riecatnor> iirc, we had some good feedback there
17:44:09 <siddharthvipul> riecatnor: oh right! we can see questions from there
17:44:16 <nasirhm> siddharthvipul: I'm thinking about having some slides about Mindshare, in the slides to share about the awesome work Mindshare does and then the Q&A part.
17:44:38 <nasirhm> s/to/we_can/g
17:44:55 <nasirhm> (for our next session.)
17:45:15 <riecatnor> some engagement on internships
17:45:17 <siddharthvipul> nasirhm: slides.. presented where? :) we are more on the line of daily discussions (I mean weekly, monthly etc).. but we can definitely look at presenting mindshare panel with some of our efforts in next place where we do this (nest/flock.)
17:45:38 <siddharthvipul> nasirhm: something to consider for sure
17:46:52 <riecatnor> WDYT about Mindshare committee doing one of the council video calls? to go over what we do, for people to meet us
17:46:53 <nasirhm> siddharthvipul: This can help the attendees know about the Mindshare Committee and it will provide them some context on questions which are in the scope of Mindshare.
17:47:26 <siddharthvipul> riecatnor: as a guest?
17:47:35 <siddharthvipul> well, as guests*
17:47:35 <riecatnor> mhm :)
17:47:51 <siddharthvipul> sure! no issues here with that :)
17:48:07 <riecatnor> other peoples thoughts?
17:48:09 <bt0> +1 for a video call at month
17:48:10 <riecatnor> +1 from me
17:48:15 <siddharthvipul> would definitely help with promotion.. and with ambassador revamp program that's what we need
17:48:21 <nasirhm> riecatnor: Sounds like an awesome idea, maybe we can present some slides to share what Mindshare is ?.
17:48:26 <x3mboy> I was disappointed that no people shows up into the Mindshare talk
17:48:28 <siddharthvipul> (did you see what smooth transition I am plotting) XD
17:48:34 <riecatnor> yeah definitely nasirhm :) I like that idea
17:49:14 <nasirhm> x3mboy: I think it was mostly due to the fact that most people are not familiar with the work of Mindshare.
17:49:15 <riecatnor> I will message bcotton, one sec I will do it now
17:51:56 <riecatnor> ok cool
17:51:59 <riecatnor> any other nest thoughts?
17:52:26 <riecatnor> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Council/Video_Meetings#Wish_list
17:52:27 <hhlp> any plan to upload recorded session?
17:52:32 <riecatnor> we've been added to the wish list
17:52:40 <riecatnor> yep hhlp bcotton is doing that :)
17:52:48 <hhlp> nice
17:53:29 <riecatnor> https://pagure.io/mindshare/issue/231
17:53:36 <riecatnor> #topic ambassador revamp
17:53:41 <riecatnor> #link https://pagure.io/mindshare/issue/231
17:54:42 <bt0> I will work in our docs tomorrow (Thursday is my docs day)
17:54:56 <riecatnor> bt0, what do you intend to do?
17:55:21 <riecatnor> I think this is something that Mariana & Sumantro are working on with my help
17:55:44 <riecatnor> but, I am curious what you were thinking of, bc help is always needed
17:56:25 <bt0> make more clear some of the zsun parts of the docs mention in the ticket
17:56:34 <nasirhm> bt0: If you would like I can provide you a hand if there are somethings that we need in the docs.
17:56:58 <bt0> of course reviewing the PR
17:56:59 <siddharthvipul> also, riecatnor if there are some small work going on this revamp, could we make it more visible? as in progress updates or taiga card ...
17:57:02 <siddharthvipul> just thinking out loud
17:57:19 <riecatnor> so funny, we are ahead of you :)
17:57:32 <riecatnor> We are working on a trello board
17:57:37 <hhlp> +1 taiga card wolud be nice
17:57:50 <siddharthvipul> hey, that's what's expected of y'all
17:57:51 <siddharthvipul> :)
17:58:12 <riecatnor> so, I kinda think the answer to this isn't to jump to make changes based on this persons feedback
17:58:13 <siddharthvipul> here, cookies! :D
17:58:15 <tg-fedmindshare> <s​umantro93> trello cards will be shared by week end - recharge day ;)
17:58:21 <nasirhm> riecatnor: Trello sounds like a good idea, but personally I would prefer teams.fp.o
17:58:50 <siddharthvipul> @sumantro93, ah trello, the best recharging tool XD
17:58:53 <riecatnor> That was part of the reason why I asked people *not* to respond there
17:58:57 <nasirhm> (Taiga)
17:59:18 <tg-fedmindshare> <s​umantro93> vipul ;)
17:59:22 <riecatnor> This is planned, this is well in hand, it can be better communicated, but what we do should not be reactionary
17:59:58 <siddharthvipul> yep yep yep
18:00:04 <bt0> :) sure
18:00:23 <riecatnor> The work is already in progress, what is needed is patience and trust from the community. So, how do we build that? Because the process will be long, there will be mistakes in docs, people will not be able to have every piece of info at once
18:01:20 <riecatnor> commblog post
18:01:29 <riecatnor> with an update
18:02:00 <nasirhm> One of the ideas that I'm thinking of is creating a CommBlog post with sharing the updates and the work we're doing on weekly/bi-weekly meetings.
18:02:13 <nasirhm> <riecatnor "commblog post"> ++
18:02:48 <riecatnor> so, Sumantro, please note that we need to build in a cadence for blog posts with updates
18:02:55 <riecatnor> I think once a month is enough personally.
18:03:08 <riecatnor> For a general update
18:03:12 <nasirhm> ++ for once a month.
18:03:17 <hhlp> +1
18:03:44 <bt0> +1 too
18:03:52 <riecatnor> anything else we can/should be doing?
18:04:02 <siddharthvipul> have a public tracking place (trello/taiga) Yes! have regular (fixed intervals) blogs Yes.. what else do we need
18:04:19 <riecatnor> all of those, now in progress :)
18:04:29 * hhlp I think not more things to add
18:04:31 <siddharthvipul> ah, of course announcement of the tracker on MLs but I guess that's already in your mind
18:04:41 <siddharthvipul> riecatnor: yep yep, that was "my way" of +1 :P
18:04:56 <bt0> fedoranews announce at the same time of the blog?
18:05:06 <nasirhm> We can summarize the CommBlog post and paste it the ML and fedoranews.
18:05:12 <riecatnor> seems good, those seem to happen wihtout me pinging anyone
18:05:19 <riecatnor> and I wonder if that is jwf
18:05:20 <siddharthvipul> bt0: that's less trouble as well.. I like it bt0
18:05:21 <riecatnor> :P
18:05:35 <siddharthvipul> of course it's jwf :D
18:06:01 <riecatnor> So, when I read this ticket, I personally had some feelings.. like this person wasn't being very nice, and the message was kind of aggressive/rude
18:06:13 <riecatnor> Did anyone else feel that way?
18:06:39 <hhlp> yep some kind fo reaction from my side
18:06:49 <bt0> me
18:06:56 <siddharthvipul> riecatnor: I won't say rude but it felt in an investigating way.. which is I guess fair for someone if they have been waiting and looking forward to it for a long time
18:07:00 * riecatnor trying to understand if that is a cultural thing or not
18:07:07 <tg-fedmindshare> <p​bokoc> Kinda, but I wonder how much of that comes down to language differences, the author is an ESL speaker
18:07:12 <siddharthvipul> not trying to defend anyone, but just saying let's not think too much I guess
18:07:18 <riecatnor> right pbokoc '
18:07:25 <siddharthvipul> pbokoc: +1
18:07:39 <bt0> but he is asking the right things in the right places and pointing to some problems I appreciate it
18:08:02 <bt0> also pbokoc++ (thanks for your comments)
18:08:02 <zodbot> bt0: Karma for pbokoc changed to 10 (for the current release cycle):  https://badges.fedoraproject.org/tags/cookie/any
18:08:03 <riecatnor> well, I am not thinking too much negatively on the ticket opener
18:08:06 <nasirhm> Personally, I didn't feel that way, it was more about asking the things that are happening. It could be cultural thing as well, as I've some Chinese / Korean friends who sometimes behave in a similar way.
18:08:19 <riecatnor> I think they have valid questions
18:08:29 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> I think it was a language issue. I have had similar experiences in the past with non native English speakers. Though I think he was a bit ticked about having to have waited long.
18:08:36 <nasirhm> riecatnor++ for your positive outlook on the ticket. :)
18:08:53 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> Sorry to butt in the conversations though! 😅
18:09:00 <riecatnor> I guess, from what I've seen, there is a lot of feelings around ambassadors, we knew there would be some upset as we go along
18:09:29 <riecatnor> good to just point that out, listen to each other on how to deal with that
18:09:43 <riecatnor> I have received DMs from people saying that this program would fail
18:09:53 <siddharthvipul> riecatnor: sigh! I am sorry
18:10:05 <siddharthvipul> I can imagine how messed up these pms can get
18:10:29 <riecatnor> so, I just want to say I am sensitive to outsiders being critical, and I am sensitive to the well being of this team.. I don't think much of this ticket, I just see it as an opportunity to bring up the bigger topic
18:10:44 <riecatnor> "outsiders" = people who are not directly tapped into the cadence of work
18:11:41 <bt0> It's a great change, many people don't like the big changes
18:11:54 * nb is here
18:12:01 <nasirhm> riecatnor: I'm really for the e-mails, They're able to only see the result but not the hard work you've put in the proposal. Once we get things done with the planning I believe people wouldn't be as critical.
18:12:02 <bt0> hi nb o/
18:12:21 <nasirhm> Hey nb \o
18:12:30 <riecatnor> And also, Sumantro, Mariana, most of us are volunteers(i know I am not).. things can happen on a slow time line when it comes to volunteer work. People should be respectful of that
18:12:36 <riecatnor> not entitled
18:12:53 <bt0> :)
18:12:55 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> People are usually over the top critical when
18:12:55 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> a. They feel left out or
18:12:55 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> b. They aren't happy about a change in the status quo.
18:12:55 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> With a change as big as ambassadors restructure there's bound to be some naysayers.
18:13:07 <riecatnor> bugsmith, exactly
18:13:26 <riecatnor> heya nb
18:13:33 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> On the flipside the presence of naysayers is actually a good sign.
18:13:34 <riecatnor> ok, so
18:13:46 <riecatnor> anything else on ambassador revamp?
18:13:46 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> It means something good is happening.
18:14:02 <riecatnor> :)
18:14:06 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> Is there a ambassadors logo?
18:14:24 <riecatnor> probably something we used a long time ago, think it might be time for a new one tho
18:14:26 <riecatnor> :D
18:14:34 <bt0> +1
18:14:58 <nasirhm> riecatnor: I think it would be best for us to make some constructive feedback out of the emails and find the reasons why we're receiving the e-mails and then we can use that to improve our planning. (It's hard).
18:15:02 <riecatnor> I would like to see a set of logos.. commops/join/ambassadors/advocates/ambassador emeritus
18:15:16 <bt0> me too
18:15:17 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> I would love to help if there is any discussion around a set of new logos.
18:15:28 <riecatnor> nasirhm, I am not sure what you are trying to explain, what is the context?
18:15:52 <riecatnor> sweet, bugsmith, I would join the fedora design TG channel as well then :)
18:16:14 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> I'm already there. (I'm sayak btw)
18:16:22 <riecatnor> oh hai, Sayak!
18:16:32 <riecatnor> nice to see you here :)
18:16:54 <bt0> sayak++
18:16:54 <zodbot> bt0: Karma for sayaksarkar changed to 1 (for the current release cycle):  https://badges.fedoraproject.org/tags/cookie/any
18:16:56 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> I didn't realise my handle was showing up as bugsmith here! 😅
18:16:57 <bt0> :P
18:17:13 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> Nice to be here.
18:17:23 <riecatnor> sayak++
18:17:23 <zodbot> riecatnor: Karma for sayaksarkar changed to 2 (for the current release cycle):  https://badges.fedoraproject.org/tags/cookie/any
18:17:25 <nasirhm> riecatnor: (I think matrix is slow), I was referring to the emails you've received, we can derive some ideas from there to improve our planning or prioritize things and not focus on the critical language for now.
18:17:33 <nasirhm> sayak++ :)
18:17:33 <zodbot> nasirhm: Karma for sayaksarkar changed to 3 (for the current release cycle):  https://badges.fedoraproject.org/tags/cookie/any
18:18:21 <riecatnor> Oh, sure, nasirhm. There is also value in making time and room for emotions that come from the emails. And better not to ignore that
18:19:06 <riecatnor> Do we want to discuss release parties before end of meeting? or do we have some open floor topics as well?
18:19:09 <x3mboy> I'm back
18:19:14 <x3mboy> Sorry, lunch time
18:19:20 <x3mboy> @tatica are you there?
18:19:22 <nasirhm> riecatnor: You're already doing really awesome :)
18:19:34 <nasirhm> x3mboy: Good to see you back \o
18:19:52 <nasirhm> <riecatnor "Do we want to discuss release pa"> ++ to discuss Virtual Release Parties.
18:20:01 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> @riecatnor I'm curious about the virtual launch party plans.
18:20:08 <riecatnor> ok
18:20:12 <riecatnor> #topic virtual release parties
18:20:16 <bt0> ok, Virtual Release Parties :)
18:20:41 <riecatnor> #link https://pagure.io/mindshare/issue/217
18:21:29 <x3mboy> Just a quick comment in previous topic, please
18:21:43 <riecatnor> so, I think we should use hopin for this. it can do a max of 72 hours for an event. we ask folks to plan as many as possible on that weekend
18:21:44 <riecatnor> sure x3mboy
18:22:21 <siddharthvipul> riecatnor: do you plan to do something along the lines of fwd (that you all were discussing in hackfest)?
18:22:30 <riecatnor> yep
18:22:31 <x3mboy> I think there is an urgent need to publish some progress on the commblog
18:22:34 <riecatnor> i was thinking th e same
18:22:59 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> @riecatnor ++ to using hopin. As long as we can figure out hopin's kick-out issues.
18:23:01 <riecatnor> ok, x3mboy
18:23:10 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> Would we be recording the release parties?
18:23:20 <siddharthvipul> riecatnor: I see +1 to that (I am aware of the planning since I was there when the discussion was happening) having similar process with also means less complications
18:23:24 <riecatnor> hold on bugsmith
18:23:30 <riecatnor> x3mboy, did you want to say more
18:24:07 <nasirhm> I was feeling the same thing as riecatnor's comment that we're a little out of track for F32, We can plan it to be awesome for F33
18:24:29 <x3mboy> Sure, I talked with 2 or 3 ambys and the feeling is like "mindshare wants to do a revamp but it's not clear what we have to do as ambys"
18:24:53 <riecatnor> mhm. makes sense, bc they have nothing to do yet ;)
18:24:54 <x3mboy> So, we need to make people clear what is the current step and which are the next steps
18:25:17 <x3mboy> riecatnor, agreed, but they need to know, at the end, it's their team
18:25:18 <x3mboy> :D
18:25:24 <siddharthvipul> x3mboy: I would ask them to volunteer in making the process better if they are waiting for something to do :)
18:25:38 <x3mboy> siddharthvipul, which I did :D
18:25:46 <siddharthvipul> x3mboy: ahhoyyy
18:26:07 <x3mboy> My policy is: complaint after doing, not before
18:26:08 <x3mboy> :D
18:26:13 <riecatnor> I put a blog post on my to do, will get together with sumantro and mariana on that
18:26:22 <x3mboy> Thanks
18:26:31 <x3mboy> Nothing else from me
18:26:50 <riecatnor> the biggest message going in there will be, we have waited years, with nothing, have patience and info will come at every point it is ready to come
18:27:26 <riecatnor> the pressure on us, and the task force needs to be relieved. I talked about this earlier, no need to be reactionary
18:27:30 <riecatnor> the plan is in hand
18:27:44 <riecatnor> so, a blog post- can do!
18:27:58 <riecatnor> ok quickly back to release parties for a few minutes
18:28:19 <nasirhm> 2 mins to be exact :}
18:28:51 <riecatnor> So, we can choose to record or not record the release parties
18:28:55 <riecatnor> to answer an earlier question
18:29:00 <bt0> Hopin Will be great for VRP but we need set up some Local tracks
18:29:28 <nasirhm> I think it would be better to leave that to the organizer that if hey would like to record or not.
18:29:34 <riecatnor> We could take requests for Hallway tracks for different locales/languages
18:29:45 <riecatnor> nasirhm, I am not sure
18:29:47 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> Wild idea: If the release party videos are recorded, it would be nice to do a mash-up video from the recordings fir the release party!
18:30:04 <riecatnor> I find that if we record them, people behave better
18:31:21 <nasirhm> riecatnor: Well, If that's the case here, I'm +1 to record.
18:31:57 <riecatnor> so using hopin for one large 3 day event where we hold sessions/parties on there for each time zone/locale that wants to participate
18:32:00 <riecatnor> +1
18:32:07 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> +1 to recording!
18:32:12 <hhlp> +1
18:32:24 <siddharthvipul> recording is fine but that can also put off people from sharing their faces
18:32:40 <riecatnor> siddharthvipul, we can have hallway tracks that are unrecorded
18:32:49 <siddharthvipul> riecatnor: was typing that
18:32:51 <riecatnor> we can have the "party" sessions recorded
18:32:53 <siddharthvipul> sounds good
18:33:14 <nasirhm> And letting people know that this session will be recorded is a plus
18:33:17 <riecatnor> so is that a +1 siddharthvipul lol
18:33:29 <siddharthvipul> riecatnor: yeah :) +1
18:33:44 <riecatnor> ok, cool! I like this plan
18:33:47 <tg-fedmindshare> <B​ugsmith> +1 to unrecorded hallway tracks.
18:33:59 <riecatnor> I will take a few notes and add those to the ticket
18:34:11 <riecatnor> we are over time
18:34:13 <nasirhm> riecatnor++ :)
18:34:14 <riecatnor> thanks everybody!
18:34:25 <riecatnor> #endmeeting